Nozal, most surprising GT Winner since?

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Crank Yanker, Sep 15, 2003.

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  1. Crank Yanker

    Crank Yanker Guest

    So with the first major mountains behind them, it's no longer beyond the realm of possibility that
    Nozal could take the Vuelta. This would be the most surprising grand tour win since when?
     
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  2. Nev Shea

    Nev Shea Guest

    [email protected] (Crank Yanker) wrote in news:[email protected]:

    > So with the first major mountains behind them, it's no longer beyond the realm of possibility that
    > Nozal could take the Vuelta. This would be the most surprising grand tour win since when?

    How about last year's Vuelta?

    Or the TdF in 1999?

    NS
     
  3. Noel Llopis

    Noel Llopis Guest

    [email protected] (Crank Yanker) wrote in news:[email protected]:

    > So with the first major mountains behind them, it's no longer beyond the realm of possibility that
    > Nozal could take the Vuelta. This would be the most surprising grand tour win since when?

    Giovanetti winning the Vuelta in 1990?

    --Noel
     
  4. Nick Burns

    Nick Burns Guest

    "Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > So with the first major mountains behind them, it's no longer beyond the realm of possibility that
    > Nozal could take the Vuelta. This would be the most surprising grand tour win since when?

    Last year's Vuelta. Before that, the 2001 and 2000 editions of the same race. The last time a
    "favorite" won the Vuelta was '99 (Ullrich) and Olano won the 1998 version (finally!). Most Vuelta
    winners are "surprise" winners.
     
  5. Nick Burns

    Nick Burns Guest

    "Noel Llopis" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > [email protected] (Crank Yanker) wrote in news:[email protected]:
    >
    > > So with the first major mountains behind them, it's no longer beyond the realm of possibility
    > > that Nozal could take the Vuelta. This would be the most surprising grand tour win since when?
    >
    > Giovanetti winning the Vuelta in 1990?
    >
    >
    > --Noel

    If you want most surprising of all, I would say Eric Caritoux in the 1984 version for the Skil team,
    where he was called in the day before to replace a domestique. After that, Alvaro Pino was a
    surprising winner in 1996. About half of the Vueltas between those that I mentioned were won by
    "suprise winners".
     
  6. Crank Yanker

    Crank Yanker Guest

    > How about last year's Vuelta?

    I had Aitor Gonzalez on my fantasy team so I must have thought he could win. Don't remember exactly
    how his form was leading up to the race, but he finished 6th in the Giro earlier in the year.

    > Or the TdF in 1999?

    Lance was 4th in the Vuelta the year before, and there was all the talk about him focusing his
    season on winning the Tour in '99.

    So, I don't think either of those qualify. I doubt there is anyone anywhere who picked Nozal as even
    a long-shot winner before this race started. That's the kind of surprise winner I'm asking about.
     
  7. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    There isn't the slightest chance of Nozal winning with at least two killer climbing stages left.

    "Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > > How about last year's Vuelta?
    >
    > I had Aitor Gonzalez on my fantasy team so I must have thought he could win. Don't remember
    > exactly how his form was leading up to
    the
    > race, but he finished 6th in the Giro earlier in the year.
    >
    > > Or the TdF in 1999?
    >
    > Lance was 4th in the Vuelta the year before, and there was all the talk about him focusing his
    > season on winning the Tour in '99.
    >
    > So, I don't think either of those qualify. I doubt there is anyone anywhere who picked Nozal as
    > even a long-shot winner before this
    race
    > started. That's the kind of surprise winner I'm asking about.
     
  8. Sonarrat

    Sonarrat Guest

    "Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote in message

    news:[email protected]...
    > So with the first major mountains behind them, it's no longer beyond the realm of possibility that
    > Nozal could take the Vuelta. This would be the most surprising grand tour win since when?

    Jan Ullrich was a shock twice - first coming in second to Bjarne Riis, himself a dark horse, and
    then winning the next year at the age of 23. 23 - Imagine if Michael Rogers or Sylvain Chavanel had
    won this year!

    -Sonarrat.
     
  9. Nozal is extremer than a non-favorite. He was a nobody. Guys like Giovanetti, Caritoux.... well at
    least they had been visible in mountain stages previously.
     
  10. Those 'killer stages' have just one serious climb at the end. Only the Pandera will suit climbers
    like Heras better. So judging from the course, it looks good for Nozal. But often such riders new in
    that situation crack simply because it's the third week.

    Now on the question of this thread: I hear comparisons with Mauri, Vuelta 91. But at least people
    who followed racing knew him before. Nozal has a really blank state of affairs.

    Laurent Fignon was also a real surprise. Before he won the Tour, he was internationally most known
    for breaking a pedal in a winning position in Paris-Tours. But actually he had won Critere
    International the year before, and a Vuelta stage too.

    For Kurgan I must add Nozal lost 10 kgs since joining ONCE.
     
  11. "Van Hoorebeeck Bart" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > Those 'killer stages' have just one serious climb at the end. Only the Pandera will suit climbers
    > like Heras better. So judging from the course, it looks good for Nozal. But often such riders new
    > in that situation crack simply because it's the third week.
    >
    > Now on the question of this thread: I hear comparisons with Mauri, Vuelta 91. But at least people
    > who followed racing knew him before. Nozal has a really blank state of affairs.
    >
    > Laurent Fignon was also a real surprise. Before he won the Tour, he was internationally most known
    > for breaking a pedal in a winning position in Paris-Tours. But actually he had won Critere
    > International the year before, and a Vuelta stage too.
    >
    > For Kurgan I must add Nozal lost 10 kgs since joining ONCE.

    Damn, that's what can legitimately be termed a transformation.

    Thanks Bart.
     
  12. "Sonarrat" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > "Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > So with the first major mountains behind them, it's no longer beyond the realm of possibility
    > > that Nozal could take the Vuelta. This would be the most surprising grand tour win since when?
    >
    > Jan Ullrich was a shock twice - first coming in second to Bjarne Riis,
    himself a
    > dark horse, and then winning the next year at the age of 23.

    I didn't think the 2nd year was a shock. The first one was.
     
  13. Sonarrat

    Sonarrat Guest

    "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Van Hoorebeeck Bart" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > > Those 'killer stages' have just one serious climb at the end. Only the Pandera will suit
    > > climbers like Heras better. So judging from the course, it looks good for Nozal. But often such
    > > riders new in that situation crack simply because it's the third week.
    > >
    > > Now on the question of this thread: I hear comparisons with Mauri, Vuelta 91. But at least
    > > people who followed racing knew him before. Nozal has a really blank state of affairs.
    > >
    > > Laurent Fignon was also a real surprise. Before he won the Tour, he was internationally most
    > > known for breaking a pedal in a winning position in Paris-Tours. But actually he had won Critere
    > > International the year before, and a Vuelta stage too.
    > >
    > > For Kurgan I must add Nozal lost 10 kgs since joining ONCE.
    >
    > Damn, that's what can legitimately be termed a transformation.

    OLN's TdF site says Nozal is 1.81m and 70.0 kg, which translates to 5'11" and 154 lb. If this is
    true, he is very similar to Ivan Basso and a bit smaller than Jan Ullrich. That site isn't totally
    reliable, though - Francisco Mancebo is most definitely NOT 84 kg, nor has he ever been.

    -Sonarrat.
     
  14. "Van Hoorebeeck Bart" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]

    > Nozal is extremer than a non-favorite. He was a nobody. Guys like Giovanetti, Caritoux.... well at
    > least they had been visible in mountain stages previously.

    Nozal had already shown some climbing ability in Spanish one week races and in this year
    Deutschland Tour

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/?id=2002/may02/castillaleon02/castillaleon024
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/?id=2002/may02/asturias02/asturias024

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/road.php?id=road/2003/jun03/tourofgermany03/tourofgermany035

    His first GT, Tour'92, wasn't bad either. I even considered him a long shot for the podium in last
    Tour. These days, the usual comparison in Spain is with Indurain in 1990 TdF. Lack of winning
    mentality seems to be his main con.

    Jenko

    --
    Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
     
  15. Crank Yanker

    Crank Yanker Guest

    > Nozal had already shown some climbing ability in Spanish one week races and in this year
    > Deutschland Tour

    But he is primarily known as a time trialist, right? I know I've seen his name in the results in the
    past, and thought, "damn, ONCE has another young good time trialist on their squad."

    Still, even within ONCE I would think Azevedo, Jaksche, Serrano, Hruska would have all been expected
    to do better than Nozal?
     
  16. Fred Marx

    Fred Marx Guest

    Van Hoorebeeck Bart wrote:
    > Those 'killer stages' have just one serious climb at the end.

    I suppose the 12 km uphill ITT stage 20 dosen't count them?
     
  17. Jenko

    Jenko Guest

    "Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote >
    >
    > Still, even within ONCE I would think Azevedo, Jaksche, Serrano, Hruska would have all been
    > expected to do better than Nozal?

    But those you mention have already reached their peak. Nozal is 26 now, and still progressing. As an
    amateur, he was one of the most dominant and promising riders in Spain, albeit he weighed too much
    back then. Since he turned pro, he has been slowly but steadily improving. Three years ago he was a
    nobody; next year, he became a good roleour; in 2002 he made his debut in a GT, and did fine both in
    TTs and hills. Sure, his Vuelta performance is surprising everyone, but I knew that he has a Top 10
    in his legs.

    Jenko

    --
    Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
     
  18. Crank Yanker

    Crank Yanker Guest

    Fred Marx <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > Van Hoorebeeck Bart wrote:
    > > Those 'killer stages' have just one serious climb at the end.
    >
    > I suppose the 12 km uphill ITT stage 20 dosen't count them

    Probably not, there appears to be only one short steep section that occurs in the first couple
    of kms and then fairly shallow (average only 5.8 %) even flat and slightly downhill in the
    middle briefly.
     
  19. Davide Tosi

    Davide Tosi Guest

    Van Hoorebeeck Bart <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Nozal is extremer than a non-favorite. He was a nobody. Guys like Giovanetti, Caritoux.... well at
    >least they had been visible in mountain stages previously.

    More, Giovannetti was an olympic champion in the TTT and he was renowned as a top rider
    against time.
     
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