Premier League style Pro Tour



hoggy

New Member
Oct 25, 2006
49
0
0
forgive the long post and the fact that I don’t know the inner workings of the English premier league but it seems it might be a good a model to rebuild the pro tour and re-integrate the organizers and cycling as whole.



Heres my suggestion.

· One License fee for all Protour and pro continental teams. This would be less than the current fee because the amount of teams paying it would increase.

· Instigate a salary cap for each team, which the UCI would monitor. This would help to keep teams as even as possible but doesn’t restrict overall teams budget

· Rank the teams based on results for example 2 points for a stage win, additional 2 points for each day a rider holds a jersey colour (like sprinters green jersey) and maybe 5 points for an overall win.

· Provide a weighting for each race, for example 10 for a GT, 5 for monument and you could either scale the rest from 4 to 0 or all be 0.

· Based on the ranking system the top 15 teams would be protour status and the rest pro continental

· Set a max number of teams / riders for each race

· Every protour team (that’s 15 under these rules) MUST start each race with a protour weighting of 5 or more (eg GT & monuments) then based on the max number of teams any other pro continental team can be invited. Team rankings would be taken into account but other factors such as French team in a French race or Belgium in Belgium race etc. could also be deciding factors.

· The UCI would establish (IN CONSULTATION) a minimum amount of points to avoid relegation and then at the end of the season highlight to those teams under that limit they have 12 months to regain their standing or be relegated. This has the effect of once getting enough points to be in the pro tour a sponsor has at least 2 years being in all the biggest races. If a team remains under the cut off after the 2nd year they get relegated and the top team from the pro continental pools gets elevated.

  • · The above will also help to ensure that every team fields their best team to each event and would help the globalization of the sport.
  • · For races outside of the GT’s and monuments they can invite who they like from the protor, pro conti and continental teams but must offer at least 80% to the pro conti teams so they can at least earn points to gain access to protor ranking points. No team is forced to attend these races. The draw card will be the possibility of earning ranking points in a race where not many other contenders are present. (keep in mind that even earning more points than a pro tour team doesn’t mean you move up a grade, as a protour team will still need to be relegated for that to happen)
  • overall protour status awards will be based on the regular classifications, eg most sprinter points, most points overall, most juniotr points etc. rather than the one protour leader as is the case now. Also an overall person could be voted from the various category winners from the riders

Doping offences

· Automatic suspension of rider pending confirmation of test results

· Suspicion of doping NOT adequate to suspend any rider. Suspicion of doping leads to more tests to catch suspect rider

· 2 year ban for rider based on proven offence

· Automatic last chance for the team. Second offence within 2 years means immediate relegation for team and exclusion from GT’s and monuments

· Banned rider can not ride for pro tour team for 2 years after their suspension

· Major offences such as systematic doping, result in immediate expulsion of team and rider UCI licenses.



Effect on cycling

· Race organizers get better say in who rides their races

· Pro tour ranking takes into account the differences in races and the different types of riders (eg sprinters & climbers)

· UCI takes control back to govern and runs as a not for profit organization. All money they have should be go back to the sport in terms of doping controls, paying commissioners, officials etc and administering the ranking and IOC / WADA connections.

· Race organizers pay a fee to the UCI to help with the above admin costs, recognizing that the UCI is not for profit and is therefore NOT trying to take all its precious money.



Pre-cursors

· Sack the current UCI management as there is too much bad blood

· I would advocate the sacking of all ASO RCS management as well (for the same reasons as above) but they are private business and not a realistic option

· Organise an effective rider union

· Drop the OP ****, start the blood passport, then even if people were getting OP blood they wont be anymore

· Clean the slate, anyone who doped, pre 2000, just accept that was what was happening at the time and leave it be.

· Everyone needs to accept their complicit role in things getting out of hand. Organisers UCI, riders teams sponsors, everyone



This may be a simplistic overview but those with a far better working knowledge of cycling rules and history could maybe build on this as an idea to go forward.



Lastly I really don’t want to hear why this cant work. I am very interested in what cycling would need to do to make something like this work.



Long live cycling!
 
I guess it was a **** idea, or do i have to earn my stripes on this forum before people respond to a thread from a relative newbie.
 
There is good ideas in your proposals, but currently the real problem who matter is not only the rules of Pro Tour, it's more the will of Verbruggen to sell the right of Pro-Tour and their races to an extern League.
 
hoggy said:
I guess it was a **** idea, or do i have to earn my stripes on this forum before people respond to a thread from a relative newbie.
It is not a **** idea. But it does not solve the main problem... which is brokering a compromise whereby each party has to accept less than what they think they can win in an all-out war.

Thinking up a better system that benefits cycling is not as difficult as convincing the current powers to relinquish their power. At the moment ASO holds the assets (big races) and the revenues. UCI holds the legitimacy. UCI is trying to create their own asset in the Pro Tour in an attempt to reduce ASO's power (the discretion to invite teams is a big one). Both are not trustworthy to put cycling ahead of self-interest. Both do not want to share or cohabitate. Both want to own the future television rights of the pro version of the sport.

It is a classic war, like the Israeli/Arab Middle East conflict. It is very easy for it to get worse if there is another metaphoric "shoving" incident.

So if you can come up with an idea to get both parties to sign an agreement, and participate in a shared pro league/tour, with shared power, and shared financial spoils, you will have achieved the solution. It is not in the "points" system or the small details of how the league operates IMHO, it is in making sure that each party feels like they have not sold out, and have gained something from the agreement. And unfortunately the war often has to get a lot worse before "peace" carries a value to both parties in the negotiation, and that this happens before one party or cycling is annihilated.
 
hoggy said:
I guess it was a **** idea, or do i have to earn my stripes on this forum before people respond to a thread from a relative newbie.
You just have to wait until I'm not as busy at work for me to respond...

I have some quibbles around the edges, but this is a good idea. What it doesn't address is the money side. There needs to be more money (not just TV exposure, but actual cash) from being a ProTour team. That is the incentive to make teams want to jump a level to the elite status. I think a distribution of TV rights income is the likely vehicle.

Unfortunately, no-one currently wants to give an inch,in any department, let alone the all-important dollar, so i don't see it flying. But it would be good.
 
Thanks guys and sorry for the impatience.


On the incentive side of things i thought automatic entry to GTs and monuments would be incentive enough. I know thats one of the current sticking points but if gaining protour status was about ranking rather than license payments then surely the organisers would be happier cos they will have the best teams there. and the compromise on the current situation is that there will be less of them and more spots for wild cards.
obviously this idea requires major concessions on both sides. lets hope people on the inside are willing to give new ideas a chance, cos i think some outside the square options may provide the breakthrough were all hoping for.
 
just re-read your post drongo and i understand your point a bit better now. In Oz the AFL has 18 teams and the comp is run by the Australian football league. The AFL own the tv rights and distribute money earned from those rights to the teams.

In cycling the likes of ASO owns the rights (as i understand it) and maybe they should be distributing some of those royalties to the teams, rather than the UCI. This could have the effect of convincing ASO to share some $$ as it wont be going to the UCI who they think is just after a cash cow.

Like in Aussie rules, the teams can use that royalty money to fund development or junior continental teams, thus spreading and improving the sport
 
hoggy said:
just re-read your post drongo and i understand your point a bit better now. In Oz the AFL has 18 teams and the comp is run by the Australian football league. The AFL own the tv rights and distribute money earned from those rights to the teams.

In cycling the likes of ASO owns the rights (as i understand it) and maybe they should be distributing some of those royalties to the teams, rather than the UCI. This could have the effect of convincing ASO to share some $$ as it wont be going to the UCI who they think is just after a cash cow.

Like in Aussie rules, the teams can use that royalty money to fund development or junior continental teams, thus spreading and improving the sport
The money is spread to the teams because the AFL is the teams. You can't rely on an independent organisation (like ASO) to spread the TV rights revenue around just because they're nice guys.
 
youre right cranky and that payment of fees to be a registered UCI event needs to be one of the concessions by ASO and the right for the ASO to have a greater choice in participating teams and change the closed nature of the pro tour needs to be a UCI concession

concession, concession, compromise. i know its a big ask but they need to start somewhere
 
I don't think it is possible to make a fair points system that takes into account GTs, GT stages, short stage races, and one day races.
 
maybe not perfect but better than the current system

every win or jersey holder from every race could get the same points but the weighting on each race race may be different. eg
winner gets 100 points
jersey holder gets 100 points
Stage races gets 250 for winner overall
points could scale down to all participants so each rider and team gets points.

then the weightings
winner = 100 points
Gt weighting is 5
monument is 3
protour race is 2
others 1... you could use the current race rating system as a guide.


this way you would end up with a pro tour KOM, Sprinter, junior, most agrressive, team and GC champs rather than the one winner at the moment
 

Similar threads