Leg Suck: better/worse on different types?

I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought "Nope, clumsy as I am, it'e
inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play the game."

But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting a broken leg out of it
are lower on some than others.

Comments?
-----------------------
Pete Cresswell

 

"(Pete Cresswell)" skrev...
[q1]> I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought "Nope, clumsy as I am, it'e[/q1]
[q1]> inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play the game."[/q1]
[q1]>[/q1]
[q1]> But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting a broken leg out of it[/q1]
[q1]> are lower on some than others.[/q1]

You know, you can get run over by crossing a road. Does that make you stay indoors?

Legsuck is not as common as you make it, just like flying over the handlebars on a DF isn't. (once
for me in 30 years)

If you are that concerned get a trike and some good clipless pedals.

Mikael

 

On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 20:25:26 GMT, "(Pete Cresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote:

>I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought "Nope, clumsy as I am, it'e
>inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play the game."

Clipless pedals and proper selection of cleats means the small risk of leg suck becomes a negligible
risk, as I read it. I changed from the silver dual-release SPD cleats to black single-release
M51/52s and my feet stay firmly on the pedals.

Guy
===
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> I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought "Nope, clumsy as I am, it'e
> inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play the game."

Hmmm...leg suck is not terribly common. I have never had it. If you are worried about it, get
clipless pedals and shoes and have a go at it. I think you are discounting the bent experience based
on a rare occurence.

Derek

 

"(Pete Cresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

> I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought "Nope, clumsy as I am, it'e
> inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play the game."
>
> But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting a broken leg out of it
> are lower on some than others.
>
> Comments?
> -----------------------
> Pete Cresswell

Hey Pete, don't sweat it. Like ALL things internet, the rarer the event the louder the talk. As
said, this is not something that is "inevitable". Take the LEARNED advice and get and use clipless
pedals. no problem. It IS dangerous, but mostly to folks that don't about it and thus don't take
measures to prevent it. I'll still ride without clipping occasional or for part of a ride if my feet
get numb. Then I just make sure I look out for upcoming bumps and either coast over them or just
make sure to pay attention to holding tension in my legs so they wouldn't drop if my feet came off
the pedals. That and not going "all out" cranking without being clipped. That will remove 99.9% of
any potential problems.

 

Actually getting a broken leg would be nice compared to the Hip damage you'll get as your leg passes
beneath your seat. If U ride a trike, stay clipped in or use Power Grips. Have seen DF type Toe
Clips used on a trike, but I would not risk using these....better to be locked in securely.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------
"(Pete Cresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought
"Nope,
> clumsy as I am, it'e inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play
the
> game."
>
> But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting
a
> broken leg out of it are lower on some than others.
>
> Comments?
> -----------------------
> Pete Cresswell

 

I ride a low BB 'bent. My foot has come off the pedal a few times but not so much as touched the
pavement, let alone gotten 'sucked'. It has been my suspicion that low BBs are less susceptable than
hi BB to leg-suck. I am only now after 20,000 miles going to clipless.

"(Pete Cresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought
"Nope,
> clumsy as I am, it'e inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play
the
> game."
>
> But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting
a
> broken leg out of it are lower on some than others.
>
> Comments?
> -----------------------
> Pete Cresswell

 

"(Pete Cresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]... <snip>
> But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting
a
> broken leg out of it are lower on some than others.
>
<snip>

Pete- Having first-hand (er...leg) experience with a broken leg while riding my Trek R200, I'd say
I'm older & wiser now. My accident was on wet pavement, going around a sharp turn too fast,
without being clipped in. I've since switched over to clipless pedals to keep my feet outta harm's
way, as well as overhauled my brakes to be able to stop on a dime (or at least slow down on a
sloped sharp curve).

On a SWB with a high bottom bracket, you've got exactly enough time when the back end slips out to
get your foot down on the ground, but NOT enough to actually shift your weight up onto that foot for
balance. The result is getting your leg bent back/sideways at an silly angle.

I'm not going to say "Don't worry, be happy, get Bent" - that's something you'll have to figure out
yourself - believe me, while I was sitting around last summer waiting for bone cells to re-grow, I
was trying to figure out how to afford a new Greenspeed GTO to avoid going through all that
again...(still haven't ruled it out!) I also searched the 'net at the time to see if this was a
common occurance in the 'bent world, and ya know what? I really couldn't find much (if ANY)
discussion of it at all.

Good luck- Kevin

 

> But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting
a
> broken leg out of it are lower on some than others.
>
> Comments?
> -----------------------
> Pete Cresswell

Many years ago I was riding my road bike in the wet & out of the saddle in an agressive maner, as
the mood sometimes took me, without toe clips & straps (b4 clipless pedals). Just as I reached max
velocity my R foot slipped off the pedal, my foot hit the ground v.hard...the next thing to happen
was a first for me and a painful surprise as the serated rat trap pedal embeded itself in my achiles
tendon...my next ride was with clips and straps...6 weeks later after I recovered...seems one ain't
safe on anything..
P.S. I'm off to The Netherlands on Sunday next to try some bents & beer...

>Clipless pedals and proper selection of cleats means the small risk of leg suck becomes a
>negligible risk, as I read it. I changed from the silver dual-release SPD cleats to black
>single-release M51/52s and my feet stay firmly on the pedals.

>Guy

Thanx for the info, was not sure if I was gonna use look or SPD, if I use SPD I'll be sure to change
the cleats...

 

Pete,

I , have followed bent accident injuries on this NG for about 5 years, and seen about 5-6 posts
reporting serious leg suck injuries. I have come close to leg suck a couple of times at speed, and
done it a few times on an off-road bent riding single track at very low speed with no serious
injury. One of the most horrid leg suck injuries I read about happened to the CEO of the ill fated
Backbent company while riding a Blackbent prototype just before they went into production. He was
riding in tennis shoes with no clips and dropped a foot and crashed. He had a slow recovery and it
probably did not help the success (not) of the venture.

Here is my take on the risks.

1) Seats that have metal side rails like Haluzak, Lightning, Longbikes, etc. have the greatest
potential for serious injury because your leg can be trapped inside the rail with nowhere to go
but under the bike.

2) Seats with bottom cushions like RANS, BikeE, many Visions, Easy Racers, etc. have less serious
injury potential because it is likely that a dropped leg will deflect to the side. This can knock
you off the bike (with resulting serious injury or death) but it is still preferable to scenario
#1 described above. I dropped a foot on a BikeE once on a fast descent and it knocked me almost
off the bike before I regained control and came to a stop. I was very lucky, it happened so fast
that all of my reactions where automatic. I have been very careful about leg suck since then.

3) I personally feel safest vis-a-vis legsuck on euro hard shell seats because more abdominal
muscles come into play to control and stabilize your legs from an accidental drop while riding
and because they have no seat rails.

4) Practice a couple of accidental foot drops while stationary to see what it feels like. Train
yourself to avoid ever feeling like that while moving on your bent. See what sort of movments set
you up for foot drop and be aware of them. Wear ankle protectors, AXO company makes a good item
called "Ankle Biters".

5) Good luck. Control your speed. Leg suck is a serious concern, but it is only one of the many very
bad things that can happen to you whilst riding any bike. In the last 5 years, I have personally
seen far more bad accidents resulting from upright riders doing botched "bunny hop" maneuvers.
One guy actually had his clips accidently release and was vaulted over the handlebars while his
front wheel dripped into a pothole. Ouch!

Cheers, Derek

"(Pete Cresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote in message

(major snippage)

> Comments?
> -----------------------
> Pete Cresswell

 

Pete The best math lesson I ever learned was at the first day of high school metal shop. The black
board equation went like this: man + machine X motion = mayhem The teacher wanted us to be sure we
understood that ANY machine can cause injury and what can we do to minimize this. Looking at
published data for emergency room visits related to bicycle injuries 80% are upper body, head,
shoulders, arms. These kind of injuries are rare on a recumbent. Common injury on recumbents are
ankles and lower legs. A more survivable injury. An average of 800 people die on bikes each year but
in the 20 years I've been into recumbents there has been only 3 (small community, word spreads
quick) Now days when I ride an upright it feels very unsafe. Feels like a small bump will make me
come off head first. My opinion is that one of the reasons that recumbents haven't "caught on" is
they aren't Xtreme enough. They don't fly through the air up side down and backwards like all the
popular sports of these modern times. They are a low risk sport. Try some recumbents you'll like em.
Happy cycling Steve "Speedy" Delaire

"(Pete Cresswell)" wrote:

> I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought "Nope, clumsy as I am, it'e
> inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't play the game."
>
> But looking at different configs, it seems like the probability of getting a broken leg out of it
> are lower on some than others.
>
> Comments?
> -----------------------
> Pete Cresswell

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> If you are that concerned get a trike and some good clipless pedals.
>
> Mikael

A trike isn't ANY different in that regard.

 

"Doug Huffman" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

> I ride a low BB 'bent. My foot has come off the pedal a few times but not so much as touched the
> pavement, let alone gotten 'sucked'. It has been my suspicion that low BBs are less susceptable
> than hi BB to leg-suck. I am only now after 20,000 miles going to clipless.

I would agree with that,as the higher the BB the more you have to support/hold your legs while
peddling. Plus just the body angle itself would lend itself to not "dropping" a leg if it comes off.

 

Guy Chapman wrote:

> Clipless pedals and proper selection of cleats means the small risk of leg suck becomes a
> negligible risk, as I read it

To which I would add:

1. For additional security, choose a machine on which unclipping is something you do once per
journey - whether a trike or a bike low enough to put a hand down.
2. Take care on slippery off-camber corners which incorporate pedestrian crossings and manhole
covers. No, I didn't get leg suck there, but there's been a few foot-down moments
inna-speedway-stylee on that particular corner...

Dave Larrington - http://legslarry.crosswinds.net/
===========================================================
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
===========================================================
"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 20:25:26 GMT, "(Pete Cresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >I was close to getting a 'bent. Then I read about leg suck and thought
"Nope,
> >clumsy as I am, it'e inevitable....If you can't afford to lose, don't
play the
> >game."
>
> Clipless pedals and proper selection of cleats means the small risk of leg suck becomes a
> negligible risk, as I read it. I changed from the silver dual-release SPD cleats to black
> single-release M51/52s and my feet stay firmly on the pedals.
>
> Guy
> ===
> ** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. http://www.chapmancentral.com (BT ADSL and
> dynamic DNS permitting)
> NOTE: BT Openworld have now blocked port 25 (without notice), so old mail addresses may no longer
> work. Apologies.

 

"MLB" skrev...
>
> >
> > If you are that concerned get a trike and some good clipless pedals.
> >
> > Mikael
>
> A trike isn't ANY different in that regard.

Hmm... so you clip out at trafficlights and other stops on a trike? Interesting.

M.

 

On Tue, 21 Jan 2003 09:35:23 -0000, "Dave Larrington" <[email protected]> wrote:

>1. For additional security, choose a machine on which unclipping is something you do once per
> journey - whether a trike or a bike low enough to put a hand down.

But Dave, we all know that you can put a hand down on a wedgie, with your arms!

>2. Take care on slippery off-camber corners which incorporate pedestrian crossings and manhole
> covers.

Oh, don't remind me. What twat puts metal covers in the roads smack in the middle of the sodding
junctions?

>No, I didn't get leg suck there, but there's been a few foot-down moments inna-speedway-stylee on
>that particular corner...

Too bloody right. When the back end slides on a bent is slides big style.

Guy
===
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dynamic DNS permitting)
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work. Apologies.

 

On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 21:02:30 -0600, MLB <[email protected]> wrote:

>> It has been my suspicion that low BBs are less susceptable than hi BB to leg-suck.

>I would agree with that,as the higher the BB the more you have to support/hold your legs while
>peddling.

I don't have to support or hold my legs even when riding with platform pedals and trainers - the
pressure of the feet on the pedal does the work. But I still prefer clipless.

Guy
===
** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. http://www.chapmancentral.com (BT ADSL and
dynamic DNS permitting)
NOTE: BT Openworld have now blocked port 25 (without notice), so old mail addresses may no longer
work. Apologies.

 

"Mikael Seierup" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

>
> "MLB" skrev...
>>
>> >
>> > If you are that concerned get a trike and some good clipless pedals.
>> >
>> > Mikael
>>
>> A trike isn't ANY different in that regard.
>
> Hmm... so you clip out at trafficlights and other stops on a trike? Interesting.
>
> M.
>
hmmm, nope, don't on my two wheeler either.

 

"Mikael Seierup" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

>
> "MLB" skrev...
>>
>> >
>> > If you are that concerned get a trike and some good clipless pedals.
>> >
>> > Mikael
>>
>> A trike isn't ANY different in that regard.
>
> Hmm... so you clip out at trafficlights and other stops on a trike? Interesting.
>
> M.

I'm interested in how you would drop a leg and run over when stopped??

 

"MLB" skrev...
> I'm interested in how you would drop a leg and run over when stopped??

I could probably manage it. ;-)

No I just meant that since legsuck involves your foot coming off the pedal a trike would help a
great deal. You don't have to clip out at said stops and thus the risk of a bad clip-in when
accelerating is gone. Also falling over while riding (due to a flat or whatever) and in the process
getting legsuck or at least breaking a foot badly as a few unfortunate people here have done is less
likely too.

So that would leave us with accidental clipouts while riding along and good clipless pedals and, in
the case of Shimano, sticking to singlerelease cleats will help a lot in that department.

I haven't really had a problem with legsuck on two wheels and still think being nervous about it
shouldn't keep you away from recumbents - but if someone _is_ nervous a trike might be good. However
thats only my humble opinion.

Mikael