Question mostlikely reposted, will i be able to succeed fromt his weight??

Discussion in 'Cycling Training' started by sunnysang, Apr 29, 2007.

  1. sunnysang

    sunnysang New Member

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    Hey guys, sorry but i couldnt find this post if it was already posted. But right now im age 16, 220 pounds, with a body to fat ratio of 33%! I just got a roadbike on this past monday (4/23). Soo far ive been riding 2 hours everyday at about avg speed of 17mph and about 27-28 miles in those 2 hours. Is that good for my position? Should i ride more?
    At about the one hour 30 minute time, it feels like i lose all energy, soo does anyone suggest a energy gel/bar/drink or anything i should take in those terms before i ride or both before and durring my ride? O yeah, and does any one think its possible for me to become TDF material?? LOL =)
    Thank you and sorry if its a repost:eek:
     
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  2. beerco

    beerco New Member

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    Just stick with it and you'll do fine. Right now you've just got to lose the fat so don't worry to much about an energy drink. You might consider riding at a very slightly lower pace so that you don't crash so hard at the 1:30 mark.

    If you decide on an energy drink, it really doesn't matter which one, they're all pretty much the same.

    TDF is a long shot for most all of us, but since you've decided to get into shape young enough (unlike a lot of us, me included) the world is your oyster.
     
  3. Xsmoker

    Xsmoker New Member

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    Welcome sunnysang. Glad to hear you are on the road to a fit lifestyle, and that's just what it is, a lifestyle. It's a change you'll hopefully embrace for the rest of your life.

    Your 17 MPH average is incredible for a newb of your weight. The question of weight loss along with proper nutrition for extended activities like cycling is a tough one to answer. It's obvious you are bonking at 1.5 hrs. The body can store around 2000 calories as glycogen in the muscles, once it is burned there is nothing left to keep the muscles firing. At your weight and speed I would say that is about right. A fit man riding a flat windless course at 14 to 15 MPH will burn 600 calories an hour. If you want to ride for two hours you will need to replace calories during the ride. Energy bars, gels and drinks will fill the bill. Although I prefer PB and Js. Just read the nutrition info on the packages and and decide what you need, but don't over do, just ask webhoast and read the "am I crazy" thread.

    Weight loss has evryhing to do with calories. Calories in, calories out. 3000 calories extra in your diet adds up to 1 pound. To loose weight you need to run a deficit of a few hundred a day. A pound a week is a safe and attainable goal.

    Add weight training to your fitness regime. This will increase your resting metabolic rate and thus you will burn more calories at rest.

    And lastly, read this and this.
     
  4. djk202020

    djk202020 New Member

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    Were you physically active before this because those are some really good numbers where are you riding at what is the terrain like? I live in Pittsburgh and have been riding for 2 years I am at 170lb right now and even if I go all out for an hour I have a hard time keeping a 17mph average because it is all hills for anyone else that lives in Pittsburgh you know my pain. Pulling 220 up the hills around here would prob tire you out much quicker considering you have 73 lbs of fat on you 220*.33? If you are riding hills at that pace and at that weight that is really impressive....
     
  5. sunnysang

    sunnysang New Member

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    thank you for the info! it is reallly helpful! the ride around here is mostly flat. There is a park which has realatively mild climbs, with 1 big one. Then i venture onto a trail which has a little more than mild hills, but mostly flat with also its one hard climb. Before i got my bike, i went to the gym on and off, mainly off. And about 2 falls ago i was playing American football (linemen ofcourse =) ). lol right now i take 1 bottle of water and the other powerade which i started yesterday. I felt like i had a lot more energy which i thought was nice, but still bonked at about 1.5hrs. ( when both bottles are depleted, i stop at starbuxs and getem filled for free with water !! =) ) And im very happy as in today im getting cycling shorts! no more pain in legs and hopefully ill be able to ride longer now also =).
    But what bars or jells do u recomended? I saw theirs those jelly bean energy things, i thought id try those out but im not to sure?? Any you guys have found that work nice while keeping a alright taste?
     
  6. Xsmoker

    Xsmoker New Member

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    Really, just try different ones. I prefer Cliff Bars over Power Bars, but I like Power Bar jells. Never tried Cliff Shots or Jelly Belly Sport Beans.
     
  7. djk202020

    djk202020 New Member

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    I'm not sure that your body is able to sustain power for that long, no matter how much energy one takes in eveyone hits a point where their bodies can no longer perform at a certain level. If you do some interval training you may find that will help you also. I cant recomend any energy supplemnets becasue I have never used any water seems to work fine for me. You may also be confusing the term bonk with just being unfit to ride that long.
     
  8. Imanewbie

    Imanewbie New Member

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    I too started cycling for weight loss and its a great way to get fit and loose weight! With folks like us who are on the chubby side , there are two very important cycling techniques and both hinge on having a good cycling computer.

    Cadence - this is the amount of revolutions your pedals turn in one minute, this is achieved by choosing a lower gear and pedalling faster. Pedelling with a high cadence activates the muscle pump , as your leg muscles contract they squeeze the blood forward through the legs assisting the heart. High Cadence also improves your aerobic and cardio vascular fitness. You will need a bike computer with a cadence sensor so that you can monitor your cadence and work on raising it. When i first started cycling it was a task to keep my average cadence above 70 and over a period of weeks i slowly built my rate untill now i average a cadence of +-90 over the entire ride. Ride for cadence not speed!!

    The second technique involves having a heart rate monitor on your bike computer or you can buy one seperately on a wrist watch. Science has discovered that at different heart rates your body will use different ways to get its energy. For chubby folks like us, our aim at the start is to cycle at a heart rate approx between 60% and 70% of our maximum heart rate (220 minus your age = max heart rate). At this rate we will use a combination of body fat and carbohydrates to power our muscles, this is the zone which we should aspire to maintain in the first few months.

    There is lots of info on the web if you want to search for it and in this case knowledge truely is power! the more you understand about what is going on in your body the more you will be able to tailor your riding style to maximise your goals.

    I would also highly reccomend a Polar CS200cad bike computer which has both cadence and a hrm , yes its a fair bit of money for a bike computer but it will serve you well for years from beginner right through to elite class cycling.

    Remember that bike fitness is a gradual thing, its not going to happen overnight, your body will need time to adapt and modify itself, changing your shape in the process. Eating healthy foods will benefit you more at this stage of cycling than power bars and drinks!!

    Have fun cycling, if it becomes a lifestyle all the heath gains will happen as a side effect of enjoyment, at this stage setting yourself unrealistic goals will only make it all seem like hard work and lead to feelings of failure and defeat.

    good luck in your efforts!
     
  9. nosduh

    nosduh New Member

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    Don't fall into the lie of wanting to lose it fast. Don't reduce your calories by too much. Like someone else said, a few hundred a day is fine. You need to keep your metabolism up. Don't use the word diet....use the word habits. You are developing lifelong habits. That is the only way to success.
     
  10. sunnysang

    sunnysang New Member

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    Thank you, i did not realise that, i am stopping my many junk foods tho while still keeping the milk and cookies :p
     
  11. Scarantino

    Scarantino New Member

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    Cliff Shot Bloks. I will never, ever eat gel again.
     
  12. DJA

    DJA New Member

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    Thats a good average but it may be a little high to achieve the best wieght loss target.
    Have you tried averaging say 15mph to see if you are able to go longer. Fat burn is best done at low intensity and the body dosn't start doing it for the first 20 to 30 min of activity. If the intensity is to high the the body will use mostly sugar stores for energy.Most of this was covered by IMANEWBIE posting.
    Also be careful with your milage increase as this can give you problems if step it up to fast (over use injures) your body could one day say thats enough. A good rule of thumb to follow is +10% for any one ride and +5% for weekly milage total.
     
  13. Imanewbie

    Imanewbie New Member

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    excellent ! :) excuse my rambling on a bit but here are things i found helpfull .

    Eat your carbs for breakfast and lunch. If you can eat low Glycemic Index (GI) carbs even better, these are slow release carbohydrates. Hi GI foods release thier energy very quickly, your body will convert this food into glycogen - it runs around your bloodstream to your muscles and liver, these store the glycogen. But they can only store so much and when they are full the body converts the rest into fat! Low GI food slows this release down so that as you do your daily routine , your body has a chance to use the glycogen before it is converted to fat. In my case i dont eat any carbs after lunch, simply because my lifstyle means i wont have the chance to burn them off. Dinner should be the food your body needs to repair itself after the day, any lean meat and lots of veges! im a milk addict too (love the stuff) but low fat or no fat milk.

    DJA mentioned low intensity riding, if you dont have a heart rate monitor the easiest way to tell if your in the right range is to be able to speak without panting. You mentioned your doing 1.5 hour rides thats fantastic! you just need to slow them down to get full benefit of the fat burning zone, at this speed your body also does other things -
    Training heart rate 60-70% HRmax- Improves the heart's ability to pump blood- Increases the number of small blood vessels in your muscles- Increases the enzymes in your muscles responsible for oxygen metabolism- Increases the strength of your muscles, tendons, ligaments and bones- Improves your endurance- Burns fat as the body's main energy source at this intensity.

    This is the foundation your body needs to build first!! So by going as fast as you can your skipping this important step. Happy trails sunnysang ;)
     
  14. sunnysang

    sunnysang New Member

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    hmmm interesting! i had thought carbs were a no no. I ride every day at about 3:30 to 4:00 (when i come from the hell hole they call school), and what happens is i relatively have cereal for breakfast and do not eat lunch. I do not have time to make a home lunch because my school starts at 6:45 in the morning and the lunch they serve at school is realativly dripping of grease and tastes like something out of the toilet. Basically its disgusting. The only thing ill do at lunch is drink a powerade or water. But at school, durring break at about 10:00 they give costco muffins, which i eat every school day, which i think muffins are high in carbs??. When i come home i imediately jump onto my bike, well i change into my new god sent cycling shorts (the savior to all cycling kind), and ride my ride which is relatively flat. After my ride, at about the 25 mile mark, ill stop at the neighborhood subway and eat the daily special (i do this every day i ride), i get 6 inch with everything but the oil and vinegar. And before i sleep ill drink a tall glass of milk with a bannana. Is that enough for the demands of cycling? I lasted about 5 days until my body rejected it (last friday, which i took a break), and it hasnt happened since.

    Refering to imanewbie, i realatively only have to catch my break when i jump into low gears when, say climbing that one hill in the park and when i get that energy burst after finishing the trail and riding the mile or three to subway at which i hit 30 mph on flat road for about a minute and then go down to about 22 mph (food makes me crazy i guess). Ill have to catch my breath a little bit, but not that severe. I think what it is is that i have a bike which many do not start with. I got a Trek Madone 5.2, but then i heard ppl say its not the bike, its the biker (i agree totally).

    And ima have to do research on that glycyinc index. The only time ive heard about it before now is that nutrisystem thing on tv, but i never thought to look into it. Thanks and thanks all for your input!
     
  15. daveryanwyoming

    daveryanwyoming Well-Known Member

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    Carbs are absolutely essential for an endurance athlete. The popularity of certain low carb diets has got a lot of folks thinking carbohydrates are the enemy. Notice the abundance of "low carb" or "low net carbs" advertisements, you sure didn't see this kind of stuff ten years ago. I'm not a big fan of intentionally putting your body into ketoacidosis(what happens when you run out of stored carbs and your body has to break down proteins for fuel, a warning sign for hypoglycemic shock and exactly what the stricter low carb diets do to your body) for anybody but especially not for someone involved in endurance sports.

    As the old cycling saying goes, "you burn fat in a carbo fire" you need the stored glycogen(which comes from consuming carbs) to fuel your exercise. It's also the only fuel your brain can use so even if you can break down proteins to fuel your working muscles you'd better keep some glycogen on board if you want to think straight.

    Ideally the carbs you consume will be low GI as pointed out above, but if you eat foods in combination it turns out not to be a very big deal. IOW if you eat a bannana alone it's relatively high GI and can result in an insulin response. That's fine while you're exercising or immediately after exercise when your body is real good at storing away glycogen. But otherwise it isn't ideal. But eat that bananna along with some fat or protein and the insulin response is much lower. Add some yogurt to your morning cereal and it will drop the effective GI and will stick with you a bit longer. Put some peanut butter on the bannana for an afternoon snack and again it lowers the GI and you won't be hungry again as soon.

    Anyway, carbs aren't the enemy. Highly processed carbs might be, I'm sure not recommending a doughnut a day and would minimize the cookies and muffins. But high fiber breads, fruits and vegetables, whole grains, etc. are all carbs and shouldn't be avoided.

    In the end it's calories consumed vs. calories burned that matter. There are very few magic bullets in terms of particular foods that result in quick weight loss. There's a huge industry of diet books and programs that lead you to believe there's a magic formula out there. The only real magic formula is exercise minus eating but if you don't eat enough you can't exercise. So it's all about balance and moderation. Eat a bit less, try to eat consciously(not because you're bored or for social reasons), eat whole foods when you can and exercise regularly.

    I know this concept of a "fat burning zone" is very common in the popular literature, but it doesn't really exist or hold up to scrutiny. Yes, you burn a higher percentage of fat vs. glycogen at lower intensities. But you burn a larger total number of both fat and glycogen calories if you work harder as long as you stay aerobic. Play around with any of the free online calories burned during exercise calculators or tables. It's real easy to see that you might burn 500 Calories/hour riding 11 mph of which maybe 70% will be fat. But if you ride 17 mph you can burn 1000 Calories/hour of which maybe 50% will be fat. In the first case you'd burn 350 fat Calories/hour in the second case 500 fat Calories/hour. Yeah you'll have to replenish some of that glycogen while you ride and when you get home but in the end you'll burn more fat. And as long as you stay aerobic you'll still get all those other benefits you listed and will be getting much faster as a bonus.

    Good luck,
    Dave
     
  16. Imanewbie

    Imanewbie New Member

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    He wont burn 1000 calories if he has to drink 600 calories to finish the ride.

    I find it ironic that you talk about "popular litrature" and scrutiny, and then go on to state your opinion as a fact, one that is based on speed and not on the workload of the individuals body. At least the "popular litrature" has hard science behind it, by nature any statement has to be general because each and every persons level of fitness is as unique as he is, but calorie consumption based on mph? sorry i've never seen that published by any institute of sport, in fact this is the first time i've heard of it.

    It takes training to burn fats at the high end of the aerobic range, simply because of one factor - oxygen - a well trained athletic cyclist will have the the extra blood vessels and muscle enzymes in place , a beginner will not.

    Even elite cyclists do training sessions that define the 60-70% max hr range as a part of thier program.
     
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