Michael Phelps Best Swimmer in World



I was watching deBruin and Thompson in the 50 free and Thompson was considerably stronger and more
muscular. Are you going to describe Thompson as an amazon?

"Dori" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Martin W. Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > Dori wrote:
> > >
> > > "Martin W. Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > > > Harold Pinter wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > "insweep" <[email protected]> wrote in news:bg19pv$23h$1 @lacerta.tiscalinet.it:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Let's wait the next Olympics....
> > > > > > --
> > > > >
> > > > > No.
> > > > >
> > > > > The 5 world records and most dominating championship the world has
ever
> > > > > seen have established him as the world's greatest swimmer.
> > > >
> > > > Wait a minute. Wait for the drug tests. A few years ago, Inge de
Bruin's
> > > > performance paled in comparison, but she was immediately attacked as
a
> > > > drug cheat. Even Ian Thorpe has had to defend himself against drug
use
> > > > accusations. So far, I haven't heard anyone say anything about
Phelps
> > > > and drugs, yet his performance is the most unbelievable of the
three.
> > > > Probably just another swimmer gone bad.
> > > >
> > > > martin
> > >
> > > That's a bad attitude.
> >
> > Do you mean all the whining and accusations unsupported by evidence?
> >
> > martin
>
> Yes. de Bruin was treated badly in Sydney after her great performances. Funny how Phelps isn't
> being looked at. Maybe it has to do with their body-types? de Bruin is like an amazon, while
> Phelps looks pretty average at best.
 
[email protected] (alexandria) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> Judging by the quality of your previous posts, I shouldn't have been surprised by your lack of
> ability to discern that I only limited to track events (ie. running/walking/hurdling). It is true
> that walking and hurdling need different sets of skills (just like back, breast, fly as opposed to
> crawl), but the greatest track athletes were never hurdlers, walkers, or cross country-ers.

I think the most complete track athletes of all are the best of the decathlon and heptathlon. Tomas
Dvorak, Dan O'Brien, Daley Thompson, Bruce Jenner, Roman Sebrle, and of coure Jackie-Joyner Kersee
(the greatest American woman track athlete ever). Most track afficianados consider the best athlete
in the world to be determined in this event.

>
> "Harold Pinter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:<[email protected]>...
> > Tell that to Edwin Moses. One of the most dominant track and field athletes of all time.
> >
> > Or run it by Jackie Joyner-Kersee. I don't recall her ever running any of those "straight"
> > events.
> >
> >
> > Nice try.
> >
> >
> > "alexandria" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > Forgot to add, in Track&Field, as an analogy, greatest runners down the history are always
> > > 'straight' runners, not the hurdlers, walkers, cross country, or steeplechaser. They can be
> > > greatest hurdles, walkers, steeplechaser, but would never be considered greatest runner
> > > without WRs/olympic golds in 'straight' 100, 200, 400, 800, 1,500, 3,000, 10,000, or marathon.
> > >
> > > Paula Radcliffe was a great cross country runner, but was only feted after she switched to
> > > marathon.
 
Colin Priest wrote:
>
> Masters swimming in Australia has a policy of not testing because many "banned" drugs are vital to
> the health of the more elderly swimmers. The idea is to encourage people to remain active and
> healthy for as long as possible.

A policy I agree with. Masters meets were enjoyable in Adelaide. They were as much social gatherings
as competitions. Participation was most important. I liked the handicapping system used for open
water races. As soon as you won an open water race, your handicap would go way up and your start
time would be way at the back. But it didn't matter. For years I had the same start time as Bill
Jamison. We were about the same speed, so we always got a good race.

martin

--
Martin Smith email: [email protected] Vollsveien 9 tel. : +47 6783 1188
P.O. Box 482 mob. : +47 932 48 303 1327 Lysaker, Norway
 
I don't know which Thompson you were looking at but deBruin is one masculine looking creature. Her
adam's apple is bigger than Ian Thorpe's.

"Colin Priest" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> I was watching deBruin and Thompson in the 50 free and Thompson was considerably stronger and more
> muscular. Are you going to describe Thompson as an amazon?
>
> "Dori" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> "Martin W. Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:<[email protected]>...
>> > Dori wrote:
>> > >
>> > > "Martin W. Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:<[email protected]>...
>> > > > Harold Pinter wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > "insweep" <[email protected]> wrote in news:bg19pv$23h$1 @lacerta.tiscalinet.it:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > > Let's wait the next Olympics....
>> > > > > > --
>> > > > >
>> > > > > No.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > The 5 world records and most dominating championship the world has
> ever
>> > > > > seen have established him as the world's greatest swimmer.
>> > > >
>> > > > Wait a minute. Wait for the drug tests. A few years ago, Inge de
> Bruin's
>> > > > performance paled in comparison, but she was immediately attacked as
> a
>> > > > drug cheat. Even Ian Thorpe has had to defend himself against drug
> use
>> > > > accusations. So far, I haven't heard anyone say anything about
> Phelps
>> > > > and drugs, yet his performance is the most unbelievable of the
> three.
>> > > > Probably just another swimmer gone bad.
>> > > >
>> > > > martin
>> > >
>> > > That's a bad attitude.
>> >
>> > Do you mean all the whining and accusations unsupported by evidence?
>> >
>> > martin
>>
>> Yes. de Bruin was treated badly in Sydney after her great performances. Funny how Phelps isn't
>> being looked at. Maybe it has to do with their body-types? de Bruin is like an amazon, while
>> Phelps looks pretty average at best.
>
 
[email protected] (Coyote) wrote in news:[email protected]:

> [email protected] (alexandria) wrote in message
> news:<[email protected]>...
>> Judging by the quality of your previous posts, I shouldn't have been surprised by your lack of
>> ability to discern that I only limited to track events (ie. running/walking/hurdling). It is true
>> that walking and hurdling need different sets of skills (just like back, breast, fly as opposed
>> to crawl), but the greatest track athletes were never hurdlers, walkers, or cross country-ers.
>
> I think the most complete track athletes of all are the best of the decathlon and heptathlon.
> Tomas Dvorak, Dan O'Brien, Daley Thompson, Bruce Jenner, Roman Sebrle, and of coure Jackie-Joyner
> Kersee (the greatest American woman track athlete ever). Most track afficianados consider the best
> athlete in the world to be determined in this event.
>
>

Of course. Only an idiot like alexandria would try to equate the most popular events with the most
demanding. But alexandria has to pursue that stupid line of reasoning because to think otherwise
would destroy his belief in Ian Thorpe's superiority, particularly when Phelps has just totally
destroyed and displaced him.
 
The most popular events are also the events with the most depth. There is more depth in track
running than in other running based events, such as hurdling, because more people compete in
running. Similarly freestyle has more depth than the form strokes, because more people compete in
freestyle than in the other strokes. Think about swimming training sessions - we tend more time
swimming freestyle in training than any other stroke. It is therefore more difficult to consistently
excel in freestyle than in the form strokes.

So Alexandria has written something entirely reasonable, and Harold Pinter has once again resorted
to name calling instead of any logical argument.

"Harold Pinter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] (Coyote) wrote in news:[email protected]:
>
> > [email protected] (alexandria) wrote in message
> > news:<[email protected]>...
> >> Judging by the quality of your previous posts, I shouldn't have been surprised by your lack of
> >> ability to discern that I only limited to track events (ie. running/walking/hurdling). It is
> >> true that walking and hurdling need different sets of skills (just like back, breast, fly as
> >> opposed to crawl), but the greatest track athletes were never hurdlers, walkers, or cross
> >> country-ers.
> >
> > I think the most complete track athletes of all are the best of the decathlon and heptathlon.
> > Tomas Dvorak, Dan O'Brien, Daley Thompson, Bruce Jenner, Roman Sebrle, and of coure
> > Jackie-Joyner Kersee (the greatest American woman track athlete ever). Most track afficianados
> > consider the best athlete in the world to be determined in this event.
> >
> >
>
>
> Of course. Only an idiot like alexandria would try to equate the most popular events with the most
> demanding. But alexandria has to pursue that stupid line of reasoning because to think otherwise
> would destroy his belief in Ian Thorpe's superiority, particularly when Phelps has just totally
> destroyed and displaced him.
 
> [email protected] (Coyote) wrote in news:[email protected]:
> >
> > I think the most complete track athletes of all are the best of the decathlon and heptathlon.
> > Tomas Dvorak, Dan O'Brien, Daley Thompson, Bruce Jenner, Roman Sebrle, and of coure
> > Jackie-Joyner Kersee (the greatest American woman track athlete ever). Most track afficianados
> > consider the best athlete in the world to be determined in this event.

You missed my point. Best Athlete. That's the keyword. It's not same as 'Best Runner'. I made an
analogy of runners for swimmers (based on the premise of fastest movement over given distance, hence
I discounted field events). 'straight runners' as 'freestylers (crawl)', other running styles
(hurdle, jump, walk) as other swimming styles (back, fly, breast). In straight 100 track, you can
walk, run, jump, cartwheel your way to the finish line. In swimming freestyle events, you can crawl,
fly, back, breast your way to the finish line. whichever faster for you.

Was Jackie-Joyner Kersee the best runner in her heyday ? NO. Is Tomas Dvorak best male runner now ?
NO. In aquatic sports, Heptahtlon and Decathlon would be like combining all aquatic events into one.
Best male sprinter runner is either Tim Montgomery or Maurice Green. Best male Middle Distance
runner is either Hicham El Guerrouj or Wilson Kipketer. Best Distance runner EVER is probably Haile
Gebreselasie. Ditto with Female. Best sprinter is Marion Jones. Best Middle Distance is Maria
Mutola. For distance events, there is no clear 'best' right now. But if Paula Radcliffe starts
running 10,000 soon, she'll be the best distance runner.

Best male hurdlers are Allen Johnson and Felix Sanchez. Best female hrudlers is Gail Devers (for
100m). Edwin Moses is the greatest male 400 m hurdler ever, but *never* greatest male runner ever,
neither are Devers and Johnson. Gail Devers has also won 2 olympic golds in 100m run. Irina
Privalova who was mainly sprinter made a switch in sydney to 400 hurdle, and she won. Carl Lewis and
Marion Jones are also great jumpers because they are great sprinters. But Lewis or Jones could never
hope to win anything in 1,500 m run. You see that it is harder to be versatile distance-wise, than
style-wise. That's why Michael Johnson is considered among the greatest of all runners as he
mastered both 200 (sprint event) and 400 (borderline middle)

I liken swimming IMs to a combination of running, walking, jumping, and hurdling in one race.
Unfortunately (or fortunately ?), there is no such thing in track. Oh wait, the closest is
Steeplechase. They run, hurdle, and jump in one race. Would you consider the best steeplechase
runner as the greatest runner ever ?

>Harold Pinter <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:<[email protected]>...

> Of course. Only an idiot like alexandria would try to equate the most popular events with the most
> demanding. But alexandria has to pursue that stupid line of reasoning because to think otherwise
> would destroy his belief in Ian Thorpe's superiority, particularly when Phelps has just totally
> destroyed and displaced him.

It is always futile to argue against someone who resorts to namecalling. Not to mention distorting
facts and putting words into another's mouth.

I hope you get it this time : Yes, I believe that Thorpe is still the superior freestyler, more
superior than anybody else. I believe that Thorpe is the greatest male freestyler ever. I also
believe that Thorpe is halfway to be considered the 'greatest male swimmer ever'. But, I don't
believe that Thorpe is the most dominant male swimmer at the moment. That title goes to Phelps.
However, I believe that Phelps is NOT the greatest male swimmer ever, not even halfway. Not until he
wins multiple olympic golds and win a freestyle event.

In December 1999 edition of Swimming World magazine, the top ten greatest male swimmers in the 20th
century were : "Spitz just edged Weissmuller for the top men's spot. Third place went to American
Matt Biondi, fourth to Australian Murray Rose and fifth to American Duke Kahanamoku. Australian
Kieren Perkins, attempting to win an unprecedented third straight Olympic 1500-meter title, is
sixth, American Don Schollander seventh, Russians Alex Popov and Vladimir Salnikov eighth and ninth,
and American Adolph Kiefer tenth."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but they were all mostly freestylers, and there is no IMers in the top ten
(Tamas Darnyi came in 22nd).

Mind you, all these in no way diminish Phelps achievements. He is the most dominating male swimmer
right now and his breaking 5 individual WRs in one meet is still the most by any male swimmer I
believe, so hats off to him, and he is on track to at least emulate Spitz' record in Athens next
year, but with Olympics, you never know. As 'the best swimmer ever' ? He still has long way to
claim that.
 
> [email protected] (Coyote) wrote in news:[email protected]:
> >
> > I think the most complete track athletes of all are the best of the decathlon and heptathlon.
> > Tomas Dvorak, Dan O'Brien, Daley Thompson, Bruce Jenner, Roman Sebrle, and of coure
> > Jackie-Joyner Kersee (the greatest American woman track athlete ever). Most track afficianados
> > consider the best athlete in the world to be determined in this event.

You missed my point. Best Athlete. That's the keyword. It's not same as 'Best Runner'. I made an
analogy of runners for swimmers (based on the premise of fastest movement over given distance, hence
I discounted field events). 'straight runners' as 'freestylers (crawl)', other running styles
(hurdle, jump, walk) as other swimming styles (back, fly, breast). In straight 100 track, you can
walk, run, jump, cartwheel your way to the finish line. In swimming freestyle events, you can crawl,
fly, back, breast your way to the finish line. whichever faster for you.

Was Jackie-Joyner Kersee the best runner in her heyday ? NO. Is Tomas Dvorak best male runner now ?
NO. In aquatic sports, Heptahtlon and Decathlon would be like combining all aquatic events into one.
Best male sprinter runner is either Tim Montgomery or Maurice Green. Best male Middle Distance
runner is either Hicham El Guerrouj or Wilson Kipketer. Best Distance runner EVER is probably Haile
Gebreselasie. Ditto with Female. Best sprinter is Marion Jones. Best Middle Distance is Maria
Mutola. For distance events, there is no clear 'best' right now. But if Paula Radcliffe starts
running 10,000 soon, she'll be the best distance runner.

Best male hurdlers are Allen Johnson and Felix Sanchez. Best female hrudlers is Gail Devers (for
100m). Edwin Moses is the greatest male 400 m hurdler ever, but *never* greatest male runner ever,
neither are Devers and Johnson. Gail Devers has also won 2 olympic golds in 100m run. Irina
Privalova who was mainly sprinter made a switch in sydney to 400 hurdle, and she won. Carl Lewis and
Marion Jones are also great jumpers because they are great sprinters. But Lewis or Jones could never
hope to win anything in 1,500 m run. You see that it is harder to be versatile distance-wise, than
style-wise. That's why Michael Johnson is considered among the greatest of all runners as he
mastered both 200 (sprint event) and 400 (borderline middle)

I liken swimming IMs to a combination of running, walking, jumping, and hurdling in one race.
Unfortunately (or fortunately ?), there is no such thing in track. Oh wait, the closest is
Steeplechase. They run, hurdle, and jump in one race. Would you consider the best steeplechase
runner as the greatest runner ever ?

>Harold Pinter <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:<[email protected]>...

> Of course. Only an idiot like alexandria would try to equate the most popular events with the most
> demanding. But alexandria has to pursue that stupid line of reasoning because to think otherwise
> would destroy his belief in Ian Thorpe's superiority, particularly when Phelps has just totally
> destroyed and displaced him.

It is always futile to argue against someone who resorts to namecalling. Not to mention distorting
facts and putting words into another's mouth.

I hope you get it this time : Yes, I believe that Thorpe is still the superior freestyler, more
superior than anybody else. I believe that Thorpe is the greatest male freestyler ever. I also
believe that Thorpe is halfway to be considered the 'greatest male swimmer ever'. But, I don't
believe that Thorpe is the most dominant male swimmer at the moment. That title goes to Phelps.
However, I believe that Phelps is NOT the greatest male swimmer ever, not even halfway. Not until he
wins multiple olympic golds and win a freestyle event.

In December 1999 edition of Swimming World magazine, the top ten greatest male swimmers in the 20th
century were : "Spitz just edged Weissmuller for the top men's spot. Third place went to American
Matt Biondi, fourth to Australian Murray Rose and fifth to American Duke Kahanamoku. Australian
Kieren Perkins, attempting to win an unprecedented third straight Olympic 1500-meter title, is
sixth, American Don Schollander seventh, Russians Alex Popov and Vladimir Salnikov eighth and ninth,
and American Adolph Kiefer tenth."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but they were all mostly freestylers, and there is no IMers in the top ten
(Tamas Darnyi came in 22nd).

Mind you, all these in no way diminish Phelps achievements. He is the most dominating male swimmer
right now and his breaking 5 individual WRs in one meet is still the most by any male swimmer I
believe, so hats off to him, and he is on track to at least emulate Spitz' record in Athens next
year, but with Olympics, you never know. As 'the best swimmer ever' ? He still has long way to
claim that.
 
The medleys are sometimes compared to the decathlon. I think in the case of the decathlon, it is
clear that the gold medalists are pretty mediocre in each and every event the decathlon is comprised
of. It's fine to admire these all-around athletes, but you can't really get as excited about them as
you can about the athletes who excel in the purer single events. In the case of the medleys, the
distinction is not as sharp, since all the events are swimming events, and medley swimmers need to
be nearer to world class in all the strokes to be successful. But nevertheless, I attach more value
to the single stroke events.

This is an example of "Farr's Law," formulated by California aerospace engineer Eugene Farr in the
1970s. He first came up with it when he noticed that the quality of the powdered eggs in dehydrated
"Denver Omlette" backpacking food packs were lower than the quality of the powdered eggs sold
separately.

Of course, Phelps's powdered eggs are pretty high level, omlette or not.
 
[email protected] (alexandria) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > [email protected] (Coyote) wrote in news:[email protected]:
> > >
> > > I think the most complete track athletes of all are the best of the decathlon and heptathlon.
> > > Tomas Dvorak, Dan O'Brien, Daley Thompson, Bruce Jenner, Roman Sebrle, and of coure
> > > Jackie-Joyner Kersee (the greatest American woman track athlete ever). Most track afficianados
> > > consider the best athlete in the world to be determined in this event.
>
> You missed my point. Best Athlete. That's the keyword. It's not same as 'Best Runner'. I made an
> analogy of runners for swimmers (based on the premise of fastest movement over given distance,
> hence I discounted field events). 'straight runners' as 'freestylers (crawl)', other running
> styles (hurdle, jump, walk) as other swimming styles (back, fly, breast). In straight 100 track,
> you can walk, run, jump, cartwheel your way to the finish line. In swimming freestyle events, you
> can crawl, fly, back, breast your way to the finish line. whichever faster for you.
>
> Was Jackie-Joyner Kersee the best runner in her heyday ? NO. Is Tomas Dvorak best male runner now
> ? NO. In aquatic sports, Heptahtlon and Decathlon would be like combining all aquatic events into
> one. Best male sprinter runner is either Tim Montgomery or Maurice Green. Best male Middle
> Distance runner is either Hicham El Guerrouj or Wilson Kipketer. Best Distance runner EVER is
> probably Haile Gebreselasie. Ditto with Female. Best sprinter is Marion Jones. Best Middle
> Distance is Maria Mutola. For distance events, there is no clear 'best' right now. But if Paula
> Radcliffe starts running 10,000 soon, she'll be the best distance runner.
>
> Best male hurdlers are Allen Johnson and Felix Sanchez. Best female hrudlers is Gail Devers (for
> 100m). Edwin Moses is the greatest male 400 m hurdler ever, but *never* greatest male runner ever,
> neither are Devers and Johnson. Gail Devers has also won 2 olympic golds in 100m run. Irina
> Privalova who was mainly sprinter made a switch in sydney to 400 hurdle, and she won. Carl Lewis
> and Marion Jones are also great jumpers because they are great sprinters. But Lewis or Jones could
> never hope to win anything in 1,500 m run. You see that it is harder to be versatile
> distance-wise, than style-wise. That's why Michael Johnson is considered among the greatest of all
> runners as he mastered both 200 (sprint event) and 400 (borderline middle)
>
> I liken swimming IMs to a combination of running, walking, jumping, and hurdling in one race.
> Unfortunately (or fortunately ?), there is no such thing in track. Oh wait, the closest is
> Steeplechase. They run, hurdle, and jump in one race. Would you consider the best steeplechase
> runner as the greatest runner ever ?
>
>
> >Harold Pinter <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:<[email protected]>...
>
> > Of course. Only an idiot like alexandria would try to equate the most popular events with the
> > most demanding. But alexandria has to pursue that stupid line of reasoning because to think
> > otherwise would destroy his belief in Ian Thorpe's superiority, particularly when Phelps has
> > just totally destroyed and displaced him.
>
> It is always futile to argue against someone who resorts to namecalling. Not to mention distorting
> facts and putting words into another's mouth.
>
> I hope you get it this time : Yes, I believe that Thorpe is still the superior freestyler, more
> superior than anybody else. I believe that Thorpe is the greatest male freestyler ever. I also
> believe that Thorpe is halfway to be considered the 'greatest male swimmer ever'. But, I don't
> believe that Thorpe is the most dominant male swimmer at the moment. That title goes to Phelps.
> However, I believe that Phelps is NOT the greatest male swimmer ever, not even halfway. Not until
> he wins multiple olympic golds and win a freestyle event.
>
> In December 1999 edition of Swimming World magazine, the top ten greatest male swimmers in the
> 20th century were : "Spitz just edged Weissmuller for the top men's spot. Third place went to
> American Matt Biondi, fourth to Australian Murray Rose and fifth to American Duke Kahanamoku.
> Australian Kieren Perkins, attempting to win an unprecedented third straight Olympic 1500-meter
> title, is sixth, American Don Schollander seventh, Russians Alex Popov and Vladimir Salnikov
> eighth and ninth, and American Adolph Kiefer tenth."
>
> Correct me if I'm wrong, but they were all mostly freestylers, and there is no IMers in the top
> ten (Tamas Darnyi came in 22nd).
>
> Mind you, all these in no way diminish Phelps achievements. He is the most dominating male swimmer
> right now and his breaking 5 individual WRs in one meet is still the most by any male swimmer I
> believe, so hats off to him, and he is on track to at least emulate Spitz' record in Athens next
> year, but with Olympics, you never know. As 'the best swimmer ever' ? He still has long way to
> claim that.

First of all thank you for addressing my points. I just don't want people to mix my commentary with
the statements of other posters if possible. Secondly, the Swimming world magazine has an evident
bias towards the past. A past in which the other strokes weren't often contested at both 100 and
200. Krisztina Egerszegi would be near the very top of any list of women I can guarantee you. What
about Tracy Caulkins? Both of them would be up there, probably along with Fraser, Evans, and perhaps
Meagher or Gould. Egerszegi's, Evans, and Gould's careers are distinctly enhanced by winning
peformances in the IM. Michael Gross is oddly absent from the top 10 in this list, which raises
questions about it's orientation to the past with performers such as Adolph Kiefer (strictly a
backstroker) who won one gold in the 100 back. The IM wasn't included until the 60's. In fact only a
few swimming events were on the programme prior to the 60's. Spitz's ranking is obviously enhanced
by his ability to dominate in butterfly at both distances. Unlike 1896-1964, if he had only
succeeded in his freestyle during the early 70's he would not be ranked the #1 swimmer, or top 20
for that matter. The others, albeit freestylers are largely there in recognition of longevity, which
Phelps has yet to demonstrate.

You can only compare track and swimming to a very limited extent. Fly, back, what have you, it's
still swimming. We should not equivocate the butterfly to steeple chase jumping or race walking.
It's not an apt comparison at all. In any stroke in swimming we use more than just legs for one
thing. Even though you don't do it intentionally you sometimes come across as making these other
disciplines seem gimmicky. In retrospect, the decathlon comparison is not a good comparison either.
There is no real apt comparison between track & field and the mulitiple disciplines of swimming.
Specifically because of the multiple demands placed upon both lower and upper body in each event.
Honestly, it is a shock to me that Darnyi isn't ranked much higher. You won't find many, if any
other such lists that rank him that low. Top 15 at minimum, IMO.
 
"Colin Priest" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...

You are right about that. The 100 and to a lesser extent the 200 free. The depth of the field is ...
again, something that enhances Ian's achievements. But there are reasons events like the 400IM
aren't as popular. Same with the 1500. But I certainly don't think it should diminish how we view
the accomplishments of Perkins or Hackett.

> The most popular events are also the events with the most depth. There is more depth in track
> running than in other running based events, such as hurdling, because more people compete in
> running. Similarly freestyle has more depth than the form strokes, because more people compete in
> freestyle than in the other strokes. Think about swimming training sessions - we tend more time
> swimming freestyle in training than any other stroke. It is therefore more difficult to
> consistently excel in freestyle than in the form strokes.

>
> So Alexandria has written something entirely reasonable, and Harold Pinter has once again resorted
> to name calling instead of any logical argument.
>
>
> "Harold Pinter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > [email protected] (Coyote) wrote in news:[email protected]:
> >
> > > [email protected] (alexandria) wrote in message
> > > news:<[email protected]>...
> > >> Judging by the quality of your previous posts, I shouldn't have been surprised by your lack
> > >> of ability to discern that I only limited to track events (ie. running/walking/hurdling). It
> > >> is true that walking and hurdling need different sets of skills (just like back, breast, fly
> > >> as opposed to crawl), but the greatest track athletes were never hurdlers, walkers, or cross
> > >> country-ers.
> > >
> > > I think the most complete track athletes of all are the best of the decathlon and heptathlon.
> > > Tomas Dvorak, Dan O'Brien, Daley Thompson, Bruce Jenner, Roman Sebrle, and of coure
> > > Jackie-Joyner Kersee (the greatest American woman track athlete ever). Most track afficianados
> > > consider the best athlete in the world to be determined in this event.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Of course. Only an idiot like alexandria would try to equate the most popular events with the
> > most demanding. But alexandria has to pursue that stupid line of reasoning because to think
> > otherwise would destroy his belief in Ian Thorpe's superiority, particularly when Phelps has
> > just totally destroyed and displaced him.