Mountain Bike Damage in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- Three Years Later

Discussion in 'Mountain Bikes' started by Mike Vandeman, Feb 20, 2003.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. February 18, 2003

    Board of Directors East Bay Regional Park District 2950 Peralta Oaks Court
    P.O. Box 5381 Oakland, California 94605-0381

    Re: Mountain Biking in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- Three Years Later

    Gentlepersons:

    I heard that mountain bikers will be doing trail maintenance on the Sinbad Creek Trail next
    Saturday, just as they did three years ago. So naturally I wanted to see why this has become
    necessary. Last Sunday I hiked that trail again. I was pleased to see that many of the
    illegal trails I reported to you three years ago have been marked "closed", and are in the
    process of being revegetated. The signs also warn the mountain bikers that if they fail to
    obey the rules, mountain biking could be banned from the park. Of course, they already knew
    that, and have known it for a long time. But who cares about rules, when you're having fun
    (and no rangers are in sight)?

    As you will recall from my March 27, 2000 letter, mountain bikers were crisscrossing the
    park with illegal trails, riding off-trail, riding during wet conditions, riding through the
    creeks, and creating deep U- or V-shaped grooves that make the trails difficult and
    dangerous to walk on. Nothing has changed! I photographed tire tracks
    ____________________
    through the grass away from the trail, through a pile of gravel you imported to "improve" the trail,
    and through the creeks. (It may be a while before I can send you the photos, since I am only halfway
    through that roll.) It had rained the previous night, and there were long skid marks in the woods
    near the Shady Creek Trail.

    Hiker-only trails (such as the Chaparral Trail in Augustin Bernal City Park) are flat, and
    easy to walk on!
    ____
    Most of the Sinbad Creek Trail (particularly its narrow, "singletrack" section) is so badly rutted
    by the bikers, that it is very difficult to walk on. Not only hikers, but even bikers are forced to
    go off-trail. None of it is flat.
    ____

    In one section I noticed that you brought in a bunch of large, exotic rocks to try to
    keep the bikers in the trail. They stand out like a sore thumb, since they look like no
    other rocks in the park. You also imbedded a plastic matrix in that section of trail in
    a vain attempt to keep it from being damaged, and covered it with exotic gravel. Just as
    I predicted, all of the gravel covering the plastic has been eroded away, and the
    plastic itself is starting to wear away, polluting an otherwise natural park with
    particles of plastic!

    Also, as I predicted, few people like walking or riding on plastic, so they are starting to
    go around it, causing further erosion. And the plastic must be dangerously slippery, when
    wet! In one place, the plastic has even sunk and tilted, making it impossible to ride or
    walk on it.

    Near that section of the trail, I met a girl walking a dog. She didn't have a map, so I gave
    her mine. When I mentioned all the damage done by the bikers, she said "I can't get too mad,
    because I like to mountain bike, too". This is typical of mountain bikers: deny, deny, deny.
    Never "rat" on your fellow bikers. That is called "the Code of the Streets": criminals
    aren't supposed to tell on each other. If mountain biking is harming the park, just look the
    other way. Pretend that it is not a problem. Well, this attitude seems to have taken hold
    among Park District personnel, as well. Instead of admitting that bicycles are incompatible
    with the protection of the parks' resources, they pretend that the trail just isn't built
    well enough!

    Well, you are right! Until the trail is paved, it will
    _____
    continue to deteriorate and need constant repairing. That is exactly why Yosemite National Park has
    insisted that bikes stick to pavement. You should do the same!

    Another hiker I met said that he thought that the bikers should have separate trails, since
    their presence on the fire roads makes it very unpleasant and scary to hike there. But that
    is no solution: either you have to build many new trails for the bikers, destroying a lot
    more wildlife habitat (and the impact of people extends far from the trail!), or you have to
    take some trails away from the majority (hikers) and give them to a small minority (bikers),
    which is not fair to the hikers. Besides, have you noticed?: mountain bikers are never
    satisfied, no matter how many trails they have!

    When are you going to face the truth?: bicycles and other vehicles belong on paved roads, as
    is the rule in Yosemite National Park! How many years do we have to wait,
    _____
    before you admit that "education", as a way of taming mountain bikers, simply doesn't work?!
    ___________________

    Sincerely,

    Michael J. Vandeman, Ph.D. [email protected]
    http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

    ===
    I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
    help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

    http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
     
    Tags:


  2. Fish!

    Fish! Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > February 18, 2003
    >
    > Board of Directors East Bay Regional Park District 2950 Peralta Oaks Court
    > P.O. Box 5381 Oakland, California 94605-0381
    >
    > Re: Mountain Biking in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- Three Years Later
    >
    > Gentlepersons:
    >
    (Dear Dad)

    > I heard that mountain bikers will be doing trail maintenance on the Sinbad Creek Trail next
    > Saturday, just as they did three years ago. So naturally I wanted to see why this has become
    > necessary. Last Sunday I hiked that trail again. I was pleased to see that many of the
    > illegal trails I reported to you three years ago have been marked "closed", and are in the
    > process of being revegetated. The signs also warn the mountain bikers that if they fail to
    > obey the rules, mountain biking could be banned from the park. Of course, they already knew
    > that, and have known it for a long time. But who cares about rules, when you're having fun
    > (and no rangers are in sight)?
    >

    I'm a boring, impotent, old tosser, with nothing better to do than to see if my every whim has been
    attended to.

    My spies are everywhere, and following a hot tip off I put on my raincoat, and hiked off in search
    of signs that bikers were raping MY wildlife park that I constantly visit, every 3 years or so....

    > As you will recall from my March 27, 2000 letter, mountain bikers were crisscrossing the
    > park with illegal trails, riding off-trail, riding during wet conditions, riding through the
    > creeks, and creating deep U- or V-shaped grooves that make the trails difficult and
    > dangerous to walk on. Nothing has changed! I photographed tire tracks

    No doubt you have a file on me named 'Shoot on sight' containing the overwhelming flood of self
    induldgent crap that I need to type which validates my pathetic existence.

    Norty Bikers have made grooves in the dirt, and I draw your attention to this crime against humanity
    in an effort to both waste your time and further your belief that I'm a danger to society.

    > ____________________
    > through the grass away from the trail, through a pile of gravel you imported to "improve" the
    > trail, and through the creeks. (It may be a while before I can send you the photos, since I am
    > only halfway through that roll.) It had rained the previous night, and there were long skid marks
    > in the woods near the Shady Creek Trail.
    >

    I know you'll be quivering with anticipation to learn that I have photgraphed every inch of the
    park, and well as my own skid marks.

    Futhermore I will attempt to criticise your every attempt at addressing failures that I percieve
    have not been adquately repaired. I know this will of course 'spur' you on to do better as my
    importance is second only to God.

    > Hiker-only trails (such as the Chaparral Trail in
    > Augustin Bernal City Park) are flat, and easy to walk on!
    > ____
    > Most of the Sinbad Creek Trail (particularly its narrow, "singletrack" section) is so badly rutted
    > by the bikers, that it is very difficult to walk on. Not only hikers, but even bikers are forced
    > to go off-trail. None of it is flat.
    > ____

    I'm repeating myself now due to the overhwelming scope of this fascinating topic

    >
    >
    > In one section I noticed that you brought in a bunch of large, exotic rocks to try to keep
    > the bikers in the trail. They stand out like a sore thumb, since they look like no other
    > rocks in the park. You also imbedded a plastic matrix in that section of trail in a vain
    > attempt to keep it from being damaged, and covered it with exotic gravel. Just as I
    > predicted, all of the gravel covering the plastic has been eroded away, and the plastic
    > itself is starting to wear away, polluting an otherwise natural park with particles of
    > plastic!
    >

    You neglected to bring in the exotic dancers I requested. The park is now polluted by plastic, in
    the same way that USENET is polluted by singleminded, boorish nutters.

    > Also, as I predicted, few people like walking or riding on plastic, so they are starting to
    > go around it, causing further erosion. And the plastic must be dangerously slippery, when
    > wet! In one place, the plastic has even sunk and tilted, making it impossible to ride or
    > walk on it.
    >

    Crystal balls in hand, I gazed deep into it's smoky depths, and made the prediction that PLASTIC,
    WHEN WET IS SLIPPERY! How dare you prevent people RIDING on it, I mean WALKING on it. Hell why did I
    say riding?

    > Near that section of the trail, I met a girl walking a dog. She didn't have a map, so I gave
    > her mine. When I mentioned all the damage done by the bikers, she said "I can't get too mad,
    > because I like to mountain bike, too". This is typical of mountain bikers: deny, deny, deny.
    > Never "rat" on your fellow bikers. That is called "the Code of the Streets": criminals
    > aren't supposed to tell on each other. If mountain biking is harming the park, just look the
    > other way. Pretend that it is not a problem. Well, this attitude seems to have taken hold
    > among Park District personnel, as well. Instead of admitting that bicycles are incompatible
    > with the protection of the parks' resources, they pretend that the trail just isn't built
    > well enough!
    >

    Although clearly terrified, the girl I met on the trail didn't scream immediately (see
    police report).

    I of course hypocritically allowed her to speak her mind, all the while nodding and thinking of ways
    to mutilate her corpse.

    Being street wise, I allowed my mind to wander to the crack house where I was brought up on the mean
    streets, in the ghetto. It was there I learned 'the code of the streets', dont rat on nobody, and
    you wont get cut.

    > Well, you are right! Until the trail is paved, it will
    > _____
    > continue to deteriorate and need constant repairing. That is exactly why Yosemite National Park
    > has insisted that bikes stick to pavement. You should do the same!
    >
    >
    Please see to paving the entire park, this will of course reduce the need for maintenance whilst
    giving the lush greenary a more uniform concrete look.

    Another hiker I met said that he thought that the
    > bikers should have separate trails, since their presence on the fire roads makes it very
    > unpleasant and scary to hike there. But that is no solution: either you have to build many new
    > trails for the bikers, destroying a lot more wildlife habitat (and the impact of people extends
    > far from the trail!), or you have to take some trails away from the majority (hikers) and give
    > them to a small minority (bikers), which is not fair to the hikers. Besides, have you noticed?:
    > mountain bikers are never satisfied, no matter how many trails they have!
    >

    I met a hiker. Such was number of hikers that I lost count, was it really as many as two? Were there
    really no bikers here to complain about. The majority of hikers certainly were outweighing the vast
    numbers of destructive bikers I encountered.

    Have you noticed however how easily satisfied I am. I hardly ever feel the need to post an infinte
    amount of stupid letters on the subject.

    > When are you going to face the truth?: bicycles and other vehicles belong on paved roads, as
    > is the rule in Yosemite National Park! How many years do we have to wait,

    When are you going to face the truth? have you not seen the overhwelming proof I've just offered
    you? Are you blind? For God's sake think of the CHILDREN!
    > _____
    > before you admit that "education", as a way of taming mountain bikers, simply doesn't work?!
    > ___________________
    >
    I have a PH.D, and look what an education did for me.
    >

    > Sincerely,
    >
    > Michael J. Vandeman, Ph.D. [email protected]
    > http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
    >
    > ===
    > I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
    > help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
    >
    > http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
     
  3. Westie

    Westie Guest

    "Fish!" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > > February 18, 2003
    > >
    > > Board of Directors East Bay Regional Park District 2950 Peralta Oaks Court
    > > P.O. Box 5381 Oakland, California 94605-0381
    > >
    > > Re: Mountain Biking in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- Three Years Later
    > >
    > > Gentlepersons:
    <snip some interesting and amusing additions>

    That's one of the better responses to Mikey I've seen in a while. I had quite the giggle
    over that lot.

    Westie
     
  4. Shaun Rimmer

    Shaun Rimmer Guest

    Westie <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Fish!" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > > > February 18, 2003
    > > >
    > > > Board of Directors East Bay Regional Park District 2950 Peralta Oaks Court
    > > > P.O. Box 5381 Oakland, California 94605-0381
    > > >
    > > > Re: Mountain Biking in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- Three Years Later
    > > >
    > > > Gentlepersons:
    > <snip some interesting and amusing additions>
    >
    > That's one of the better responses to Mikey I've seen in a while. I had quite the giggle over
    > that lot.
    >
    > Westie

    Aye, me too - especially the first few....

    Shaun aRe - good to see the envireejit is still providing good material for comedians to work with.
     
  5. On Fri, 21 Feb 2003 20:24:20 +1300, Westie did issue forth:

    >> > Gentlepersons:
    > <snip some interesting and amusing additions>
    >
    > That's one of the better responses to Mikey I've seen in a while. I had quite the giggle over
    > that lot.

    That was fantastic. I've got the man quite comprehensively filtered out, but I've just Googled for
    the post, and I'm so glad I did.

    --
    Huw Pritchard Replace bounce with huw to reply by mail
     
  6. Gsl

    Gsl Guest

    Mike,

    I have co-founded a mountain bike club here in Florida, and about one-third of the members are
    environmentalists. I also hike and run on the trail.

    Non-motorized access to nature should be promoted. It is well documented that equestrians, off-road
    cyclists, and yes, hikers, all have an impact on nature. You know this, I know this, and fortunately
    so do most park managers.

    You really should consider directing your energy toward the cross-country motocross and ATV
    invasion. The current administration is pro-hydrocarbon recreation. We should all be aware of this
    trend and do what we can to stop it as they are the true destroyers of the trail.

    Where I ride, I am having to stop and pick up bottled water jugs left by hikers on a weekly basis.
    The equestrians cause major erosion and leave heaping piles of feces everywhere. Off-road cyclists
    skid into corners and loosen the trail. Do I get upset? A little.

    But then I remind myself that when more people share a resource, such as a state park, the more
    likely we are all going to benefit from it. We should all be joining forces, and working toward
    expansion, access, and protection of public lands - - not against one another.

    Consider this thought, stop hating, and start hiking & enjoying your life.

    Scott G. www.porc.org

    "Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > February 18, 2003
    >
    > Board of Directors East Bay Regional Park District 2950 Peralta Oaks Court
    > P.O. Box 5381 Oakland, California 94605-0381
    >
    > Re: Mountain Biking in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- Three Years Later
    >
    > Gentlepersons:
    >
    > I heard that mountain bikers will be doing trail maintenance on the Sinbad Creek Trail next
    > Saturday, just as they did three years ago. So naturally I wanted to see why this has become
    > necessary. Last Sunday I hiked that trail again. I was pleased to see that many of the illegal
    > trails I reported to you three years ago have been marked "closed", and are in the process of
    > being revegetated. The signs also warn the mountain bikers that if they fail to obey the rules,
    > mountain biking could be banned from the park. Of course, they already knew that, and have
    > known it for a long time. But who cares about rules, when you're having fun (and no rangers are
    > in sight)?
    >
    > As you will recall from my March 27, 2000 letter, mountain bikers were crisscrossing the park with
    > illegal trails, riding off-trail, riding during wet conditions, riding through the creeks, and
    > creating deep U- or V-shaped grooves that make the trails difficult and dangerous to walk on.
    > Nothing has changed! I photographed tire tracks
    > ____________________
    > through the grass away from the trail, through a pile of gravel you imported to "improve" the
    > trail, and through the creeks. (It may be a while before I can send you the photos, since I am
    > only halfway through that roll.) It had rained the previous night, and there were long skid marks
    > in the woods near the Shady Creek Trail.
    >
    > Hiker-only trails (such as the Chaparral Trail in Augustin Bernal City Park) are flat, and easy to
    > walk on!
    > ____
    > Most of the Sinbad Creek Trail (particularly its narrow, "singletrack" section) is so badly rutted
    > by the bikers, that it is very difficult to walk on. Not only hikers, but even bikers are forced
    > to go off-trail. None of it is flat.
    > ____
    >
    >
    > In one section I noticed that you brought in a bunch of large, exotic rocks to try to keep the
    > bikers in the trail. They stand out like a sore thumb, since they look like no other rocks in the
    > park. You also imbedded a plastic matrix in that section of trail in a vain attempt to keep it
    > from being damaged, and covered it with exotic gravel. Just as I predicted, all of the gravel
    > covering the plastic has been eroded away, and the plastic itself is starting to wear away,
    > polluting an otherwise natural park with particles of plastic!
    >
    > Also, as I predicted, few people like walking or riding on plastic, so they are starting to go
    > around it, causing further erosion. And the plastic must be dangerously slippery, when wet! In one
    > place, the plastic has even sunk and tilted, making it impossible to ride or walk on it.
    >
    > Near that section of the trail, I met a girl walking a dog. She didn't have a map, so I gave her
    > mine. When I mentioned all the damage done by the bikers, she said "I can't get too mad, because I
    > like to mountain bike, too". This is typical of mountain bikers: deny, deny, deny. Never "rat" on
    > your fellow bikers. That is called "the Code of the Streets": criminals aren't supposed to tell on
    > each other. If mountain biking is harming the park, just look the other way. Pretend that it is
    > not a problem. Well, this attitude seems to have taken hold among Park District personnel, as
    > well. Instead of admitting that bicycles are incompatible with the protection of the parks'
    > resources, they pretend that the trail just isn't built well enough!
    >
    > Well, you are right! Until the trail is paved, it will
    > _____
    > continue to deteriorate and need constant repairing. That is exactly why Yosemite National Park
    > has insisted that bikes stick to pavement. You should do the same!
    >
    > Another hiker I met said that he thought that the bikers should have separate trails, since their
    > presence on the fire roads makes it very unpleasant and scary to hike there. But that is no
    > solution: either you have to build many new trails for the bikers, destroying a lot more wildlife
    > habitat (and the impact of people extends far from the trail!), or you have to take some trails
    > away from the majority (hikers) and give them to a small minority (bikers), which is not fair to
    > the hikers. Besides, have you noticed?: mountain bikers are never satisfied, no matter how many
    > trails they have!
    >
    > When are you going to face the truth?: bicycles and other vehicles belong on paved roads, as is
    > the rule in Yosemite National Park! How many years do we have to wait,
    > _____
    > before you admit that "education", as a way of taming mountain bikers, simply doesn't work?!
    > ___________________
    >
    >
    > Sincerely,
    >
    > Michael J. Vandeman, Ph.D. [email protected] http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
    >
    > ===
    > I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
    > help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
    >
    > http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
     
  7. While I don't agree fully with your assessment of motorized recreation, I do full agree with the
    idea that non-motorized vehicles are a better choice of recreation. Any movement we can get away
    from motorized vehicles and onto non-motorized vehicles is a good move.

    I happen to think that there are viable venues for motorized recreation, and I also believe that
    motorized vehicles and pedestrians should generally be separated whenever possible. However, this
    may sometimes mean that hikers and bikes should be locked out because the route is predominately a
    motor vehicle route. In my assessment, hikers and bikers should be using vehicle routes, but
    vehicles should not be using foot paths.

    "GSL" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:%[email protected]...
    > Mike,
    >
    > I have co-founded a mountain bike club here in Florida, and about
    one-third
    > of the members are environmentalists. I also hike and run on the trail.
    >
    > Non-motorized access to nature should be promoted. It is well documented that equestrians,
    > off-road cyclists, and yes, hikers, all have an impact
    on
    > nature. You know this, I know this, and fortunately so do most park managers.
    >
    > You really should consider directing your energy toward the cross-country motocross and ATV
    > invasion. The current administration is pro-hydrocarbon recreation. We should all be aware of this
    > trend and do what we can to
    stop
    > it as they are the true destroyers of the trail.
    >
    > Where I ride, I am having to stop and pick up bottled water jugs left by hikers on a weekly basis.
    > The equestrians cause major erosion and leave heaping piles of feces everywhere. Off-road cyclists
    > skid into corners
    and
    > loosen the trail. Do I get upset? A little.
    >
    > But then I remind myself that when more people share a resource, such as a state park, the more
    > likely we are all going to benefit from it. We
    should
    > all be joining forces, and working toward expansion, access, and
    protection
    > of public lands - - not against one another.
    >
    > Consider this thought, stop hating, and start hiking & enjoying your life.
    >
    > Scott G. www.porc.org
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > "Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > February 18, 2003
    > >
    > > Board of Directors East Bay Regional Park District 2950 Peralta Oaks Court
    > > P.O. Box 5381 Oakland, California 94605-0381
    > >
    > > Re: Mountain Biking in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- Three Years Later
    > >
    > > Gentlepersons:
    > >
    > > I heard that mountain bikers will be doing trail maintenance on the Sinbad Creek Trail next
    > > Saturday, just as they did three years ago. So naturally I wanted to see why this has become
    > > necessary. Last Sunday I hiked that trail again. I was pleased to see that many of the illegal
    > > trails I reported to you three years ago have been marked "closed", and are in the process of
    > > being revegetated. The signs also warn the mountain bikers that if they fail to obey the rules,
    > > mountain biking could be banned from the park. Of course, they already knew that, and have known
    > > it for a long time. But who cares about rules, when you're having fun (and no rangers are in
    > > sight)?
    > >
    > > As you will recall from my March 27, 2000 letter, mountain bikers were crisscrossing the park
    > > with illegal trails, riding off-trail, riding during wet conditions, riding through the creeks,
    > > and creating deep U- or V-shaped grooves that make the trails difficult and dangerous to walk
    > > on. Nothing has changed! I photographed tire tracks
    > > ____________________
    > > through the grass away from the trail, through a pile of gravel you imported to "improve" the
    > > trail, and through the creeks. (It may be a while before I can send you the photos, since I am
    > > only halfway through that roll.) It had rained the previous night, and there were long skid
    > > marks in the woods near the Shady Creek Trail.
    > >
    > > Hiker-only trails (such as the Chaparral Trail in Augustin Bernal City Park) are flat, and easy
    > > to walk on!
    > > ____
    > > Most of the Sinbad Creek Trail (particularly its narrow, "singletrack" section) is so badly
    > > rutted by the bikers, that it is very difficult to walk on. Not only hikers, but even bikers are
    > > forced to go off-trail. None of it is flat.
    > > ____
    > >
    > >
    > > In one section I noticed that you brought in a bunch of large, exotic rocks to try to keep the
    > > bikers in the trail. They stand out like a sore thumb, since they look like no other rocks in
    > > the park. You also imbedded a plastic matrix in that section of trail in a vain attempt to keep
    > > it from being damaged, and covered it with exotic gravel. Just as I predicted, all of the gravel
    > > covering the plastic has been eroded away, and the plastic itself is starting to wear away,
    > > polluting an otherwise natural park with particles of plastic!
    > >
    > > Also, as I predicted, few people like walking or riding on plastic, so they are starting to go
    > > around it, causing further erosion. And the plastic must be dangerously slippery, when wet! In
    > > one place, the plastic has even sunk and tilted, making it impossible to ride or walk on it.
    > >
    > > Near that section of the trail, I met a girl walking a dog. She didn't have a map, so I gave her
    > > mine. When I mentioned all the damage done by the bikers, she said "I can't get too mad, because
    > > I like to mountain bike, too". This is typical of mountain bikers: deny, deny, deny. Never "rat"
    > > on your fellow bikers. That is called "the Code of the Streets": criminals aren't supposed to
    > > tell on each other. If mountain biking is harming the park, just look the other way. Pretend
    > > that it is not a problem. Well, this attitude seems to have taken hold among Park District
    > > personnel, as well. Instead of admitting that bicycles are incompatible with the protection of
    > > the parks' resources, they pretend that the trail just isn't built well enough!
    > >
    > > Well, you are right! Until the trail is paved, it will
    > > _____
    > > continue to deteriorate and need constant repairing. That is exactly why Yosemite National Park
    > > has insisted that bikes stick to pavement. You should do the same!
    > >
    > > Another hiker I met said that he thought that the bikers should have separate trails, since
    > > their presence on the fire roads makes it very unpleasant and scary to hike there. But that is
    > > no solution: either you have to build many new trails for the bikers, destroying a lot more
    > > wildlife habitat (and the impact of people extends far from the trail!), or you have to take
    > > some trails away from the majority (hikers) and give them to a small minority (bikers), which is
    > > not fair to the hikers. Besides, have you noticed?: mountain bikers are never satisfied, no
    > > matter how many trails they have!
    > >
    > > When are you going to face the truth?: bicycles and other vehicles belong on paved roads, as is
    > > the rule in Yosemite National Park! How many years do we have to wait,
    > > _____
    > > before you admit that "education", as a way of taming mountain bikers, simply doesn't work?!
    > > ___________________
    > >
    > >
    > > Sincerely,
    > >
    > > Michael J. Vandeman, Ph.D. [email protected] http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
    > >
    > > ===
    > > I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
    > > help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
    > >
    > > http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
     
  8. Spider

    Spider Guest

    "GSL" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<%[email protected]>...
    > Mike,
    >
    <snip>

    > Consider this thought, stop hating, and start hiking & enjoying your life.
    >
    > Scott G. www.porc.org

    Scott, it is foolish to try and reason with an unreasonable person.

    Do a google groups search on Mike, and use one year as the time delimiter. Use one ng from the
    list, to filter the cross-posts. You will be astounded by the lack of reason you see - he is
    quite single-minded about MTBs. He has his windmills to joust at, and showing him reality just
    confuses him.

    Spider
     
  9. Martees

    Martees Guest

    "Fish!" <[email protected]> wrote some nice stuff in message.

    Fish,

    Nicely done BUT to be very honest you put WAAY too much time into "He Who Must Not Be Named".

    Marty
     
  10. On Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:33:15 GMT, "GSL" <[email protected]> wrote:

    .Mike, . .I have co-founded a mountain bike club here in Florida, and about one-third .of the
    members are environmentalists.

    Wrong. NO real environmentalists (as opposed to environmental rapists masquerading as
    "environmentalists") mountain bike.

    I also hike and run on the trail. . .Non-motorized access to nature should be promoted.

    BS. It destrous wildlife and wildlife habitat.

    It is well documented .that equestrians, off-road cyclists, and yes, hikers, all have an impact on
    .nature. You know this, I know this, and fortunately so do most park .managers. . .You really
    should consider directing your energy toward the cross-country .motocross and ATV invasion. The
    current administration is pro-hydrocarbon .recreation. We should all be aware of this trend and do
    what we can to stop .it as they are the true destroyers of the trail.

    What are you doing about it? When the land managers find out that you are a mountain biker, ripping
    up the land with knobby tires, they will know you are nothing but a hypocrite, and won't listen.

    .Where I ride, I am having to stop and pick up bottled water jugs left by .hikers on a weekly basis.
    The equestrians cause major erosion and leave .heaping piles of feces everywhere. Off-road cyclists
    skid into corners and .loosen the trail. Do I get upset? A little.

    But not about your OWN destruction.

    .But then I remind myself that when more people share a resource, such as a .state park, the more
    likely we are all going to benefit from it. We should .all be joining forces, and working toward
    expansion, access, and protection .of public lands - - not against one another.

    If you would think about the wildlife for ONE SECOND, you would know what BS this is: wildlife don't
    appreciate the presence of humans!

    .Consider this thought, stop hating, and start hiking & enjoying your life.

    I hate the destruction of nature, as EVERY responsible person should.

    .Scott G. .www.porc.org . . . . . ."Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    .news:[email protected]... .> February 18, 2003 .> .> Board of Directors .>
    East Bay Regional Park District .> 2950 Peralta Oaks Court .> P.O. Box 5381 .> Oakland, California
    94605-0381 .> .> Re: Mountain Biking in Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park -- .> Three Years Later .> .>
    Gentlepersons: .> .> I heard that mountain bikers will be doing trail .> maintenance on the Sinbad
    Creek Trail next Saturday, just .> as they did three years ago. So naturally I wanted to see .> why
    this has become necessary. Last Sunday I hiked that .> trail again. I was pleased to see that many
    of the illegal .> trails I reported to you three years ago have been marked .> "closed", and are in
    the process of being revegetated. The .> signs also warn the mountain bikers that if they fail to .>
    obey the rules, mountain biking could be banned from the .> park. Of course, they already knew that,
    and have known it .> for a long time. But who cares about rules, when you're .> having fun (and no
    rangers are in sight)? .> .> As you will recall from my March 27, 2000 letter, .> mountain bikers
    were crisscrossing the park with illegal .> trails, riding off-trail, riding during wet conditions,
    .> riding through the creeks, and creating deep U- or V-shaped .> grooves that make the trails
    difficult and dangerous to .> walk on. Nothing has changed! I photographed tire tracks .>
    ____________________ .> through the grass away from the trail, through a pile of .> gravel you
    imported to "improve" the trail, and through the .> creeks. (It may be a while before I can send you
    the .> photos, since I am only halfway through that roll.) It had .> rained the previous night, and
    there were long skid marks .> in the woods near the Shady Creek Trail. .> .> Hiker-only trails (such
    as the Chaparral Trail in .> Augustin Bernal City Park) are flat, and easy to walk on! .> ____ .>
    Most of the Sinbad Creek Trail (particularly its narrow, .> "singletrack" section) is so badly
    rutted by the bikers, .> that it is very difficult to walk on. Not only hikers, but .> even bikers
    are forced to go off-trail. None of it is flat. .> ____ .> .> .> In one section I noticed that you
    brought in a bunch .> of large, exotic rocks to try to keep the bikers in the .> trail. They stand
    out like a sore thumb, since they look .> like no other rocks in the park. You also imbedded a .>
    plastic matrix in that section of trail in a vain attempt .> to keep it from being damaged, and
    covered it with exotic .> gravel. Just as I predicted, all of the gravel covering the .> plastic has
    been eroded away, and the plastic itself is .> starting to wear away, polluting an otherwise natural
    park .> with particles of plastic! .> .> Also, as I predicted, few people like walking or .> riding
    on plastic, so they are starting to go around it, .> causing further erosion. And the plastic must
    be .> dangerously slippery, when wet! In one place, the plastic .> has even sunk and tilted, making
    it impossible to ride or .> walk on it. .> .> Near that section of the trail, I met a girl walking a
    .> dog. She didn't have a map, so I gave her mine. When I .> mentioned all the damage done by the
    bikers, she said "I .> can't get too mad, because I like to mountain bike, too". .> This is typical
    of mountain bikers: deny, deny, deny. Never .> "rat" on your fellow bikers. That is called "the Code
    of .> the Streets": criminals aren't supposed to tell on each .> other. If mountain biking is
    harming the park, just look .> the other way. Pretend that it is not a problem. Well, this .>
    attitude seems to have taken hold among Park District .> personnel, as well. Instead of admitting
    that bicycles are .> incompatible with the protection of the parks' resources, .> they pretend that
    the trail just isn't built well enough! .> .> Well, you are right! Until the trail is paved, it will
    .> _____ .> continue to deteriorate and need constant repairing. That .> is exactly why Yosemite
    National Park has insisted that .> bikes stick to pavement. You should do the same! .> .> Another
    hiker I met said that he thought that the .> bikers should have separate trails, since their
    presence on .> the fire roads makes it very unpleasant and scary to hike .> there. But that is no
    solution: either you have to build .> many new trails for the bikers, destroying a lot more .>
    wildlife habitat (and the impact of people extends far from .> the trail!), or you have to take some
    trails away from the .> majority (hikers) and give them to a small minority .> (bikers), which is
    not fair to the hikers. Besides, have .> you noticed?: mountain bikers are never satisfied, no .>
    matter how many trails they have! .> .> When are you going to face the truth?: bicycles and .> other
    vehicles belong on paved roads, as is the rule in .> Yosemite National Park! How many years do we
    have to wait, .> _____ .> before you admit that "education", as a way of taming .> mountain bikers,
    simply doesn't work?! .> ___________________ .> .> .> Sincerely, .> .> Michael J. Vandeman, Ph.D. .>
    [email protected] .> http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande .> .> === .> I am working on creating
    wildlife habitat that is off-limits to .> humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the
    previous 8 .> years fighting auto dependence and road construction.) .> .>
    http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande .

    ===
    I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
    help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

    http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
     
  11. Fish!

    Fish! Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    >
    > "Fish!" <[email protected]> wrote some nice stuff in message.
    >
    > Fish,
    >
    > Nicely done BUT to be very honest you put WAAY too much time into "He Who Must Not Be Named".
    >
    > Marty
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    Umm I wrote that in under 5 minutes, though that is quite a long time.
     
Loading...
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...