Monte Perdido

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by Northern Helmets, Nov 25, 2005.

  1. I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)

    One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.

    I appreciate that:

    (a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    this in the USA.
    (b) possibility(!) of bad weather

    But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    for snow and ice skills - we have none?

    I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    do it without ice axe etc.?

    Any help appreciated.
     
    Tags:


  2. "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    > the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)
    >
    > One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    > side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.
    >
    > I appreciate that:
    >
    > (a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    > this in the USA.
    > (b) possibility(!) of bad weather
    >
    > But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    > for snow and ice skills - we have none?
    >
    > I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    > Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    > do it without ice axe etc.?
    >
    > Any help appreciated.
    >

    Hi,

    Thank you for your e-mail acknowledging my route suggestion. From what I
    remember ascending Perdido from the Goriz refuge is fairly straightforward.
    Although I do not recall any serious snow patches on Perdido(twenty years
    ago) I always think that an ice axe and crampons are useful in the Pyrenees.
    There is a sort of wide gully on the final section which, I understand, can
    clog with snow in a bad winter. That said many do climb it without
    axe/crampons as I believe it is possible to avoid the snow patches. If you
    are ascending from the Refuge de la Breche to the Breche(to get to Goriz)
    itself then an axe and crampons wil make for faster progress on the
    permanent snow field above the hut.

    When are you going? Try to get some axe/crampon practice in this winter!

    Altitude is not really a problem in the Pyrenees if you are reasonably fit.
     
  3. On 25 Nov 2005 00:27:43 -0800, "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    >the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)
    >
    >One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    >side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.
    >
    >I appreciate that:
    >
    >(a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    >this in the USA.
    >(b) possibility(!) of bad weather
    >
    >But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    >for snow and ice skills - we have none?
    >
    >I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    >Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    >do it without ice axe etc.?
    >
    >Any help appreciated.


    You need to book the hut about 6 months in advance, otherwise you can
    camp. The ascent is straightforward, but you do have to cross a
    couple of dirty snow fields, so crampons and ice axe are advisable.
    Being a non-technical ascent you should be able to get away with an
    ascent without having been on a winter skills course, but a winter
    ascent in the UK using ice axe and crampons with an experienced friend
    beforehand should be a priority.
     
  4. On 25 Nov 2005 00:27:43 -0800, "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >
    >I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    >Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    >do it without ice axe etc.?
    >


    What time of year? We did it in September, and there was no need for
    any snow skills or equipment. Since we had axes and crampons with us
    we picked a route across the snow/ice, but everyone else stuck to the
    snow-free footpath. There was a small snow field on the summit, where
    we were happier with crampons on, but nobody else did! It's popular
    enough that there is generally a trail through the snow.

    As for booking the hut 6 months in advance - that might be required in
    July/August I suppose, though quite unusual. But we just turned up
    without booking, and there was no problem.

    S.

    --
    Oppose ID cards and the database state - sign the pledge at
    http://www.pledgebank.com/refuse
     
  5. mikek

    mikek Guest

    "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    > the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)
    >
    > One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    > side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.
    >
    > I appreciate that:
    >
    > (a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    > this in the USA.
    > (b) possibility(!) of bad weather
    >
    > But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    > for snow and ice skills - we have none?
    >
    > I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    > Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    > do it without ice axe etc.?
    >
    > Any help appreciated.
    >


    My number one concern is that if you intend to stay at the Goriz refuge in
    the summer it will be a disgusting experience. At the best of times you
    have to put up with black mould coming off the walls and flea bites. In the
    summer the nearby stream is full of toilet paper. The toilets are situated
    50m away from the sleeping quarters. The refuge itself is seriously
    overcrowded, mainly by older non Spaniards. There are often groups of Brits
    on guided tours organised by British adventure tour companies whose guides
    tend to be in their early 20's. These guides will proudly tell you that they
    have a good way of improving "group cohesion", and that it involves giving
    their group unlimited access to alcohol - which really pisses off most other
    people. Sleeping is difficult, as I said, most of the people that sleep in
    goriz these days are older, usually men in their late 40's upwards, they
    snore and fart all night. This might be the worse refuge in the Pyrenees.
    Sleep outside and try and get a meal and breakfast inside.

    Altitude is not a problem, the refuge is at 2200m (you can camp the night
    outside), this altitude is almost equal to the decompression inside a normal
    aeroplane in flight. The route to the summit is not strenuos and taken
    slowly the peak at about 3500m is not difficult. The walk to the refuge
    from Torla is tedious, if you make that you can make the summitt.

    Ice axe and crampons- between December and end of June I would consider them
    to be essential, unless otherwise told by people that you have met that have
    climbed the peak the previous day. August as far as I can tell is always ok
    without crampons but there are a couple of patches of snow that really
    require carrying an ice axe. Do not take the advice of the Goriz refuge
    guardians, they get younger and more reckless each year. There is nearly
    always an uptodate weather forecast on the refuge noticeboard.

    Good luck
     
  6. "mikek" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >>I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    >> the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)
    >>
    >> One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    >> side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.
    >>
    >> I appreciate that:
    >>
    >> (a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    >> this in the USA.
    >> (b) possibility(!) of bad weather
    >>
    >> But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    >> for snow and ice skills - we have none?
    >>
    >> I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    >> Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    >> do it without ice axe etc.?
    >>
    >> Any help appreciated.
    >>

    >
    > My number one concern is that if you intend to stay at the Goriz refuge in
    > the summer it will be a disgusting experience. At the best of times you
    > have to put up with black mould coming off the walls and flea bites. In
    > the summer the nearby stream is full of toilet paper. The toilets are
    > situated 50m away from the sleeping quarters. The refuge itself is
    > seriously overcrowded, mainly by older non Spaniards. There are often
    > groups of Brits on guided tours organised by British adventure tour
    > companies whose guides tend to be in their early 20's. These guides will
    > proudly tell you that they have a good way of improving "group cohesion",
    > and that it involves giving their group unlimited access to alcohol -
    > which really pisses off most other people. Sleeping is difficult, as I
    > said, most of the people that sleep in goriz these days are older, usually
    > men in their late 40's upwards, they snore and fart all night. This might
    > be the worse refuge in the Pyrenees. Sleep outside and try and get a meal
    > and breakfast inside.
    >
    > Altitude is not a problem, the refuge is at 2200m (you can camp the night
    > outside), this altitude is almost equal to the decompression inside a
    > normal aeroplane in flight. The route to the summit is not strenuos and
    > taken slowly the peak at about 3500m is not difficult. The walk to the
    > refuge from Torla is tedious, if you make that you can make the summitt.
    >
    > Ice axe and crampons- between December and end of June I would consider
    > them to be essential, unless otherwise told by people that you have met
    > that have climbed the peak the previous day. August as far as I can tell
    > is always ok without crampons but there are a couple of patches of snow
    > that really require carrying an ice axe. Do not take the advice of the
    > Goriz refuge guardians, they get younger and more reckless each year.
    > There is nearly always an uptodate weather forecast on the refuge
    > noticeboard.
    >
    > Good luck
    >
    >

    Whilst I cannot comment on the current state of the Goriz hut - it is twenty
    years since I was there - I do take exception to your implied prejudice
    about older people. As a 60 year old still active walker I could probably
    fart and snore the pants off you any day, especially in the Pyrenees!

    Behave yourself and you might make sixty yourself one day!
     
  7. On Sat, 26 Nov 2005 16:50:11 +0000 (UTC), "mikek"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >My number one concern is that if you intend to stay at the Goriz refuge in
    >the summer it will be a disgusting experience. At the best of times you
    >have to put up with black mould coming off the walls and flea bites. In the
    >summer the nearby stream is full of toilet paper. The toilets are situated
    >50m away from the sleeping quarters. The refuge itself is seriously
    >overcrowded, mainly by older non Spaniards. There are often groups of Brits
    >on guided tours organised by British adventure tour companies whose guides
    >tend to be in their early 20's. These guides will proudly tell you that they
    >have a good way of improving "group cohesion", and that it involves giving
    >their group unlimited access to alcohol - which really pisses off most other
    >people. Sleeping is difficult, as I said, most of the people that sleep in
    >goriz these days are older, usually men in their late 40's upwards, they
    >snore and fart all night. This might be the worse refuge in the Pyrenees.
    >Sleep outside and try and get a meal and breakfast inside.


    The refuge has recently been refitted.

    They cook meals for 80 people, with accommodation for 60 people. If
    you camp a meal is not gauranteed.
     
  8. mikek

    mikek Guest

    "Michael Hobby" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > "mikek" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >>
    >> "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> news:[email protected]
    >>>I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    >>> the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)
    >>>
    >>> One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    >>> side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.
    >>>
    >>> I appreciate that:
    >>>
    >>> (a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    >>> this in the USA.
    >>> (b) possibility(!) of bad weather
    >>>
    >>> But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    >>> for snow and ice skills - we have none?
    >>>
    >>> I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    >>> Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    >>> do it without ice axe etc.?
    >>>
    >>> Any help appreciated.
    >>>

    >>
    >> My number one concern is that if you intend to stay at the Goriz refuge
    >> in the summer it will be a disgusting experience. At the best of times
    >> you have to put up with black mould coming off the walls and flea bites.
    >> In the summer the nearby stream is full of toilet paper. The toilets are
    >> situated 50m away from the sleeping quarters. The refuge itself is
    >> seriously overcrowded, mainly by older non Spaniards. There are often
    >> groups of Brits on guided tours organised by British adventure tour
    >> companies whose guides tend to be in their early 20's. These guides will
    >> proudly tell you that they have a good way of improving "group cohesion",
    >> and that it involves giving their group unlimited access to alcohol -
    >> which really pisses off most other people. Sleeping is difficult, as I
    >> said, most of the people that sleep in goriz these days are older,
    >> usually men in their late 40's upwards, they snore and fart all night.
    >> This might be the worse refuge in the Pyrenees. Sleep outside and try and
    >> get a meal and breakfast inside.
    >>
    >> Altitude is not a problem, the refuge is at 2200m (you can camp the night
    >> outside), this altitude is almost equal to the decompression inside a
    >> normal aeroplane in flight. The route to the summit is not strenuos and
    >> taken slowly the peak at about 3500m is not difficult. The walk to the
    >> refuge from Torla is tedious, if you make that you can make the summitt.
    >>
    >> Ice axe and crampons- between December and end of June I would consider
    >> them to be essential, unless otherwise told by people that you have met
    >> that have climbed the peak the previous day. August as far as I can tell
    >> is always ok without crampons but there are a couple of patches of snow
    >> that really require carrying an ice axe. Do not take the advice of the
    >> Goriz refuge guardians, they get younger and more reckless each year.
    >> There is nearly always an uptodate weather forecast on the refuge
    >> noticeboard.
    >>
    >> Good luck
    >>
    >>

    > Whilst I cannot comment on the current state of the Goriz hut - it is
    > twenty years since I was there - I do take exception to your implied
    > prejudice about older people. As a 60 year old still active walker I could
    > probably fart and snore the pants off you any day, especially in the
    > Pyrenees!
    >
    > Behave yourself and you might make sixty yourself one day!
    >


    I left the third annoying thing, which is the twice nightly visiter to the
    loo, of which I am one :-(
     
  9. mikek

    mikek Guest

    "Bertie Wiggins" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Sat, 26 Nov 2005 16:50:11 +0000 (UTC), "mikek"
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >>My number one concern is that if you intend to stay at the Goriz refuge in
    >>the summer it will be a disgusting experience. At the best of times you
    >>have to put up with black mould coming off the walls and flea bites. In
    >>the
    >>summer the nearby stream is full of toilet paper. The toilets are situated
    >>50m away from the sleeping quarters. The refuge itself is seriously
    >>overcrowded, mainly by older non Spaniards. There are often groups of
    >>Brits
    >>on guided tours organised by British adventure tour companies whose
    >>guides
    >>tend to be in their early 20's. These guides will proudly tell you that
    >>they
    >>have a good way of improving "group cohesion", and that it involves giving
    >>their group unlimited access to alcohol - which really pisses off most
    >>other
    >>people. Sleeping is difficult, as I said, most of the people that sleep in
    >>goriz these days are older, usually men in their late 40's upwards, they
    >>snore and fart all night. This might be the worse refuge in the Pyrenees.
    >>Sleep outside and try and get a meal and breakfast inside.

    >
    > The refuge has recently been refitted.
    >
    > They cook meals for 80 people, with accommodation for 60 people. If
    > you camp a meal is not gauranteed.


    Refitted!!! When was that? I was there July 2005 and it was worse than
    ever. I have seen the refuge every year since 1999 and its been getting
    steadily worse. This summer I spent 1 night there and needed antihistamines
    to cope with the flea bites, I know it was fleas because I caught one.

    Yes, you are right about meals not being guaranteed.
     
  10. On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 10:43:01 +0000 (UTC), "mikek"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Refitted!!! When was that? I was there July 2005 and it was worse than
    >ever. I have seen the refuge every year since 1999 and its been getting
    >steadily worse. This summer I spent 1 night there and needed antihistamines
    >to cope with the flea bites, I know it was fleas because I caught one.


    Bunks have risen from 72 to 96, apparently. You should have seen it
    before the refit. ;-)

    http://tinyurl.com/b67lo

    >Yes, you are right about meals not being guaranteed.
     
  11. hyweldavies

    hyweldavies Guest

    With the caveat that I haven't climbed it myself, but have been in the
    vicinity a couple of times - great area by the way - I know people who
    have climbed it quite happily without axes, though with the odd snow
    patch to cross. They are normally fit adventurous hill-walkers rather
    than serious climbers as such, if that's any guide. I'd say walking
    poles would be highly recommended as a (inferior) substitute for an axe
    under these circumstances. Personally I'd probably risk it without an
    axe, as it's a long way to carry one and not (really) need it. If I had
    a car, I would however take it on the holiday, and judge whether to
    carry it according to my thoughts at the time. All this assumes you are
    talking about a summer trip - at this time of year, you'd definitely
    want axe, crampons, the lot, and it would be a serious undertaking.

    Cheers

    Hywel
     
  12. Thanks for all the replies... our foreign trips are always
    mid-september - cheaper air fares, no school kids etc - so by the sound
    of it we **should** be OK without snow/ice skills.

    We stopped camping (abroad) becuase we can do/see so much more without
    all of the clobber (therefore weight) required... I appreciate the huts
    can be cosy - with all the "benefits" this brings ... but your
    descriptions are putting me off! Any alternatives?
     
  13. On 28 Nov 2005 14:00:27 -0800, "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >Thanks for all the replies... our foreign trips are always
    >mid-september - cheaper air fares, no school kids etc - so by the sound
    >of it we **should** be OK without snow/ice skills.


    Take an axe at the very least and spend a day in Britain in winter
    conditions.

    >We stopped camping (abroad) becuase we can do/see so much more without
    >all of the clobber (therefore weight) required... I appreciate the huts
    >can be cosy - with all the "benefits" this brings ... but your
    >descriptions are putting me off! Any alternatives?


    Two. Bivi, or climb the hill and back in a day. Don't be too put off
    by Goriz. It's warm and dry, and once asleep you don't notice your
    surroundings.
     
  14. On 28 Nov 2005 14:00:27 -0800, "Northern Helmets" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >Thanks for all the replies... our foreign trips are always
    >mid-september - cheaper air fares, no school kids etc - so by the sound
    >of it we **should** be OK without snow/ice skills.


    Unless of course you hit the first snows of winter ;-)

    >
    >We stopped camping (abroad) becuase we can do/see so much more without
    >all of the clobber (therefore weight) required... I appreciate the huts
    >can be cosy - with all the "benefits" this brings ... but your
    >descriptions are putting me off! Any alternatives?


    If it's anything like as bad as some have said, then it's changed
    hugely in the last 7 years since I was there. I thought it just a
    normal mountain hut, with all that implies, both good and bad.

    S.

    --
    Oppose ID cards and the database state - sign the pledge at
    http://www.pledgebank.com/refuse
     
  15. Jay

    Jay Guest

    I camped at the Goriz hut last summer, early July or very late June.
    There was some snow around above the hut but none at the hut itself.

    It is very crowded and quite expensive. Camping is a good option, there
    are lots of 'ready made' pitches and some stunning views.


    Jay


    Michael Hobby wrote:
    > "mikek" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >
    >>"Northern Helmets" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>news:[email protected]
    >>
    >>>I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    >>>the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)
    >>>
    >>>One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    >>>side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.
    >>>
    >>>I appreciate that:
    >>>
    >>>(a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    >>>this in the USA.
    >>>(b) possibility(!) of bad weather
    >>>
    >>>But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    >>>for snow and ice skills - we have none?
    >>>
    >>>I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    >>>Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    >>>do it without ice axe etc.?
    >>>
    >>>Any help appreciated.
    >>>

    >>
    >>My number one concern is that if you intend to stay at the Goriz refuge in
    >>the summer it will be a disgusting experience. At the best of times you
    >>have to put up with black mould coming off the walls and flea bites. In
    >>the summer the nearby stream is full of toilet paper. The toilets are
    >>situated 50m away from the sleeping quarters. The refuge itself is
    >>seriously overcrowded, mainly by older non Spaniards. There are often
    >>groups of Brits on guided tours organised by British adventure tour
    >>companies whose guides tend to be in their early 20's. These guides will
    >>proudly tell you that they have a good way of improving "group cohesion",
    >>and that it involves giving their group unlimited access to alcohol -
    >>which really pisses off most other people. Sleeping is difficult, as I
    >>said, most of the people that sleep in goriz these days are older, usually
    >>men in their late 40's upwards, they snore and fart all night. This might
    >>be the worse refuge in the Pyrenees. Sleep outside and try and get a meal
    >>and breakfast inside.
    >>
    >>Altitude is not a problem, the refuge is at 2200m (you can camp the night
    >>outside), this altitude is almost equal to the decompression inside a
    >>normal aeroplane in flight. The route to the summit is not strenuos and
    >>taken slowly the peak at about 3500m is not difficult. The walk to the
    >>refuge from Torla is tedious, if you make that you can make the summitt.
    >>
    >>Ice axe and crampons- between December and end of June I would consider
    >>them to be essential, unless otherwise told by people that you have met
    >>that have climbed the peak the previous day. August as far as I can tell
    >>is always ok without crampons but there are a couple of patches of snow
    >>that really require carrying an ice axe. Do not take the advice of the
    >>Goriz refuge guardians, they get younger and more reckless each year.
    >>There is nearly always an uptodate weather forecast on the refuge
    >>noticeboard.
    >>
    >>Good luck
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Whilst I cannot comment on the current state of the Goriz hut - it is twenty
    > years since I was there - I do take exception to your implied prejudice
    > about older people. As a 60 year old still active walker I could probably
    > fart and snore the pants off you any day, especially in the Pyrenees!
    >
    > Behave yourself and you might make sixty yourself one day!
    >
    >
     
  16. mikek

    mikek Guest

    Hi, yes I'd agree with the camping option. Its a bit of a downer at first,
    seeing all these people hanging about the refuge and wondering if you are
    missing out on something special. But you can nearly always have the 6.30am
    breakfast which is not so nice but comes with a hot drink and that makes up
    for any camping discomfort. I have spend a few nights in one of those
    claustrophobic gortex bivi bags near the refuge and it really is rough and
    lonely. But having spent a few nights inside the refuge is an experience I
    don't want to repeat too often.

    What did you do aruond there?


    "Jay" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >I camped at the Goriz hut last summer, early July or very late June. There
    >was some snow around above the hut but none at the hut itself.
    >
    > It is very crowded and quite expensive. Camping is a good option, there
    > are lots of 'ready made' pitches and some stunning views.
    >
    >
    > Jay
    >
    >
    > Michael Hobby wrote:
    >> "mikek" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> news:[email protected]
    >>
    >>>"Northern Helmets" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>news:[email protected]
    >>>
    >>>>I recently asked a question on this group about suggested routes around
    >>>>the Pyrenees (thanks for all the replies!)
    >>>>
    >>>>One night on our trip would probably be at the Goriz hut on the Spanish
    >>>>side, with the obvious option of climing Monte Perdido the next day.
    >>>>
    >>>>I appreciate that:
    >>>>
    >>>>(a) there may be an altitude issue - though we have climbed higher than
    >>>>this in the USA.
    >>>>(b) possibility(!) of bad weather
    >>>>
    >>>>But the concern I have is the under-foot conditions. Is there any need
    >>>>for snow and ice skills - we have none?
    >>>>
    >>>>I am happy to be at the hut, and if the conditions dictate not climb
    >>>>Monte Perdido, I guess the question is on a good day is it possible to
    >>>>do it without ice axe etc.?
    >>>>
    >>>>Any help appreciated.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>My number one concern is that if you intend to stay at the Goriz refuge
    >>>in the summer it will be a disgusting experience. At the best of times
    >>>you have to put up with black mould coming off the walls and flea bites.
    >>>In the summer the nearby stream is full of toilet paper. The toilets are
    >>>situated 50m away from the sleeping quarters. The refuge itself is
    >>>seriously overcrowded, mainly by older non Spaniards. There are often
    >>>groups of Brits on guided tours organised by British adventure tour
    >>>companies whose guides tend to be in their early 20's. These guides will
    >>>proudly tell you that they have a good way of improving "group cohesion",
    >>>and that it involves giving their group unlimited access to alcohol -
    >>>which really pisses off most other people. Sleeping is difficult, as I
    >>>said, most of the people that sleep in goriz these days are older,
    >>>usually men in their late 40's upwards, they snore and fart all night.
    >>>This might be the worse refuge in the Pyrenees. Sleep outside and try and
    >>>get a meal and breakfast inside.
    >>>
    >>>Altitude is not a problem, the refuge is at 2200m (you can camp the night
    >>>outside), this altitude is almost equal to the decompression inside a
    >>>normal aeroplane in flight. The route to the summit is not strenuos and
    >>>taken slowly the peak at about 3500m is not difficult. The walk to the
    >>>refuge from Torla is tedious, if you make that you can make the summitt.
    >>>
    >>>Ice axe and crampons- between December and end of June I would consider
    >>>them to be essential, unless otherwise told by people that you have met
    >>>that have climbed the peak the previous day. August as far as I can tell
    >>>is always ok without crampons but there are a couple of patches of snow
    >>>that really require carrying an ice axe. Do not take the advice of the
    >>>Goriz refuge guardians, they get younger and more reckless each year.
    >>>There is nearly always an uptodate weather forecast on the refuge
    >>>noticeboard.
    >>>
    >>>Good luck
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> Whilst I cannot comment on the current state of the Goriz hut - it is
    >> twenty years since I was there - I do take exception to your implied
    >> prejudice about older people. As a 60 year old still active walker I
    >> could probably fart and snore the pants off you any day, especially in
    >> the Pyrenees!
    >>
    >> Behave yourself and you might make sixty yourself one day!
     
  17. Ivo

    Ivo Guest

  18. Camping is non-starter for us. We wild camp everytime in the UK, when
    abroad we will always use a pre-booked hut. We are there for the
    walking... we can see & do much more with a MUCH lighter back on our
    backs and when we go (September) the places are never more than half
    full.

    The trouble with camping is that you need (apart from the obvious kit)
    to carry your own food / cooking equipment/ fuel... It's no good saying
    you can "usually" rely on a meal at the hut. You need to know where
    your meal is coming from after a hard day.

    We have a route (or 99% of one)... now to decide on whether to fly or
    train it...

    Once we have an itinary I shall post here - worth a laugh!!

    Loads of wild camping articles on http://www.thehelmets.co.uk
     
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