Mid 70s Frame ID help needed.



C

Camilo

Guest
Maybe rbt is not the correct forum to ask this, but here goes. Any
info, or pointers would be GREATLY appreciated.

I am trying to figure out the name that was on the frame of a bike I
bought in 1976.

At the time, I remember being positive that this frame was the same as
was being labeled Novara by REI. I "THINK" I read this in Consumer
Reports at the time, maybe not.

It was not labeled "Novara" and was not bought from REI. It was
bought at an LBS, for probably around $150 at the time. I know it was
copper in color, had bar-end shifters that were not indexed, but had a
ratchet feel to them. I believe the rear derailleur was Suntour V, it
had a cotterless crank (Sugino?). (remember back then, cottered
cranks were the norm in mid level "10 speeds", this was a big deal to
have a cotterless crank!).

This was and is the only brand new bike I've ever purchased. I'm a big
fan of buying slightly used bikes for 1/2 retail price! Maybe this
attitude is caused by the fact that this, my only new bike, was stolen
off my back porch a couple of years later, a heavy cable cut to get
it. That's bad enough, but it happened about 2 days after I'd wrecked
my car and was my only means of transportation at the time. (I was
late to work that day!)

Turns out I replaced it with the bike I probably loved more than any
I've had, just because of the comfort and where I was at at the time -
My red Raleigh Supercourse MK II.

This is a very trivial question that has just been driving me nuts
lately. In my mind, I'm trying to catalogue all the bicycles I've
owned in my life and I just can't get this one.
 
A

A Muzi

Guest
Camilo wrote:
> Maybe rbt is not the correct forum to ask this, but here goes. Any
> info, or pointers would be GREATLY appreciated.
>
> I am trying to figure out the name that was on the frame of a bike I
> bought in 1976.
>
> At the time, I remember being positive that this frame was the same as
> was being labeled Novara by REI. I "THINK" I read this in Consumer
> Reports at the time, maybe not.
>
> It was not labeled "Novara" and was not bought from REI. It was
> bought at an LBS, for probably around $150 at the time. I know it was
> copper in color, had bar-end shifters that were not indexed, but had a
> ratchet feel to them. I believe the rear derailleur was Suntour V, it
> had a cotterless crank (Sugino?). (remember back then, cottered
> cranks were the norm in mid level "10 speeds", this was a big deal to
> have a cotterless crank!).
>
> This was and is the only brand new bike I've ever purchased. I'm a big
> fan of buying slightly used bikes for 1/2 retail price! Maybe this
> attitude is caused by the fact that this, my only new bike, was stolen
> off my back porch a couple of years later, a heavy cable cut to get
> it. That's bad enough, but it happened about 2 days after I'd wrecked
> my car and was my only means of transportation at the time. (I was
> late to work that day!)
>
> Turns out I replaced it with the bike I probably loved more than any
> I've had, just because of the comfort and where I was at at the time -
> My red Raleigh Supercourse MK II.
>
> This is a very trivial question that has just been driving me nuts
> lately. In my mind, I'm trying to catalogue all the bicycles I've
> owned in my life and I just can't get this one.
>

Big field. Maybe Kobe, Compania, Sekai, Lumala, Centurion, Nishiki,
Azuki, Crystal? Plus many 'store labels'. Way too many from your
description of "not Novarra".

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
 
O

Ozark Bicycle

Guest
On Apr 2, 5:38 pm, A Muzi <[email protected]> wrote:
> Camilo wrote:
> > Maybe rbt is not the correct forum to ask this, but here goes. Any
> > info, or pointers would be GREATLY appreciated.

>
> > I am trying to figure out the name that was on the frame of a bike I
> > bought in 1976.

>
> > At the time, I remember being positive that this frame was the same as
> > was being labeled Novara by REI. I "THINK" I read this in Consumer
> > Reports at the time, maybe not.

>
> > It was not labeled "Novara" and was not bought from REI. It was
> > bought at an LBS, for probably around $150 at the time. I know it was
> > copper in color, had bar-end shifters that were not indexed, but had a
> > ratchet feel to them. I believe the rear derailleur was Suntour V, it
> > had a cotterless crank (Sugino?). (remember back then, cottered
> > cranks were the norm in mid level "10 speeds", this was a big deal to
> > have a cotterless crank!).

>
> > This was and is the only brand new bike I've ever purchased. I'm a big
> > fan of buying slightly used bikes for 1/2 retail price! Maybe this
> > attitude is caused by the fact that this, my only new bike, was stolen
> > off my back porch a couple of years later, a heavy cable cut to get
> > it. That's bad enough, but it happened about 2 days after I'd wrecked
> > my car and was my only means of transportation at the time. (I was
> > late to work that day!)

>
> > Turns out I replaced it with the bike I probably loved more than any
> > I've had, just because of the comfort and where I was at at the time -
> > My red Raleigh Supercourse MK II.

>
> > This is a very trivial question that has just been driving me nuts
> > lately. In my mind, I'm trying to catalogue all the bicycles I've
> > owned in my life and I just can't get this one.

>
> Big field. Maybe Kobe, Compania, Sekai, Lumala, Centurion, Nishiki,
> Azuki, Crystal? Plus many 'store labels'. Way too many from your
> description of "not Novarra".
>


Did REI even use the Novara brand name as far back as 1976?
 
G

Gary Jacobson

Guest
">> Big field. Maybe Kobe, Compania, Sekai, Lumala, Centurion, Nishiki,
>> Azuki, Crystal? Plus many 'store labels'. Way too many from your
>> description of "not Novarra".
>>

>
> Did REI even use the Novara brand name as far back as 1976?



REI sold Crescent- Swedish made bikes -in 1976 ,I am quite certain.
Does it have a very weird front geometry? Likea step head angle?

Gary Jacobson
Rosendale, NY
 
On Apr 3, 1:04 pm, "sergio" <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2 Apr, 21:12, "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > I am trying to figure out the name that was on the frame of a bike I
> > bought in 1976.
> > At the time, I remember being positive that this frame was the same as
> > was being labeled Novara by REI.

>
> I asked around and someone came out with what would have been the most
> obvious answer indeed.
> That REI was the maker in Novara, a town between Milano and Torino.
>
> Sergio
> Pisa


Thanks! I was wondering about that. Now how do you explan
"Scattante" ?

Doug
 
H

Hank Wirtz

Guest
On Apr 3, 1:22 pm, [email protected] wrote:
> On Apr 3, 1:04 pm, "sergio" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > On 2 Apr, 21:12, "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
> > > I am trying to figure out the name that was on the frame of a bike I
> > > bought in 1976.
> > > At the time, I remember being positive that this frame was the same as
> > > was being labeled Novara by REI.

>
> > I asked around and someone came out with what would have been the most
> > obvious answer indeed.
> > That REI was the maker in Novara, a town between Milano and Torino.

>
> > Sergio
> > Pisa

>
> Thanks! I was wondering about that. Now how do you explan
> "Scattante" ?
>
> Doug


That's the result of Truth-In-Advertising laws.
 
F

Forbes B-Black

Guest
On Apr 2, 12:12 pm, "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> It was not labeled "Novara" and was not bought from REI. It was
> bought at an LBS, for probably around $150 at the time. I know it was
> copper in color, had bar-end shifters that were not indexed, but had a
> ratchet feel to them. I believe the rear derailleur was Suntour V, it
> had a cotterless crank (Sugino?). (remember back then, cottered
> cranks were the norm in mid level "10 speeds", this was a big deal to
> have a cotterless crank!).
>

Miyata? Sounds kinda similar to "Novara" in terms of cadence and word
structure. I want to remember a copper-colored Miyata, but I might be
imagining things.

I'm sure that Univega sold copper colored road bikes.

Both Miyata and Univega had nice touring bikes available with the
Suntour ratcheting Barcon shifters you describe.

Either of those names sound familiar?

Yours,

Forbes B-Black
 
S

sergio

Guest
On 3 Apr, 22:20, A Muzi <[email protected]> wrote:
> If I recall, REI only used the "Novara" name for Japanese-produced ...


I take your word, Andrew.
Then, the one I quoted might have been simply an easy, and stupid,
guess.

> If I were an REI product manager, I'd name my bike "Novara" instead of
> "Osaka" or "Kaohsiung"


Well, I think I could have come up with a lot of better names than
that.

Sergio
Pisa
 
On Apr 3, 3:39 pm, Tim McNamara <[email protected]> wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
>
>
>
> "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Maybe rbt is not the correct forum to ask this, but here goes. Any
> > info, or pointers would be GREATLY appreciated.

>
> > I am trying to figure out the name that was on the frame of a bike I
> > bought in 1976.

>
> > At the time, I remember being positive that this frame was the same
> > as was being labeled Novara by REI. I "THINK" I read this in
> > Consumer Reports at the time, maybe not.

>
> > It was not labeled "Novara" and was not bought from REI. It was
> > bought at an LBS, for probably around $150 at the time. I know it
> > was copper in color, had bar-end shifters that were not indexed, but
> > had a ratchet feel to them. I believe the rear derailleur was
> > Suntour V, it had a cotterless crank (Sugino?). (remember back then,
> > cottered cranks were the norm in mid level "10 speeds", this was a
> > big deal to have a cotterless crank!).

>
> My guess is a mid-level Panasonic, Fuji or Miyata that was relabeled as
> the REI house brand. Panasonic still makes bikes for other labels, I
> don't know if they sell bikes under their own name outside of Japan.


In that case why would it have been bought at an LBS and not REI?
 
G

Gary Jacobson

Guest
"Hank Wirtz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> On Apr 3, 1:22 pm, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Apr 3, 1:04 pm, "sergio" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> > On 2 Apr, 21:12, "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote:

>> Thanks! I was wondering about that. Now how do you explan
>> "Scattante" ?
>>
>> Doug

>
> That's the result of Truth-In-Advertising laws.


Yep, derived from the same Latin origin that the word *scat* comes from.
Does *tante* mean big?

Gary Jacobson
Rosendale, NY
 
G

Gary Jacobson

Guest
"Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> On Apr 2, 6:06 pm, "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> ">> Big field. Maybe Kobe, Compania, Sekai, Lumala, Centurion, Nishiki,
>>
>> >> Azuki, Crystal? Plus many 'store labels'. Way too many from your
>> >> description of "not Novarra".

>>
>> > Did REI even use the Novara brand name as far back as 1976?

>>
>> REI sold Crescent- Swedish made bikes -in 1976 ,I am quite certain.
>> Does it have a very weird front geometry? Likea step head angle?
>>
>> Gary Jacobson
>> Rosendale, NY

>
> Thanks for the ideas everyone. Unfortunately, I don't have the bike
> (stolen) and am only trying to remember the name for my personal
> historic enjoyment.
>
> While I have this vague memory of a link between my frame and the
> bikes sold at that time by REI, I am now thinking it is possibly not
> accurate at all. But Crescent does sound familiar.....


Many Crescents had checkerboard graphic accents.

Gary Jacobson
Rosendale, NY
 
C

Camilo

Guest
On Apr 3, 2:55 pm, "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 2, 6:06 pm, "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> ">> Big field. Maybe Kobe, Compania, Sekai, Lumala, Centurion, Nishiki,

>
> >> >> Azuki, Crystal? Plus many 'store labels'. Way too many from your
> >> >> description of "not Novarra".

>
> >> > Did REI even use the Novara brand name as far back as 1976?

>
> >> REI sold Crescent- Swedish made bikes -in 1976 ,I am quite certain.
> >> Does it have a very weird front geometry? Likea step head angle?

>
> >> Gary Jacobson
> >> Rosendale, NY

>
> > Thanks for the ideas everyone. Unfortunately, I don't have the bike
> > (stolen) and am only trying to remember the name for my personal
> > historic enjoyment.

>
> > While I have this vague memory of a link between my frame and the
> > bikes sold at that time by REI, I am now thinking it is possibly not
> > accurate at all. But Crescent does sound familiar.....

>
> Many Crescents had checkerboard graphic accents.


Thanks again Gary. My dim 50+ mind is getting a glimmer of
familiarity. I'm going to take this as motivation to look at my
photos from that era, and maybe call up some old friends!
 
C

Camilo

Guest
On Apr 3, 2:55 pm, "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 2, 6:06 pm, "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> ">> Big field. Maybe Kobe, Compania, Sekai, Lumala, Centurion, Nishiki,

>
> >> >> Azuki, Crystal? Plus many 'store labels'. Way too many from your
> >> >> description of "not Novarra".

>
> >> > Did REI even use the Novara brand name as far back as 1976?

>
> >> REI sold Crescent- Swedish made bikes -in 1976 ,I am quite certain.
> >> Does it have a very weird front geometry? Likea step head angle?

>
> >> Gary Jacobson
> >> Rosendale, NY

>
> > Thanks for the ideas everyone. Unfortunately, I don't have the bike
> > (stolen) and am only trying to remember the name for my personal
> > historic enjoyment.

>
> > While I have this vague memory of a link between my frame and the
> > bikes sold at that time by REI, I am now thinking it is possibly not
> > accurate at all. But Crescent does sound familiar.....

>
> Many Crescents had checkerboard graphic accents.
>


You got me searching for Crescent, and I'm now beginning to think it
was. The seat tube decal jogs a memory. I especially like the
"influential ads" on this web site! I'm sure it would have affected
my buying decision at the time.

http://www.classicrendezvous.com/Sweden/Crescent.htm
 
S

semi-ambivalent

Guest
On Apr 3, 2:04 pm, "sergio" <[email protected]> wrote:

"That REI was the maker in Novara, a town between Milano and Torino."

I think "Novara" came out of a licensing deal between R.E.I. and Sue
Novara, Olympic medal winner in some year or another. I seem to recall
seeing her at the Chicago bicycle show, riding rollers in the Raleigh
booth in a one-piece skin suit. Awesome. But then, I'm 53, and there
might have been some meds in my cup of fruit cocktail...
 
C

Camilo

Guest
On Apr 3, 2:55 pm, "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Camilo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]
>
>
>
> > On Apr 2, 6:06 pm, "Gary Jacobson" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> ">> Big field. Maybe Kobe, Compania, Sekai, Lumala, Centurion, Nishiki,

>
> >> >> Azuki, Crystal? Plus many 'store labels'. Way too many from your
> >> >> description of "not Novarra".

>
> >> > Did REI even use the Novara brand name as far back as 1976?

>
> >> REI sold Crescent- Swedish made bikes -in 1976 ,I am quite certain.
> >> Does it have a very weird front geometry? Likea step head angle?

>
> >> Gary Jacobson
> >> Rosendale, NY

>
> > Thanks for the ideas everyone. Unfortunately, I don't have the bike
> > (stolen) and am only trying to remember the name for my personal
> > historic enjoyment.

>
> > While I have this vague memory of a link between my frame and the
> > bikes sold at that time by REI, I am now thinking it is possibly not
> > accurate at all. But Crescent does sound familiar.....

>
> Many Crescents had checkerboard graphic accents.
>
> Gary Jacobson
> Rosendale, NY


This Windsor looks awfully familiar, this exact bike would be my
guess:

http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=33816&d=1168218723