Lower gearing for shimano 5500 9spd

[mrvlhs]

As you can imagine, I never use the big-big combination that I pictured above. When I use small in the front and big on the back the clearance of the upper pulley is very close to 0 when using the paper clip. If I ditch the clip, the pulley touches the cassette, and this is already with a longer b-screw than what came with the bike. So I just really need to know if it's ok to shorten the chain in your opinion. I will also try to put back the old lower pulley as you mentioned.

Thanks!

 

[alfeng]

You are correct in thinking that you do NOT want the Upper Pulley Wheel to be making contact with the teeth on any of the Cogs of the Cassette ...

If putting the 11t Pulley Wheel back in place as the lower Pulley Wheel doesn't cant the cage enough, then removing 1" of chain is probably the only viable option at the moment.

​

 

[mrvlhs]

Finally it works! I got 32t working

One last thing, I installed the Shimano quick pin from the outside of the bike to the inside. This means that the side of the chain that touches the cassette has the pin sticking out a little bit. I'm not sure if this is how it's supposed to be, the other side is flush, but this was the only way that I found the chain to bend freely. Now I think that the pin will be rubbing on the cassette and wearing it out. I was thinking if by using a master connector I could break the chain, position it correctly and replace one of the other links with the master link. I just can't afford for the chain to be any shorter. Another option I thought of was filing down the pin where it would touch the cassette but I'm thinking that might be unsafe.

Let me know what you think and thank you for helping me pull this, I can't tell you enough how glad I am!

 

[alfeng]

FYI ...

In theory, the PIN should appear to be the same as the ones which were undisturbed by maintenance ...

With an equal protrusion on the outside of each plate.​

While a pin which has an end that is flush with the plate may seem to be okay, the odds are that the plate will splay at a most inconvenient time due to the lateral stress of successive shifts ...

I am speaking from first hand experience!!! ​

It may take MANY tries to get the pin properly seated so that the link pivots freely ...

PATIENCE is the key ...​

This may be stating the obvious, but the Shimano quick pins are chain-type specific -- the 8-speed pin is longer than the 9-speed pin, et cetera ...​

If manipulating the pin to-and-fro (laterally) cannot resolve the chain's flexibility, then you may-or-may-not want to push the particular pin out & use the second pin which (hopefully) came in the package and start over ...

BUT, I would only start from scratch as a last resort.​

Of course, the outer plates must be touching the inner link's plates.​

NB. While I have some stashed in my toolbox, I do not use any of the masterlinks ... and, after using Shimano's pin (once ... after THAT, it was a "why bother?" decision), I decided I might as well just do it the old-fashioned way and press the "old" pin 95% of the way out and re-use it to re-connect the chain ...

Now, this is NOT for the faint of heart because (due to apparently MY not being as dexterous and/or patient as I think I was in the past), sometimes I have pushed the pin too far when breaking the chain ...

Once the pin is all the way out, it cannot be pressed back into the plate without a special vise.
​

That means that I could potentially end up with a chain which is too short by an inch if I am too clumsy (which is one reason why have the tendency to run the chain slightly longer than the "ideal") ...

With the fore going in mind, I guess that I would only resort to a masterlink if I had botched multiple attempts to join a chain and subsequently needed the additional 1/2" to make the chain usable.
​

That's a very long way of saying that you need to take the time to set the pin so that it extends equally on both sides of the chain while allowing the joined links to pivot freely.

 

[mrvlhs]

The pin I used came with the 9spd chain. I don't think it's possible to get it flush on both sides but of course it's possible to get it equally uneven. Still, I'm unsure if in that position the chain will move freely, because before using the dedicated Shimano pin I tried your technique of not pushing the original pin out enough and it didn't go well right at the end, I did not aligning them well enough and pushed a part of the plate away making the link "open". So this might also be a reason why I'm having some trouble now.

So in your opinion, the side on which the pin is installed is irrelevant? Also, is on your opinion a bad idea to use a master link?

(I read that you should not reuse a pin that comes on the bike even if you don't push it all the way, because the pin does not have rivets at the end like the guide pin that comes with the chain does, and so will be a weak point in the chain. This is why I only use your technique for figuring the best chain size, but then I finish the job with a proper pin)

 

[alfeng]

The pin I used came with the 9spd chain. I don't think it's possible to get it flush on both sides but of course it's possible to get it equally uneven. Still, I'm unsure if in that position the chain will move freely, because before using the dedicated Shimano pin I tried your technique of not pushing the original pin out enough and it didn't go well right at the end, I did not aligning them well enough and pushed a part of the plate away making the link "open". So this might also be a reason why I'm having some trouble now

The joined link should be invisible relative to the other links ...

That is, you won't be able to notice a visible difference between it and any other link.​

So, when the pin is successfully inserted, YOU will see an equal portion of the pin protruding from both plates ...​

Again, a pin with an end which is FLUSH to the plate is a pin which will probably result in a link which will fail.

A problem which you may be having may be a consequence of using a chain tool which is not designed for a 9-/10-/11-speed chain.

An older chain tool is not only not cast from metal which is strong enough to withstand the force needed to push the pin into place OR out, the older chain tools are not designed to hold the SECOND, dorsal (relative to the tool's 'crank' ... for want of a better term) PLATE against the inner link.​

I think that most of the chain tools which have been designed to handle a 9-speed (or, narrower) chain will have an adjustable, hollow bolt which will press against the dorsal side of the chain & the "hollow" will receive the pin when it is being pressed out.

The chain tool(s) which may not be adjustable is the who-can-afford-it chain tool(s) made by Campagnolo.​

So in your opinion, the side on which the pin is installed is irrelevant? Also, is on your opinion a bad idea to use a master link?

Most people apparently love using a masterlink ...

I do not think that a masterlink is a bad idea ... it is just not a necessary option ...

Other than the possibility of installing it upside-down (which apparently will cause balky shifting ... but, it should be obvious when checking while the bike is stationary & on a workstand) I don't have a reason other than the "Why bother?" attitude I have expressed regarding Shimano's quick pin.
​

Just ensure that the masterlink you get is designed for your chain's width ...

Chains from different manufacturers may-or-may-not vary in width from similarly designated chains for a given "speed" of drivetrain.​

(I read that you should not reuse a pin that comes on the bike even if you don't push it all the way, because the pin does not have rivets at the end like the guide pin that comes with the chain does, and so will be a weak point in the chain. This is why I only use your technique for figuring the best chain size, but then I finish the job with a proper pin)

I've read that, too ...

In theory, masterlinks are NOT supposed to be re-used, too!

That is, a different, new masterlink is supposed to be used each time a chain is joined; but, many people obviously break their chains repeatedly without (?) negative consequence because they think they should break the chain & remove it from the bike each time the chain is cleaned.​

Based on my having successfully muffed the installation (meaning, that I managed to replicate the problem which occurs when not using one of the alternates!), it is certainly easier to just push the pin out all the way out (when using a proper-for-the-chain tool) and then use one of the alternates.

RACE MECHANICS really have too much to do AND they do not have time to fiddle with the chain ... so, the typical rider benefits from Shimano providing the installation pins with their chains.​

Since I am not in a hurry, spending a few (many!?!) extra minutes installing a chain is not a big deal to me ....

It's like waxing one's skis ...

A person can think of it is as either a chore or an opportunity to decompress while approaching a pseudo-zen bond with the skis/(whatever) ...​

Consequently, I will say that the key to successfully 're-using' the pin is to ensure that the plates are not distorted ...

AND, if you have distorted the plate, then that is the problem ...

AND, you should anticipate needing to pony up €15 +/- for an appropriate chain tool which is designed for a 9-/10-/11-speed chain..

 

[mrvlhs]

Shimano's Wayne Stetina says, "Never, never never (flex the link sideways to free it) especially 10-speed, but also for 9-speed chains. We need to get people away from this lazy bad habit when installing Shimano chains. If a Shimano chain does not move freely, the pin is not correctly seated in the back plate. If it is correctly seated, it WILL automatically be correctly centered. Loosening it like this may cause the connector pin to pull out of the plate. It will definitely cause a 10-speed chain to fail."

After some time around the chain, having one side protude the same as the other doesn't make the chain free

 

[alfeng]

Shimano's Wayne Stetina says, "Never, never never (flex the link sideways to free it) especially 10-speed, but also for 9-speed chains. We need to get people away from this lazy bad habit when installing Shimano chains. If a Shimano chain does not move freely, the pin is not correctly seated in the back plate. If it is correctly seated, it WILL automatically be correctly centered. Loosening it like this may cause the connector pin to pull out of the plate. It will definitely cause a 10-speed chain to fail."

ACK ...

You have misunderstood what I was saying ...​

I have no disagreement with what Wayne Stetina says with regard to chain installation ...

BTW. I was a little surprised (¿a few years ago?) when I think that he (or someone else from Shimano while he was attending the Sea Otter Classic) indicated with some surprise that a an older (might-or-must have been a 10-speed) wheel worked in the bike outfitted with what must-have-been some pre-production 11-speed shifters.

I mean, do they NOT (have) test(s of) all their components with all available possibilities?!?

Well, they may not; but, I do.
​

There is nothing wrong with Stetina repeating dogma, but YOU should always question information which comes from factory reps because they may be good at reading tech sheets & recommendations, but ....

​

You want to move/("manipulate") the PIN to-and-fro whereby you are pushing it from side to side until "the pin is correctly seated" ...

And, when the chain pivots freely on the pin then YOU will know that you are good-to-go.
​

Regardless, if you have splayed the dorsal/"back"/either plate away from the interior/shrouded link, then you have damaged that plate ...

Again, YOU presumably-and-probably need to buy a different chain tool which is designed to handle a 9-/10-/11-speed chain.
​

After some time around the chain, having one side protude the same as the other doesn't make the chain free

FYI ...

I wasn't kidding when I suggested that it could take "many minutes" to install the pin ...

To the point where it may become frustratingly tedious.

It is MORE than a visual adjustment where the pin appears to protrude from the chain equally ...​

Regardless, while pushing the pin to-and-fro can seem to be a tedious endeavor with little hope of success, you will eventually be able to seat the pin correctly as long as the plates have not been damaged.

.

 

[mrvlhs]

The chain is currently free, there's just not an equal protrusion on both sides. It's almost flush on one side and there's a considerable protrusion on the other. After some good time around it I have found this is the only position where it works.

 

[alfeng]

The chain is currently free, there's just not an equal protrusion on both sides. It's almost flush on one side and there's a considerable protrusion on the other. After some good time around it I have found this is the only position where it works.

.
HMMmmm ....

At this point, all I can suggest is that you bring your chain tool + the extra installation pin with you on ALL of your rides!

Hopefully, you'll never need to use them away from the friendly confines of your home ...

However, depending on how quickly you are riding when the chain comes off, you'll probably need to look between 10 meters & 30 meters behind where you finally stop.​

 

[mrvlhs]

I don't have an extra installation pin, the one that was supplied with the chain is already installed.

I used the technique of reusing the pins from the chain to measure it, but then finished the job with the special pin.

 

[alfeng]

Oh ...

Back in the Cretaceous Period, Shimano used to include two connecting pins with each new chain ... I guess that's not true, now.

No matter ...

Regardless, I think that it won't hurt for you to bring your chain tool with you when you go riding.​