Orange P7 2001 upgrade or new bike ?

[swebb99]

Hi,

I'm getting back into biking again after an accident a few years back.
My old bike is an Orange P7 (2001 I think??)
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/swebb99/CoventryBikeRide/photo#5061456063790700578
I like it but compaired to some of the new kit I see it looks, well
dated.

I'm wondering if I would be better upgrading it or selling it on and
getting something new. Its got a great steal frame and I find it nice
to ride however the front suspension is tired and it has no disc
brakes, but it has lugs for them.

I recently read a review for the new P7 and they thought it was great,
the thing that struck me was it still had a steal frame like mine but
with a different geometry. They review seemed the think the frame was
great. This is what got me thinking about upgrading rather than
changing.

I'm planning on using it mainly for general riding, light off road
work and now and again some heaver stuff with steep hill work. Nothing
mad where I would need full suspension.

Any comments gratefully received.

Thanks

Steve

 

[Paul Boyd]

On 15/03/2008 15:56, swebb99 said,

> I'm wondering if I would be better upgrading it or selling it on and
> getting something new. Its got a great steal frame and I find it nice
> to ride however the front suspension is tired and it has no disc
> brakes, but it has lugs for them.

My MTB is a 2007 P7, and I love it! If you like yours, then I think it
will be well worth upgrading it. The frame itself is pretty much
timeless, and they always do seem to come out well in reviews. Not
everyone likes steel frames, but having ridden both aluminium and steel
hardtails, I know which I prefer.

If the forks are original, then they could really do with replacing. I
have RockShox Revelations on mine, but you'll need to confirm the travel
that your frame is intended for otherwise you can mess with the geometry
to its detriment. As you have the disc brake mountings, it will be well
worth fitting disc brakes for all sorts of reasons. This is one of
those situations where if you ask 10 people which is best, you will get
12 different responses, but FWIW I have Shimano LX on the rear and XT on
the front (don't ask!). Avid Juicy 5s are supposed to be good, but I
haven't tried them myself.

If the drivetrain works, then leave it for now, but there's another
minefield!

> I recently read a review for the new P7 and they thought it was great,
> the thing that struck me was it still had a steal frame like mine but
> with a different geometry. They review seemed the think the frame was
> great. This is what got me thinking about upgrading rather than
> changing.

....upgrade...

> Any comments gratefully received.

....upgrade...



--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

 

[Rob Morley]

In article <af4bba47-c267-43e6-8b46-ef6dc7377ea3
@i29g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, swebb99
[email protected] says...

> I'm getting back into biking again after an accident a few years back.
> My old bike is an Orange P7 (2001 I think??)
> http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/swebb99/CoventryBikeRide/photo#5061456063790700578
> I like it but compaired to some of the new kit I see it looks, well
> dated.

That's your problem - think of it as 'classic' or 'retro' instead.
>
> I'm wondering if I would be better upgrading it or selling it on and
> getting something new. Its got a great steal frame and I find it nice
> to ride however the front suspension is tired and it has no disc
> brakes, but it has lugs for them.

Why do you think you want/need disc brakes?
>
> I recently read a review for the new P7 and they thought it was great,
> the thing that struck me was it still had a steal frame like mine but
> with a different geometry. They review seemed the think the frame was
> great. This is what got me thinking about upgrading rather than
> changing.
>
> I'm planning on using it mainly for general riding, light off road
> work and now and again some heaver stuff with steep hill work. Nothing
> mad where I would need full suspension.
>
I'd like to 'upgrade' my 1993-ish bike to rigid forks, but it's hard to
find nice ones with a one inch steerer these days - you wouldn't have
that problem.

 

[Duncan Smith]

>
> Why do you think you want/need disc brakes?
>

Why not? Disc brakes are awesome, less hassle in that once set-up
they stay in the 'sweet spot' for far longer, and (as far as I can
tell) provide more stopping power and finer controllability.

Regards,

Duncan

 

[Duncan Smith]

> the front (don't ask!). Avid Juicy 5s are supposed to be good, but I
> haven't tried them myself.
>

Juicy-7s are worth the extra cash for the quick pad adjustment dial.

Regards,

Duncan

 

[Simon Brooke]

Duncan Smith wrote:

>> Why do you think you want/need disc brakes?
>>
>
> Why not? Disc brakes are awesome, less hassle in that once set-up
> they stay in the 'sweet spot' for far longer, and (as far as I can
> tell) provide more stopping power and finer controllability.

All those, except more stopping power, I'd accept - but the benefits are
features of hydraulic brakes, not of disk brakes. V brakes provide plenty
enough stopping power to send you over the bars, so any more is completely
redundant. However, V brakes are a lot cheaper and a fair bit lighter. The
controlability problem is the friction of the cable in its sleeve, and
applies to cable operated disk brakes just as much as to V brakes.

Furthermore, V brakes, although they do need regular maintenance, are easy
to set up and to maintain, whereas some brands of disk brakes are
exceedingly difficult.

--
[email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
Just as defying the law of gravity through building aircraft requires
careful design and a lot of effort, so too does defying laws of
economics. It seems to be a deeply ingrained aspect of humanity to
forever strive to improve things, so unquestioning acceptance of a
free market system seems to me to be unnatural. ;; Charles Bryant

 

[Mark T]

Simon Brooke writtificated

> V brakes provide
> plenty enough stopping power to send you over the bars, so any more is
> completely redundant.

Not having to clear the rims of goo before they send you over the bars is a
big plus of disks.

> However, V brakes are a lot cheaper and a fair
> bit lighter. The controlability problem is the friction of the cable
> in its sleeve, and applies to cable operated disk brakes just as much
> as to V brakes.

Yeppity, the OP should avoid cable operated disk brakes - all the
disadvantages, not many of the advantages and no longer a great price
difference between them and hydraulics.

 

[Doki]

Simon Brooke wrote:
> Duncan Smith wrote:
>
>>> Why do you think you want/need disc brakes?
>>>
>>
>> Why not? Disc brakes are awesome, less hassle in that once set-up
>> they stay in the 'sweet spot' for far longer, and (as far as I can
>> tell) provide more stopping power and finer controllability.
>
> All those, except more stopping power, I'd accept - but the benefits
> are features of hydraulic brakes, not of disk brakes. V brakes
> provide plenty enough stopping power to send you over the bars, so
> any more is completely redundant. However, V brakes are a lot cheaper
> and a fair bit lighter. The controlability problem is the friction of
> the cable in its sleeve, and applies to cable operated disk brakes
> just as much as to V brakes.
>
> Furthermore, V brakes, although they do need regular maintenance, are
> easy to set up and to maintain, whereas some brands of disk brakes are
> exceedingly difficult.

I went through a set of pads every time I went riding when I had V-brakes
and it was muddy. I'd also be swapping cables pretty often. My discs have
had very little done to them in comparision.

 

[swebb99]

On 16 Mar, 08:36, "Doki" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Simon Brooke wrote:
> > Duncan Smith wrote:
>
> >>> Why do you think you want/need disc brakes?
>
> >> Why not? Disc brakes are awesome, less hassle in that once set-up
> >> they stay in the 'sweet spot' for far longer, and (as far as I can
> >> tell) provide more stopping power and finer controllability.
>
> > All those, except more stopping power, I'd accept - but the benefits
> > are features of hydraulic brakes, not of disk brakes. V brakes
> > provide plenty enough stopping power to send you over the bars, so
> > any more is completely redundant. However, V brakes are a lot cheaper
> > and a fair bit lighter. The controlability problem is the friction of
> > the cable in its sleeve, and applies to cable operated disk brakes
> > just as much as to V brakes.
>
> > Furthermore, V brakes, although they do need regular maintenance, are
> > easy to set up and to maintain, whereas some brands of disk brakes are
> > exceedingly difficult.
>
> I went through a set of pads every time I went riding when I had V-brakes
> and it was muddy. I'd also be swapping cables pretty often. My discs have
> had very little done to them in comparision.

Thanks for the replies guys. Didn't realise it would cause so much
debate

It sounds like hydrolic disk brakes are probably the way to go, I
always seem to end up in 3" of mud at some point !

The forks I guess I just need to modern good quality ones that match
the frame geometry.

One guy was telling me there is a bit of a market for original bikes
like the P7 and I could get money for it on ebay but I've not seen any
proof of that. He said it would pay for a reasonable modern bike, any
views ? Seems a little unlikely to me.

Steve

 

[Paul Boyd]

On 17/03/2008 15:40, swebb99 said,

> One guy was telling me there is a bit of a market for original bikes
> like the P7 and I could get money for it on ebay but I've not seen any
> proof of that. He said it would pay for a reasonable modern bike, any
> views ? Seems a little unlikely to me.

I've not seen Orange P7s go for anything special on eBay, so I don't
think selling it would go far towards a more modern bike. Incidentally,
the 2001 P7 is hardly an old bike! Given some new forks and decent
brakes it will still hold its own amongst newer stuff.

Now if anyone has an Overbury's Pioneer, they're serious money! I
bought one once in the mid-late 1980s but some low-life nicked it.
Lovely bike for its time, and the frame was made to order with whatever
braze-ons and paint finish I wanted.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

 

[Mark T]

swebb99 writtificated

> One guy was telling me there is a bit of a market for original bikes
> like the P7 and I could get money for it on ebay but I've not seen any
> proof of that. He said it would pay for a reasonable modern bike, any
> views ? Seems a little unlikely to me.

It's true that they hold their value better than alloy framed bikes. You
can search ebay for the results of past auctions to give you an idea of
prices.

 

[swebb99]

On 17 Mar, 16:33, Mark T
<pleasegivegenerously@warmail*turn_up_the_heat_to_reply*.com.invalid>
wrote:
> swebb99 writtificated
>
> > One guy was telling me there is a bit of a market for original bikes
> > like the P7 and I could get money for it on ebay but I've not seen any
> > proof of that. He said it would pay for a reasonable modern bike, any
> > views ? Seems a little unlikely to me.
>
> It's true that they hold their value better than alloy framed bikes.  You
> can search ebay for the results of past auctions to give you an idea of
> prices.

Oh didn't realize you can search for past auction prices !

 

[Roger Merriman]

swebb99 <[email protected]> wrote:

> On 16 Mar, 08:36, "Doki" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Simon Brooke wrote:
> > > Duncan Smith wrote:
> >
> > >>> Why do you think you want/need disc brakes?
> >
> > >> Why not? Disc brakes are awesome, less hassle in that once set-up
> > >> they stay in the 'sweet spot' for far longer, and (as far as I can
> > >> tell) provide more stopping power and finer controllability.
> >
> > > All those, except more stopping power, I'd accept - but the benefits
> > > are features of hydraulic brakes, not of disk brakes. V brakes
> > > provide plenty enough stopping power to send you over the bars, so
> > > any more is completely redundant. However, V brakes are a lot cheaper
> > > and a fair bit lighter. The controlability problem is the friction of
> > > the cable in its sleeve, and applies to cable operated disk brakes
> > > just as much as to V brakes.
> >
> > > Furthermore, V brakes, although they do need regular maintenance, are
> > > easy to set up and to maintain, whereas some brands of disk brakes are
> > > exceedingly difficult.
> >
> > I went through a set of pads every time I went riding when I had V-brakes
> > and it was muddy. I'd also be swapping cables pretty often. My discs have
> > had very little done to them in comparision.
>
> Thanks for the replies guys. Didn't realise it would cause so much
> debate
>
> It sounds like hydrolic disk brakes are probably the way to go, I
> always seem to end up in 3" of mud at some point !

one option if your a mud plugger could be some new tires?
>
> The forks I guess I just need to modern good quality ones that match
> the frame geometry.
>
> One guy was telling me there is a bit of a market for original bikes
> like the P7 and I could get money for it on ebay but I've not seen any
> proof of that. He said it would pay for a reasonable modern bike, any
> views ? Seems a little unlikely to me.
>
> Steve

roger
--
www.rogermerriman.com

 

[Mark T]

swebb99 writtificated

> Oh didn't realize you can search for past auction prices !

It's called 'completed listings' and tucked down with the other search
options on the left hand side.

 

[swebb99]

On 17 Mar, 19:53, Mark T
<pleasegivegenerously@warmail*turn_up_the_heat_to_reply*.com.invalid>
wrote:
> swebb99 writtificated
>
> > Oh didn't realize you can search for past auction prices !
>
> It's called 'completed listings' and tucked down with the other search
> options on the left hand side.

Yep found it, cheers That will be useful in future.