~~My Transgendered Activities ~~

Discussion in 'Health and medical' started by Ilena Rose, Apr 22, 2004.

  1. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

    The "two women" referred to below are Susan Schaelzer and Myrl
    Jeffcoat, from this group:

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm

    Sorry Teddy/Stevie Barrett /Terry the Terror ...

    .... it is you who use cowardly men pretending to be women to do your
    publicist work ...


    Subject: My Transgendered Activities
    Newsgroups: soc.support.transgendered
    Date: 1998/03/24


    (from alt.support.breast-implant)

    Some of you know that I was recently criticized by two women
    for "aligning" myself with a transsexual group. Their theory
    was that this "alliance" might somehow, someway hurt some
    of the impending cases.

    Further, GWS people, I was sternly informed, did not wish to be
    "aligned" with "you." (that's Gulf War Syndrome, altho it doesn't even
    matter).

    They further expressed that "I" could not speak for "them" because
    I had posted some jokes on an atheist board and this made me unworthy
    somehow to share information on the dangers of silicone.

    I assured them that posting on an atheist board no more made
    me an atheist than my posting on a gardening board made me a
    vegetable.

    This all strikes a very personal and profound chord in me.

    We are one generation away from Nazi Germany.
    Many of my ancestors died horrific deaths in
    concentration camps ~ less than 55 years ago.
    A blink in time and space.

    We have at least one holocaust survivor in our support system ~ a
    woman I cherish beyond words.

    Our organization makes no judgements as to why
    someone was implanted or injected, who they are, what they do
    for a living, who they have slept with, what their personal vices
    may be, with their criminal record may be, or whether
    they are gazillionaires or paupers, heathens or saints.

    We raise consciousness as to the dangers of silicone and our grateful
    everyday that we have the health and ability to do so.

    I would like to share this message I just received from
    a reader on the soc.support.transgendered board. It made my
    day as you might well imagine. TS stands for transsexual.

    Love to all.
    Ilena Rosenthal


    Tue Mar 24 13:51 PST 1998
    >From: m
    >Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 13:51:47 -0800
    >To: [email protected]
    >Subject: Re: Silicone Immunopathology
    >Ilena:
    >Just in case no one has written to say thank you for imparting some
    >scientific knowledge to this group; thank you. TSs as a group may seem
    >to be ignorant, but really many of us are just desperate. I would guess
    >you know about these 'practioners' who inject industrial grade silicone
    >while in public bathrooms. I hope you never feel anger about the people
    >in this group, but maybe just a little pity along with the compassion
    >you have demonstrated.
     
    Tags:


  2. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

    The "two women" referred to below are Susan Schaelzer and Myrl
    Jeffcoat, from this group:

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm

    Sorry Teddy/Stevie Barrett /Terry the Terror ...

    .... it is you who use cowardly men pretending to be women to do your
    publicist work ...


    Subject: My Transgendered Activities
    Newsgroups: soc.support.transgendered
    Date: 1998/03/24


    (from alt.support.breast-implant)

    Some of you know that I was recently criticized by two women
    for "aligning" myself with a transsexual group. Their theory
    was that this "alliance" might somehow, someway hurt some
    of the impending cases.

    Further, GWS people, I was sternly informed, did not wish to be
    "aligned" with "you." (that's Gulf War Syndrome, altho it doesn't even
    matter).

    They further expressed that "I" could not speak for "them" because
    I had posted some jokes on an atheist board and this made me unworthy
    somehow to share information on the dangers of silicone.

    I assured them that posting on an atheist board no more made
    me an atheist than my posting on a gardening board made me a
    vegetable.

    This all strikes a very personal and profound chord in me.

    We are one generation away from Nazi Germany.
    Many of my ancestors died horrific deaths in
    concentration camps ~ less than 55 years ago.
    A blink in time and space.

    We have at least one holocaust survivor in our support system ~ a
    woman I cherish beyond words.

    Our organization makes no judgements as to why
    someone was implanted or injected, who they are, what they do
    for a living, who they have slept with, what their personal vices
    may be, with their criminal record may be, or whether
    they are gazillionaires or paupers, heathens or saints.

    We raise consciousness as to the dangers of silicone and our grateful
    everyday that we have the health and ability to do so.

    I would like to share this message I just received from
    a reader on the soc.support.transgendered board. It made my
    day as you might well imagine. TS stands for transsexual.

    Love to all.
    Ilena Rosenthal


    Tue Mar 24 13:51 PST 1998
    >From: m
    >Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 13:51:47 -0800
    >To: [email protected]
    >Subject: Re: Silicone Immunopathology
    >Ilena:
    >Just in case no one has written to say thank you for imparting some
    >scientific knowledge to this group; thank you. TSs as a group may seem
    >to be ignorant, but really many of us are just desperate. I would guess
    >you know about these 'practioners' who inject industrial grade silicone
    >while in public bathrooms. I hope you never feel anger about the people
    >in this group, but maybe just a little pity along with the compassion
    >you have demonstrated.
     
  3. Coleah

    Coleah Guest

    Ah yes.....shades of 'divide and conquer' in the name of helping women
    harmed by silicone breast implants. This newsgroup wasn't enough for her,
    so she had to entwine "us" with transgender, Gulf War veterans, alternative
    health, etc, etc......All for our own good!!!

    And yes, we ARE an ungrateful bunch of cyber monkeys, one by one barfing on
    the banana's you force feed those who read this newsgroup.
    Thank God for the archives.




    "Ilena Rose" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > The "two women" referred to below are Susan Schaelzer and Myrl
    > Jeffcoat, from this group:
    >
    > www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm
    >
    > Sorry Teddy/Stevie Barrett /Terry the Terror ...
    >
    > ... it is you who use cowardly men pretending to be women to do your
    > publicist work ...
    >
    >
    > Subject: My Transgendered Activities
    > Newsgroups: soc.support.transgendered
    > Date: 1998/03/24
    >
    >
    > (from alt.support.breast-implant)
    >
    > Some of you know that I was recently criticized by two women
    > for "aligning" myself with a transsexual group. Their theory
    > was that this "alliance" might somehow, someway hurt some
    > of the impending cases.
    >
    > Further, GWS people, I was sternly informed, did not wish to be
    > "aligned" with "you." (that's Gulf War Syndrome, altho it doesn't even
    > matter).
    >
    > They further expressed that "I" could not speak for "them" because
    > I had posted some jokes on an atheist board and this made me unworthy
    > somehow to share information on the dangers of silicone.
    >
    > I assured them that posting on an atheist board no more made
    > me an atheist than my posting on a gardening board made me a
    > vegetable.
    >
    > This all strikes a very personal and profound chord in me.
    >
    > We are one generation away from Nazi Germany.
    > Many of my ancestors died horrific deaths in
    > concentration camps ~ less than 55 years ago.
    > A blink in time and space.
    >
    > We have at least one holocaust survivor in our support system ~ a
    > woman I cherish beyond words.
    >
    > Our organization makes no judgements as to why
    > someone was implanted or injected, who they are, what they do
    > for a living, who they have slept with, what their personal vices
    > may be, with their criminal record may be, or whether
    > they are gazillionaires or paupers, heathens or saints.
    >
    > We raise consciousness as to the dangers of silicone and our grateful
    > everyday that we have the health and ability to do so.
    >
    > I would like to share this message I just received from
    > a reader on the soc.support.transgendered board. It made my
    > day as you might well imagine. TS stands for transsexual.
    >
    > Love to all.
    > Ilena Rosenthal
    >
    >
    > Tue Mar 24 13:51 PST 1998
    > >From: m
    > >Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 13:51:47 -0800
    > >To: [email protected]
    > >Subject: Re: Silicone Immunopathology
    > >Ilena:
    > >Just in case no one has written to say thank you for imparting some
    > >scientific knowledge to this group; thank you. TSs as a group may seem
    > >to be ignorant, but really many of us are just desperate. I would guess
    > >you know about these 'practioners' who inject industrial grade silicone
    > >while in public bathrooms. I hope you never feel anger about the people
    > >in this group, but maybe just a little pity along with the compassion
    > >you have demonstrated.

    >
     
  4. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

    On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 23:29:50 GMT, "Coleah" <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >Ah yes.....shades of 'divide and conquer' in the name of helping women
    >harmed by silicone breast implants.


    Exactly ... Schaezler and Jeffcoat were WAY off base ... in my
    advocacy work ... speaking at many Health Fairs, Expos, etc. ... I
    made many, many, many friends ... Veterans with GWS ... Agent Orange
    sufferers ... people who also were harmed by other cover ups such as
    the silicone issue .

    I received much appreciation at the time for making even more
    alliances ... and Schaezler and Jeffcoat looked like petty, selfish,
    divisive fools then too.

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/ss.html

    www.humantlicsfoundation.com/myrl.html

    Now that Karen Lawrence, President of NSIF is promoting Barrett /
    Quackwatch ... while Ted Nidiffer is held up as a Mentor by at least
    one of Andy's Posse ...

    while several men who promote Barrett etc.'s Web of Deceit sometimes
    pretending to be women add to the Ilena Bash-a-thon ..

    as always ... much more to be revealed.

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm

    (I've some requests for the url to my response to NSIF's lies about me
    .... it's not done yet, however, I've forwarded Karen "Gigi's" letter
    to several who requested ... but not posted it.

    We're on the road now and it's hit or miss with internet cafes.
     
  5. Coleah

    Coleah Guest

    Transgender
    Schaezler
    Jeffcoat
    Health Fairs
    Veterans
    People harmed by 'other cover ups'
    Karen Lawrence
    Barrett /Quackwatch
    Ted Nidiffer
    Mentor
    Andy's Posse
    Web of Deceit
    Ilena Bash-a-thon
    NSIF's lies
    "Gigi's" letter
    as always ... much more to be revealed.

    Good God, I hope not!
    If anyone has questions about why Ilena's 'conspiracy theories' don't
    hold water, watching her posts swirl around and around should
    give them a tiny hint.

    Somehow, it is all connected in Ilena's mind.....
    now it's that SPECIAL !




    "Ilena Rose" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 23:29:50 GMT, "Coleah" <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    >
    > >Ah yes.....shades of 'divide and conquer' in the name of helping women
    > >harmed by silicone breast implants.

    >
    > Exactly ... Schaezler and Jeffcoat were WAY off base ... in my
    > advocacy work ... speaking at many Health Fairs, Expos, etc. ... I
    > made many, many, many friends ... Veterans with GWS ... Agent Orange
    > sufferers ... people who also were harmed by other cover ups such as
    > the silicone issue .
    >
    > I received much appreciation at the time for making even more
    > alliances ... and Schaezler and Jeffcoat looked like petty, selfish,
    > divisive fools then too.
    >
    > www.humanticsfoundation.com/ss.html
    >
    > www.humantlicsfoundation.com/myrl.html
    >
    > Now that Karen Lawrence, President of NSIF is promoting Barrett /
    > Quackwatch ... while Ted Nidiffer is held up as a Mentor by at least
    > one of Andy's Posse ...
    >
    > while several men who promote Barrett etc.'s Web of Deceit sometimes
    > pretending to be women add to the Ilena Bash-a-thon ..
    >
    > as always ... much more to be revealed.
    >
    > www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm
    >
    > (I've some requests for the url to my response to NSIF's lies about me
    > ... it's not done yet, however, I've forwarded Karen "Gigi's" letter
    > to several who requested ... but not posted it.
    >
    > We're on the road now and it's hit or miss with internet cafes.
     
  6. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

    On Thu, 29 Apr 2004 18:14:13 GMT, "Coleah" <[email protected]>
    wrote:



    >as always ... much more to be revealed.
    >
    >Good God, I hope not!


    As long as you and others on Andy's Posse continue to attempt to
    change history to protect the guilty ... more will be revealed.

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm
     
  7. Coleah

    Coleah Guest

    "Ilena Rose" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Thu, 29 Apr 2004 18:14:13 GMT, "Coleah" <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > >as always ... much more to be revealed.
    > >
    > >Good God, I hope not!

    >
    > As long as you and others on Andy's Posse continue to attempt to
    > change history to protect the guilty ... more will be revealed.
    >
    > www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm
    >


    Oh Dear.....
    That of course would be change history from
    Ilena The Self-Righteous Know-It-All
    Prove/Answer-Nothing Accuse-Ad-Nausea's point of view.
    (The ONE and ONLY Correct Version of History)
     
  8. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

    The "two women" referred to below are Susan Schaelzer and Myrl
    Jeffcoat, from this group:

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm

    Sorry Teddy/Stevie Barrett /Terry the Terror ...

    .... it is you who use cowardly men pretending to be women to do your
    publicist work ...


    Subject: My Transgendered Activities
    Newsgroups: soc.support.transgendered
    Date: 1998/03/24


    (from alt.support.breast-implant)

    Some of you know that I was recently criticized by two women
    for "aligning" myself with a transsexual group. Their theory
    was that this "alliance" might somehow, someway hurt some
    of the impending cases.

    Further, GWS people, I was sternly informed, did not wish to be
    "aligned" with "you." (that's Gulf War Syndrome, altho it doesn't even
    matter).

    They further expressed that "I" could not speak for "them" because
    I had posted some jokes on an atheist board and this made me unworthy
    somehow to share information on the dangers of silicone.

    I assured them that posting on an atheist board no more made
    me an atheist than my posting on a gardening board made me a
    vegetable.

    This all strikes a very personal and profound chord in me.

    We are one generation away from Nazi Germany.
    Many of my ancestors died horrific deaths in
    concentration camps ~ less than 55 years ago.
    A blink in time and space.

    We have at least one holocaust survivor in our support system ~ a
    woman I cherish beyond words.

    Our organization makes no judgements as to why
    someone was implanted or injected, who they are, what they do
    for a living, who they have slept with, what their personal vices
    may be, with their criminal record may be, or whether
    they are gazillionaires or paupers, heathens or saints.

    We raise consciousness as to the dangers of silicone and our grateful
    everyday that we have the health and ability to do so.

    I would like to share this message I just received from
    a reader on the soc.support.transgendered board. It made my
    day as you might well imagine. TS stands for transsexual.

    Love to all.
    Ilena Rosenthal


    Tue Mar 24 13:51 PST 1998
    >From: m
    >Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 13:51:47 -0800
    >To: [email protected]
    >Subject: Re: Silicone Immunopathology
    >Ilena:
    >Just in case no one has written to say thank you for imparting some
    >scientific knowledge to this group; thank you. TSs as a group may seem
    >to be ignorant, but really many of us are just desperate. I would guess
    >you know about these 'practioners' who inject industrial grade silicone
    >while in public bathrooms. I hope you never feel anger about the people
    >in this group, but maybe just a little pity along with the compassion
    >you have demonstrated.
     
  9. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:

    >We are one generation away from Nazi Germany.
    >Many of my ancestors died horrific deaths in
    >concentration camps ~ less than 55 years ago.


    A pity that doesn't keep you from trivializing their suffering by
    equating Nazism and breast implants.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
    These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
     
  10. Orac

    Orac Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    [email protected] (David Wright) wrote:

    > In article <[email protected]>,
    > Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >We are one generation away from Nazi Germany.
    > >Many of my ancestors died horrific deaths in
    > >concentration camps ~ less than 55 years ago.

    >
    > A pity that doesn't keep you from trivializing their suffering by
    > equating Nazism and breast implants.


    Ilena has always had a talent for hyperbole.

    --
    Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    |
    |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    | inconvenience me with questions?"
     
  11. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Orac <[email protected]> wrote:
    >In article <[email protected]>,
    > [email protected] (David Wright) wrote:
    >
    >> In article <[email protected]>,
    >> Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >> >We are one generation away from Nazi Germany.
    >> >Many of my ancestors died horrific deaths in
    >> >concentration camps ~ less than 55 years ago.

    >>
    >> A pity that doesn't keep you from trivializing their suffering by
    >> equating Nazism and breast implants.

    >
    >Ilena has always had a talent for hyperbole.


    In fact, she has the greatest talent for it of any sentient being in
    the visible universe!

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
    These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
     
  12. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

    On Sat, 01 May 2004 14:29:05 GMT, Orac <[email protected]> wrote:


    Davey's ... this website was created by silicone survivors ... for
    silicone survivors ...


    www.SiliconeHolocaust.org

    They didn't need nor request the Quack Empire's approval for this very
    well publicized website.

    I know personally SEVERAL women who, after being lied to by medical
    doctors such as yourself ... who were influenced by the Junk Science
    Media Campaign by ACSH/junkscience.com and their front groups,
    .... found the truth about their illnesses throught this site.

    I would like to put on record here that SEVERAL of the Publicists (aka
    Flacks and Shills) for quackwatch.com and healthwatcher.net are Jewish
    men ... some pretending to be women ... who have aligned with others
    from Barrett's Healthfraud List ... to attack people and attempt to
    convince the world that their "Marks" (myself, Ms Drew and others) ...
    are "anti-semitic."

    There are in fact thousands of such posts by Jews Langer and Probert
    .... both from the Quack Web of Deceit who proudly call themselves
    "Ragtag Posse" ...

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/andysposse.htm

    Their King ... their Leader of this Empire, while they scream ugly
    names at we critics ... one of the losing Plaintiffs in a high profile
    internet lawsuit against me ... will not admit or deny whether he too
    is Jewish... although much of the twisted campaign of his "publicists"
    is around those like Langer & Probert pretending to represent the
    voice of Judasim ... while screaming "racist" and "anti-semite."

    www.humanticsfoundation.com/quacklibelsuit.htm

    Shabbot Shalom.
     
  13. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

  14. Orac

    Orac Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:

    > On Sat, 01 May 2004 14:29:05 GMT, Orac <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >
    > Davey's ... this website was created by silicone survivors ... for
    > silicone survivors ...


    The hyperbole to which I was referring was your bringing up the Nazis.

    --
    Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    |
    |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    | inconvenience me with questions?"
     
  15. Orac

    Orac Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:

    > On Sat, 01 May 2004 20:02:18 GMT, [email protected] (David
    > Wright) wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > >>Ilena has always had a talent for hyperbole.

    > >
    > >In fact, she has the greatest talent for it of any sentient being in
    > >the visible universe!
    > >
    > > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net

    >
    >
    > Good one Daveys!
    >
    > Think you just took the honour!
    >
    > www.humanticsfoundation.com/disinfoagentsfaq.htm#WrongerThanWright


    Ah, yes. More of your enemies list that you like to post. Your enemies
    list says far more about you than it does about anyone on it.

    --
    Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    |
    |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    | inconvenience me with questions?"
     
  16. Jan

    Jan Guest

    >Subject: Re: ~~~My Transgendered Activities ~~~
    >From: Orac [email protected]
    >Date: 5/1/2004 12:26 PM Pacific Standard Time
    >Message-id: <[email protected]>
    >
    >In article <[email protected]>,
    > Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> On Sat, 01 May 2004 20:02:18 GMT, [email protected] (David
    >> Wright) wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> >>Ilena has always had a talent for hyperbole.
    >> >
    >> >In fact, she has the greatest talent for it of any sentient being in
    >> >the visible universe!
    >> >
    >> > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net

    >>
    >>
    >> Good one Daveys!
    >>
    >> Think you just took the honour!
    >>
    >> www.humanticsfoundation.com/disinfoagentsfaq.htm#WrongerThanWright

    >
    >Ah, yes. More of your enemies list that you like to post


    Well no, just reality. It appears you aren't bashful when it comes to bashing
    personally, but do blame it on the others.

    GROW UP!!
     
  17. Jan

    Jan Guest

    >Subject: Re: ~~~My Transgendered Activities ~~~
    >From: Orac [email protected]
    >Date: 5/1/2004 12:24 PM Pacific Standard Time
    >Message-id: <[email protected]>
    >
    >In article <[email protected]>,
    > Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> On Sat, 01 May 2004 14:29:05 GMT, Orac <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >> Davey's ... this website was created by silicone survivors ... for
    >> silicone survivors ...

    >
    >The hyperbole to which I was referring was your bringing up the Nazis.


    Orac google search Nazis 3,660.

    IIena 10

    Orac, Orac, Orac.

    Foot in LYING mouth.

    Jan
    What a hypocrite.
     
  18. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:
    >On Sat, 01 May 2004 20:02:18 GMT, [email protected] (David
    >Wright) wrote:
    >
    >>>Ilena has always had a talent for hyperbole.

    >>
    >>In fact, she has the greatest talent for it of any sentient being in
    >>the visible universe!
    >>
    >> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net

    >
    >Good one Daveys!
    >
    >Think you just took the honour!


    Congratulations, Ilena. You are now partway to developing a sense of
    humor.

    Perhaps some day you'll travel the rest of the way, and maybe even
    develop a sense of irony to go with it.

    I'm not optimistic, though. It sure hasn't happened with the Drewster.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
    These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
     
  19. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Orac <[email protected]> wrote:
    >In article <[email protected]>,
    > Ilena Rose <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> On Sat, 01 May 2004 20:02:18 GMT, [email protected] (David
    >> Wright) wrote:
    >>
    >> >>Ilena has always had a talent for hyperbole.
    >> >
    >> >In fact, she has the greatest talent for it of any sentient being in
    >> >the visible universe!
    >> >
    >> > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net

    >>
    >>
    >> Good one Daveys!
    >>
    >> Think you just took the honour!
    >>

    >Ah, yes. More of your enemies list that you like to post.


    I'd be more worried if I didn't make it, actually. Like Hunter
    Thompson being outraged that he didn't show up on Nixon's enemies
    list.

    >Your enemies list says far more about you than it does about anyone
    >on it.


    Ain't it the truth? I don't have a web site, and even if I did, I
    wouldn't pollute it by mentioning Ilena. I don't even consider her an
    enemy, just a sad and somewhat crazy egomaniac.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
    These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
     
  20. Ilena Rose

    Ilena Rose Guest

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