Mari Holden - Still Alive?

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Ken Very Big Li, Oct 9, 2003.

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  1. What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's TT...

    ---
    Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar
     
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  2. Ken Very Big Liar <[email protected]> writes:

    > What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's TT...
    >
    > ---
    > Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar

    I thought she was riding for TMO (T-Mobile)

    She rode some World Cup events this year too.

    --
    le vent a Dos

    Davey Crockett
     
  3. "Ken Very Big Liar" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's
    TT...
    >
    > ---
    > Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar

    That website is pretty awful. Yeah, Mari is probaby still high on TT victories from the past which
    isn't that much to brag about. She hasn't won anything to speak of in quite a while. Word is she has
    been eating too much Ice Cream. Also some people think Mari looks like an alien.

    B-
     
  4. She looked pretty strong in SF.

    http://littlechainring.com/tmobileintl2003/sfgp%20306.jpg

    Mark VandenBerghe

    "Bruce Johnston" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Ken Very Big Liar" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's
    > TT...
    > >
    > > ---
    > > Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar
    >
    > That website is pretty awful. Yeah, Mari is probaby still high on TT victories from the past which
    > isn't that much to brag about. She hasn't
    won
    > anything to speak of in quite a while. Word is she has been eating too
    much
    > Ice Cream. Also some people think Mari looks like an alien.
    >
    > B-
     
  5. K. J. Papai

    K. J. Papai Guest

    Davey Crockett <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]rs.com>...
    > Ken Very Big Liar <[email protected]> writes:
    >
    > > What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's TT...
    > >
    > > ---
    > > Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar
    >
    > I thought she was riding for TMO (T-Mobile)
    >
    > She rode some World Cup events this year too.

    She also was racing at San Rafael and San Francisco last month, Sept. 13-14.

    -Ken
     
  6. Scott Patton

    Scott Patton Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, Bruce Johnston <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >"Ken Very Big Liar" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's
    >TT...
    >>
    >> ---
    >> Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar
    >
    >That website is pretty awful. Yeah, Mari is probaby still high on TT victories from the past which
    >isn't that much to brag about. She hasn't won anything to speak of in quite a while. Word is she
    >has been eating too much Ice Cream. Also some people think Mari looks like an alien.
    >
    >B-
    >
    >

    I wouldn't go so far as to say awful. Horribly out of date, maybe, but not awful...

    Mari has been focusing more on track this year, looking to do well in the pursuit.

    As Ken pointed out, she was also in San Fran for both races. I am 99% sure she did the Giro, but
    don't recall.

    She just hasn't sent me much content and I don't have time to followe her around.

    Scott Webmaster - MariHolden.com

    --
    -*- Scott Patton -*- Colorado Springs, CO -*- http://www.FixedGearFever.com -*- Track Racing
    Web Services
     
  7. Racer X

    Racer X Guest

    Mari appears to be on the receiving end of flagrant favorable treatment from the US National team
    most likely as payback because she won silver in Sydney and took the rainbow jersey at Worlds that
    same year. Actually everyone knows Leontien van Moorsel was the real world champion TT'er in 2000
    (Mari only won the rainbow because van Moorsel skipped Worlds after the Olympics). I mean, everybody
    knows the best men TTers are Ullrich and Armstrong, not the guy who wins Worlds.

    Mari isn't even within 4 minutes of the winner anymore at US Nationals ITT, and it's very unclear
    how she could have even qualified for the Worlds road team this year considering she hasn't won (or
    podiumed?) in a single NRC race in the past 3 years.

    Her spot on T-Mobile is doing nothing but retarding the development of younger riders with more
    potential who better deserve the opportunity.

    Her website is a reflection of her complete lack of results in the past 3 years. She'll likely
    finish 20 minutes down in the road race on Saturday and then right afterwards sign a 2 year
    extention with T-Mobile.

    Politics as usual.

    Racer X

    Ken Very Big Liar wrote:

    > What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's TT...
    >
    > ---
    > Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar
     
  8. K. J. Papai

    K. J. Papai Guest

    "Mark VandenBerghe" <>...
    > She looked pretty strong in SF. http://littlechainring.com/tmobileintl2003/sfgp%20306.jpg Mark
    > VandenBerghe

    Nice expression there!

    I'll have to post my favorite Holden Fillmore photo too I hope I remember to do this tonight....

    -Ken

    >
    > "Bruce Johnston" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > > "Ken Very Big Liar" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    > > > What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's
    > TT...
    > > >
    > > > ---
    > > > Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar
    > >
    > > That website is pretty awful. Yeah, Mari is probaby still high on TT victories from the past
    > > which isn't that much to brag about. She hasn't
    > won
    > > anything to speak of in quite a while. Word is she has been eating too
    > much
    > > Ice Cream. Also some people think Mari looks like an alien.

    Not really?!

    Bruce you might look like an alien too dude!

    -kjp
     
  9. "RACER X" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Mari appears to be on the receiving end of flagrant favorable treatment
    from the
    > US National team most likely as payback because she won silver in Sydney
    and
    > took the rainbow jersey at Worlds that same year. Actually everyone knows Leontien van Moorsel was
    > the real world champion TT'er in 2000 (Mari only
    won
    > the rainbow because van Moorsel skipped Worlds after the Olympics). I
    mean,
    > everybody knows the best men TTers are Ullrich and Armstrong, not the guy
    who
    > wins Worlds.
    >
    > Mari isn't even within 4 minutes of the winner anymore at US Nationals
    ITT, and
    > it's very unclear how she could have even qualified for the Worlds road
    team
    > this year considering she hasn't won (or podiumed?) in a single NRC race
    in the
    > past 3 years.
    >
    > Her spot on T-Mobile is doing nothing but retarding the development of
    younger
    > riders with more potential who better deserve the opportunity.
    >
    > Her website is a reflection of her complete lack of results in the past 3 years. She'll likely
    > finish 20 minutes down in the road race on Saturday
    and
    > then right afterwards sign a 2 year extention with T-Mobile.
    >
    > Politics as usual.
    >
    >
    > Racer X

    Exactly! You sound very much like someone I know.
    >
    >
    >
    > Ken Very Big Liar wrote:
    >
    > > What's up with her? Website has old content, no showing at the World's
    TT...
    > >
    > > ---
    > > Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar
     
  10. RACER X <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<3F8[email protected]>...
    > Mari appears to be on the receiving end of flagrant favorable treatment from the US National team
    > most likely as payback because she won silver in Sydney and took the rainbow jersey at Worlds that
    > same year. Actually everyone knows Leontien van Moorsel was the real world champion TT'er in 2000
    > (Mari only won the rainbow because van Moorsel skipped Worlds after the Olympics). I mean,
    > everybody knows the best men TTers are Ullrich and Armstrong, not the guy who wins Worlds.
    >
    > >>SNIP<<

    Miller has beaten both Ullrich and Armstrong. Everybody knows the World Champion, for that year, is
    the person who wins the World Championships. Now you know why the Worlds are held annualy.

    This is the second post I have seen from you belittling racers for not beating other racers who did
    not participate. By this logic no present day racers are faster than the pros of yesteryear because
    they never went head to head. Clearly, the winner of a race beats everyone who raced AND all those
    who did not choose to race. How many races do you win if you don't enter any races? Obviously none.
    If a racer does not enter a race he cannot claim he would have beaten the winner. The winner of the
    world championship race, therefore, is the world champion. Any one COULD have entered the race. If
    they didn't, they did not win and cannot be the world champion. You seem to have an axe to grind.
    You appear to feel the Worlds are held too late in the season. Possibly. The Vuelta used to be held
    early in the season. Its reputation suffered because the great racers would regularly skip it. Now
    it is later in the season and lots of the great racers regularly skip it. Moving the date of the
    Worlds would not make it any more valid as a "true Worlds" as at any given time some racers would
    have to skip it. Who shows up race day can win. All others do not compare. Mike
     
  11. Bob Schwartz

    Bob Schwartz Guest

    scott patton <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Mari has been focusing more on track this year, looking to do well in the pursuit.

    Then it would appear that she needs more focus. A 4:06 at nationals is not a very high standard,
    especially for a rider of her ability.

    I'll bet you could get Longo up in the middle of the night and she could do a 4:06 with no warmup.

    Bob Schwartz [email protected]
     
  12. "Bob Schwartz" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > scott patton <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > Mari has been focusing more on track this year, looking to do well in the pursuit.
    >
    > Then it would appear that she needs more focus. A 4:06 at nationals is not a very high standard,
    > especially for a rider of her ability.

    Dumbass -

    Wow, 4:06 is really bad.

    I'll bet a fifth of the Fatties in this group might be able to manage that standard.
     
  13. Bob Schwartz

    Bob Schwartz Guest

    RACER X <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Mari appears to be on the receiving end of flagrant favorable treatment from the US National team
    > most likely as payback because she won silver in Sydney and took the rainbow jersey at Worlds that
    > same year.

    Well, if you were into conspiracy theories you might conclude that her spot on T-Mobile was payback
    for her support of Thom's takeover of USAC.

    > Mari isn't even within 4 minutes of the winner anymore at US Nationals ITT, and it's very unclear
    > how she could have even qualified for the Worlds road team this year considering she hasn't won
    > (or podiumed?) in a single NRC race in the past 3 years.

    > Her spot on T-Mobile is doing nothing but retarding the development of younger riders with more
    > potential who better deserve the opportunity.

    There are two ways of looking at it. One is that no deserving rider was denied by her participation.
    In spite of the fall off in results in the last few years, the list of US riders with any UCI points
    at all is not long.

    The other is that the US would be better off letting some bumpkin gain experience than allowing Mari
    to add to her long list of Worlds RR DNFs. And the other side of *that* is that you commit to the
    bumpkin with potential at the beginning of the season, not the end by putting an inexperienced rider
    into a high level event.

    As it stands now she is sort of like the female Kenny Labbe. Kenny has marketing value as a real
    letter carrier and makes his living from that. I'll bet if you took a look at the team's financials
    you would see that he is not a drain on the team's resources.

    And so it may be with Mari. She has value as an Olympic and Worlds medalist and it is entirely
    possible that this is reflected in the sponsorship with T-Mobile. It is possible but certainly not a
    given that her presence on the team is diverting resources from rider development. My guess is that
    this is not the case.

    > Her website is a reflection of her complete lack of results in the past 3 years. She'll likely
    > finish 20 minutes down in the road race on Saturday and then right afterwards sign a 2 year
    > extention with T-Mobile.

    DNF Mari Holden (USA)

    She does not have a history of finishing the Worlds RR. Finishing 20 minutes down would require some
    improvement.

    Bob Schwartz [email protected]
     
  14. "Bob Schwartz" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    > The other is that the US would be better off letting some bumpkin gain experience than allowing
    > Mari to add to her long list of Worlds RR DNFs.

    Dumbass -

    There were some non-bumpkins who were left at home.
     
  15. Bob Schwartz

    Bob Schwartz Guest

    Kurgan Gringioni <[email protected]> wrote:

    > "Bob Schwartz" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >>
    >> The other is that the US would be better off letting some bumpkin gain experience than allowing
    >> Mari to add to her long list of Worlds RR DNFs.

    > Dumbass -

    > There were some non-bumpkins who were left at home.

    OK, this inspired me to go check the rankings. Here are the US riders with UCI points:

    Name Age Points Ranking Demet-Barry 31 166 20 Neben 28 152 22 Bruckner 33 126 29 Armstrong 30 80 45
    Mayolo 37 25 81 Anderson 35 22 84 Berger-Grove 29 12 113 Gaggioli ?? 12 113 Miller 30 9 132 Holden
    32 7 148 Albert 35 5 164 Thorburn 34 4 182 Begosh 27 1 237 Breon 37 1 237 Cowden 30 1 237 Van
    Gilder 39 1 237

    Note: Nicole Freedman is riding for Israel.

    My assumption is that any favortism on USAC's part is towards the team and not to any specific
    rider. That is to say, if Holden got a spot over another T-Mobile rider there was a valid reason for
    it. If that is true then the only riders with better numbers are Gaggioli and Miller, and then only
    marginally.

    The thing that this list makes apparent is that the US is not busting open with young talent. So if
    you are going to send riders to races to gain international experience, you send them to San Fran or
    Sea Otter and not Worlds.

    There is a ton of difference comparing this list to a comparable one for the Aussies, for example.

    Bob Schwartz [email protected]
     
  16. "Bob Schwartz" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Kurgan Gringioni <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > OK, this inspired me to go check the rankings. Here are the US riders with UCI points:
    >
    > Name Age Points Ranking Demet-Barry 31 166 20 Neben 28 152 22 Bruckner 33 126 29 Armstrong 30 80
    > 45 Mayolo 37 25 81 Anderson 35 22 84 Berger-Grove 29 12 113 Gaggioli ?? 12 113 Miller 30 9 132
    > Holden 32 7 148 Albert 35 5 164 Thorburn 34 4 182 Begosh 27 1 237 Breon 37 1 237 Cowden 30 1 237
    > Van Gilder 39 1 237
    >
    > Note: Nicole Freedman is riding for Israel.
    >
    > My assumption is that any favortism on USAC's part is towards the team and not to any
    > specific rider.

    <snip>

    Dumbass -

    Politics.
     
  17. "Davey Crockett" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
    > >>
    > >> Name Age Points Ranking Holden 32 7 148
    >
    > Hmmmmm. Davey wonders how old she was when she won the Tour de France?
    >
    > 32 - 20 (roughly) == 12
    >

    Ok, I'm confused. Who is mixing up Mari Holden with Marianne Martin?
     
  18. "Bob Schwartz" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    > I'll bet you could get Longo up in the middle of the night and she could do a 4:06 with no warmup.
    >

    Of course. Think of all the adrenaline she'd be pumping when she was rudely awakened.
     
  19. Nick Burns

    Nick Burns Guest

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