Manolo Saiz arrested

[cyclingheroes]

Leblanc tried to ban Saiz from the race once before - in 1999. Guess who told ASO they had to have Saiz on the race? Yup, those whiter than white types over at the UCI - who have been responsible for reintegrating riders that the TdF have wanted excluded time and time again.

If the UCI were doing their job in terms of cleaning up the sport then there would have been no vacuum for WADA to fill. The fact that this huge scandal has erupted with the ProTour 'ethics code' in place is purely laughable.

Agreed!

But what i ment was: altough they say they would even ban a team with a rider like Vino (that's what Leblanc ment), he says (in the radsportnews.com article) he could understand that riders protect their team manager (he ment the remarks by Vino about Saiz last Saturday). Than the attack against Saiz (hooliganism..). So i have a feeling he actually said: get rid of Saiz or face the consequenses (not riding the Tour) There was a lot Leblanc said between the lines...

 

[whiteboytrash]

I get the feeling that Saiz was questioned prior to the arrest (maybe around the time of Heras ?) and agreed to collaborate with the Spanish Guard in the 'sting' in agreement for immunity. This is why Vino said he is innocent. Saiz knew what he was doing and was working with the police to set up Eufemiano Fuentes.

Agreed!

But what i ment was: altough they say they would even ban a team with a rider like Vino (that's what Leblanc ment), he says (in the radsportnews.com article) he could understand that riders protect their team manager (he ment the remarks by Vino about Saiz last Saturday). Than the attack against Saiz (hooliganism..). So i have a feeling he actually said: get rid of Saiz or face the consequenses (not riding the Tour) There was a lot Leblanc said between the lines...

 

[cyclingheroes]

I get the feeling that Saiz was questioned prior to the arrest (maybe around the time of Heras ?) and agreed to collaborate with the Spanish Guard in the 'sting' in agreement for immunity. This is why Vino said he is innocent. Saiz knew what he was doing and was working with the police to set up Eufemiano Fuentes.

Intresting tought.... Or do you know more about it?

 

[musette]

It's an impossible proposition. Who would put himself through this, including Saiz? But this is the kind of thing that people who speculate might speculate about.

 

[bobke]

It's an impossible proposition. Who would put himself through this, including Saiz? But this is the kind of thing that people who speculate might speculate about.

Right, his reputation and career are ruined just now, and it won't work for him to come out a week from now and say he was used in a sting. The only time this happens in the real world is when soneone (Saiz) is caught and guilty and agrees to turn states evidence and help other big and bigger fish get caught and go down. It doesnt mean innocence.
Besdies the whole thing is speculative and utter nonsense, just my two cents.
He is absolutely guilty and Vino is too or monumentally stupid..

 

[whiteboytrash]

Right, his reputation and career are ruined just now, and it won't work for him to come out a week from now and say he was used in a sting. The only time this happens in the real world is when soneone (Saiz) is caught and guilty and agrees to turn states evidence and help other big and bigger fish get caught and go down. It doesnt mean innocence.
Besdies the whole thing is speculative and utter nonsense, just my two cents.
He is absolutely guilty and Vino is too or monumentally stupid..

I agree with you but I still think there is a twist. Yes Saiz is guilty but I believe not to face criminal charges he may have helped to fry the big fish. Or have I been watching to many De Niro movies ?

 

[alibat]

Just when does anyone think that the truth is going to come out, if at all? All we've had so far is speculation. Eg, firstly it is reported that 'all the big names except Valverde' are implicated, then later you read that he is. Until a list is disclosed there's not a lot you can do. The only rider we know with certainty has entered the building which houses the clinic is Sevilla, because he has admitted it (and I have to say, much as I like the guy I find his explanation suspect). Will it all come out and blow up during the Tour? As for Saiz being involved with a sting to get a lighter sentence, it's not beyond the realms of possibility but would he risk his team not being entered for the Tour? If it had all come out earlier, the team would have had time to reorganise and get a new DS for example. Flyer would have had a field day with all of this.....

 

[musette]

I wonder if Vino's contract says that he can leave if Liberty Seguros/successor team becomes non-ProTour or is barred from the Tour? Vino's advisors may not have contemplated such a possibility, no?

Even if Vino could technically leave, maybe Vino is being realistic. Apart from TM which will not want him as a leader for obvious reasons, it's too late for Vino to coordinate with any other team and be effective in the Tour, even if A-Wurth were excluded.

 

[cyclingheroes]

Apart from TM which will not want him as a leader for obvious reasons, it's too late for Vino to coordinate with any other team and be effective in the Tour, even if A-Wurth were excluded.

Agributel?

 

[musette]

OK, they would want him, but he would not have worked with any of that team's existing riders and presumably would be taking at most one or two key helpers with him to his new team.

 

[cyclingheroes]

Several amateur riders started the iniative "Fans gegen Doping" (which means fans against doping). A beta version of their website (in German) is online at: http://www.silver-solutions.de/fgd/

 

[cyclingheroes]

OK, they would want him, but he would not have worked with any of that team's existing riders and presumably would be taking at most one or two key helpers with him to his new team.

I don't think he will join Agributel, but who knows what he will do if ASO bans Astana from the TdF. On the other hand: ASO and the UCI fear they have to pay huge amounts of money... (the word goes round that the Kazach sponsors will sue them and demand millions if they take away the protour license from the team)

 

[cyclingheroes]

Here is a link to British Europsport of an interview with Vino (the interview is from today): http://www.eurosport.com/cycling/sport_sto900008.shtml

 

[moviekindoflife]

Vino's website has a mention that Unibet has contacted ASO about taking over for any team who's invitation to the tour is taken away. They also said that if Astana/Liberty are not included then they would gladly have Vino ride for them.

 

[cyclingheroes]

Vino's website has a mention that Unibet has contacted ASO about taking over for any team who's invitation to the tour is taken away. They also said that if Astana/Liberty are not included then they would gladly have Vino ride for them.

In the Belgium press i read the same but Leblanc already said that ASO wouldn't invite other teams if they ban Astana and/or Valenciana...

 

[whiteboytrash]

Would it be fair to say without Armstrong in the peleton riders now feel less inhibited to speak their minds on doping ? I think so... Casar and now Voeckler voicing their opinions... The tide is turning....
_______
Vinokourov was responding to a comment in the French press by Bouygues Telecom rider Thomas Voeckler who said of the suggestion that the team would be sponsored by Astana, the capital of Kazakhstan, "Ils sont gonflés." It's not clear whether Vinokourov has picked up on the double meaning of 'gonflés' in French. Voeckler's comment could mean, "They're pumped up," or "They're arrogant."

Voeckler said he felt ashamed to wear the same turquoise colours of Bouygues Telecom on his gloves as the one of the renamed Astana-Würth Spanish based squad. "If they're cheats in this affair, hopefully there will be sanctions as well and not only some noise," he added.

 

[cyclingheroes]

Would it be fair to say without Armstrong in the peleton riders now feel less inhibited to speak their minds on doping ? I think so... Casar and now Voeckler voicing their opinions... The tide is turning....

No that wouldn't be fair, but yes i also have the feeling the tide is turning, more and more riders (Franch) speak out.

 

[whiteboytrash]

No that wouldn't be fair, but yes i also have the feeling the tide is turning, more and more riders (Franch) speak out.

Ok but agree that more and more riders are now speaking out without facing retribution... Vergeltung ? Agree its mostly French riders who have the most stringent drug testing laws of any cycling nation in the world. I think they are happy that the rest of the world is coming back to the pack…..

 

[whiteboytrash]

Didn't USPS use Actovegin to stop cut & abbrasions ?

Interviú publishes Fuentes' drug list

Spanish weekly Interviú has published a list of the drugs seized by the Civil Guard from doctor Eufemiano Fuentes as part of 'Operación Puerto'. Although the case is still under investigation by the courts, Interviú reports that Fuentes had "Chinese EPO and growth hormone. Other substances seized were corticosteroids, peptide hormones, testosterone, Actovegin, and HMG Lepori. These products, in their therapeutic use, are used to treat cancer, rheumatism, asthma, and sterility."

 

[rejobako]

Would it be fair to say without Armstrong in the peleton riders now feel less inhibited to speak their minds on doping ? I think so...

Right. There was never any comment about doping when Armstrong was around.

Do you actually watch cycling, or do you just go to sniff Jan's sweet German rump?