machanical disc or hydrolic rim



P

Paul

Guest
brakes that is.

I'm thinking of getting a HPVelotechnic Grasshopper (I'm
only waiting for them to come in the shops - any time now
according to Bikefix in london)

Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical rim
brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of these
(or simalar) systems and would like to comment. The bike
will be used mainly on road with some easy trail riding. No
hard off roarding!

cheers in advance

Paul.

ps. sorry if you've already seen this on .recumbents, I'm
only just getting the hang of ngs outside work :)
 
A

Ambrose Nankive

Guest
In news:[email protected],
paul <[email protected]> typed:
> brakes that is.
>
> I'm thinking of getting a HPVelotechnic Grasshopper (I'm
> only waiting for them to come in the shops - any time now
> according to Bikefix in london)
>
> Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
> includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical
> rim brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of
> these (or simalar) systems and would like to comment. The
> bike will be used mainly on road with some easy trail
> riding. No hard off roarding!

I'm very happy with the response on my Avid mechanical
discs. I'm a fan of discs because I hate the feeling of
grinding my rims away when I brake and the amount of
disgusting foul brake dust that gets on your hands if you
have to take the wheel off when you have rim brakes. Thats
my 2p worth.

A
 
T

Tony Raven

Guest
paul wrote:
>
> Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
> includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical
> rim brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of
> these (or simalar) systems and would like to comment. The
> bike will be used mainly on road with some easy trail
> riding. No hard off roarding!
>

I've not heard of Tektonic mechanical disk brakes but would
be wary as they are not a known name like Avid. I have Hope
disks and Magura rim brakes and while the disks are great,
for this particular application I would be inclined towards
the Maguras. The hydraulics make such a difference to the
performance and the feel that I would go for hydraulics over
mechanical.

Tony
 
P

Peter Clinch

Guest
paul wrote:

> I'm thinking of getting a HPVelotechnic Grasshopper (I'm
> only waiting for them to come in the shops - any time now
> according to Bikefix in london)
>
> Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
> includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical
> rim brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of
> these (or simalar) systems and would like to comment.

Ah, Roos is playing the same game, wondering when the
Kinetics one will land ("In March", and it *is* March!), and
wondering which boxes to tick if the GH is indeed the Magic
Bike. I'm assuming the Default brakes will be Tektro Vs as
on the Streetmachine GT, which is what I've got and they're
perfectly adequate so you don't *need* to spend any more.
Having said that, I've also tried mechanical discs,
hydraulic rims and hydraulic discs on various bikes over
time, and my feelings are as follows:

hydraulic rims, not actually that much (if any) more
powerful but *much* smoother and basically a pleasure to use
with, AIUI, less adjusting to be done with time.

mech discs, better than the mech rim brakes with more
ooomph, and no worries about trashing your rims over
time any more.

hydraulic discs, if you're going to town you might as well
go to the big city and march down the main street with a
high kicking chorus, easily the best brakes I've ever used.
Very smooth, easy to modulate and

especially handy on a 'bent as you won't sail over the bars
if you really slam on the anchors.

I'd dither between the hydro rims and mech discs, both have
their nice points. But if I had the money I'd get hydraulic
discs. Though I haven't had major traumas that I didn't have
the money and have the standard V brakes!

Another issue is what other extras are you looking at. I
would especially recommend the hub dynamo setup, especially
if you're looking at the underseat steering. It's brilliant
anyway, but underseat steering gives you one place less to
mount lamps, but even without that particular gotcha I would
unhesitatingly recommend getting the SON supplied with the
bike over and above any brake upgrades unless you never ride
in the dark or twilight.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext.
33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177
Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email protected]
http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
paul posted ...

> brakes that is.
>
> I'm thinking of getting a HPVelotechnic Grasshopper (I'm
> only waiting for them to come in the shops - any time now
> according to Bikefix in london)
>
> Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
> includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical
> rim brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of
> these (or simalar) systems and would like to comment. The
> bike will be used mainly on road with some easy trail
> riding. No hard off roarding!

Hydraulics over mechanics for braking systems in my book.
More powerful, generally, and certainly more 'feel' and
controllability.

--
Paul

(8(|) Homer rocks .. ;)
 
F

Frobnitz

Guest
"paul" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
> includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical
> rim brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of
> these (or simalar) systems and would like to comment. The
> bike will be used mainly on road with some easy trail
> riding. No hard off roarding!

I recently bought a Streetmachine with the Magura HS33 rim
brakes, and they're very good. Not really much more powerful
than standard Vs, but I've always found standard Vs
perfectly adequate. The main advantages are that they are
silky smooth, and uniformly light throughout the braking
sequence - even if you need to brake hard, you don't have to
put much extra force into the levers - I have bolts in my
wrists which limit my power, and the brakes have been a
lifesaver (particularly when learning the fine art of riding
a SWB USS 'bent). Adjustment is a doddle (even if the
fluorescent stars that are the adjusters look a tad
delicate), replacing the pads is trivial, the pads are
reasonably cheap (the Koolstop pads are about 14quid a set
of four). The main downside is that removing a wheel to e.g.
repair a puncture is a tad fiddly - you have to dismount one
side of the brakes - not as serious as it sounds, the brakes
are separate units on each side, one having a QR lever,
linked by a hydraulic pipe and the "brake booster" arch, but
still something to think about on a cold Scots morning when
you've dragged off two layers of gloves and your fingers
have the mechanical dexterity of frozen sausages.

Enjoy the Grasshopper - looks a sorted machine

E
 
M

Mark Van Gorkom

Guest
>Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
>includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical
>rim brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of
>these (or simalar) systems and would like to comment. The
>bike will be used mainly on road with some easy trail
>riding. No hard off roarding!
>
Never had mechanical discs, but tried three kinds of
hydraulics (Magura Julie and Louise and Shimano Deore) and
finally gave up in desparation. Soon as the roads are wet
the brakes start dragging, eating up the pads at a
frightfull rate. The Julie had a tendency to stick, and the
(old style) Louise needs fairly frequent adjustment.
Swapping pads is also less than straightforward, and the
pads are expensive. The HS11 on my last two bikes worked
flawlessy, the pads lasted forever (and changing them takes
seconds), and personally, I've not noticed any rim wear, not
even on the (very heavy and semi faired) Streetmachine,
where I only ever used the front brake (couldn't fit a
Magura under the tailbox). I'm told mechanical discs have
better clearance, so they shouldn't drag quite so much, but
unless you only ever ride in dry wheather, I'd stick with
hydraulic rim brakes.

Me, I'm switching to a front rollerbrake; can't fit rim
brakes on my Baron, unfortunately

Mark van Gorkom
 
P

Peter Clinch

Guest
Mark van Gorkom wrote:

> Never had mechanical discs, but tried three kinds of
> hydraulics (Magura Julie and Louise and Shimano Deore) and
> finally gave up in desparation. Soon as the roads are wet
> the brakes start dragging, eating up the pads at a
> frightfull rate. The Julie had a tendency to stick, and
> the (old style) Louise needs fairly frequent adjustment.

Just a note that my hyd. disc praise was only based on dry
weather riding...

I'm fairly seriously considering retrofitting the Mag rim
brakes to the Streetmachine after hearing nothing but good
of them and using them for a day (and a rather wet one at
that) around bits of the NL on a Mistral and finding the
brakes to be the only outstandingly positive thing I had to
say about the whole bike!

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext.
33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177
Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email protected]
http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
 
T

Tony Raven

Guest
Mark van Gorkom wrote:
>
> Never had mechanical discs, but tried three kinds of
> hydraulics (Magura Julie and Louise and Shimano Deore) and
> finally gave up in desparation. Soon as the roads are wet
> the brakes start dragging, eating up the pads at a
> frightfull rate. The Julie had a tendency to stick, and
> the (old style) Louise needs fairly frequent adjustment.
> Swapping pads is also less than straightforward, and the
> pads are expensive.

Never had anything remotely like that on my Hope discs and
not heard of it as a Magura or Shimano problem. As for
eating pads, I've ridden off-road in areas where you can get
through a couple of sets of rim brake pads in a ride because
of the abrasive soil. The rim brakes, apart from getting
less muck on them last a lot lot longer in those conditions
so I'm suprised you are eating up pads.

Tony
 
D

Dave Larrington

Guest
Tony Raven wrote:

> Never had anything remotely like that on my Hope discs and
> not heard of it as a Magura or Shimano problem. As for
> eating pads, I've ridden off-road in areas where you can
> get through a couple of sets of rim brake pads in a ride
> because of the abrasive soil. The rim brakes, apart from
> getting less muck on them last a lot lot longer in those
> conditions so I'm suprised you are eating up pads.

What Tony said. And replacing the pads on Hope discs is
quicker than replacing 'em on any other brake I've tried.
The V-brakes with the pads held in by pins are OK as long as
you can get the pin back in with the pad in situ, which, on
the rear of my tourer, appears to be impossible. Bah!

I agree about the cost of pads though. A set for a car costs
less. Bah encore!

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
===========================================================
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
===========================================================
 
J

Just Zis Guy

Guest
"Simon Brooke" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> I'd praise hydraulic discs (I have Hayes HFX9) in any
> weather. Their stopping power in absolutely foul
> conditions is little short of amazing, and their drag
> negligable. So far (six months) no nead for any
> maintenance whatsoever.

YHDMV. Magura Julies are permanently on, squeal like a road
owner caught on camera, wear out pads in about 1,500 miles
and are generally functionally sub-optimal. But Hope and
Hayes are, I am reliably informed, much better.

--
Guy
===
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after
posting. http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at
Washington University
 
D

Dave Kahn

Guest
On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:15:39 -0000, "Just zis Guy, you know?"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>YHDMV. Magura Julies are permanently on, squeal like a road
>owner caught on camera, wear out pads in about 1,500 miles
>and are generally functionally sub-optimal.

That's not so bad then. The brake pads outlast the frame. (I
know - kick a man when he's down and all that.)

--
Dave...

Get a bicycle. You will not regret it. If you live. -
Mark Twain
 
J

Just Zis Guy

Guest
On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 22:26:11 +0000, Dave Kahn <[email protected]>
wrote in message <[email protected]>:

>>YHDMV. Magura Julies are permanently on, squeal like a
>>road owner caught on camera, wear out pads in about 1,500
>>miles and are generally functionally sub-optimal.

>That's not so bad then. The brake pads outlast the frame.

Low blow :-(

--
Guy
===
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University
 
D

Dave Kahn

Guest
On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 22:29:03 +0000, "Just zis Guy, you know?"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>>That's not so bad then. The brake pads outlast the frame.
>
>Low blow :-(

Yes it was a bit evil. Sorry about that.

--
Dave...

Get a bicycle. You will not regret it. If you live. -
Mark Twain
 
A

Anonymous Cowar

Guest
Ambrose Nankivell wrote:

> In news:[email protected],
> paul <[email protected]> typed:
>> brakes that is.
>>
>> I'm thinking of getting a HPVelotechnic Grasshopper (I'm
>> only waiting for them to come in the shops - any time now
>> according to Bikefix in london)
>>
>> Anyway, I want to upgrade the brakes, and the option list
>> includes Magura hydro rim brakes and Tektonic mechanical
>> rim brakes. So has anyone got any experience in either of
>> these (or simalar) systems and would like to comment. The
>> bike will be used mainly on road with some easy trail
>> riding. No hard off roarding!
>
> I'm very happy with the response on my Avid mechanical
> discs. I'm a fan of discs because I hate the feeling of
> grinding my rims away when I brake and the amount of
> disgusting foul brake dust that gets on your hands if you
> have to take the wheel off when you have rim brakes. Thats
> my 2p worth.
>
> A

I too have eaten away rims in the past with my magura rim
brakes. At one time I was using the wrong sort of pads - but
I think it's a problem at the best of times.

Magura rim brakes stand up wonderfully to mud, grit, salt
and all the other killers of mechanical brake cables, but
they don't stand up very well to being pulled and bent in
bike racks, IME.

AC
 
D

Dave Larrington

Guest
Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

> YHDMV. Magura Julies are permanently on, squeal like a
> road owner caught on camera, wear out pads in about 1,500
> miles and are generally functionally sub-optimal. But Hope
> and Hayes are, I am reliably informed, much better.

The Julies which were original equipment on Cosimo didn't
suffer from any of these problems, but /did/ have:

o ****-poor stopping power, and o levers made of cheese

The former could be because they never got properly bedded
in - Magura recommend 30 stops from 30 km/h, a figure which
requires about three years of racing. However, I have
replaced them with Hope Mono Minis, which are lighter and
look massively more posy. The Julies are migrating onto my
mountain bike. If they do turn out to be Very Poor in
regular use, I can probably live with it as that bike
doesn't see a great deal of use.

Or I can put the V-brakes back on :-(

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
===========================================================
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
===========================================================