Paris Roubaix picks

[Drongo]

Thanks for looking this up. Interesting.

I was curious enough to write to Hed, the maker of the Hed Stinger carbon rim that Hincapie was riding on Sunday. I asked them to comment on the "High Profile High Road Rim Failure." Andy from Hed wrote back to say that George suffered a puncture on his rear wheel (Hed Stinger) and swapped it out for another wheel. (Non Stinger, but I don't know type or brand of wheel.) That wheel then suffered a broken spoke and George had to change again.

The flat and mechanical back to back would explain why he couldn't catch back on. Hed also pointed out that Bernhard Eisel completed the whole Paris Roubaix on the Hed Stingers w/ no issues.

Likewise, Maaskant finished 4th with carbon wheels, but big Maggie's wheel failed. If only half of a team's riders finish because their wheels fail, that is not good enough. I'm just not sure of the proportions. If Hincapie's first replacement wheel was a 32-spoke Ambrosio rim Roubaix special, then maybe they're not a panacea after all. If it was another carbon 20-spoke wonder-wheel, the accusations stand.

So, while I still personally disagree with the choice of those rims for Paris-Roubaix, perhaps there is more to the Hincapie story.

True.

I wonder what was the wheel choice for Hincapie's teammate, Servais Knaven. He spent many years riding for Patrick Lefevre's teams and he won Paris-Roubaix in 2001, riding a Merckx Team SC with some solidly built wheels.

Don't know the answer to that. The new version of the Team SC, the Premium, is still used by the Topsport Vlaanderen team. None of that carbon fibre stuff that Merckx puts his name to, even if costs a damned sight more.

 

[Powerful Pete]

Drongo, given the pave' at the Roubaix, no wheel is a panacea and can be relied upon 100%. Having said that, it seems logical to me that I would ride an Ambrosio 32 or 36 spoke rim in that kind of race with a super comfy tubular, rather than risk a CF wheel.

 

[whiteboytrash]

Jezus Christ if we start taking gospel from the marketing guy we're all doomed.

Here lies the problem with Hincapie; Mark Madiot said in this month's Cycle Sport that FDJ spend around 100,000 euros on equipment alone for Roubaix. Thats one race. Whereas Hincapie would be hemorrhaging that sort of cash on doping products 2-3 times a year. Hincapie's success (for lack of better term) came from doping not from spending money and time on his equipment... now thats he's given up the dope he doesn't know the real and true value of cycling..... George an open letter you: Preparation is not doping and hard work and planning win races. Leave cycling now and leaves us all alone. You're a fool.

WBT out.

I was curious enough to write to Hed, the maker of the Hed Stinger carbon rim that Hincapie was riding on Sunday. I asked them to comment on the "High Profile High Road Rim Failure." Andy from Hed wrote back to say that George suffered a puncture on his rear wheel (Hed Stinger) and swapped it out for another wheel. (Non Stinger, but I don't know type or brand of wheel.) That wheel then suffered a broken spoke and George had to change again.

The flat and mechanical back to back would explain why he couldn't catch back on. Hed also pointed out that Bernhard Eisel completed the whole Paris Roubaix on the Hed Stingers w/ no issues.

So, while I still personally disagree with the choice of those rims for Paris-Roubaix, perhaps there is more to the Hincapie story. I wonder what was the wheel choice for Hincapie's teammate, Servais Knaven. He spent many years riding for Patrick Lefevre's teams and he won Paris-Roubaix in 2001, riding a Merckx Team SC with some solidly built wheels.

 

[TheDarkLord]

Likewise, Maaskant finished 4th with carbon wheels, but big Maggie's wheel failed. If only half of a team's riders finish because their wheels fail, that is not good enough. I'm just not sure of the proportions. If Hincapie's first replacement wheel was a 32-spoke Ambrosio rim Roubaix special, then maybe they're not a panacea after all. If it was another carbon 20-spoke wonder-wheel, the accusations stand.

Yes. The question is what fraction of carbon wheels failed, and what fraction of the other wheels failed. At least from anecdotal small number statistics we have had so far, it doesn't seem that carbon wheels are reliable enough for the harsh conditions of this race.

 

[thoughtforfood]

Jezus Christ if we start taking gospel from the marketing guy we're all doomed.

Here lies the problem with Hincapie; Mark Madiot said in this month's Cycle Sport that FDJ spend around 100,000 euros on equipment alone for Roubaix. Thats one race. Whereas Hincapie would be hemorrhaging that sort of cash on doping products 2-3 times a year. Hincapie's success (for lack of better term) came from doping not from spending money and time on his equipment... now thats he's given up the dope he doesn't know the real and true value of cycling..... George an open letter you: Preparation is not doping and hard work and planning win races. Leave cycling now and leaves us all alone. You're a fool.

WBT out.

You are right about his doping, I will give you that WBT. However, you also hate him because he is from the US, and that just makes you a xenophobic asshole.

 

[classic1]

You can't win the race if you can't finish it. You are unlikely to win if you are pushing the envelope so far on your equipment there is a big chance it will fail. Deep dish carbon rims in Paris-Roubaix are stupid. Hincapies constant punctures and equipment failures in P-R aren't bad luck, they are dumb luck.

FWIW, Roger De Vlaeminck allegedly punctured only once in all the years he rode Paris-Roubaix.

 

[Anticyclone]

You can't win the race if you can't finish it. You are unlikely to win if you are pushing the envelope so far on your equipment there is a big chance it will fail.

But if you are unlikely to win using safer wheels then surely there is a justification for taking the risk?

How much time would the deep dish rims save you? I would imagine everyone using them knew they would be more likely to have some sort of mechanical but if they thought that the only way they could win was to take a chance then why shouldnt they? If they looked at the start list and thought safe wheels will get me a fifth place but the faster wheels could be the thing that gets me into the top three or wins then i can see why some would choose this way. Is it really that different from launching an all-out attack from a group when you know you dont really stand much of a chance of winning the sprint? Did anyone manage to make it to the finish with no problems with the deep dish rims?

 

[classic1]

Fragile wheels save you nothing if they fark up and you are left standing on the side of the road with your broken wheel in one hand and your limp snag in the other. In P-R reliability is everything.

Deep rims are less forgiving, they tend to chatter on rough surfaces, carbon generally doesn't take impact as well as metal, deep rims don't give as much as box section rims, the braking surfaces on carbon isnt as good as on Aluminium, they have less spokes so go out of true more when a spoke breaks. Reliability and reducing risk of mechancial failure is 10 times more important than any dubious speed gain from deep rims. Again, deep dish wheels are a stupid choice in P-R. Look what the top three were riding. It wasn't deep rims. And no one in a race like P-R looks at a start list and thinks deep rims are going to make the difference between 3rd and 5th.

 

[Bro Deal]

Maaskant's power output for P-R.

http://www.saris.com/athletes/CommentView,guid,38eca391-6ee9-4c55-9cc4-d5a189bc10c4.aspx

Maaskant's 272 Watts over 6:06
FLandis's stage 17: 281 Watts over 5:23

 

[thunder]

Maaskant's power output for P-R.

http://www.saris.com/athletes/CommentView,guid,38eca391-6ee9-4c55-9cc4-d5a189bc10c4.aspx

Maaskant's 272 Watts over 6:06
FLandis's stage 17: 281 Watts over 5:23

not normalised for generic weight tho?

MM is nearly 20% heavier

 

[italiano]

not normalised for generic weight tho?

MM is nearly 20% heavier

... 20%??...
maybe 10-15%
he sprinter - 76k..
other problem...no nonpedaling time...

 

[Crankyfeet]

If you read the comments below the diagrams... they smoothed out the graphs (averaged the power over slightly longer intervals than the power tap recorded I guess), which took away the zero power at zero cadence.

 

[whiteboytrash]

Maaskant's power output for P-R.

http://www.saris.com/athletes/CommentView,guid,38eca391-6ee9-4c55-9cc4-d5a189bc10c4.aspx

Maaskant's 272 Watts over 6:06
FLandis's stage 17: 281 Watts over 5:23

Could someone be kind enough to interpret this data for me ? Is this good for Maaskant or bad ? what is the relationship to Landis's ride ?