Mountain Bikers Aren't Interested in Restoring (Removing) Their Illegal Trails



M

Mike Vandeman

Guest
Subject: RE: "Parker Ranch Restoration Project"
Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 08:26:11 -0800

Mike,

As the word "illegal" in illegal trail indicates, the mountain bikers
were not allowed to build the bike trail. They worked quietly hidden
in
wooded areas on private lands, even without the property owners'
knowledge.

They not only ignore, they destroy signs. The City has been fighting
with them for quite awhile.

Unfortunately, no one from the illegal bicycle trail builders stepped
up
to help this past Saturday to restore the land to its natural original
contours. Please check the City website for more details about the
volunteer opportunities on Parker Ranch trail restoration if you are
interested.
http://www.saratoga.ca.us/pw/parker_ranch.html

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Vandeman [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 7:21 PM
Subject: "Parker Ranch Restoration Project"

Why are mountain bikers allowed to build an illegal trail? Trail
building is habitat destruction -- not appropriate for land under a
"conservation easement". Mountain biking, in particular, is
incompatible with conservation.

Bicycles should not be allowed in any natural area. They are
inanimate objects and have no rights. There is also no right to
mountain bike. That was settled in federal court in 1994:
http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande/mtb10. It's dishonest of mountain
bikers to say that they don't have access to trails closed to bikes.
They have EXACTLY the same access as everyone else -- ON FOOT! Why
isn't that good enough for mountain bikers? They are all capable of
walking....

A favorite myth of mountain bikers is that mountain biking is no more
harmful to wildlife, people, and the environment than hiking, and
that science supports that view. Of course, it's not true. To settle
the matter once and for all, I read all of the research they cited,
and wrote a review of the research on mountain biking impacts (see
http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande/scb7). I found that of the seven
studies they cited, (1) all were written by mountain bikers, and (2)
in every case, the authors misinterpreted their own data, in order to
come to the conclusion that they favored. They also studiously
avoided mentioning another scientific study (Wisdom et al) which did
not favor mountain biking, and came to the opposite conclusions.

Those were all experimental studies. Two other studies (by White et
al and by Jeff Marion) used a survey design, which is inherently
incapable of answering that question (comparing hiking with mountain
biking). I only mention them because mountain bikers often cite them,
but scientifically, they are worthless.

Mountain biking accelerates erosion, creates V-shaped ruts, kills
small animals and plants on and next to the trail, drives wildlife
and other trail users out of the
area, and (worst of all) teaches kids that the rough treatment of
nature is okay (it's NOT!). What's good about THAT?

Mike Vandeman


Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 20:56:36 -0800
From: "Josh Moore" <[email protected]>
Subject: Parker Ranch Restoration Project

First and Third Saturdays in March and April
09:00 AM Saturday, March 15 2008 Duration: 5:0
The Parker Ranch Trail was an amazing feat in trail building and
riding pleasure. Unfortunately it is on private land which is under a
conservation easement. Even the private land owners are not allowed to
build on it. Please come out and create some goodwill by helping to
restore this trail.

The city of Saratoga requires that you fill out their volunteer form
and sign a waiver for this event.

This trail is officially closed. Please don't ride it or rebuild it
anymore. ROMP is working with land managers to provide more riding
opportunities like this.

Location:
Top of Picea Court
Picea Court
Saratoga CA
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
 
I'll bet that I have done far more trail maintenance than you have. Some
maintenance was on historic routes in the forest that you would deny access
to, other maintenance was done to restore land closed due to environmental
whackos like yourself to open land. Land was closed to visitation in my
local National Forest, and as a result the closed areas were set aside via
the use of barbed wire strung for miles through the forest. Forest managers
finally agreed that the land should be open, and I personally took down
nearly 5 miles of fence posts by myself, well myself and my daughter.

I don't know the voracity of your assertion of "illegal" trail, but your
assertion that we don't care is a blatant lie.

I do not pretend, as you do, that just because you failed to show up at any
of the sites I cleaned up, then environmenalists don't care about public
access to public land. I do pretend, rightly I might add, that you are a
blithering idiot.
 
On Wed, 05 Mar 2008 01:46:08 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I'll bet that I have done far more trail maintenance than you have. Some
>maintenance was on historic routes in the forest that you would deny access
>to, other maintenance was done to restore land closed due to environmental
>whackos like yourself to open land. Land was closed to visitation in my
>local National Forest, and as a result the closed areas were set aside via
>the use of barbed wire strung for miles through the forest. Forest managers
>finally agreed that the land should be open, and I personally took down
>nearly 5 miles of fence posts by myself, well myself and my daughter.
>
>I don't know the voracity of your assertion of "illegal" trail, but your
>assertion that we don't care is a blatant lie.
>
>I do not pretend, as you do, that just because you failed to show up at any
>of the sites I cleaned up, then environmenalists don't care about public
>access to public land. I do pretend, rightly I might add, that you are a
>blithering idiot.


What does any of this have to do with the FACT that no mountain bikers
showed up to restore their illegally constructed trail?
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
 
"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> What does any of this have to do with the FACT that no mountain bikers
> showed up to restore their illegally constructed trail?



You didn't show up either. What's your point?

I'm not even a mountain biker, but I've done far more to restore and
maintain stuff than you will ever hope to do.

We could take all of the miles of route that you have affected and multiply
it by 10, and I've done more in a day on that much.
 
On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 23:44:53 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>>
>> What does any of this have to do with the FACT that no mountain bikers
>> showed up to restore their illegally constructed trail?

>
>
>You didn't show up either. What's your point?


They created the mess, and refuse to clean it up. They shouldn't be
allowed to mountain bike, except on paved roads.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
 
On Mar 6, 9:19 pm, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 23:44:53 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
>
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...

>
> >> What does any of this have to do with the FACT that no mountain bikers
> >> showed up to restore their illegally constructed trail?

>
> >You didn't show up either. What's your point?

>
> They created the mess, and refuse to clean it up. They shouldn't be
> allowed to mountain bike, except on paved roads.



Good point Mike, it is their mess and they are responsible for it.

Now that we have that straightened out, you've got a whole bunch of
CO2, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, and oxides of nitrogen and
sulpher floating in the atmosphere that you are resposible for when
you CHOSE to fly on a commercial airline instead of taking a sailboat.
When are you going to get that mess cleaned up?
 
On Fri, 7 Mar 2008 03:45:43 -0800 (PST), kayak144 <[email protected]>
wrote:

>On Mar 6, 9:19 pm, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 23:44:53 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
>>
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> >news:[email protected]...

>>
>> >> What does any of this have to do with the FACT that no mountain bikers
>> >> showed up to restore their illegally constructed trail?

>>
>> >You didn't show up either. What's your point?

>>
>> They created the mess, and refuse to clean it up. They shouldn't be
>> allowed to mountain bike, except on paved roads.

>
>
> Good point Mike, it is their mess and they are responsible for it.
>
>Now that we have that straightened out, you've got a whole bunch of
>CO2, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, and oxides of nitrogen and
>sulpher floating in the atmosphere that you are resposible for when
>you CHOSE to fly on a commercial airline instead of taking a sailboat.


Prove it, LIAR.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
 
"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Try to stick to the subject. No one is talking about YOU. We are
> talking about DEADBEAT, IRRESPONSIBLE MOUNTAIN BIKERS. Go back to
> sleep.
> --


Try and keep up yourself.

You are standing in a glass house throwing stones. You are complaining about
people not doing the same thing you will not do, and you are complaining to
a guy that does what you will not do.

Idiot.
 
On Sat, 08 Mar 2008 04:22:40 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>>
>> Try to stick to the subject. No one is talking about YOU. We are
>> talking about DEADBEAT, IRRESPONSIBLE MOUNTAIN BIKERS. Go back to
>> sleep.
>> --

>
>Try and keep up yourself.
>
>You are standing in a glass house throwing stones. You are complaining about
>people not doing the same thing you will not do, and you are complaining to
>a guy that does what you will not do.
>
>Idiot.


BS. I don't create illegal trails. Mountain bikers do. Try to stick to
the subject.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
 
On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 18:19:39 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> BS. I don't create illegal trails. Mountain bikers do. Try to stick to
>> the subject.

>
>
>You don't clean up the legal trails either.


Your idiocy knows no bounds. By definition, there is nothng about
legal trails needing to be "cleaned up". Illegal trails need to be
removed.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
 
Mike Vandeman wrote:
> On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 18:19:39 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> "Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> BS. I don't create illegal trails. Mountain bikers do. Try to stick to
>>> the subject.

>>
>> You don't clean up the legal trails either.

>
> Your idiocy knows no bounds. By definition, there is nothng about
> legal trails needing to be "cleaned up". Illegal trails need to be
> removed.


You sir obviously have 'never' been on a trail, legal or otherwise to
think that 'legal' trails don't need clean ups! I guess trails are a
long way away from your cafeteria job eh.

We worked with the local township and the property owners on a three
weekend clean up in a local bush area half crown land and half private.

'We' didn't discriminate, we cleaned the legal parts and any 'illegal'
parts of the bush area with a crew of off-roaders in Jeeps and Land
Rovers. We had 20 Jeeps in my group alone from a Usenet newsgroup,
rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys, for three Saturdays dragging garbage and
old vehicles out of the bush so the city workers could take them away.

We pulled 3 metric tons of pure garbage, two dumptrucks full of scrap
steel, two truck loads of used tires and about 30 vehicle hulks out of
this area.

The local press was there as well as the writer for the Land Rover
Magazine who did an article on it.

Maybe you should get off the keyboard and actually go see some trails so
you can have an 'educated' opinion of them Mike. All you do is post
other peoples opinions with nothing first hand.

Mike
(not a biker, but a Jeeper)
 
"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:eek:[email protected]...
>
> Your idiocy knows no bounds. By definition, there is nothng about
> legal trails needing to be "cleaned up". Illegal trails need to be
> removed.



Legal trails take far more cleaning and maintenance than ANY illegal trail
will ever get.

Trail maintenance is done all of the time. The Forest Service and the Park
Service are always looking for volunteers to do trail maintenance. You seem
to be completely ignorant of the fact that forests and parks have
Adopt-A-Trail Programs that work much the same as the Adopt-A-Highway
program that the highway departments have. Groups come in and volunteer time
and material to keep routes in the national forests and parks open. They
shore up the low side of the trail to remedy or prevent erosion, they haul
out fallen trees, repair irrigation systems, whatever the ranger needs to
have done, volunteers come together to make it happen.

You really need to get out more.

Idiot.
 
On Mon, 10 Mar 2008 09:43:08 -0400, Mike Romain <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Mike Vandeman wrote:
>> On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 18:19:39 GMT, "Jeff Strickland"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> "Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]...
>>>> BS. I don't create illegal trails. Mountain bikers do. Try to stick to
>>>> the subject.
>>>
>>> You don't clean up the legal trails either.

>>
>> Your idiocy knows no bounds. By definition, there is nothng about
>> legal trails needing to be "cleaned up". Illegal trails need to be
>> removed.

>
>You sir obviously have 'never' been on a trail, legal or otherwise to
>think that 'legal' trails don't need clean ups! I guess trails are a
>long way away from your cafeteria job eh.
>
>We worked with the local township and the property owners on a three
>weekend clean up in a local bush area half crown land and half private.
>
>'We' didn't discriminate, we cleaned the legal parts and any 'illegal'
>parts of the bush area with a crew of off-roaders in Jeeps and Land
>Rovers. We had 20 Jeeps in my group alone from a Usenet newsgroup,
>rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys, for three Saturdays dragging garbage and
>old vehicles out of the bush so the city workers could take them away.
>
>We pulled 3 metric tons of pure garbage, two dumptrucks full of scrap
>steel, two truck loads of used tires and about 30 vehicle hulks out of
>this area.
>
>The local press was there as well as the writer for the Land Rover
>Magazine who did an article on it.
>
>Maybe you should get off the keyboard and actually go see some trails so
>you can have an 'educated' opinion of them Mike. All you do is post
>other peoples opinions with nothing first hand.
>
>Mike
>(not a biker, but a Jeeper)


I know it's hard, but try to stick to the subject: restoration of
illegal trails to habitat.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
 

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