Ot-AOL quoting 'style'

Quoted message said:

From: "B i l l S o r n s o n"

Quoted message said:

That's because he didn't QUOTE anything.

Not entirely.

Tom Paterson said:

Quoted message said:

From: "B i l l S o r n s o n"

Quoted message said:

That's because he didn't QUOTE anything.

Not entirely.

Look again.

Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email hidden]> wrote:
Tim:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'll admit I don't understand your attitude. People have been asking
you to change your posting style- for years- so that they can more
easily read what you have to say. Seems to me that's a compliment to
you.

It hasn't been 'for years'

It's getting on for it; the first request I can find was in June 2003.

Quoted message said:

I'll change it, tell me how Tim...but as I stated, the 5 examples of quoting
I received were just as I typed them with a bit of <BR> on them,

But don't you notice how your quotes have paired angle brackets at the
start and end - or worse yet, where you've done post facto editing, only
one of those pairs (the post I am replying to here, for example, has only
the leading pair rendering it difficult to distinguish your text from
Tim's) - whereas most other people's prepends a single angle bracket to
each line?

Quoted message said:

Help me quote so that you can easily read it but I think it's not nearly as
problematic as you and David say.

It is a particular nuisance in a case like this one where I must manually
reformat the portion of Tim's misquoted article I want to retain; I will
not post a mangled article except for the specific purpose of illustrating
mangled quoting.
--
David Damerell <[email hidden]> flcl?

Quoted message said:

From: "B i l l S o r n s o n"

(B.S. wrote):

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That's because he didn't QUOTE anything.

(I answered):

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not entirely.

(B.S. rejoined):

Quoted message said:

Look again.

Looked. Paragraphing (hard returns), not "quoting" per se, is what I see.. The
post I referred to had two paragraphs IMS. I might be using the same "post
response" box Vecchio is, since I'm on AOL 5.0. Assuming my stuff isn't run
together. But then, I don't know what you see on your screen. I see >'s on the
left, numbered according to layers. I put the "B.S. answered" (stuff in
parentheses) in by hand while pulling weeds, so to speak. Takes extra time.

Um, I'm a lot more interested in reading what Mr. Chisholm has to say than
complaining about the form. FWIW. --TP

Tim McNamara <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Your posts would be eminently more readable if you were using normal
Usenet posting styles rather than AOL's dysfunctional one, which
looks to be both weird and HTML-based (given the <BR><BR> tags that
follow every block of quoted text in your posts).

Trivially. Trivially more readable, not eminently.

Never bothered me none.

dkl

Douglas Landau said:

Tim McNamara <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Your posts would be eminently more readable if you were using normal
Usenet posting styles rather than AOL's dysfunctional one, which
looks to be both weird and HTML-based (given the <BR><BR> tags that
follow every block of quoted text in your posts).

Trivially. Trivially more readable, not eminently.

I think "eminently" is an apt word considering cases like the following:

,----[fictitious post from Peter]
|
| person A Writes-<< some text from person A some more text from person A even
| more text from person A yet more text from person A.
|
| Another paragraph from person A more of the paragraph from person A even
| more of the paragraph from person A etc.
|
| Response from Peter more of the response from Peter and so forth and so
| on.
|
`----

In examples like this it's impossible to tell except by deduction from
reading the context who said what.

This can be difficult to interpret for anybody, but it's particularly
annoying for those people who use nice newsreader features such as
rendering quoted text in different colours for different posters.

Although I would never deliberately stop reading someone's articles for
reasons such as this, I really appreciate it when posters take the trouble
to make their work more pleasant to read.

--
Benjamin Lewis

Although the moon is smaller than the earth, it is farther away.

(Qui si parla Campagnolo ) said:

I'll admit I don't understand your attitude. People have been asking
you to change your posting style- for years- so that they can more
easily read what you have to say. Seems to me that's a compliment to
you.

It hasn't been 'for years' and as I asked, I got no information nor could I
find anything in all the preferences and settings pages on the versiion(version
for Mac OX10).

Errr, Pete, you seem to be having a dual personality episode above
(directly quoting from your reply). Now because I happen to recognize
the first part as coming from someone else's post, I can figure it
out. However, that's not usually the case, certainly not for most
people. Trying to make sense of what appears to be a post of you
answering your own questions is going to be confusing at best.

FWIW...

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $695 ti frame

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

Tim-<< When someone
doesn't follow those standards reasonably closely, it makes things
more difficult for others. I'm sad to see that you seem to think
that's a good thing, when you could change this in a matter of seconds
and frankly no skin off your nose.

I'll admit I don't understand your attitude. People have been asking
you to change your posting style- for years- so that they can more
easily read what you have to say. Seems to me that's a compliment to
you.

It hasn't been 'for years' and as I asked, I got no information nor could I
find anything in all the preferences and settings pages on the versiion(version
for Mac OX10).

I'll change it, tell me how Tim...but as I stated, the 5 examples of quoting I
received were just as I typed them with a bit of <BR> on them, something I saw
on your post on the NG as well.

Help me quote so that you can easily read it but I think it's not nearly as
problematic as you and David say.

Peter,

Look at this post of yours in plain text on Google:
<http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20041115085907.11818.00000628%40mb-m16.aol.com&output=gplain>.

It is not possible to differentiate between your new text and the text
of Tim McNamara that you quoted. That IS a problem.

--
Tom Sherman

(Qui si parla Campagnolo ) said:

Tim-<< Your posts would be eminently more readable if you were using
normal Usenet posting styles rather than AOL's dysfunctional one,
which looks to be both weird and HTML-based (given the >><BR><BR>

Copy one of mine and send it to me via direct email...I gotta see
what you are talking about.

As I stated, i have wandered all artound all the preferences of NG
and WWW and see nothing that refers to 'internet sytrle posting'. If
it's there, HELP ME OUT TIM!!!

Not to ingore this, as we've already been discussing this back-channel
(I'll mail forward a copy of your original post to you, although I
have no idea how the AOL software will render it. You could try
looking at it in TextEdit to see it as plain text, the way most Usenet
users would see it).

The end result thus far is that I can't find anything via Google that
will show how to fix quoting in your newsreader. AOL seems to have
screwed up the latest version they released for OS X. It's a bummer,
because it makes AOL/OS X users look bad.

Quoted message said:

I'm not gonna change newsrearders, AOL is just too easy for this
computer idiot.

I understand your point.

Tom Paterson said:

Quoted message said:

From: "B i l l S o r n s o n"

(B.S. wrote):

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> That's because he didn't QUOTE anything.

(I answered):

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not entirely.

(B.S. rejoined):

Quoted message said:

Look again.

Looked. Paragraphing (hard returns), not "quoting" per se, is what I
see.. The post I referred to had two paragraphs IMS. I might be using
the same "post response" box Vecchio is, since I'm on AOL 5.0.
Assuming my stuff isn't run together. But then, I don't know what you
see on your screen. I see >'s on the left, numbered according to
layers. I put the "B.S. answered" (stuff in parentheses) in by hand
while pulling weeds, so to speak. Takes extra time.

Um, I'm a lot more interested in reading what Mr. Chisholm has to say
than complaining about the form. FWIW. --TP

Not to belabor this (too late for THAT), but you commented that a post from
Peter looked normal (or "easy to read", IIRC). I commented that it was
because he hadn't quoted anyone in said post (which he hadn't). I didn't
understand your reply "not entirely", and still don't.

(He WAS replying to Carl, but didn't quote a single Fogelism. Thus the
clean format.)

Belaboredly Yours,
--
BS (no, really)

On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 07:19:00 GMT, "B i l l S o r n s o n"
<[email hidden]> wrote:

[snip]

Quoted message said:

(He WAS replying to Carl, but didn't quote a single Fogelism. Thus the
clean format.)

Dear Bill,

From which we may deduce that the secret to a clean internet
format is . . .

[snip]

Quoted message said:

From: "B i l l S o r n s o n"

Quoted message said:

I didn't
understand your reply "not entirely", and still don't.

No quotes, but it also looked to me as though he put at least one hard return
in there to start a new paragraph. ("Manual" quoting, courtesy AwOL.)

IOW, paragraph breaks and new lines are started with the Return key. There was
a new paragraph start in Vecchio's post, plus an extra return key stroke was
made to put an empty line between paragraphs, which at least at this screen
makes things easy to read.

Quoted message said:

I didn't
understand your reply (snip)

"You keep asking, I'll keep trying to explain what I think I mean".

Quoted message said:

Belaboredly Yours,

Not at all. --TP

From carlfogel:

Quoted message said:

From which we may deduce that the secret to a clean internet
format is . . .

Quoted message said:

[snip]

Quotes from Twain. --TP

David writes-"<< It is a particular nuisance in a case like this one where I
must manually
reformat the portion of Tim's misquoted article I want to retain; I will
not post a mangled article except for the specific purpose of illustrating
mangled quoting. >><BR><BR>

I answer-" well we have seen that AOL for OSX is not possible to change so I
will add things like quotation marks and I said, you said type stuff to give
one less thing to talk about...now BACK to Bies for me"

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 07:19:00 GMT, "B i l l S o r n s o n"
<[email hidden]> wrote:

[snip]

Quoted message said:

(He WAS replying to Carl, but didn't quote a single Fogelism. Thus
the clean format.)

Dear Bill,

From which we may deduce that the secret to a clean internet
format is . . .

[snip]

Dear Carl,

Nice.
--
BS (no, really)

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

David said:

It is a particular nuisance in a case like this one where I
must manually reformat the portion of Tim's misquoted article I want to
retain; I will not post a mangled article except for the specific purpose
of illustrating mangled quoting.

well we have seen that AOL for OSX is not possible to change so I
will add things like quotation marks

If you're willing to add stuff manually, why not add stuff to quote
conventionally rather than switching to another mangled style?
--
David Damerell <[email hidden]> flcl?

Tom Paterson said:

Quoted message said:

From: "B i l l S o r n s o n"

Quoted message said:

I didn't
understand your reply "not entirely", and still don't.

No quotes, but it also looked to me as though he put at least one hard
return in there to start a new paragraph. ("Manual" quoting, courtesy
AwOL.)

IOW, paragraph breaks and new lines are started with the Return
key. There was a new paragraph start in Vecchio's post, plus an extra
return key stroke was made to put an empty line between paragraphs, which
at least at this screen makes things easy to read.

What do paragraph breaks have to do with quoting? They make things look
nicer, yes, but this is a different issue.

--
Benjamin Lewis

Politics is the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow, next
week, next month and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to
explain why it didn't happen.
-- Winston Churchill

Quoted message said:

From: Benjamin Lewis>Standard Time
Message-id:<[email hidden]>>>Tom Paterson wrote:>>>> From: "B

i l l S o r n s o n">>>>>I didn't>>> understand your reply "not entirely", and
still don't.>>>>No quotes, but it also looked to me as though he put at least
one hard>>return in there to start a new paragraph. ("Manual" quoting, courtesy

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

AwOL.)>>>>IOW, paragraph breaks and new lines are started with the

Return>>key.There was a new paragraph start in Vecchio's post, plus an extra >>
return key stroke was made to put an empty line between paragraphs, which

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

at least at this screen makes things easy to read.>>What do paragraph breaks

have to do with quoting? They make things look >nicer, yes, but this is a
different issue.>>-->Benjamin Lewis>

Quoted message said:

Politics is the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow,

next>week, next month and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to

Quoted message said:

explain why it didn't happen. >-- Winston Churchill>>>

Or, I could have put paragraphs in as usual, which would have made it easier to
see which quotes applied where and thus who was saying what and where sigs
start and end, etc. I did cheat a little, but only for effect. --TP

Tom Paterson said:

Or, I could have put paragraphs in as usual, which would have made it
easier to see which quotes applied where and thus who was saying what and
where sigs start and end, etc. I did cheat a little, but only for effect.

Yes, but the mere use of paragraphs doesn't mean there is any "quoting"
occurring.

--
Benjamin Lewis

Politics is the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow, next
week, next month and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to
explain why it didn't happen.
-- Winston Churchill

Quoted message said:

From: Benjamin Lewis

Quoted message said:

Yes, but the mere use of paragraphs doesn't mean there is any "quoting"
occurring.

Hmmm, did I say that? Not what I meant, if so. Nope, paragraphing and spacing
just gives quotes and sigs, intros, whatever their own little space on the
screen, so content is easier to follow. That's what Vecchio did in that certain
post, with no quoting, which will now pass from memory, andbespokennomoreof, I
hope. --TP