New Shimano chain - use the existing pin?

[Justin Vincent]

I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but it's
only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano chains come out
of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could be used to join the
chain.

Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the right
thing?

Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
damages it?

Justin Vincent

 

[Lou Holtman]

"Justin Vincent" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:C0BF7286.13C56%[email protected]...
> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but it's
> only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano chains come
out
> of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could be used to join the
> chain.
>
> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the right
> thing?
>

You did the right thing.

> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
> damages it?
>

The pin isn't damaged, the hole in the outer plate of the link where you
pushed the pin through to open it is 'damaged'. To reconnect this save you
need the special pin......or get an appropriate quick link.


Lou

 

[Lou Holtman]

"Justin Vincent" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:C0BF7286.13C56%[email protected]...
> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but it's
> only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano chains come
out
> of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could be used to join the
> chain.

Oops, I have to correct my earlier answer. Yes you can use the pin half out
to connect a NEW chain. The opposite outer plate of the link isn't damaged.

Lou

 

[Hans]

"Justin Vincent" <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:C0BF7286.13C56%[email protected]...
> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but it's
> only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano chains come
out
> of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could be used to join the
> chain.
>
> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the right
> thing?
>
> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
> damages it?
>
> Justin Vincent
>

Good question. I think you can use the standard pin half out the first time
and the next time use the special joining pin.

By the way I don't use the special pin anymore. Every time I put one in it
went very easy and felt like the new pin was not very strong. Now I use a
Sram powerlink on all my Shimanochains. Easy to get the chain on and off and
it feels more solid.

Hans

 

[Sorni]

Justin Vincent wrote:
> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but
> it's only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano
> chains come out of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could
> be used to join the chain.
>
> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the
> right thing?
>
> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
> damages it?

As others said, you could probably use it that one time. HOWEVER, don't you
have to /shorten/ the chain when installing it? If so, then the plate where
you break the chain will be compromised, and you'll need a special pin
anyway.

I just use Powerlinks (9-speed only so far).

Bill S.

 

[Lou Holtman]

Sorni wrote:
> Justin Vincent wrote:
>
>>I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but
>>it's only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano
>>chains come out of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could
>>be used to join the chain.
>>
>>Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the
>>right thing?
>>
>>Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
>>damages it?
>
>
> As others said, you could probably use it that one time. HOWEVER, don't you
> have to /shorten/ the chain when installing it? If so, then the plate where
> you break the chain will be compromised, and you'll need a special pin
> anyway.

You have to shorten the chain on the other end. Campy chains always have
a label on the chain warning for this.

Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu

 

[Justin Vincent]

Lou Holtman wrote:
> Sorni wrote:
>
>> Justin Vincent wrote:
>>
>>> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but
>>> it's only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano
>>> chains come out of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could
>>> be used to join the chain.
>>>
>>> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the
>>> right thing?
>>>
>>> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
>>> damages it?
>>
>>
>>
>> As others said, you could probably use it that one time. HOWEVER,
>> don't you have to /shorten/ the chain when installing it? If so, then
>> the plate where you break the chain will be compromised, and you'll
>> need a special pin anyway.
>
>
> You have to shorten the chain on the other end. Campy chains always have
> a label on the chain warning for this.
>
> Lou

Thanks. You're right; I do need to shorten the chain, so I haven't been
wasting the pins.

Justin Vincent

 

[[email protected]]

and don't forget to string chain on the cycle before connecting the
links

 

[Lou Holtman]

Justin Vincent wrote:
> Lou Holtman wrote:
>
>> Sorni wrote:
>>
>>> Justin Vincent wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but
>>>> it's only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano
>>>> chains come out of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could
>>>> be used to join the chain.
>>>>
>>>> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the
>>>> right thing?
>>>>
>>>> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
>>>> damages it?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As others said, you could probably use it that one time. HOWEVER,
>>> don't you have to /shorten/ the chain when installing it? If so,
>>> then the plate where you break the chain will be compromised, and
>>> you'll need a special pin anyway.
>>
>>
>>
>> You have to shorten the chain on the other end. Campy chains always
>> have a label on the chain warning for this.
>>
>> Lou
>
>
> Thanks. You're right; I do need to shorten the chain, so I haven't been
> wasting the pins.

Yes you have. As I said you have to shorten the chain at the other end
so you don't cut off the link with the useable half out pin

Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu

 

[Matt O'Toole]

On Wed, 21 Jun 2006 22:02:46 +1000, Justin Vincent wrote:

> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but it's
> only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano chains come out
> of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could be used to join the
> chain.
>
> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the right
> thing?
>
> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
> damages it?

Both. Plus these days, the pins are peened so strongly that pushing them
out can damage the side plates.

Shimano's special pins are self peening, which gives a stronger joint.
Pushing plain pins in and out leaves weak spots in the chain. The chances
of breaking a chain are still slim, but they increase with every weak spot.

The whole issue can be avoided by using Powerlink-type links. KMC makes a
good one that costs less than $3.

Matt O.

 

[Sorni]

Lou Holtman wrote:
> Justin Vincent wrote:
>> Lou Holtman wrote:
>>
>>> Sorni wrote:
>>>
>>>> Justin Vincent wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on,
>>>>> but it's only just occurred to me after all these years that
>>>>> Shimano chains come out of the with a standard pin half out, as
>>>>> if it could be used to join the chain.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing
>>>>> the right thing?
>>>>>
>>>>> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in
>>>>> that damages it?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> As others said, you could probably use it that one time. HOWEVER,
>>>> don't you have to /shorten/ the chain when installing it? If so,
>>>> then the plate where you break the chain will be compromised, and
>>>> you'll need a special pin anyway.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> You have to shorten the chain on the other end. Campy chains always
>>> have a label on the chain warning for this.
>>>
>>> Lou
>>
>>
>> Thanks. You're right; I do need to shorten the chain, so I haven't
>> been wasting the pins.
>
> Yes you have. As I said you have to shorten the chain at the other end
> so you don't cut off the link with the useable half out pin

But I thought the idea is that any time you break a Shimano chain you've
ruined the plate for a "normal" pin. Are you saying the one installed half
way is a "special" pin already? Maybe that's what I'm missing. (Still
easier to just use a PL IMO.)

 

[eflayer2]

Might we all agree that the Shimano pin system is a dinosaur and it is
moderately appalling that all chain companies won't simply include a
quick link. Can't sell quite as many extra pins that way but the
consumer might be better off.


Justin Vincent wrote:
> I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on, but it's
> only just occurred to me after all these years that Shimano chains come out
> of the with a standard pin half out, as if it could be used to join the
> chain.
>
> Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing the right
> thing?
>
> Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in that
> damages it?
>
> Justin Vincent

 

[Lou Holtman]

Sorni wrote:
> Lou Holtman wrote:
>
>>Justin Vincent wrote:
>>
>>>Lou Holtman wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Sorni wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Justin Vincent wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I've always used the special joining pins to put a new chain on,
>>>>>>but it's only just occurred to me after all these years that
>>>>>>Shimano chains come out of the with a standard pin half out, as
>>>>>>if it could be used to join the chain.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Have I been wasting all those joining pins or have I been doing
>>>>>>the right thing?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Is it the process of pushing out a standard pin or pushing it in
>>>>>>that damages it?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>As others said, you could probably use it that one time. HOWEVER,
>>>>>don't you have to /shorten/ the chain when installing it? If so,
>>>>>then the plate where you break the chain will be compromised, and
>>>>>you'll need a special pin anyway.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>You have to shorten the chain on the other end. Campy chains always
>>>>have a label on the chain warning for this.
>>>>
>>>>Lou
>>>
>>>
>>>Thanks. You're right; I do need to shorten the chain, so I haven't
>>>been wasting the pins.
>>
>>Yes you have. As I said you have to shorten the chain at the other end
>>so you don't cut off the link with the useable half out pin
>
>
> But I thought the idea is that any time you break a Shimano chain you've
> ruined the plate for a "normal" pin.

That is true if you break a chain that is already installed.

> Are you saying the one installed half
> way is a "special" pin already?

For the half through pin on new chain yes. Otherwise it would be a very
stupid thing to do, even for Shimano. I smell law suits ;-)

> Maybe that's what I'm missing. (Still
> easier to just use a PL IMO.)

Very true stupid system both Shimano and Campy.

Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu

 

[Werehatrack]

On 21 Jun 2006 15:11:06 -0700, "eflayer2" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Might we all agree that the Shimano pin system is a dinosaur and it is
>moderately appalling that all chain companies won't simply include a
>quick link. Can't sell quite as many extra pins that way but the
>consumer might be better off.

IIANM, Shimano is charging about as much for their special pins as
some others charge for a quick-link. I'm sure it's far more
profitable for them to sell their pin than to come up with a link, and
besides, Shimano has made a point of the fact that they *never* accept
outside suggestions or do anything the same way that others do it if
they have a choice.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

 

[Werehatrack]

On 21 Jun 2006 15:11:06 -0700, "eflayer2" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Might we all agree that the Shimano pin system is a dinosaur and it is
>moderately appalling that all chain companies won't simply include a
>quick link. Can't sell quite as many extra pins that way but the
>consumer might be better off.

IIANM, Shimano is charging about as much for their special pins as
some others charge for a quick-link. I'm sure it's far more
profitable for them to sell their pin than to come up with a link, and
besides, Shimano has made a point of the fact that they *never* accept
outside suggestions or do anything the same way that others do it if
they have a choice.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

 

[John Forrest Tomlinson]

On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 05:53:21 GMT, Werehatrack
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On 21 Jun 2006 15:11:06 -0700, "eflayer2" <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>
>>Might we all agree that the Shimano pin system is a dinosaur and it is
>>moderately appalling that all chain companies won't simply include a
>>quick link. Can't sell quite as many extra pins that way but the
>>consumer might be better off.
>
>IIANM, Shimano is charging about as much for their special pins as
>some others charge for a quick-link.

I think you can get that you get three pins for about the price of a
quick link? Still not a good deal.

JT

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[John Forrest Tomlinson]

On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 05:53:21 GMT, Werehatrack
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On 21 Jun 2006 15:11:06 -0700, "eflayer2" <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>
>>Might we all agree that the Shimano pin system is a dinosaur and it is
>>moderately appalling that all chain companies won't simply include a
>>quick link. Can't sell quite as many extra pins that way but the
>>consumer might be better off.
>
>IIANM, Shimano is charging about as much for their special pins as
>some others charge for a quick-link.

I think you can get that you get three pins for about the price of a
quick link? Still not a good deal.

JT

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