max load rating for road bikes?



[email protected] wrote:
> On Feb 20, 2:01 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>> [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Feb 20, 11:52 am, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>>>> D'ohBoy wrote:
>>>>>> Woland99 wrote:
>>>>>>> Well definitely I am over 200 pounds now and by quite a WIDE
>>>>>>> margin. I used to ski so I have strong leg muscles so I can
>>>>>>> do some hills now even with all that extra weight. Altho fact
>>>>>>> is you cannot fool you knees. And even if I go down to my
>>>>>>> college/rock climbing weight (which will take a a year or so)
>>>>>>> I will still be close to 200 - about 185-190.
>>>>>>> So in the meantime I thought about cyclocross bike - maybe
>>>>>>> sth hybrid like Bianchi Axis?
>>>>>> There is a world-class sprinter, Thor Hushovd, who weighs about the
>>>>>> same as you and he races superlight carbon road bikes. I prolly have
>>>>>> weighed as much as you by a bit in the past (now stay within +/- 10
>>>>>> lbs of 200) and I have ridden many different bikes of different
>>>>>> materials, some pretty lightweight. Like others said, stay away from
>>>>>> stoopidlight.[...]
>>>>> How many miles does professional actually put on a bicycle before the
>>>>> team replaces it? A component that is fine for 500 hours of use may well
>>>>> be unsafe if used for 10,000 hours.
>>>> Do you have a road frame that is used 10000 hours? I manage to cycle
>>>> 10-15 hours per week. 10000 hours is 660-1000 weeks. My season is from
>>>> March till October; that's 35 weeks. So we are talking about 19 to 28
>>>> years. Who needs a frame that last that long? When I look around I think
>>>> that the average lifespan of a road frame is 5-10 years.
>>> I'd like my frames to last that long. Longer, in fact. My hardtail
>>> mountain bike, which I thrash relentlessly, is 13 years old and going
>>> strong. My road bike is 40ish, hard to put an exact date on it. That
>>> frame is still perfectly servicable and one of my favorites as well,
>>> though it is a dumpster conversion.

>> Why?
>> You put 10-15 hours for 3/4 of the year on those bikes for those 13 and
>> 40 years?
>>
>> Lou- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -

>
> I'd say I put 15 or so hours per week on the road bike from the start
> of March into the beginning of November, and then probably 5 hours per
> week November through February. I've been doing that with this
> particular bike for a couple years, and would like to continue this
> same tradition on this same frame for at least another 50 years.
> There's also no telling how many hours were put on it in the thirty
> some odd years it was around before I got it, but appearance suggests
> this is a very well ridden frame.
>
> The mountain bike sees less use, perhaps 10-15 hours per week in the
> on season and nothing at all on the off season - I've got a ~12 year
> old beater full suspension bike for winter MTBing. It's been seeing
> this use in my care for 9 or so years, and was ridden just as much if
> not more before I got it from a friend who raced it. Since I just
> found an alternative "race home route" that's primarily offroad, I
> expect those hours to spike heavily this summer (with a corresponding
> drop on the road bike miles).
>
> I LOVE this bike. I hope it outlives me. Last summer I custom
> ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th If I
> break this frame, when I'm done crying, I'll probably send what's left
> of it to someone who can make me another with exactly the same
> geometry in ti (so it can be repaired if need be).



I'm impressed. There are not many guys like you ;-)
Most people like to treat themselves with a new (shiny) new frame/bike
once in a while. Some every year, most after 5-10 years. But 40 years?
Wow!!.
My last treat:

http://home.planet.nl/~holtm072/plaatjes/Singlespeed_01.jpg

Lou
 
On Feb 20, 2:48 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > On Feb 20, 2:01 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> [email protected] wrote:
> >>> On Feb 20, 11:52 am, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
> >>>>> D'ohBoy wrote:
> >>>>>> Woland99 wrote:
> >>>>>>> Well definitely I am over 200 pounds now and by quite a WIDE
> >>>>>>> margin. I used to ski so I have strong leg muscles so I can
> >>>>>>> do some hills now even with all that extra weight. Altho fact
> >>>>>>> is you cannot fool you knees. And even if I go down to my
> >>>>>>> college/rock climbing weight (which will take a a year or so)
> >>>>>>> I will still be close to 200 - about 185-190.
> >>>>>>> So in the meantime I thought about cyclocross bike - maybe
> >>>>>>> sth hybrid like Bianchi Axis?
> >>>>>> There is a world-class sprinter, Thor Hushovd, who weighs about the
> >>>>>> same as you and he races superlight carbon road bikes. I prolly have
> >>>>>> weighed as much as you by a bit in the past (now stay within +/- 10
> >>>>>> lbs of 200) and I have ridden many different bikes of different
> >>>>>> materials, some pretty lightweight. Like others said, stay away from
> >>>>>> stoopidlight.[...]
> >>>>> How many miles does professional actually put on a bicycle before the
> >>>>> team replaces it? A component that is fine for 500 hours of use may well
> >>>>> be unsafe if used for 10,000 hours.
> >>>> Do you have a road frame that is used 10000 hours? I manage to cycle
> >>>> 10-15 hours per week. 10000 hours is 660-1000 weeks. My season is from
> >>>> March till October; that's 35 weeks. So we are talking about 19 to 28
> >>>> years. Who needs a frame that last that long? When I look around I think
> >>>> that the average lifespan of a road frame is 5-10 years.
> >>> I'd like my frames to last that long. Longer, in fact. My hardtail
> >>> mountain bike, which I thrash relentlessly, is 13 years old and going
> >>> strong. My road bike is 40ish, hard to put an exact date on it. That
> >>> frame is still perfectly servicable and one of my favorites as well,
> >>> though it is a dumpster conversion.
> >> Why?
> >> You put 10-15 hours for 3/4 of the year on those bikes for those 13 and
> >> 40 years?

>
> >> Lou- Hide quoted text -

>
> >> - Show quoted text -

>
> > I'd say I put 15 or so hours per week on the road bike from the start
> > of March into the beginning of November, and then probably 5 hours per
> > week November through February. I've been doing that with this
> > particular bike for a couple years, and would like to continue this
> > same tradition on this same frame for at least another 50 years.
> > There's also no telling how many hours were put on it in the thirty
> > some odd years it was around before I got it, but appearance suggests
> > this is a very well ridden frame.

>
> > The mountain bike sees less use, perhaps 10-15 hours per week in the
> > on season and nothing at all on the off season - I've got a ~12 year
> > old beater full suspension bike for winter MTBing. It's been seeing
> > this use in my care for 9 or so years, and was ridden just as much if
> > not more before I got it from a friend who raced it. Since I just
> > found an alternative "race home route" that's primarily offroad, I
> > expect those hours to spike heavily this summer (with a corresponding
> > drop on the road bike miles).

>
> > I LOVE this bike. I hope it outlives me. Last summer I custom
> > ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th If I
> > break this frame, when I'm done crying, I'll probably send what's left
> > of it to someone who can make me another with exactly the same
> > geometry in ti (so it can be repaired if need be).

>
> I'm impressed. There are not many guys like you ;-)
> Most people like to treat themselves with a new (shiny) new frame/bike
> once in a while. Some every year, most after 5-10 years. But 40 years?
> Wow!!.
> My last treat:
>
> http://home.planet.nl/~holtm072/plaatjes/Singlespeed_01.jpg
>
> Lou



My last treat was a Storck Scenario C1.1. Some take pride in a life
of asceticism; I am more of a hedonist and have little in the way of
expenses (we are DINKs).

Next on the list is either a mtn bike or a single speed (fixies are
for real men, I prefer the safety of unreality).

D'ohBoy
 
On Feb 20, 3:48 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > On Feb 20, 2:01 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> [email protected] wrote:
> >>> On Feb 20, 11:52 am, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
> >>>>> D'ohBoy wrote:
> >>>>>> Woland99 wrote:
> >>>>>>> Well definitely I am over 200 pounds now and by quite a WIDE
> >>>>>>> margin. I used to ski so I have strong leg muscles so I can
> >>>>>>> do some hills now even with all that extra weight. Altho fact
> >>>>>>> is you cannot fool you knees. And even if I go down to my
> >>>>>>> college/rock climbing weight (which will take a a year or so)
> >>>>>>> I will still be close to 200 - about 185-190.
> >>>>>>> So in the meantime I thought about cyclocross bike - maybe
> >>>>>>> sth hybrid like Bianchi Axis?
> >>>>>> There is a world-class sprinter, Thor Hushovd, who weighs about the
> >>>>>> same as you and he races superlight carbon road bikes. I prolly have
> >>>>>> weighed as much as you by a bit in the past (now stay within +/- 10
> >>>>>> lbs of 200) and I have ridden many different bikes of different
> >>>>>> materials, some pretty lightweight. Like others said, stay away from
> >>>>>> stoopidlight.[...]
> >>>>> How many miles does professional actually put on a bicycle before the
> >>>>> team replaces it? A component that is fine for 500 hours of use may well
> >>>>> be unsafe if used for 10,000 hours.
> >>>> Do you have a road frame that is used 10000 hours? I manage to cycle
> >>>> 10-15 hours per week. 10000 hours is 660-1000 weeks. My season is from
> >>>> March till October; that's 35 weeks. So we are talking about 19 to 28
> >>>> years. Who needs a frame that last that long? When I look around I think
> >>>> that the average lifespan of a road frame is 5-10 years.
> >>> I'd like my frames to last that long. Longer, in fact. My hardtail
> >>> mountain bike, which I thrash relentlessly, is 13 years old and going
> >>> strong. My road bike is 40ish, hard to put an exact date on it. That
> >>> frame is still perfectly servicable and one of my favorites as well,
> >>> though it is a dumpster conversion.
> >> Why?
> >> You put 10-15 hours for 3/4 of the year on those bikes for those 13 and
> >> 40 years?

>
> >> Lou- Hide quoted text -

>
> >> - Show quoted text -

>
> > I'd say I put 15 or so hours per week on the road bike from the start
> > of March into the beginning of November, and then probably 5 hours per
> > week November through February. I've been doing that with this
> > particular bike for a couple years, and would like to continue this
> > same tradition on this same frame for at least another 50 years.
> > There's also no telling how many hours were put on it in the thirty
> > some odd years it was around before I got it, but appearance suggests
> > this is a very well ridden frame.

>
> > The mountain bike sees less use, perhaps 10-15 hours per week in the
> > on season and nothing at all on the off season - I've got a ~12 year
> > old beater full suspension bike for winter MTBing. It's been seeing
> > this use in my care for 9 or so years, and was ridden just as much if
> > not more before I got it from a friend who raced it. Since I just
> > found an alternative "race home route" that's primarily offroad, I
> > expect those hours to spike heavily this summer (with a corresponding
> > drop on the road bike miles).

>
> > I LOVE this bike. I hope it outlives me. Last summer I custom
> > ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th If I
> > break this frame, when I'm done crying, I'll probably send what's left
> > of it to someone who can make me another with exactly the same
> > geometry in ti (so it can be repaired if need be).

>
> I'm impressed. There are not many guys like you ;-)


Thanks. I mean, I have it, I love it, it works, why replace it? I
got sidetracked above about the forks, I meant to say "Last summer I
custom ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th
framesets with fork would have cost".


> Most people like to treat themselves with a new (shiny) new frame/bike
> once in a while. Some every year, most after 5-10 years. But 40 years?
> Wow!!.


Like I said, why change what works? I forgot to mention I've had the
same Dirt Jumper/Skate Park/BMX bike for 14 years as well, and there
is no doubt whatsoever that baby will still be going strong for years
to come. It's bulletproof. The rear wheel has destroyed/bent/kinked
spokes, at least one missing spoke, and is still true!!! Granted it
weighs roughly 100lbs, but that doesn't matter in the skate park or in
the jumps, only on the track.


> My last treat:
>
> http://home.planet.nl/~holtm072/plaatjes/Singlespeed_01.jpg


Nice. Looks sweet! What kind of bars are those, or what's mounted to
them - what's up with them basically?

Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
(it's the orange hardtail):
from the back: http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
from the front: http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb

I often regret not having any pictures of the ultra lightweight & dope
Mosh I used to race BMX with, as well as the Standard BMX I traded for
the hardtail. I should really get some pics of the rest of my bikes
one of these days.
 
[email protected] wrote:
> On Feb 20, 3:48 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>> [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Feb 20, 2:01 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> [email protected] wrote:
>>>>> On Feb 20, 11:52 am, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>>>>>> D'ohBoy wrote:
>>>>>>>> Woland99 wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Well definitely I am over 200 pounds now and by quite a WIDE
>>>>>>>>> margin. I used to ski so I have strong leg muscles so I can
>>>>>>>>> do some hills now even with all that extra weight. Altho fact
>>>>>>>>> is you cannot fool you knees. And even if I go down to my
>>>>>>>>> college/rock climbing weight (which will take a a year or so)
>>>>>>>>> I will still be close to 200 - about 185-190.
>>>>>>>>> So in the meantime I thought about cyclocross bike - maybe
>>>>>>>>> sth hybrid like Bianchi Axis?
>>>>>>>> There is a world-class sprinter, Thor Hushovd, who weighs about the
>>>>>>>> same as you and he races superlight carbon road bikes. I prolly have
>>>>>>>> weighed as much as you by a bit in the past (now stay within +/- 10
>>>>>>>> lbs of 200) and I have ridden many different bikes of different
>>>>>>>> materials, some pretty lightweight. Like others said, stay away from
>>>>>>>> stoopidlight.[...]
>>>>>>> How many miles does professional actually put on a bicycle before the
>>>>>>> team replaces it? A component that is fine for 500 hours of use may well
>>>>>>> be unsafe if used for 10,000 hours.
>>>>>> Do you have a road frame that is used 10000 hours? I manage to cycle
>>>>>> 10-15 hours per week. 10000 hours is 660-1000 weeks. My season is from
>>>>>> March till October; that's 35 weeks. So we are talking about 19 to 28
>>>>>> years. Who needs a frame that last that long? When I look around I think
>>>>>> that the average lifespan of a road frame is 5-10 years.
>>>>> I'd like my frames to last that long. Longer, in fact. My hardtail
>>>>> mountain bike, which I thrash relentlessly, is 13 years old and going
>>>>> strong. My road bike is 40ish, hard to put an exact date on it. That
>>>>> frame is still perfectly servicable and one of my favorites as well,
>>>>> though it is a dumpster conversion.
>>>> Why?
>>>> You put 10-15 hours for 3/4 of the year on those bikes for those 13 and
>>>> 40 years?
>>>> Lou- Hide quoted text -
>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>> I'd say I put 15 or so hours per week on the road bike from the start
>>> of March into the beginning of November, and then probably 5 hours per
>>> week November through February. I've been doing that with this
>>> particular bike for a couple years, and would like to continue this
>>> same tradition on this same frame for at least another 50 years.
>>> There's also no telling how many hours were put on it in the thirty
>>> some odd years it was around before I got it, but appearance suggests
>>> this is a very well ridden frame.
>>> The mountain bike sees less use, perhaps 10-15 hours per week in the
>>> on season and nothing at all on the off season - I've got a ~12 year
>>> old beater full suspension bike for winter MTBing. It's been seeing
>>> this use in my care for 9 or so years, and was ridden just as much if
>>> not more before I got it from a friend who raced it. Since I just
>>> found an alternative "race home route" that's primarily offroad, I
>>> expect those hours to spike heavily this summer (with a corresponding
>>> drop on the road bike miles).
>>> I LOVE this bike. I hope it outlives me. Last summer I custom
>>> ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th If I
>>> break this frame, when I'm done crying, I'll probably send what's left
>>> of it to someone who can make me another with exactly the same
>>> geometry in ti (so it can be repaired if need be).

>> I'm impressed. There are not many guys like you ;-)

>
> Thanks. I mean, I have it, I love it, it works, why replace it? I
> got sidetracked above about the forks, I meant to say "Last summer I
> custom ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th
> framesets with fork would have cost".
>
>
>> Most people like to treat themselves with a new (shiny) new frame/bike
>> once in a while. Some every year, most after 5-10 years. But 40 years?
>> Wow!!.

>
> Like I said, why change what works? I forgot to mention I've had the
> same Dirt Jumper/Skate Park/BMX bike for 14 years as well, and there
> is no doubt whatsoever that baby will still be going strong for years
> to come. It's bulletproof. The rear wheel has destroyed/bent/kinked
> spokes, at least one missing spoke, and is still true!!! Granted it
> weighs roughly 100lbs, but that doesn't matter in the skate park or in
> the jumps, only on the track.
>
>
>> My last treat:
>>
>> http://home.planet.nl/~holtm072/plaatjes/Singlespeed_01.jpg

>
> Nice. Looks sweet! What kind of bars are those, or what's mounted to
> them - what's up with them basically?


It is just e flatbar. What you see is my front light with the battery
pack. I use this bike for my winter evening rides and casual rides in
the summer.

>
> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
> (it's the orange hardtail):
> from the back: http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
> from the front: http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb


Nice weather. My mountain biking is more or less mud wrestling ;-)

>
> I often regret not having any pictures of the ultra lightweight & dope
> Mosh I used to race BMX with, as well as the Standard BMX I traded for
> the hardtail. I should really get some pics of the rest of my bikes
> one of these days.


Yes that's nice.

Cheers,

Lou
 
[email protected] wrote:
> On Feb 20, 3:48 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>> [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Feb 20, 2:01 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> [email protected] wrote:
>>>>> On Feb 20, 11:52 am, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>>>>>> D'ohBoy wrote:
>>>>>>>> Woland99 wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Well definitely I am over 200 pounds now and by quite a WIDE
>>>>>>>>> margin. I used to ski so I have strong leg muscles so I can
>>>>>>>>> do some hills now even with all that extra weight. Altho fact
>>>>>>>>> is you cannot fool you knees. And even if I go down to my
>>>>>>>>> college/rock climbing weight (which will take a a year or so)
>>>>>>>>> I will still be close to 200 - about 185-190.
>>>>>>>>> So in the meantime I thought about cyclocross bike - maybe
>>>>>>>>> sth hybrid like Bianchi Axis?
>>>>>>>> There is a world-class sprinter, Thor Hushovd, who weighs about the
>>>>>>>> same as you and he races superlight carbon road bikes. I prolly have
>>>>>>>> weighed as much as you by a bit in the past (now stay within +/- 10
>>>>>>>> lbs of 200) and I have ridden many different bikes of different
>>>>>>>> materials, some pretty lightweight. Like others said, stay away from
>>>>>>>> stoopidlight.[...]
>>>>>>> How many miles does professional actually put on a bicycle before the
>>>>>>> team replaces it? A component that is fine for 500 hours of use may well
>>>>>>> be unsafe if used for 10,000 hours.
>>>>>> Do you have a road frame that is used 10000 hours? I manage to cycle
>>>>>> 10-15 hours per week. 10000 hours is 660-1000 weeks. My season is from
>>>>>> March till October; that's 35 weeks. So we are talking about 19 to 28
>>>>>> years. Who needs a frame that last that long? When I look around I think
>>>>>> that the average lifespan of a road frame is 5-10 years.
>>>>> I'd like my frames to last that long. Longer, in fact. My hardtail
>>>>> mountain bike, which I thrash relentlessly, is 13 years old and going
>>>>> strong. My road bike is 40ish, hard to put an exact date on it. That
>>>>> frame is still perfectly servicable and one of my favorites as well,
>>>>> though it is a dumpster conversion.
>>>> Why?
>>>> You put 10-15 hours for 3/4 of the year on those bikes for those 13 and
>>>> 40 years?
>>>> Lou- Hide quoted text -
>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>> I'd say I put 15 or so hours per week on the road bike from the start
>>> of March into the beginning of November, and then probably 5 hours per
>>> week November through February. I've been doing that with this
>>> particular bike for a couple years, and would like to continue this
>>> same tradition on this same frame for at least another 50 years.
>>> There's also no telling how many hours were put on it in the thirty
>>> some odd years it was around before I got it, but appearance suggests
>>> this is a very well ridden frame.
>>> The mountain bike sees less use, perhaps 10-15 hours per week in the
>>> on season and nothing at all on the off season - I've got a ~12 year
>>> old beater full suspension bike for winter MTBing. It's been seeing
>>> this use in my care for 9 or so years, and was ridden just as much if
>>> not more before I got it from a friend who raced it. Since I just
>>> found an alternative "race home route" that's primarily offroad, I
>>> expect those hours to spike heavily this summer (with a corresponding
>>> drop on the road bike miles).
>>> I LOVE this bike. I hope it outlives me. Last summer I custom
>>> ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th If I
>>> break this frame, when I'm done crying, I'll probably send what's left
>>> of it to someone who can make me another with exactly the same
>>> geometry in ti (so it can be repaired if need be).

>> I'm impressed. There are not many guys like you ;-)

>
> Thanks. I mean, I have it, I love it, it works, why replace it? I
> got sidetracked above about the forks, I meant to say "Last summer I
> custom ordered a fork for this bike that cost as much as many 1-1/8th
> framesets with fork would have cost".
>
>
>> Most people like to treat themselves with a new (shiny) new frame/bike
>> once in a while. Some every year, most after 5-10 years. But 40 years?
>> Wow!!.

>
> Like I said, why change what works? I forgot to mention I've had the
> same Dirt Jumper/Skate Park/BMX bike for 14 years as well, and there
> is no doubt whatsoever that baby will still be going strong for years
> to come. It's bulletproof. The rear wheel has destroyed/bent/kinked
> spokes, at least one missing spoke, and is still true!!! Granted it
> weighs roughly 100lbs, but that doesn't matter in the skate park or in
> the jumps, only on the track.
>
>
>> My last treat:
>>
>> http://home.planet.nl/~holtm072/plaatjes/Singlespeed_01.jpg

>
> Nice. Looks sweet! What kind of bars are those, or what's mounted to
> them - what's up with them basically?
>
> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
> (it's the orange hardtail):
> from the back: http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
> from the front: http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb


dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect them
/every/ ride.


>
> I often regret not having any pictures of the ultra lightweight & dope
> Mosh I used to race BMX with, as well as the Standard BMX I traded for
> the hardtail. I should really get some pics of the rest of my bikes
> one of these days.
 
Lou Holtman wrote:
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>
>> How many miles does [a] professional actually put on a bicycle before the
>> team replaces it? A component that is fine for 500 hours of use may
>> well be unsafe if used for 10,000 hours.

>
> Do you have a road frame that is used 10000 hours? I manage to cycle
> 10-15 hours per week. 10000 hours is 660-1000 weeks. My season is from
> March till October; that's 35 weeks. So we are talking about 19 to 28
> years. Who needs a frame that last that long? When I look around I think
> that the average lifespan of a road frame is 5-10 years.
>

I understand that Jobst Brandt has hubs and spokes with that much or
more use on them.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
 
"jim beam" wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>> [...]
>> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
>> (it's the orange hardtail):
>> from the back:
>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
>> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
>> from the front:
>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
>> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb

>
> dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect them
> /every/ ride.
>

What brand and model are the cranks, and are they known for having a
fatigue cracking problem?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
 
On Feb 20, 5:28 am, Art Harris <[email protected]> wrote:
> Woland99 wrote:
> > OK - thanks again for all the replies - I learn something new each
> > time I read this ng. I decided to go for steel frame, 27spd type of bike.
> > More of a touring bike - built to go distance rather then for speed.
> > Simple reason is that it will be better (reliability, comfort) bike to
> > get in shape and then when/if I decide to get bona-fide racing
> > machine I will always be able to use it as commuting or touring bike. Whereas
> > if I buy substandard racing bike now I will have to cope with
> > potential wheel/frame failures and then after getting next bike I will not be
> > able to adapt it for commuting.

>
> > So next I will test-ride following:
> > Novara Randonee
> > Trek 520
> > Surly Long Haul Trucker
> > anything else I should add to this list?

>
> Those sound like reasonable choices. Make sure the shop tensions and
> stress relieves the wheels before you take delivery.
>
> Everytime I hear from someone looking for a decent quality, durable,
> and affordable bike I bemoan the demise of the 1980s style "sport
> touring" bikes. Those were real road bikes with clearance for
> reasonable width tires, rugged Cr-Mo steel frames, and inexpensive
> downtube shifters.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miyata
>


When I was twenty-something, weighing about 165 lbs (75 kg), I bought
a brand new Miyata 112 (entry-level "Sport" model). Man, I really,
really loved that bike, and rode it all over. Then it sat parked in
the shed for a long time, and was eventually stolen :-(

When I started riding again last year, I weighed around 215 lbs (98
kg).

First I bought a Trek 400 "Elance" (sport bike) on ebay for about $100
plus shipping. It was built in ~1986, with Reynolds 531 steel frame
and 36 spokes on each wheel. It's only a twelve-speed, but I rode it
back-and-forth to work - 25 miles (40 km) each way - including over
some hills. The guys with the new, $1000 bikes made fun of my bike's
weight, but we didn't mind too much :)

Since then I have dropped my own weight to a little under 190 lbs (85
kg), and rewarded myself with a Miyata 914. It's a 1989 model, with
racing geometry, steel frame, 32 spokes per wheel, and Shimano 105
components. It's a marvelous machine.
 
Tom Sherman wrote:
> "jim beam" wrote:
>> [email protected] wrote:
>>> [...]
>>> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
>>> (it's the orange hardtail):
>>> from the back:
>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
>>> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
>>> from the front:
>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
>>> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb

>>
>> dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect
>> them /every/ ride.
>>

> What brand and model are the cranks, and are they known for having a
> fatigue cracking problem?
>


bored tom? can't be bothered to do any of your own homework this evening?
 
"jim beam" WHO? wrote:
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>> "jim beam" wrote:
>>> [email protected] wrote:
>>>> [...]
>>>> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
>>>> (it's the orange hardtail):
>>>> from the back:
>>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
>>>> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
>>>> from the front:
>>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
>>>> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb
>>>
>>> dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect
>>> them /every/ ride.
>>>

>> What brand and model are the cranks, and are they known for having a
>> fatigue cracking problem?
>>

>
> bored tom? can't be bothered to do any of your own homework this evening?


So I should spend hours doing web searches for pictures of cranks to
identify the model on the bicycle in question, when "jim beam" could
provide us the answer?

I know it is not one of the cranks I have, so the identification is not
of immediate personal importance to me. However, if "jim beam" knows
that there is a problem with a particular model of crank, he could do
the readers of rec.bicycle.tech a service by posting the information,
rather than being cryptic and snarky.

It is obvious that "jim beam" must be bored, since he/she/they/it is
trying to pick a fight again.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
 
Tom Sherman wrote:
> "jim beam" WHO? wrote:
>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>> "jim beam" wrote:
>>>> [email protected] wrote:
>>>>> [...]
>>>>> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
>>>>> (it's the orange hardtail):
>>>>> from the back:
>>>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
>>>>> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
>>>>> from the front:
>>>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
>>>>> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb
>>>>
>>>> dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect
>>>> them /every/ ride.
>>>>
>>> What brand and model are the cranks, and are they known for having a
>>> fatigue cracking problem?
>>>

>>
>> bored tom? can't be bothered to do any of your own homework this
>> evening?

>
> So I should spend hours doing web searches for pictures of cranks to
> identify the model on the bicycle in question, when "jim beam" could
> provide us the answer?
>
> I know it is not one of the cranks I have, so the identification is not
> of immediate personal importance to me. However, if "jim beam" knows
> that there is a problem with a particular model of crank, he could do
> the readers of rec.bicycle.tech a service by posting the information,
> rather than being cryptic and snarky.
>
> It is obvious that "jim beam" must be bored, since he/she/they/it is
> trying to pick a fight again.
>


lightweight hypocrite.
 
"jim beam" WHO? wrote:
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>> "jim beam" WHO? wrote:
>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>>> "jim beam" wrote:
>>>>> [email protected] wrote:
>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
>>>>>> (it's the orange hardtail):
>>>>>> from the back:
>>>>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
>>>>>> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
>>>>>> from the front:
>>>>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
>>>>>> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb
>>>>>
>>>>> dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect
>>>>> them /every/ ride.
>>>>>
>>>> What brand and model are the cranks, and are they known for having a
>>>> fatigue cracking problem?
>>>>
>>>
>>> bored tom? can't be bothered to do any of your own homework this
>>> evening?

>>
>> So I should spend hours doing web searches for pictures of cranks to
>> identify the model on the bicycle in question, when "jim beam" could
>> provide us the answer?
>>
>> I know it is not one of the cranks I have, so the identification is
>> not of immediate personal importance to me. However, if "jim beam"
>> knows that there is a problem with a particular model of crank, he
>> could do the readers of rec.bicycle.tech a service by posting the
>> information, rather than being cryptic and snarky.
>>
>> It is obvious that "jim beam" must be bored, since he/she/they/it is
>> trying to pick a fight again.
>>

>
> lightweight hypocrite.


"jim beam" obviously has trouble understanding the meaning of hypocrite,
since its use in this context makes no sense. Or is "jim beam" just
mindlessly tossing out a gratuitous insult?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
 
Tom Sherman writes:

>>> How many miles does [a] professional actually put on a bicycle
>>> before the team replaces it? A component that is fine for 500
>>> hours of use may well be unsafe if used for 10,000 hours.


>> Do you have a road frame that is used 10000 hours? I manage to
>> cycle 10-15 hours per week. 10000 hours is 660-1000 weeks. My
>> season is from March till October; that's 35 weeks. So we are
>> talking about 19 to 28 years. Who needs a frame that last that
>> long? When I look around I think that the average lifespan of a
>> road frame is 5-10 years.


> I understand that Jobst Brandt has hubs and spokes with that much or
> more use on them.


They have more then 300,000 miles on the hubs and spokes, the front
one still in regular service although I retired the rear hub having
had too many axle breaks. Last week a spoke broke at the elbow in the
front wheel. I understand that the low failure rate is due to better
spoke materials these days, except that these spokes are more than 30
years old. Like those countersunk pedal threads on my cranks, whose
failure has ceased because mainly through better materials although
they are more than 20 years old.

Jobst Brandt
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Tom Sherman <[email protected]> wrote:

> "jim beam" WHO? wrote:
> > Tom Sherman wrote:
> >> "jim beam" wrote:
> >>> [email protected] wrote:
> >>>> [...]
> >>>> Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
> >>>> (it's the orange hardtail):
> >>>> from the back:
> >>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
> >>>> or http://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
> >>>> from the front:
> >>>> http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
> >>>> or http://tinyurl.com/3xxufb
> >>>
> >>> dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect
> >>> them /every/ ride.
> >>>
> >> What brand and model are the cranks, and are they known for having a
> >> fatigue cracking problem?
> >>

> >
> > bored tom? can't be bothered to do any of your own homework this evening?

>
> So I should spend hours doing web searches for pictures of cranks to
> identify the model on the bicycle in question, when "jim beam" could
> provide us the answer?


This is the bait and switch. jb is in sales.

--
Michael Press
 
On Feb 21, 12:38 am, [email protected] wrote:
use on them.
>
> They have more then 300,000 miles on the hubs and spokes, the front
> one still in regular service although I retired the rear hub having
> had too many axle breaks.  Last week a spoke broke at the elbow in the
> front wheel.  I understand that the low failure rate is due to better
> spoke materials these days, except that these spokes are more than 30
> years old.  Like those countersunk pedal threads on my cranks, whose
> failure has ceased because mainly through better materials although
> they are more than 20 years old.
>
> Jobst Brandt


Dear Jobst,

"It appears that the better spokes now available would have made the
discovery of many of the concepts of this book more difficult for
lack
of failure data. I am grateful in retrospect for the poor durability
of earlier spokes. They operated so near their limits that durability
was significantly altered by the techniques that I have outlined."

--Jobst Brandt, "The Bicycle Wheel," 3rd Edition, 1993, p.124

Cheers,

Carl Fogel
 
On Feb 20, 4:56 pm, Lou Holtman <[email protected]> wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > Nice. Looks sweet! What kind of bars are those, or what's mounted to
> > them - what's up with them basically?

> It is just e flatbar. What you see is my front light with the battery
> pack. I use this bike for my winter evening rides and casual rides in
> the summer.


Cool. I couldn't tell if it was a light, gps, or just some funky
bars.


> > Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
> > (it's the orange hardtail):
> > from the back:http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
> > orhttp://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
> > from the front:http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
> > orhttp://tinyurl.com/3xxufb

>
> Nice weather. My mountain biking is more or less mud wrestling ;-)


That was one of the nicer days. We get it all in New England, perfect
days, heat waves, hurricanes and blizzards. At least it's not
boring.
 
On Feb 20, 9:00 pm, jim beam <[email protected]> wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > Here are the only pictures I'm aware of ever taken of any of my bikes
> > (it's the orange hardtail):
> > from the back:http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3386.JPG
> > orhttp://tinyurl.com/2pgtwj
> > from the front:http://www.mtbadventureseries.org/mtbadventure/EventPics/IMG_3255.JPG
> > orhttp://tinyurl.com/3xxufb

>
> dude, keep a /real/ close eye on those cranks for fatigue. inspect them
> /every/ ride.


Why is that? I appreciate any heads up you may be able to offer me.
Were you actually able to identify the model from those pictures, or
are you biased against the brand in general? Perhaps you were just
commenting on the obvious wear? The rest of the bike, save for the
new fork, shows the same amount of wear. It's been holding up great
so far. I do inspect it occasionally, but nowhere near every ride.

If you wanted to see pictures of things I ride that look like they'll
fail on the next ride I could provide a few examples, assuming I
bother to dig out a camera and take some pictures. Somehow they tend
to keep going. I heard all last season that my rear rim was going to
blow off the tire, the rim being seriously pinched/dented from a rock
it was bounced off during a crash. It's still going strong, much to
everyone's surprise.
 
Carl Fogel writes:

> use on them.


>> They have more then 300,000 miles on the hubs and spokes, the front
>> one still in regular service although I retired the rear hub having
>> had too many axle breaks.  Last week a spoke broke at the elbow in
>> the front wheel. I understand that the low failure rate is due to
>> better spoke materials these days, except that these spokes are
>> more than 30 years old. Like those countersunk pedal threads on my
>> cranks, whose failure has ceased because mainly through better
>> materials although they are more than 20 years old.


# It appears that the better spokes now available would have made the
# discovery of many of the concepts of this book more difficult for
# lack of failure data. I am grateful in retrospect for the poor
# durability of earlier spokes. They operated so near their limits
# that durability was significantly altered by the techniques that I
# have outlined.

> --Jobst Brandt, "The Bicycle Wheel," 3rd Edition, 1993, p.124


The quote is from text I wrote about 30 years ago, (not 1993) after
better spokes (DT) were available. and referred to poor spokes of the
1950's by Berg, Robergel, and Stella. The words are meant be taken
literally because it was the means by which wheel building techniques
were developed. Spokes before then were far more failure prone and
made these discoveries more easily observable.

Why do you bring that up?

Jobst Brandt
 
[email protected] wrote:
> Carl Fogel writes:
>
>> use on them.

>
>>> They have more then 300,000 miles on the hubs and spokes, the front
>>> one still in regular service although I retired the rear hub having
>>> had too many axle breaks. Last week a spoke broke at the elbow in
>>> the front wheel. I understand that the low failure rate is due to
>>> better spoke materials these days, except that these spokes are
>>> more than 30 years old. Like those countersunk pedal threads on my
>>> cranks, whose failure has ceased because mainly through better
>>> materials although they are more than 20 years old.

>
> # It appears that the better spokes now available would have made the
> # discovery of many of the concepts of this book more difficult for
> # lack of failure data. I am grateful in retrospect for the poor
> # durability of earlier spokes. They operated so near their limits
> # that durability was significantly altered by the techniques that I
> # have outlined.
>
>> --Jobst Brandt, "The Bicycle Wheel," 3rd Edition, 1993, p.124

>
> The quote is from text I wrote about 30 years ago, (not 1993) after
> better spokes (DT) were available. and referred to poor spokes of the
> 1950's by Berg, Robergel, and Stella. The words are meant be taken
> literally because it was the means by which wheel building techniques
> were developed. Spokes before then were far more failure prone and
> made these discoveries more easily observable.
>
> Why do you bring that up?


why don't we discuss instead the fact that you've been using that 300k
mile figure for about 10 years? somewhere, it means you're bullshitting
about:

1. the actual mileage of that wheel
2. your actual annual mileage, or
3. whether this really is the only wheel you use.

given that you've also said:
"When I start a ride I also like to grab a suitable wheel from by
"armory" and quickly and simply attach it to my bicycle. "

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.tech/msg/bcff18bce92a8439

clearly, /something/ is used buffalo fodder.
 
On Feb 21, 3:24 pm, jim beam <[email protected]> wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > Carl Fogel writes:

>
> >> use on them.

>
> >>> They have more then 300,000 miles on the hubs and spokes, the front
> >>> one still in regular service although I retired the rear hub having
> >>> had too many axle breaks.  Last week a spoke broke at the elbow in
> >>> the front wheel.  I understand that the low failure rate is due to
> >>> better spoke materials these days, except that these spokes are
> >>> more than 30 years old.  Like those countersunk pedal threads on my
> >>> cranks, whose failure has ceased because mainly through better
> >>> materials although they are more than 20 years old.

>
> > # It appears that the better spokes now available would have made the
> > # discovery of many of the concepts of this book more difficult for
> > # lack of failure data.  I am grateful in retrospect for the poor
> > # durability of earlier spokes.  They operated so near their limits
> > # that durability was significantly altered by the techniques that I
> > # have outlined.

>
> >> --Jobst Brandt, "The Bicycle Wheel," 3rd Edition, 1993, p.124

>
> > The quote is from text I wrote about 30 years ago, (not 1993) after
> > better spokes (DT) were available.  and referred to poor spokes of the
> > 1950's by Berg, Robergel, and Stella.  The words are meant be taken
> > literally because it was the means by which wheel building techniques
> > were developed.  Spokes before then were far more failure prone and
> > made these discoveries more easily observable.

>
> > Why do you bring that up?

>
> why don't we discuss instead the fact that you've been using that 300k
> mile figure for about 10 years?  somewhere, it means you're bullshitting
> about:
>
> 1. the actual mileage of that wheel
> 2. your actual annual mileage, or
> 3. whether this really is the only wheel you use.
>
> given that you've also said:
> "When I start a ride I also like to grab a suitable wheel from by
> "armory" and quickly and simply attach it to my bicycle. "
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.tech/msg/bcff18bce92a8439
>
> clearly, /something/ is used buffalo fodder.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -


Jim,

Just a reminder to follow up on your statement about my cranks.

Thanks,

Dan