Overtraining while staying aerobic?

Discussion in 'Cycling Training' started by ltsop, Nov 21, 2002.

  1. ltsop

    ltsop New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2002
    Messages:
    53
    Likes Received:
    0
    Is it possible to overtrain while only doing aerobic training? Or do things like volume of training (at whatever intensity) also matter?<br /><br />
     
    Tags:


  2. EPO

    EPO New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2002
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    0
    YES, you can overtrain just doing aerobic training. This can happen if your body is not used to the volume and frequency of the volume. It is important to build the volume of training slowly, counts especialy for base training. Never just start with big volume, the whole purpose of earobic is to make your body used to distance and volume. The only way you can effectively get your body used to it is by building it up. While building it up you must still be on the lookout for signes of overtaining like resting heart rate etc.
     
  3. Steve Junior

    Steve Junior New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2002
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    0
    everyone says to keep an eye on ur restin hr..but i cannot find a good way of finding this...how does everyone else record their resting hr?<br />thanx<br />steve
     
  4. 2LAP

    2LAP New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    1,265
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes you can overtrain by doing aerobic work. I have been looking for a good definition of overtraining for a while now and what I have found a number of times is....<br /><br />'a temporary imbalance between training and recovery' <br /><br />this is usualy diagnosed due to the presence of a number of symproms from a list of about 30 symptoms including physiological and psychological symptoms. As the 'imbalance' increases the symptoms become more serious and 'less temporary'.<br /><br />Steve Junior, check your pulse at your wrist or neck (neck is perhaps easiest). Take it first thing in the morning, if you sit on the edge of the bed (extra physical activity can raise it more), relax, find your pulse and count it for 15 seconds. Multiply the pulse you have counted by 4. This gives you the number of beats per minute!<br /><br />The other easy way is to sit up in bed and put a heart rate monitor on if you have one. You should be looking for your heart rate to increase or decrease by 10 beats per minute as a warning of poor recovery or poor health!
     
  5. maarten

    maarten New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2002
    Messages:
    294
    Likes Received:
    0
    To chek your heart rate:<br /><br />The finger to the wrist or neck method isn't really accurate because you got 4beats/a minute intervals you, would better take 30sec interval or one minute and repeat it 2 or 3 times to elliminate coincidence total procedure will still take you less than 5 minutes. Things to tink of Do it first thing in the morning when you are still lying in your bed, get a nice big clock in sight of your bed(much easier than a watch because you still gotta feel the polse with your hands. <br /><br /><br />BETTER HR MONITOR<br /><br />Put it within reach beside your bed (together with a glass of wather when you need to wetten the electrodes to get a decent reading), put it on wait for 2 minutes and then look at how much beats/min you have.<br /><br />When you have a heart rate monito with memory you can try to wear it sometimes when you sleep this gives you a rel accurate reading.<br /><br /><br />Heart rate is personl get to know your body buth it will take a wile.<br /><br />I use to go 5 beats up first day when i 'm sick and another 5 the next day. hard race costs me 10 beats the next day. <br />When I am top i have 40-45 base rate out of season 55.<br />This is just an example some people react harder/slower number are personal (get to know your own intervals) <br /><br />After a time you will get to know your heart and so keep track of your performance numbers are strictly personal<br />
     
  6. 2LAP

    2LAP New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    1,265
    Likes Received:
    0
    Have not heard that taking 15 second intervals and multiplying by 4 wasn't very good, this is a technique used by doctors and hospitals due to ease. To add to Maarten's advice, record the HR you get in a table or even better graphicaly so that you can see trends in resting heart rate.
     
  7. ric_stern/RST

    ric_stern/RST New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2002
    Messages:
    3,866
    Likes Received:
    1
    Overtraining is a long-term unexplained decrease in performance, unlike for, e.g., feeling tired after a race or hard session for several+ days, which is generally referred to as overreaching and is an important and needed aspect of periodised training.<br /><br />Currently, there's no markers of overtraining that can be identified within a laboratory. Scientists have tried to find markers by doing mood checks, blood bio-chemistry, and HR etc.<br /><br />Recovery from overtraining can take from several week, to months to year+. if you recover within a few days, it was overreaching!<br /><br />some studies have looked at massive increases in training loads (e.g. more than double your normal training amount) and overtraining hasn't been induced, so it may well also be caused by other stressors in addition, such as family, school, and work problems.<br /><br />I *think* i've also seen the problem referred to in conjunction with chronic glycogen depletion -- which means that people aren't eating enough carbos to support their training loads.<br /><br />There's also research suggesting two types of overtraining, where in one type, resting HR increases, and in the other resting HR decreases, so you have to be aware of changes in both direction.<br /><br />Perhaps, the best advice is to gradually increase your training, eat well, and have recovery weeks scheduled on a regular basis. Having a coach should help to, as they'll be able to objectively review the training logs you keep.<br /><br />Ric
     
  8. maarten

    maarten New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2002
    Messages:
    294
    Likes Received:
    0
    [quote author=2LAP link=board=19;threadid=2683;start=0#23006 date=1038053175]<br />Have not heard that taking 15 second intervals and multiplying by 4 wasn't very good, this is a technique used by doctors and hospitals due to ease. To add to Maarten's advice, record the HR you get in a table or even better graphicaly so that you can see trends in resting heart rate.<br />[/quote]<br /><br />when you have 15 seconds gaps go by 4 the methods is good for a quick look not for a day to day follow up. Withe the 15 sec method small variations aren't seen <br /><br />you can go from 37 to43 or from 39 to 40 you have the same you got one beep more but when hou go up 6 beats you have a problem with 39to 40 thers nothing to worry about. when you miss a second and only mesure 14 seconds you miss a beep and you get by example 40 in stead of 44 as result which is a considerable error.<br /><br />You easily create 4-8 besats a minute erros. Most people tend to show differences of around 5-10 showing overtraing or illness. So with the 15 sec method it is easy to falsy think your ok or ill.<br /><br />Often well trained people get rest heart rates of between 30 and 45 beats a minute which means only 9- 13% increases will be noticed. Therfore use at least 30 and preferably 60 sec intervals and when you have a muserement which is out off lin dubble check.
     
  9. 2LAP

    2LAP New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    1,265
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ric, these two types are sympathetic and parasympathetic overtraining.<br /><br />Doctors can look at some markers in the blood to determine chronic overtraining (e.g. hormone profiles, chatecholamine levels, etc.). However most diagnososis are subjective and made on the basis of the athletes reports only!
     
  10. tracker

    tracker New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2002
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi there !<br /><br />Yes, overtraining during aerobic work is possible and very common in endurance sport. As allready referred, overtraining is a disbalance of recovery and training and is mediated, (that is one of multiple assumptions in this field) by a disbalance between the autonomous and the somatic nerval system. For non-doctors: The body has, in addition to the nervous system that controls movement etc., another nerval system, that acts without beeing influenced by our will. (Organ functions etc) It has been shown, that the balance between those two systems is highly disturbed in overtraining states.<br />You might be able to estimate this balance through the &quot;heart rate variability&quot;. That is a new marker that is somehow related to the autonomous nerval system. Studies are on the way...<br />@2Lap: There is no laboratory marker that has shown any reliable correlation with overtraining.
     
  11. 2LAP

    2LAP New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    1,265
    Likes Received:
    0
    Sorry Tracker, just had a PM from Ric. To clarify my last post, I agree with you there are no single markers that can be used to diagnose overtraining (and that is why overtraining diagnosis is usualy based on reported symptoms). However there are a number of markers that can give an insight into overtraining and perhaps be used to help diagnosis. Hope this abstract helps Ric. There are lots of interesting lines of research into markers of overtraining and I will remain optermistic.<br /><br />Diagnosis of overtraining: what tools do we have?. [Review] [63 refs]<br /><br />Sports Medicine. 32(2):95-102, 2002.<br /><br />Abstract<br />The multitude of publications regarding overtraining syndrome (OTS or 'staleness') or the short-term 'over-reaching' and the severity of consequences for the athlete are in sharp contrast with the limited availability of valid diagnostic tools. Ergometric tests may reveal a decrement in sport-specific performance if they are maximal tests until exhaustion. Overtrained athletes usually present an impaired anaerobic lactacid performance and a reduced time-to-exhaustion in standardised high-intensity endurance exercise accompanied by a small decrease in the maximum heart rate. Lactate levels are also slightly lowered during submaximal performance and this results in a slightly increased anaerobic threshold. A reduced respiratory exchange ratio during exercise still deserves further investigation. A deterioration of the mood state and typical subjective complaints ('heavy legs', sleep disorders) represent sensitive markers, however, they may be manipulated. Although measurements at rest of selected blood markers such as urea, uric acid, ammonia, enzymes (creatine kinase activity) or hormones including the ratio between (free) serum testosterone and cortisol, may serve to reveal circumstances which, for the long term, impair the exercise performance, they are not useful in the diagnosis of established OTS. The nocturnal urinary catecholamine excretion and the decrease in the maximum exercise-induced rise in pituitary hormones, especially adrenocorticotropic hormone and growth hormone, and, to a lesser degree, in cortisol and free plasma catecholamines, often provide interesting diagnostic information, but hormone measurements are less suitable in practical application. From a critical review of the existing overtraining research it must be concluded that there has been little improvement in recent years in the tools available for the diagnosis of OTS.
     
Loading...
Loading...