Originally Posted by SierraSlim .
[COLOR= #0000ff]Hi, Froze![/COLOR]
[COLOR= #0000ff]I'm going to tackle your questions one at a time to be sure I don't miss any. I'm sorry I'm being so confusing.[/COLOR]
[COLOR= #0000ff]The Cafe Express 8 is an odd duck here, it has 8 speeds in side the rear hub and that's all the gears you would have. This is ok if your not going to climb any steep grades with a load while your touring. I am not sure about the reliability of the Nexus 8 speed hub, someone else here might know. [/COLOR]It was my hubby who first suggested this bike. He liked that it had the hub, he liked the price, and pointed out that it didn't have drop-down bars, which I don't want. Also, he has had the Nexus 8 IGH on his bike for the past 4 or 5 years, and LOVES the thing. He brags about how he has never had to do a thing with it, how well it shifts, etc. He originally said that he didn't 'want to mess with a derailleur,' but is now saying he 'could learn to take care of it,' but I can tell he's not looking forward to it, lol. HE says that with the 3 gears up front, combined with the 8 in the rear, that that makes 24 gears, "most of which you would never use." I don't know if he's right about the 24 gears or not; your next paragraph seems to indicate that this one doesn't have the front 3 gears. This was the first bike I inquired about on here, I think, but nobody seemed to think much of it, which is when I started asking questions about what kind of bike I should get for my tour... and the floodgates opened. (And thanks for the link to the extra water-bottle thing!)
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[COLOR= #0000ff]The Cafe Latte comes with the second water bottle mounts, and it comes with a triple front set of gears for a total of 24 gears which would make it easier to pedal up steep grades while even loaded but it's not an internal geared hub like your wanting.[/COLOR] I added these bikes into the mix when somebody here I read on several forums that it was a far better bike than the Express 8, comparable to the others but with cheaper price. I was just trying to find out if y'all thought it was good, too, and which Motobecane was best for the money.
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[COLOR= #0000ff]I'm not sure how far you want to go into touring. Are you planning really long trips or little weekend ventures? I ask this because neither of those two bikes are suited for heavy loaded touring [/COLOR]. Since this-coming tour in June will be my very first, I'm not sure how far I want to go into it, either, lol. If i love it as much as I THINK I'm going to love it, then I will definitely take more tours. But here's the thing: I'm not sure my definition of tour and y'alls is the same. This tour is 5 days long, but it's with a group, with guides, Sag-wagon-supported, staying in motels/hotels/B&Bs at night. That sounds like a BLAST to me. I don't know whether or not I will ever want to do independent, take-all-your-camping-gear-and-cook-in-the-woods-no-matter-how-exhausted-and-sweaty-you-are-(and-forget-the-bath!)-type tours that require 100-pound panniers, because I've never done one... but my gut says those aren't my style. (My style could change; I NEVER thought I'd love cycling!!) But as tired and drained as biking makes me currently, I would guess that I'm probably always going to want someplace with a soft bed and hot bubblebath waiting at the end of the day. So the tours may be long, as in up to 1 or 2 weeks (is that long???), but they probably wouldn't be rough and ruggedy camping-at-night type tours. Does that help?
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[COLOR= #0000ff]That being said, if eyelets are what you use to fasten fenders to a bike, then I need eyelets, because I want fenders to fend off mud and water spray, etc., if that's what they do on a road bike. That's what I used them for on my cruisers, anyway, lol. [/COLOR]
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[COLOR= #0000ff]The Fairfax and the Ravenna are also not suited for touring it only has 28 spoked rims and you need to have 36. Both of these two are not internal geared hub bikes which is what you said you wanted. [/COLOR]The spoke requirement s the kind of information I don't know and am trying to find out, lol. I didn't even know bikes CAME with different numbers of spokes until I started asking questions here. When I said I was a total ignoramus about biking in my earlier posts, I wasn't kidding. I had never even BEEN in a bike ship until a couple weeks ago, and almost none of my friends bike -- though I'm hoping to change that! I know they don't have the IGH; we're having trouble finding bikes with one, and that's why I'm giving up and considering derailleurs.
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[COLOR= #0000ff]You're also, if I remember correctly, a tad overweight; yet you looking at bikes that are not suited for touring nor suited to carry your body weight, not alone adding another 50 pounds on top of your weight. [/COLOR]Thank you for saying I'm a 'tad' overweight. That's like saying the Pacific is a tad wet, LOL. You said I was looking at bikes not suited for touring nor suited to carry my body weight. I'm not sure what makes a bike suited for touring. I really thought that's what road bikes were for. Several people have suggested I buy a hybrid type bike, but I'm guessing that wouldn't be suitable, either, so now I'm really confused. Maybe, again, it's the definition of 'tour' that's the problem, since I'm not planning across-America and up-the-Alps tours, but am planning at this point to take week-long beginner's easy-terrain, max of 40 miles a day on good roads or bike paths tours. Does that make a difference?
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[COLOR= #0000ff]All the bikes you came up with are made for right around 180 to 200 pounds total, and I wouldn't trust that much weight on 28 spoked rims, but some do ride with that few at those weights. All touring specific bikes are built with rims that have at least 36 spokes to handle the weight. [/COLOR]Again, that's information I need and don't know where to find. I didn't see it in any of the specs on the bikes, which I'm trying to learn to read and understand. It says how many spokes they HAVE, but where do I learn how many they need according to what I weigh?
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[COLOR= #0000ff]All touring bikes today come with 24 gears not 8 speed internal hubs. That's not saying you can't tour on 8 speeds because you can but it will limit you to flat and rolling hills, and limit you to about 30 pounds of touring gear.[/COLOR] As I mentioned previously, Hubby said that with 8 gears in back hub and 3 in front, that would make 24 gears that should be plenty. He could very well be wrong, but I would be the last person to know that, lol. If I can tour on 8 speeds in flat and rolling hills, that would be WONDERFUL, because at this point that's all I'm planning. If I actually ever get skilled enough to want to tackle steep hills and difficult tours, I can undertake another search for the perfect bike -- and maybe by that time, if it ever comes, I won't be so ignorant about bikes. Like: where do I learn how many pounds of gear my bike can carry along with me?
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[COLOR= #000000]I hope when your going into a place like REI that your telling them what you want to use the bike for and how much gear you'll be hauling...hopefully a minimum wage retail employee will understand what that means in search of a bike for you. [/COLOR][COLOR= #0000ff] I TELL them I'm going to be doing beginner's flat-terrain bike tours on paved roads. (I didn't tell them anything about how much gear I'll haul, because they didn't ask and I have no idea, though I did tell them it was Sag-wagon-supported.) Whether they listen/understand or not, I have no idea. I suspect some of the younger ones look at my fat and think, "Yeah, like that's going to happen," not believing that old fat people can really change. The one at REI fitted me and encouraged me to buy Marin bikes because of the 3 I tried there, the Marin felt best to me when riding. The clerk at Bob's Bikes was a moron -- when I asked if the bike frame was aluminum buttted -- one of the things I've learned to look for, here -- he said, "I don't know. It's metal. I think it's aluminum." He had no idea what butted meant -- and wanted me to test-ride my bike INSIDE the store, dodging the customers, the store dog who wanted to play fetch, and the racks of cycling clothes and bikes. Maybe y'all could do that without falling over; I couldn't, and knew better.[/COLOR]
[COLOR= #0000ff]Anyway, Froze, I hope that clears up some of your confusion. Maybe what I want doesn't exist: A bike under $700 that has internal gear hubs in back plus gears in front, mustache handlebars, a suspension seat post, an adjustable stem, adjustable seat, tires with enough spokes for my weight, fenders, and components good enough that none of y'all snicker about the bike here, that can take me on easy beginner tours with no steep hills and no worry about speeds. And I DO want it to be pretty; who wants to ride an ugly bike?? I keep trying to find one and asking in the forum here if this one fits or that one fits the bill, and the opinions are so varied that I seem to be getting more confused. That's why I typed all the stuff trying to compare the 4 bikes of each brand; I was hoping there would be a clear consensus of, "This is the best of the bikes you listed" by at least a small majority of those who voted, and it would guide my decision. [/COLOR]
[COLOR= #0000ff]I'm sorry I've caused such confusion. I just wanted a good bike to get better riding on and take on really easy tours.[/COLOR]
[COLOR= #0000ff]Thanks for all your help![/COLOR]