Re: 15 Year Study - Fast Food , Obesity and Insulin Resistance

Discussion in 'Food and nutrition' started by Daniel Hoffmeister, Jan 1, 2005.

  1. MU

    MU Guest

    On Wed, 05 Jan 2005 22:49:07 +0000, Dominic Shields wrote:

    > On Tue, 4 Jan 2005 18:16:08 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> Since when is counting calories the
    >>only way to become thin? There are zillions of normal weight people around
    >>who are thin and don't count calories.

    >
    > Absolutely, I'm one of them. But that's not really what interests me,
    > its why something so simple is made so complex, I appreciate that
    > everyone is different and that's what makes things interesting, but in
    > this area it is easy to see how unscrupulous people cash in on the
    > gullible. Everyone must know at some intellectual level that there are
    > no miracle cures and its up to the individual to eat less and exercise
    > more on a permanent basis because without the change of mindset,
    > everything else is false.


    Simple to answer. Ppl who make weight loss difficult do so out of a desire
    to setup a scenario for failure. Match that along with the magic pill, no
    discipline mentality, and you have what you have. A bunch of folks playing
    silly games with their health and trying to optimize (maximize) the amount
    of food and the types of food (crap) they can (continue) to eat.

    Then they come to alt support groups for mostly social reasons to find
    others who want to play the diet game with them. And when they fail, they
    fail together, supporting their myths.

    It used to be sad, now it is annoying.
     


  2. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    Dominic Shields wrote:
    || On Tue, 4 Jan 2005 18:16:08 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    || <[email protected]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| Since when is counting calories the
    ||| only way to become thin? There are zillions of normal weight
    ||| people around who are thin and don't count calories.
    ||
    || Absolutely, I'm one of them. But that's not really what interests me,
    || its why something so simple is made so complex, I appreciate that
    || everyone is different and that's what makes things interesting, but
    || in
    || this area it is easy to see how unscrupulous people cash in on the
    || gullible. Everyone must know at some intellectual level that there
    || are
    || no miracle cures and its up to the individual to eat less and
    || exercise
    || more on a permanent basis because without the change of mindset,
    || everything else is false.

    Agreed. But since humans are flawed things, the question is HOW. That
    where the complexity creeps in.
     
  3. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    Dominic Shields wrote:
    || On Tue, 4 Jan 2005 18:16:08 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    || <[email protected]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| Since when is counting calories the
    ||| only way to become thin? There are zillions of normal weight
    ||| people around who are thin and don't count calories.
    ||
    || Absolutely, I'm one of them. But that's not really what interests me,
    || its why something so simple is made so complex, I appreciate that
    || everyone is different and that's what makes things interesting, but
    || in
    || this area it is easy to see how unscrupulous people cash in on the
    || gullible. Everyone must know at some intellectual level that there
    || are
    || no miracle cures and its up to the individual to eat less and
    || exercise
    || more on a permanent basis because without the change of mindset,
    || everything else is false.

    Agreed. But since humans are flawed things, the question is HOW. That
    where the complexity creeps in.
     
  4. jbuch

    jbuch Guest

    Dominic Shields wrote:
     
  5. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    Dominic Shields wrote:
    || On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 18:40:50 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    || <[email protected]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| Agreed. But since humans are flawed things, the question is HOW.
    ||| That where the complexity creeps in.
    ||
    || I think its not contentious to say that there is a difference between
    || having a fancy for some item of food and real physical hunger, my
    || belief

    Note your use of the word "belief".

    is that the more we cater for fancies and feed them, the more
    || we associate a mild liking or routine snacking for genuine hunger and
    || the higher our baseline daily level of calories becomes.
    ||
    || There is no "how" other than deciding to change your life by totally
    || changing your attitude to food.

    And what makes you the expert on everyone else beside you? You seem to
    judge others by what you're able to accomplish. But let me ask you this: Are
    you excellent in *everything* you have ever done, even things you don't
    like? Is there no thing that you are poor at? Finally, do you claim to be
    all-knowing?

    || I continually make myself unpopular
    || by refusing food when I'm not hungry.

    I doubt that is why you're unpopular.
     
  6. MU

    MU Guest

    On Thu, 06 Jan 2005 21:40:04 +0000, Dominic Shields wrote:

    > There is no "how" other than deciding to change your life by totally
    > changing your attitude to food. I continually make myself unpopular by
    > refusing food when I'm not hungry.


    Wait until you refuse it and admit you're hungry.
     
  7. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    Dominic Shields wrote:
    || On Thu, 6 Jan 2005 16:47:58 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    || <[email protected]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| Note your use of the word "belief".
    ||
    || Interesting, you correctly grasped that this is my belief, not fact,
    || then go on to assert that I think I'm right about this or anything
    || else.
    || Where I did slip up is by bringing the personal into it, that is
    || always a mistake.

    In one statement you referred to your belief. then, in the next paragraph
    you started making statements that were much stronger than just belief - you
    statements were made as if you assumed they were fact, not opinion. And I
    think you even know that since you snipped all of these rest but yet refer
    to it here. Sad.
     
  8. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    Dominic Shields wrote:
    || On Fri, 7 Jan 2005 07:05:43 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    || <[email protected]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| Dominic Shields wrote:
    ||||| On Thu, 6 Jan 2005 16:47:58 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    ||||| <[email protected]> wrote:
    |||||
    |||||| Note your use of the word "belief".
    |||||
    ||||| Interesting, you correctly grasped that this is my belief, not
    ||||| fact, then go on to assert that I think I'm right about this or
    ||||| anything
    ||||| else.
    ||||| Where I did slip up is by bringing the personal into it, that is
    ||||| always a mistake.
    |||
    ||| In one statement you referred to your belief. then, in the next
    ||| paragraph you started making statements that were much stronger
    ||| than just belief - you statements were made as if you assumed they
    ||| were fact, not opinion. And I think you even know that since you
    ||| snipped all of these rest but yet refer to it here. Sad.
    ||
    || The snipping is done pure out of consideration for other readers as
    || the inability to snip is one of the most infuriating things people
    || can
    || do.
    || I quoted what you said that was bang on, the other bits I said are
    || still in the original message, I haven't erased them from history.
    || I've been frequenting newsgroups since at least 1994 and one of the
    || things I discovered fairly quickly was how annoying it is to have to
    || qualify everything with "In my humble opinion" - I find this
    || downright condescending, everything I say is obviously my opinion
    || unless I'm
    || quoting a scientific fact.

    So, how does one know when you're quoting scientific fact or not? Geez....
     
  9. Roger Zoul

    Roger Zoul Guest

    Dominic Shields wrote:
    || On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 08:31:59 -0500, "Roger Zoul"
    || <[email protected]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| So, how does one know when you're quoting scientific fact or not?
    ||| Geez....
    ||
    || Are we getting slightly into the realms of pedantry ? Anyway . . .
    || Like this (for example) - The Second Law Of Thermodynamics says
    ||
    || "The second law states that thermal energy, or heat, is special among
    || the types of energies: all the forms of energy can be converted into
    || heat, but in a way that is not reversible; it is not possible to
    || convert the heat back fully in its original form. In other words,
    || heat
    || is a form of energy of lower quality."
    || http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_law_of_thermodynamics

    Please....if you understand how to use language, then it is easy to express
    an opinion without having to say "in my opinion". For example, you could
    have said "I think anyone can lose weight by doing xxxxx " or "I believe
    losing weight merely boils down to xxx". Rather, you made a much stronger
    statement which leads one to believe that YOU are the holder of truth (or
    something).
     
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