Race performance/overtrained?

[bigwillie013]

I had my A race on last weekends saturday. I had thought I had done everything right but here are some intriguing details that hopefully some of you might have a thought or two on:

1) in the last few L5 interval training sessions I was only hardly able to elevate my HRmax during these sessions (171) close to my HRmax (178 this year)

2) during the race I had a HRmax of 171. Power didn't drop from lap 2 to 3 (of total 3 laps) HRmax dropped from 171 in lap 1 to 165 in lap 2 and 161 in lap 3. HRavg for the laps: 1) 163, 2) 155, 3) 154. Wattsavg 1) 251, 2) 218, 3) 228. Looks like overpacing in lap1?? We wanted to chase down the first start block (1 minute in front) - which we did - but it cost loads of matches.

In the attached zip documents I've compared a race in May to this one. Although the race in May lasted in total 3:30h I cut out the first 2 hours only. But still I produced considerably more power in May (252W) than I did now (232W). I had an Alps camp 3 weeks ago and raised my TSS considerably then. I had hoped I recovered enough from it but by the looks of my race performance I didn't. I had produced more Wavg before the camp over 2 hours in training.

What I've done so far is to too take it easy for a few days (will only hit the bike on thursday for next training session) and see if my HR and Wattage readings will correlate better again.

Your thoughts?

BTW I still ranked 12th in my age group on saturday on a very hilly course with 1,600m of elevation on 70km. But with the higher power from May I assume I would have finished within the leading group being 2nd or 3rd in age group and 10th - 15th overall. Never mind.

 

[daveryanwyoming]

....What I've done so far is to too take it easy for a few days (will only hit the bike on thursday for next training session) and see if my HR and Wattage readings will correlate better again.

Your thoughts? ...

Throw away the HR strap.

If your race power is low and you feel awful that's all the data you need. If your race power was low and you felt like you were being too cagey and never really rolled the dice and made a big effort then think about tactics and racing more aggressively. You should know if you were too hammered or too flat to put out a better effort and the HR numbers aren't going to tell you anything new. Folks vary widely in terms of how their HR and power correlates and it changes all the time for a lot of reasons, especially when riding outdoors.

If you're chronically tired then rest as you've suggested. If you ran out of fuel then work on feeding yourself better prior to and during your events. If your legs were blocked up on race day then think about your taper and openers ride in the days leading up to important races. But none of those observations require a HR number and chasing a preconceived notion of HR/power correlation is a wild goose chase.

Good luck,
-Dave

 

[jhuskey]

I would not seriously gauge a training standard on the results of one race. You could have an off day, everybody does and I agree that you should not dwell on one aspect such as HR.
Experience will let you know your body in relation as to what to expect and congratulations on your finish.

 

[frost]

It looks like your Normalized Power was almost the same (well much closer) in both races (281 vs. 272). For a road race with its variable/stochastic nature, NP better reflects the intensity than AP. That 9w difference could easily come from eg. holding back one lap after the chase (like it looks like). Of course you would expect higher power figure later on season after good preparation but did you give it all?

If I remember right you reported increased FTP very soon after the training camp and also TSB close 0 already couple of weeks ago. Have you done L4 workouts recently? How has the power been comparing to May? How about the power in your L5 sessions? On the other words are you really down on power or was it just this race?

 

[frost]

BTW I still ranked 12th in my age group on saturday on a very hilly course with 1,600m of elevation on 70km. But with the higher power from May I assume I would have finished within the leading group being 2nd or 3rd in age group and 10th - 15th overall. Never mind.

Oh, yes and congratulations for the result! I bet in Germany 12th means leaving a big bunch behind!

 

[bigwillie013]

Throw away the HR strap.

If your race power is low and you feel awful that's all the data you need. If you're chronically tired then rest as you've suggested. If you ran out of fuel then work on feeding yourself better prior to and during your events. If your legs were blocked up on race day then think about your taper and openers ride in the days leading up to important races.
Good luck,
-Dave

Many interesting points you're making. First I have to say that I was getting tired of all this dedicated hard training just before the race already. Tapering didn't help that much as hoped and the openers ride was cancelled due to bad weather. looks like a bad idea although I had 2 days complete rest as a result.

I would not seriously gauge a training standard on the results of one race. You could have an off day, everybody does and I agree that you should not dwell on one aspect such as HR.

I have to say that this race was THE RACE for me this year! I had really thouht I can make it with the leading group over the first laps ascent at least. Did eventually loose only 5 minutes on the winner at the end but still you can imagine my deep disappointment, hence this post at the forum

It looks like your Normalized Power was almost the same (well much closer) in both races (281 vs. 272). For a road race with its variable/stochastic nature, NP better reflects the intensity than AP. That 9w difference could easily come from eg. holding back one lap after the chase (like it looks like). Of course you would expect higher power figure later on season after good preparation but did you give it all?

If I remember right you reported increased FTP very soon after the training camp and also TSB close 0 already couple of weeks ago. Have you done L4 workouts recently? How has the power been comparing to May? How about the power in your L5 sessions? On the other words are you really down on power or was it just this race?

I have to admit I didn't look at NP but rather on AP, clearly a mistake! And you're right the 2nd lap was somehow a recovery (but high level that was ) from the chase in the 1st.
Having compared some recent power files with older ones I found that my ergomo either did too high readings back then or does too low now as I need less time now for the same reference hill but have lower power readings!?!

Now with a few days after my disapponting (at first glance) race I feel I was too straight with myself. I improved some 6 minutes over last years performance having had rain this year for the second half rather than sunshine last year which would have taken another minute or 2 off my time.
I did a hard effort yesterday and my power is definitely not down. If it was it was only for the race - for whatever reasons (Dave had given some possible reason above)

Thanks for your most valued feedback on this. And just in case you're interested: I finished 35th overall of 650 starters and 12th in my age group of total 170 starters. Shouldn't be too disappointed

 

[bigbadwoulfe]

Pretty nice result there. Nice job!

 

[Meek One]

Throw away the HR strap.

I knew you were going to say that.