<
[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> William Kemp writes:
>
> >>> Those tests were done on a smooth drum of course. How important are the energy losses
> >>> associated with going over a rough surface with less suspension (from higher pressure in the
> >>> tires)?
>
> >> Maybe you can describe a model of what you believe happens on a paved road of typical asphalt
> >> roughness that would change rolling resistance response of a tire. Do not omit an energy
> >> equation that shows where these losses are converted to heat, the result of all energy losses.
> >> Note that tire deflection from a rider sitting on the bicycle is greater than pavement
> >> roughness, that is if this enters into the model you visualize.
>
> > Ah, I see, If I cannot give you a realistic scenario based on science I am not allowed to even
> > ask whether there is an effect caused by rough roads.
>
> Certainly there is an effect of rough roads but it is not one that will change the nature of
> reducing rolling resistance as pressure is increased. The amount of tire distortion increases with
> roughness as does rolling resistance. You can test that if you have a suitable road by riding on
> or off the chip seal and noting the speed. I had the opportunity of doing that on the north slope
> of Monitor Pass on US 395. There was a repeatably lower speed on the rougher surface.
>
> > Science needs simple questions before you arrive at a complex answer. Are there figures for how
> > rolling resistance varies with tyre pressure on a rough surface?
>
> Not that I know of. Of course, from knowing that tread squirm,
typical
> of patterned treads where tread rubber bulges into tread voids, impressing angular pavement
> features into a smooth tread will also cause tread squirm. Tread squirm is the principal loss in
> knobby tires rolling on smooth pavement. This has been measured.
>
> >>> Its not a personal pet theory of mine or anything, but I have seen theories based on something
> >>> like the above, in that when dealing with a slightly rough road surface the ability of a tire
> >>> to act as suspension may be more of an advantage than that given by the lower "smooth surface
> >>> RR".
>
> >> Before repeating these pseudo-science tales, you might look into their validity. Myth and lore
> >> survives on repetition, not fact.
>
> > Simple questions:
>
> > Do people riding on rougher roads experience more rolling
resistance?
>
> Yes.
>
> > Sorry, I cannot explain if this is true in terms of energy loss.
>
> Tire losses are almost entirely due to tread, casing, and inner tube flexing while the least
> losses are caused by tread scrubbing on the road. If this were not the case tires would wear out
> much faster than they do.
On a rough surface, if the tires are inflated so high as to cause an upward velocity component of
the bicycle and rider, then surely the losses are not just limited to the flexing of the tires.
Phil Holman