Protection against dogs

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Per LöWdin, Mar 2, 2003.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Per LöWdin

    Per LöWdin Guest

    Tags:


  2. Frank Riley

    Frank Riley Guest

    "Per Löwdin" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

    > Last year in South East Asia we were sometimes shit scarred, especially in Trat, where quite a few
    > dogs charged after us. Carrying stoned to fling after them is of course a possibility but I would
    > like to have something more efficient. Does any one have experience with electronic devises: e.g.,
    > http://www.petstime.com/DogOff.html

    Many people on the touring list have indicated that the Dog Dazer works quite well:

    http://www.securityworld.com/personalsafety/1012.html
     
  3. Www.Raph.Nl

    Www.Raph.Nl Guest

    "Per Löwdin" <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email protected]...
    > Last year in South East Asia we were sometimes shit scarred,
    especially in
    > Trat, where quite a few dogs charged after us. Carrying stoned to
    fling
    > after them is of course a possibility but I would like to have
    something
    > more efficient. Does any one have experience with electronic
    devises: e.g.,
    > http://www.petstime.com/DogOff.html
    >
    > Per http://user.tninet.se/~ipg289h/fu99/MTB.html
    >

    Hello Per,

    Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the perfect
    solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the Navajo Reservation
    in Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution may sound like a joke, but
    I can assure you that it's not; it really worked. A warning, however: don't try it if you're not
    totally confident. Dogs will notice it and may attack!

    CU!

    Raph www.raph.nl
     
  4. Frank Riley

    Frank Riley Guest

    "www.raph.nl" <[email protected]> wrote in news:1046729989.595642 @halkan.kabelfoon.nl:

    > Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the perfect
    > solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the Navajo
    > Reservation in Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution may sound
    > like a joke, but I can assure you that it's not; it really worked. A warning, however: don't try
    > it if you're not totally confident. Dogs will notice it and may attack!

    I will be cycling through the Navajo Nation this summer. Did you encounter a lot of dogs there?
     
  5. Per LöWdin

    Per LöWdin Guest

    > Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the perfect
    > solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the Navajo
    > Reservation in Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution may sound
    > like a joke, but I can assure you that it's not; it really worked. A warning, however: don't try
    > it if you're not totally confident. Dogs will notice it and may attack!

    It works. At least in Asia you can scare off most dogs by acting totally confident and appear
    threatening, by having a I-will-take-no-shit-you-lousy-dog attitude, backed up with stones. That
    is how the locals deal with them. And the implicit threat is enough, so you rarely if ever
    actually have to throw the stones. However, it is demanding when there is a dog every kilometres
    or so. In parts of Trat in Thailand we could not relax, felt that any dog might give chase and
    charge almost any time, we had to be constantly looking for dogs, and be prepared to fend them off
    with shouts and stones. Not any fun. Best would be if you could stop them in their tracks with
    just a push of a button.

    Per
     
  6. David Kunz

    David Kunz Guest

    Per Löwdin wrote:
    >>Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the perfect
    >>solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the Navajo
    >>Reservation in Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution may sound
    >>like a joke, but I can assure you that it's not; it really worked. A warning, however: don't try
    >>it if you're not totally confident. Dogs will notice it and may attack!
    >
    >
    > It works. At least in Asia you can scare off most dogs by acting totally confident and appear
    > threatening, by having a I-will-take-no-shit-you-lousy-dog attitude, backed up with stones. That
    > is how the locals deal with them. And the implicit threat is enough, so you rarely if ever
    > actually have to throw the stones. However, it is demanding when there is a dog every kilometres
    > or so. In parts of Trat in Thailand we could not relax, felt that any dog might give chase and
    > charge almost any time, we had to be constantly looking for dogs, and be prepared to fend them off
    > with shouts and stones. Not any fun. Best would be if you could stop them in their tracks with
    > just a push of a button.
    >

    Works here in the US too. Best if you yell BAD DOG... NO in a very loud, confident, commanding
    voice. Most dogs that have been around people know these words and their meaning/consequences. I've
    tried just yelling and adding those words usually helps.

    David
     
  7. "Per Löwdin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > > Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the perfect
    > > solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the Navajo
    > > Reservation in Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution may sound
    > > like a joke, but I can assure you that it's not; it really worked. A warning, however: don't try
    > > it if you're not totally confident. Dogs will notice it and may attack!
    >
    > It works. At least in Asia you can scare off most dogs by acting totally confident and appear
    > threatening, by having a I-will-take-no-shit-you-lousy-dog attitude, backed up with stones. That
    > is how the locals deal with them. And the implicit threat is enough, so you rarely if ever
    > actually have to throw the stones. However, it is demanding when there is a dog every kilometres
    > or so. In parts of Trat in Thailand we could not relax, felt that any dog might give chase and
    > charge almost any time, we had to be constantly looking for dogs, and be prepared to fend them off
    > with shouts and stones. Not any fun. Best would be if you could stop them in their tracks with
    > just a push of a button.
    >
    > Per

    If you are looking for something that is cheap and very effective, ammonia spray works well.
    Ordinary household ammonia, dispensed from a hand pump bottle (the kind that can shoot a good
    stream), will stop a dog if you hit it anywhere in the face.

    Steve Shapiro
     
  8. > I will be cycling through the Navajo Nation this summer. Did you encounter a lot of dogs there?

    Indian reservation towns are always full of loose dogs. They usually chase you in 2 to 3 dog
    packs, sometimes more. I've never had one try to bite me though. They are usually Heinz 57's,
    not attack dogs. I've never seen an attack breed.
     
  9. [email protected] (Steve Shapiro) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > "Per Löwdin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > > Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the
    > > > perfect solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the
    > > > Navajo Reservation in Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution
    > > > may sound like a joke, but I can assure you that it's not; it really worked. A warning,
    > > > however: don't try it if you're not totally confident. Dogs will notice it and may attack!
    > >
    > > It works. At least in Asia you can scare off most dogs by acting totally confident and appear
    > > threatening, by having a I-will-take-no-shit-you-lousy-dog attitude, backed up with stones. That
    > > is how the locals deal with them. And the implicit threat is enough, so you rarely if ever
    > > actually have to throw the stones. However, it is demanding when there is a dog every kilometres
    > > or so. In parts of Trat in Thailand we could not relax, felt that any dog might give chase and
    > > charge almost any time, we had to be constantly looking for dogs, and be prepared to fend them
    > > off with shouts and stones. Not any fun. Best would be if you could stop them in their tracks
    > > with just a push of a button.
    > >
    > > Per
    >
    >
    > If you are looking for something that is cheap and very effective, ammonia spray works well.
    > Ordinary household ammonia, dispensed from a hand pump bottle (the kind that can shoot a good
    > stream), will stop a dog if you hit it anywhere in the face.
    >
    > Steve Shapiro

    My previos posting seems cold hearted upon re-read. Actually, I love dogs and my preference is not
    to hurt them. I would try first to run or brandish my frame pump. I'd use the amonia if the other
    methods failed. Steve Shapiro
     
  10. "David Kunz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:0E%[email protected]...
    >
    > Works here in the US too. Best if you yell BAD DOG... NO in a very loud, confident, commanding
    > voice. Most dogs that have been around people know these words and their meaning/consequences.
    > I've tried just yelling and adding those words usually helps.
    >

    One time in the heat of a chasing dog I somehow came up with a loud "get off the couch". I was
    amazed that the dog stopped dead in its tracks. (I was equally amazed that I came up with that)
     
  11. Per LöWdin

    Per LöWdin Guest

    LOL
    > One time in the heat of a chasing dog I somehow came up with a loud "get off the couch". I was
    > amazed that the dog stopped dead in its tracks. (I was equally amazed that I came up with that)
     
  12. Per LöWdin

    Per LöWdin Guest

    > I love dogs and my preference is not to hurt them.

    Of course, we would rather not hurt them either, but they are a problem. As long as dog charges are
    rare, far less than one a day, it can be handled by being stern, barking back, or whatever. But when
    there is a bunch of dogs that give chase every other kilometre it would be nice to have an efficient
    way of putting them off. I would prefer an electronic devise to amoniak.

    Per
     
  13. Steve Shapiro wrote:

    > [email protected] (Steve Shapiro) wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > "Per Löwdin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > > > Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the
    > > > > perfect solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the
    > > > > Navajo Reservation in Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution
    > > > > may sound like a joke, but I can assure you that it's not; it really worked. A warning,
    > > > > however: don't try it if you're not totally confident. Dogs will notice it and may attack!
    > > >
    > > > It works. At least in Asia you can scare off most dogs by acting totally confident and appear
    > > > threatening, by having a I-will-take-no-shit-you-lousy-dog attitude, backed up with stones.
    > > > That is how the locals deal with them. And the implicit threat is enough, so you rarely if
    > > > ever actually have to throw the stones. However, it is demanding when there is a dog every
    > > > kilometres or so. In parts of Trat in Thailand we could not relax, felt that any dog might
    > > > give chase and charge almost any time, we had to be constantly looking for dogs, and be
    > > > prepared to fend them off with shouts and stones. Not any fun. Best would be if you could stop
    > > > them in their tracks with just a push of a button.
    > > >
    > > > Per
    > >
    > >
    > > If you are looking for something that is cheap and very effective, ammonia spray works well.
    > > Ordinary household ammonia, dispensed from a hand pump bottle (the kind that can shoot a good
    > > stream), will stop a dog if you hit it anywhere in the face.
    > >
    > > Steve Shapiro
    >
    > My previos posting seems cold hearted upon re-read. Actually, I love dogs and my preference is not
    > to hurt them. I would try first to run or brandish my frame pump. I'd use the amonia if the other
    > methods failed.

    Understood. It IS scary when snarling teeth come running at you, so any defense is appropriate at
    the time to save your ass (ankles? *).

    I have learned to shout out, "Come on boy! Let's get going! Let's see how far we can run together!"
    And then I enjoy a fast ride with my new, tongue flopping friend (much like Ralph's idea about
    cheering).

    This has worked for me (so far), as the dog seems to like it - and I like thinking that the owner is
    going to end up scratching his hollow head and wondering where in the hell Rover went.

    * As a side note, and to maybe alter this thread. How many people have actually been injured in a
    dog encounter? Can we hear those stories? Is the fear well founded?

    --
    **********************************************
    Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO CycleTourist at http://www.CycleTourist.com attbi.com Tolerance is
    recognizing that other people have different ideals and needs than you. Compromise is acting on
    that knowledge.
    ***********************************************************
     
  14. Norm

    Norm Guest

    X-No-Archive: Yes Chuck Anderson wrote:

    > * As a side note, and to maybe alter this thread. How many people have actually been injured in a
    > dog encounter? Can we hear those stories? Is the fear well founded?

    Yesterdays (march 4th) FL StPete Times had a section B cover story on a young woman rider of
    ~200mi/week whose misadventures recently including injuries on a bike from a dog attack.
    http://www.sptimes.com

    I've been lucky but due at least in part to having Halt! on all my bikes, the more dangerous moments
    were from condition inattention or swerving due to dog attacks and as someone pointed out dogs in
    packs are the worse.

    --
    Do not perform these tasks out of order: 1--Put your contacts in 2--Urinate 3--Slice the jalapenos
    for the nachos 4--Varnish the cabinet <AHBoU
     
  15. Jay Hill

    Jay Hill Guest

    > * As a side note, and to maybe alter this thread. How many people have actually been injured in a
    > dog encounter?
    >
    Come on. Do you mean per day? I've been ripped up twice by dogs, once while on my bike. At least one
    of those dogs is dead as a result, but dog attacks are a constant part of riding. I've also seen
    friends of mine get ripped. It's the owners' fault, but the dogs sometimes have to pay with their
    lives. Only sometimes do the owners have to pay a fine of some kind.
     
  16. Per LöWdin

    Per LöWdin Guest

    > I have learned to shout out, "Come on boy! Let's get going! Let's see
    how far we can run together!" And then I
    > enjoy a fast ride with my new, tongue flopping friend (much like Ralph's
    idea about cheering).

    There are a lot of different dogs around. Admittedly some are young dogs who just like to play and
    would not bite. They are just having fun. Most common I think is that they want you off their turf
    so they give chase to the next dogs territory. Some races that have been bred to herd livestock may
    wag their tails when you come and then bark like hell trying to prevent you from leaving. There are
    also some who really bite. And, some who don´t bark just go straight for you leg from behind. Etc.

    > * As a side note, and to maybe alter this thread. How many people have
    actually been injured in a dog encounter? Can
    > we hear those stories?

    There is a thread at www.funsportmoutain.bike in Swedish by someone who was just bitten. Passed a
    guy at a fire road and the dog was behind the guy and just went for his leg. Personally, I have
    never been hurt but we have had two close calls. Once on Bali and once in northern Thailand when
    huge dogs have come charging after us. Both times we have stopped jumped behind the bikes to have
    them as shields and yelled at the dogs disciplining them.

    > Is the fear well founded?

    Absolutely, when you have a huge snarling dog snapping after your leg on one side and a heavy flow
    of heavy vehicles on the other it can be extremely dangerous.

    Per
     
  17. David Kunz

    David Kunz Guest

    Chuck Anderson wrote: ...
    > * As a side note, and to maybe alter this thread. How many people have actually been injured in a
    > dog encounter? Can we hear those stories? Is the fear well founded?

    I've been pretty lucky. The only dog that acutally bit me didn't get a good hold and only left big
    welts in my ankle. I went yelling at some people near-by demanding to know who the owner was and
    they claimed not to know (yea). BUT, the next time that I saw that dog, they had put up an
    electronic (radio) fence :).

    I get lots of dogs that I'm sure are going to bite me, but since I started with the NO... BAD DOG!,
    I've had less of a problem. I've tried the friendship thing and it only works for some dogs --
    didn't work for the one that bit me. I haven't tried "get off the couch" -- ROTFLAMO!

    My other close calls are the darting ones that want to play by getting in your way <sigh>. I hope
    that I never connect with one.

    David
     
  18. David Newman

    David Newman Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, Chuck Anderson <[email protected]> wrote:

    > * As a side note, and to maybe alter this thread. How many people have actually been injured in a
    > dog encounter? Can we hear those stories? Is the fear well founded?

    My uncle was riding at a slow pace talking to someone who was walking at the same pace. A small dog
    somehow got under his front wheel and caused him to crash. He fell awkwardly and his upper leg was
    broken. I don't have any more details, but this shows that even slow speed crashes can be pretty
    dangerous.

    I have heard second-hand that a member of my bike club crashed while trying to avoid a large barking
    dog that was chasing him. I don't know exactly what his injuries were, but the second-hand reports
    indicate that he and his bike were messed up pretty badly.

    Most people seem to think that the greatest danger from dogs is being bitten. I used to think so
    too, but I have slowly changed my mind. I now think the greatest danger is a dog-induced crash.

    When I am chased by a dog, I tend to look at the dog rather than at where I am going. I can easily
    see this causing a crash. I can also see an enthusiastic and friendly dog leaping at a rider and
    knocking the rider down. I can see a running dog getting under the bike by accident and causing the
    rider to go down. Finally, I can see a dog trying to bite a rider and pulling the rider down without
    actually succeeding in biting.

    I think dog bites are emphasized by the press since there is a public safety issue regarding vicious
    dogs anyway, and most readers and reporters don't really care about bicycle crashes no matter how
    they were caused. So I suspect that dog-bike crashes are under-reported. I hope others will respond
    to your question regarding dog-related bicycling injuries -- perhaps this informal survey can shed
    some more light on whether crashes or bites are more prevalent.

    >>Dave
     
  19. In 20 years I've had two injuries from dogs and oddly, both were friendly ones. The first was when
    my neighbor's dog decided to go along when I went for a ride and after trotting on my right decided
    to cross in front of me. I hit her, went up over the handlebars, turned a flip in the ait, and
    landed on one hip and flopped backwards onto the pavement. I heard my helmet hit with a loud smack
    (one of only two times that I would have been injured without the helmet) and then I began to move
    carefully to see what parts of my body still worked. All did and so I remounted the bike and pressed
    on. The dog was uninjured. Wow was I stiff and sore the next morning.

    On the second occasion two dogs came out from a farmhouse to chase me, an old, fat, slow dog and a
    young speedy one. I could have outrun the old dog but not the young one so I just stopped and
    stood there and said "OK dog you've got me, now what?" They don't know what to do with the cyclist
    once they've caught him and so soon they look bewildered and wander off (if I'm worried that the
    dog might continue after I stop I just keep the bike between myself and the dog. That's a problem
    when there is more than one dog). Soon the young dog wandered off and the old one was silling
    beside me waiting to be petted. I've learned not to do that because the dog will often follow if
    you do. I pulled the right pedal up to start off again and just as my calf muscle tensed the old
    dog bit the back of it. Sunk a fang into it and then sat down to be petted again. I didn't pet him
    but went and knocked on the farmhouse door. Nobody was home so I noted the name on the mailbox and
    pressed on (the old dog didn't follow me back to the road). Later in the day I called the dog
    owner to complain. I didn't want anything from him except to bitch about what had happened. He had
    the usual response that the dog wasn't aggressive (which was true but still I had blood on my leg)
    and I was still pretty rattled from the experience so I ended up questioning his parentage and
    then hung up and called the sheriff. The sheriff called back in a few minutes and said that the
    dog owner said I'd cursed at him. I agreed that I had indeed done so and that I didn't want
    anything more than to complain.

    I've had good luck with the "OK dog you've got me, now what?" approach described above and also with
    just riding directly at a dog, becomming the aggressor. The dog nearly always turns tail and
    retreats. This doesn't work if the dog is approaching from behind.

    I have heard guys speak of outrunning a dog but for me that would have to be a pretty slow dog. Most
    dogs can run very fast and an unsuccessful attempt to outrun a dog means that you're going awfully
    fast if you hit him and so you'd go down very hard. I worry a lot more about hitting the dog and
    going down than about being bitten.

    My wife gave me a Tazer electronic dog repeller but I was never sure whether it was effective or
    not. Besides you have to take a hand off the bars to use it.

    Halt works and it would work on humans too if necessary. I've gotten a drop on my skin and it
    burns like mad. I know an hispanic guy who seasons food with Halt on occasion. (It's derived from
    cayane pepper)

    Strong amonia water will work too but I've always been concerned that it would do lasting damage
    especially to a dog's eyes. Bob Taylor
     
  20. Www.Raph.Nl

    Www.Raph.Nl Guest

    "Frank Riley" <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email protected]...
    > "www.raph.nl" <[email protected]> wrote in news:1046729989.595642 @halkan.kabelfoon.nl:
    >
    > > Take a look at http://home.hccnet.nl/raph.de.rooij/1993-usa/61.htm There you'll find the perfect
    > > solution: effective and guaranteed animal friendly. It was "field tested" in the Navajo
    > > Reservation
    in
    > > Arizona and at numerous other occasions. To some readers the solution may sound like a joke,
    > > but I can
    assure
    > > you that it's not; it really worked. A warning, however: don't try it if you're not totally
    > > confident.
    Dogs
    > > will notice it and may attack!
    >
    > I will be cycling through the Navajo Nation this summer. Did you
    encounter
    > a lot of dogs there?

    Yep.
     
Loading...
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...