Powertap - should I or shouldnt I?

[RidwarePhil]

I am considering investing in a PowerTap.

- I have been using HR based training for the last 3 years

- I purchased a polar S725 and power module last year and spent more time trying to get the power module to work correctly than training with it-

- The polar unit was fiddly to set up
- Didnt work on a trainer
- Kept dropping out during road rides
- Gave inconsistent power results

How much better is a PowerTap and will I spend as much time messing around trying to get it to work?

I am looking to buy second hand as I cant afford a new one but which model should I get? What should I look out for when buying?

Is the PT software any good or should I just et cycling peaks from the off?


I ride a great deal on the turbo due to work and family commitments and 2 wheels 1 for road and 1 for turbo with a turbo specific tyre. I have 2 bikes race and training with different wheels.

How does everyone else manage this situation? i.e. run the same tyre on turbo and road?

Do you bother with PowerTap on your race bike?

Sorry for so many questions ;-)

 

[grahamspringett]

I love my Powertap. I used HR training for years but have found training with power to be more efficient and easier. You spend less time worrying if you're in the right zone and you can be sure you're doing what you need to do. As you probably know, HR lags behind effort so when you start an interval you're more or less flying blind if you're not an RPE expert.

I bought mine off eBay, it's the old black model, but I bought a new yellow head unit when I went USB on my computer. Try to get the SL if you can afford it, the electronics are sealed against the elements better and the head unit will work on its own as a speedo/HRM if you want to use your race wheels.

But if you can't afford that, the standard PT Pro or even the black one as I have work well, just don't get them wet. I've never had a problem, but I live in Australia.

As for software, I use the Cycleops stuff that comes with it. I'm a Mac user so I can't use CyclingPeaks, but if and when they do a Mac version I'll use that. The Cycleops stuff is OK, but it's just a diary with some pretty graphs. You can zoom in on sections and zoom in on marked intervals, which does me, but it's actually not as good as the original PT software.

Dive in, get one. You won't regret it if you're prepared to learn how to use it and apply what it's telling you to your training. If you don't, you're spending a lot of money just to look at pretty numbers.

And if you do get one, you'll want to ride solo all the time - group training with a power meter shows you what a waste of time group rides can be. That's not to say group rides are no good - I love em cos they're fun and social - but the majority of my riding is done solo.

Turbo training becomes far easier as you can concentrate on the numbers while you listen to Phil and Paul on the Tour of Flanders DVD.

I sometimes race with it, but it's quite heavy. My Ksyriums make me feel faster!

 

[existence]

- Kept dropping out during road rides
- Gave inconsistent power results

Welcome to PowerTap. Think of SARIS as like a lottery company. Some units might work, some might not. Its a lottery. The further you live away from them the less likely they are to talk to you and want to deal with you post purchase. If you get a unit that works - congratulations you won the lottery. Rejoice. You will love PowerTap for sure. If you dont win the lottery welcome to the world of cursing SARIS.

How much better is a PowerTap and will I spend as much time messing around trying to get it to work?

In terms of setup PowerTap is very easy. Ive owned both the Polar S725 and Powertap 2.4. Polar interface is better IMO. Unfortunately Polar is a good company with a crappy powermeter and Powertap is a good powermeter (when it works) but a crappy interface IMO. Then there is SRM with a good product but ******** price. Right now you cant win IMO.

Dont buy second hand. Wait (until Saris get their **** sorted out) and save your money for a new one.

CyclingPeaks...........is O.K but if you dont have a coach then its not worth $100 more like $25. PowerAgent supplied by Saris is fine if you dont have a coach and combine it with some basic spread sheeting skills.

My $0.02.

 

[Alex Simmons]

CyclingPeaks...........is O.K but if you dont have a coach then its not worth $100 more like $25. PowerAgent supplied by Saris is fine if you dont have a coach and combine it with some basic spread sheeting skills.

I would have thought that CP's Power Profiling and the Performance Manager were worth the price of admission for a non-coached rider.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Welcome to PowerTap. Think of SARIS as like a lottery company. Some units might work, some might not. Its a lottery. The further you live away from them the less likely they are to talk to you and want to deal with you post purchase. If you get a unit that works - congratulations you won the lottery. Rejoice. You will love PowerTap for sure. If you dont win the lottery welcome to the world of cursing SARIS.

I don't believe this is true at all. That or Saris only supply me with good units...

I think i'm on PT no7 or 8 now, (i've upgraded each time a new one came out or shortly after, plus a spare one for racing). I've not had any major faults (except when the torque tube goes after about 2 - 4 years), and my original Tune Power Tap still works! Granted on most of them HR has stopped working (but then i don't really care about that...) and i have been through a few receiver kits. But by and large no major issues.

Additionally, i've probably sold more PTs than anyone else in Europe. I've had virtually no returns, other than torque tubes going after ~several years, and HR not working. I've probably had (off the top of my head since i started selling them in was it 99 or 2000) about 10 returns on the receiver, and i think one or two broken hubs. I had a couple more not quite right hubs when the SLs first came out (but we supplied some Pro wheels to those people). i've had a few out of warranty returns (but what stuff never breaks!).

As i understand there are a few possibly dodgy systems, but i wouldn't call it a lottery.

Ric

 

[daveryanwyoming]

I would have thought that CP's Power Profiling and the Performance Manager were worth the price of admission for a non-coached rider.

I'll second that. One could argue that selfcoached folks get more benefit out of the performance manager than folks with coaches. That feature alone is worth more than the price of WKO+ but there's plenty of good stuff in there for a selfcoached rider.

I definitely race as well as train with PT wheels but I'm running PT SLs. Still in most races the additional weight of even the pro hub is meaningless, especially for a crit specialist as you mentioned in your other thread. The best data is race data because that tells you what you can and can't do under pressure with real world stress and recovery periods and it helps you figure out what areas you need to focus on in your training.

Get a PT, get WKO+, surf these forums to better understand how to use them, it'll change the way you ride, train and race.

-Dave

 

[dkrenik]

Get a PT, get WKO+, surf these forums to better understand how to use them, it'll change the way you ride, train and race.
-Dave

And I'll second that.

Dave

 

[Bikeridindude]

Here's my take on the situation:
I bought a powertap sl last fall, October. Had if for a week, rode it in the rain, it became screwed up, I sent it in, they sent it back, been working great ever since. It looks like they just slopped a little more goop on it to make it more waterproof, but I'm not afraid to use it in a torrential downpour (I have and it worked fine). The software that comes with it sucks, it's slow as hell and more difficult to manipulate and look at specific things that you want. The speed of running the software alone is worth the 100 bucks to me, I'm not kidding, it was sloowwww... As far as the bikes go, if you get the SL, you can put a harness on both bikes and swith your wheel between them. It's not ideal, but I've learned to compromise. I got the mavic open pro rims, not the best for racing but oh well. I figured the difference won't be very big, and the information is invaluable. When I do a priority race with a significant amount of climbing, I just use my old polar hrm/bike computer so I have have times/speeds and a lighter set of wheels. A lot of guys will tell you that I'd still be better off having the powermeter despite the weight, but sometimes I still like to do things the old fashioned way anyway. Imagine what it would be like to not have any monitoring devices at all!!? We would all still survive. Normally when I race I'm not a contender anyway, so I just figure I'd be 15 or so seconds faster if I'd used my race wheels. Powermeters are awesome. You'll be able to track your fitness gains to the gnat's ass. It'll help keep you motivated and let you know if you're training program sucks.

 

[NomadVW]

I ride in constant rain this time of year. The most problems I have had are not from the hub getting wet but from the PT mount on the stem getting wet at the contacts and dropping cadence and/or power briefly. I fix this by rubberbanding a small plastic baggie over it. It's not pretty but it works.

I have two powertaps. The PT SL I have is at Saris now getting the torque tube fixed and the PT pro is working flawlessly. Saris has been Grade A customer service every time I've talked to them - calling them works better than email. I'm in Japan and they've shown no resistance to helping me on the other side of the world.

Saris could put their customer service up against almost anyone's I've dealt with and outshine them. This seems to be the sentiment I get from everyone I've talked to about them.

The only question about whether or not to get a powertap is budget IMO. If you have the budget for a powermeter but not an SRM, get a Powertap. (provided it meets your powermeter needs - ala, single wheel use).

As far as cyclingpeaks goes - it's the cheapest self-coach tool you could buy.

 

[RidwarePhil]

Hi Guys

Thanks for all of the replies - really helped.

I read training and racing with a powermeter last year then got pi**ed of with spending more time trying to get my Polar unit working than training through December which was pretty costy - retrospectively! PT seems to be a good way foroward.

2 questions.

What are torque tubes?

If a PT fails in the UK where does it need to go to for service and how long will it be gone for typically?

Cheers Phil

 

[ric_stern/RST]

What are torque tubes?

the tube in the centre of the hub that house the electronics. specifically, the strain gauges are located here, which measure the torque

If a PT fails in the UK where does it need to go to for service and how long will it be gone for typically?

Cheers Phil

As with all things purchased within the UK (presuming you're in the UK, and presuming that the purchase is a retail purchase and not a business purchase), the PT would go back to the point of purchase (as your contract is with the retailer). If the PT fails due to electronics (e.g. torque tube) it then has to go back to the States for repair at Saris. Typically, you're probably looking at 3 weeks, but i've had shorter and longer returns.

Additionally, if you purchase from me, and something goes wrong in the warranty period that requires the unit to go back to the States, i'll do my utmost (but can't guarantee) to get you a spare unit should you so wish.

Finally, we have a big sale on PT SLs at present [thumbs up] see http://www.cyclingforums.com/t403071.html

Cheers
Ric