Re: "Social rider" beef



S

Sarah Banick

Guest
"psycholist" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>>

> That's such ****. I'm so sick of "social" riders who act like you're
> doing something wrong just 'cuz you can, or you just like to, ride faster
> than they do. I never hear the fast riders complain about the "social"
> riders. But the "social" riders always feel compelled to tell the fast
> riders how they should ride.
>


Bob, can't you just be angry at the organizer and leave us slower/social
riders out of your anger? Your comments can be taken for a type of
arrogance -- one that can dissuade potential cyclists from getting involved
in the sport. Not everyone can be fast, and those of us who were usually
picked last for kickball enjoy cycling BECAUSE it isn't competitive.

I'm 42 with two partial knee replacements. I'm slow. I'm usually finishing a
50 when the century riders catch me. That can feel a little weird, so it
makes me feel good when somebody yells out a call of encouragement. Every
now and then, there's some (arrogant, egotistical) jerk who thinks I'm in
his way. Luckily, I'm wiser than I was 20 years ago. :)

We're all in this together: slow, fast, whatever. I'm never gonna be in the
pack, but I am staying healthy and enjoying the opportunity to meet a lot of
interesting people. To me, it's about the journey.

Each of us gets what we need from cycling. If either side "claims" the sport
as their own, it just alienates the other.

Ride on,
Sarah
 
Mon, 30 May 2005 17:59:28 -0400, <[email protected]>,
"Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote of fast vs. social
riders

>Each of us gets what we need from cycling. If either side "claims" the sport
>as their own, it just alienates the other.


Anybody claiming cycling is a"sport" without recognising that it's
much more than mere "sport" for many of us who choose it as their
lifestyle really makes me want to strangle them.

Cycling is life.

"Sport" serves no useful purpose. It's play. It's a game like tennis
or golf or ultimate frisbee. Utterly useless for anything other than a
pastime.

Go golf if you want a "sport" for people with lousy knees or start
racing if wish to pigeonhole cycling in the very limited realm of
"sport".
--
zk
 
"Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:eek:[email protected]...

> Each of us gets what we need from cycling. If either side "claims" the
> sport as their own, it just alienates the other.
>
> Ride on,
> Sarah


Sarah,

I thought that's pretty much what I was crying out for. In my case, I was
being told yet again that I "didn't ride right" by a "social rider" just
because I exceeded some mysterious, invisible speed limit that disqualified
me from the ride he organized. If you don't ride the way I do, you don't
hear the things I do. There's quite a crowd of people in my area who feel
compelled to tell me that I need to slow down and ride their way.
(Likewise, there are plenty of folks I enjoy riding with who like to ride
the way I do.) Aside from that garbage, I enjoy being involved in the club.
I've done the newsletters and designed logos and ride T-shirts. I'm
volunteering all the time. I also support the club financially, well beyond
my annual dues. When it's time to ride, I don't care to be told how I'm
supposed to ride. I ride just fine. I ride on the fog line and I'm
respectful of the traffic I share the road with. Most of the riders I ride
with through the week don't bother to be involved with the club 'cuz they're
sick of the "you ride too fast" garbage. I've always thought it quite
ironic that our club has driven away most of the really highly dedicated
riders who care enough about the sport to train seriously and who enjoy
riding at a very high level. (You can do that without actually racing.) I
stay involved with the club, but I get frustrated. I don't try to tell
others how they should ride except when they're being a danger to others or
when they're not sharing the road we're supposed to be sharing.

As for your partial knee replacements and your age, well, I'm 49. I got
slammed by a teenage driver talking on a cell phone just 2 1/2 years ago. I
was told I'd never ride again and that I might not walk again. I've got all
kinds of titanium hardware holding my left leg together (it held my left leg
on for a while), and I had fractures to my spine and pelvis. I know we all
have different constitutions and characters. I wasn't about to be handed
crutches and/or a wheelchair for life, but it amazed me to see how readily
people with whom I was in rehab accept those kinds of verdicts without
challenge. I ride and walk just fine today. Most limitations are in your
mind. Not all, but most.

If you're still in recovery mode, I wish you all the best! Well, I wish
you all the best, anyway.

--
Bob C.

"Of course it hurts. The trick is not minding that it hurts."
T. E. Lawrence (of Arabia)
 
Zoot Katz wrote:

> Anybody claiming cycling is a"sport" without recognising that it's
> much more than mere "sport" for many of us who choose it as their
> lifestyle really makes me want to strangle them.


It's obviously keeping YOU well-adjusted! (rofl)

Bill "the man needs a ride, I tells ya" S.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Zoot Katz <[email protected]> writes:
> Mon, 30 May 2005 17:59:28 -0400, <[email protected]>,
> "Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote of fast vs. social
> riders
>
>>Each of us gets what we need from cycling. If either side "claims" the sport
>>as their own, it just alienates the other.

>
> Anybody claiming cycling is a"sport" without recognising that it's
> much more than mere "sport" for many of us who choose it as their
> lifestyle really makes me want to strangle them.
>
> Cycling is life.


There's a picture of a kewl-looking Jorg & Olif cargo
bike in the June issue of Shared Vision magazine.

I tried looking for a URL to it at www.jorgandolif.com
but the bastards will only let browsers equipped with
Flash 5 in, which thoroughly pisses me off.


cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca
 
On Mon, 30 May 2005 21:31:22 -0700, [email protected] (Tom Keats)
wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>,
> Zoot Katz <[email protected]> writes:
>> Mon, 30 May 2005 17:59:28 -0400, <[email protected]>,
>> "Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote of fast vs. social
>> riders
>>
>>>Each of us gets what we need from cycling. If either side "claims" the sport
>>>as their own, it just alienates the other.

>>
>> Anybody claiming cycling is a"sport" without recognising that it's
>> much more than mere "sport" for many of us who choose it as their
>> lifestyle really makes me want to strangle them.
>>
>> Cycling is life.

>
>There's a picture of a kewl-looking Jorg & Olif cargo
>bike in the June issue of Shared Vision magazine.
>
>I tried looking for a URL to it at www.jorgandolif.com
>but the bastards will only let browsers equipped with
>Flash 5 in, which thoroughly pisses me off.
>
>
>cheers,
> Tom


The order form has some small pics. Maybe you can right click and save as
to view:

http://www.jorgandolif.com/jo_orderform.pdf

jj
 
Tue, 31 May 2005 03:37:10 GMT,
<[email protected]>, "Bill Sornson"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>> Anybody claiming cycling is a"sport" without recognising that it's
>> much more than mere "sport" for many of us who choose it as their
>> lifestyle really makes me want to strangle them.

>
>It's obviously keeping YOU well-adjusted! (rofl)
>
>Bill "the man needs a ride, I tells ya" S.


That may well be true but it raises my ire when people pigeonhole
cycling as a "sport" when bicycle racing is a sport while cycling
itself is far more. Sport is lame unless you're playing or betting.

I'm neither a "sports fan" nor an "athlete". I'm a cyclist.

When I attend bicycle races, the actual race is secondary to the
street theatre and public "happening".
--
zk
 
Tom Keats wrote:

> There's a picture of a kewl-looking Jorg & Olif cargo
> bike in the June issue of Shared Vision magazine.
>
> I tried looking for a URL to it at www.jorgandolif.com
> but the bastards will only let browsers equipped with
> Flash 5 in, which thoroughly pisses me off.


Don't think that bike is pictured, anyway (site is pretty bare, really).

Just out of curiosity, what's wrong with having Flash on your machine? (NOT
an endorsement of Flash sites, btw; I find 'em damned annoying 94.6% of the
time.)

-bs
 
Mon, 30 May 2005 22:29:28 -0700, <[email protected]>,
[email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

>I'm gonna have to have a close-up-&-personal look at
>those J&O city bikes, too. They're getting a lot of
>promo and advertising here lately.


That's because they finally got some. There was a call out on the
Velolove list for mechanics to assemble and service the shipment.

If you're still lookin' for a jobe, you could get paid to become tired
of seeing 'em.
--
zk
 
In article <[email protected]>,
"Bill Sornson" <[email protected]> writes:
> Tom Keats wrote:
>
>> There's a picture of a kewl-looking Jorg & Olif cargo
>> bike in the June issue of Shared Vision magazine.
>>
>> I tried looking for a URL to it at www.jorgandolif.com
>> but the bastards will only let browsers equipped with
>> Flash 5 in, which thoroughly pisses me off.

>
> Don't think that bike is pictured, anyway (site is pretty bare, really).
>
> Just out of curiosity, what's wrong with having Flash on your machine? (NOT
> an endorsement of Flash sites, btw; I find 'em damned annoying 94.6% of the
> time.)


It's not having Flash that bugs me -- it's /having/ to have it
to view the site at all. But then I guess I'm a curmudgeonly
fossil who remembers such concepts as backward compatibility
(as well as portability, and vertical development.)

If a street doesn't accommodate bicycles very well, it's
said to not be a "Complete Street". Correspondingly, I
figure a web site that can't be visited via Lynx (or
Netscape w/ Flash 4) is not a Complete Site.


cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca
 
Mon, 30 May 2005 23:14:51 -0700, <[email protected]>,
[email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

>
>If a street doesn't accommodate bicycles very well, it's
>said to not be a "Complete Street". Correspondingly, I
>figure a web site that can't be visited via Lynx (or
>Netscape w/ Flash 4) is not a Complete Site.


The munglumping Feds wouldn't let me file for EI online because my 128
bit encryption isn't part of some version of Nutscrape or Exploder.
Their dinky devil uppers don't know about Opera.
--
zk
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Zoot Katz <[email protected]> writes:
> Mon, 30 May 2005 23:14:51 -0700, <[email protected]>,
> [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>
>>
>>If a street doesn't accommodate bicycles very well, it's
>>said to not be a "Complete Street". Correspondingly, I
>>figure a web site that can't be visited via Lynx (or
>>Netscape w/ Flash 4) is not a Complete Site.

>
> The munglumping Feds wouldn't let me file for EI online because my 128
> bit encryption isn't part of some version of Nutscrape or Exploder.
> Their dinky devil uppers don't know about Opera.


I blame the undereducated, young-whippersnapper, know-it-all
web designers who choose to ignore the lessons learned by
prior generations about the desirability of backward
compatibility and portability.


cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Zoot Katz <[email protected]> writes:
> Mon, 30 May 2005 22:29:28 -0700, <[email protected]>,
> [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>
>>I'm gonna have to have a close-up-&-personal look at
>>those J&O city bikes, too. They're getting a lot of
>>promo and advertising here lately.

>
> That's because they finally got some. There was a call out on the
> Velolove list for mechanics to assemble and service the shipment.
>
> If you're still lookin' for a jobe, you could get paid to become tired
> of seeing 'em.


Yeah, I thought of that. But I think I'd rather dig out ol'
tree stumps for a living than risk having all the fun sucked
out of my interest in bikes, by making a job out of it.
I'm just more of a "work to live" than a "live to work" guy.


cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca
 
psycholist wrote:
:: "Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote in message
:: news:eek:[email protected]...
::
::: Each of us gets what we need from cycling. If either side "claims"
::: the sport as their own, it just alienates the other.
:::
::: Ride on,
::: Sarah
::
:: Sarah,
::
:: I thought that's pretty much what I was crying out for. In my case,
:: I was being told yet again that I "didn't ride right" by a "social
:: rider" just because I exceeded some mysterious, invisible speed
:: limit that disqualified me from the ride he organized. If you don't
:: ride the way I do, you don't hear the things I do. There's quite a
:: crowd of people in my area who feel compelled to tell me that I need
:: to slow down and ride their way. (Likewise, there are plenty of
:: folks I enjoy riding with who like to ride the way I do.) Aside
:: from that garbage, I enjoy being involved in the club. I've done the
:: newsletters and designed logos and ride T-shirts. I'm volunteering
:: all the time. I also support the club financially, well beyond my
:: annual dues. When it's time to ride, I don't care to be told how
:: I'm supposed to ride. I ride just fine. I ride on the fog line and
:: I'm respectful of the traffic I share the road with. Most of the
:: riders I ride with through the week don't bother to be involved with
:: the club 'cuz they're sick of the "you ride too fast" garbage. I've
:: always thought it quite ironic that our club has driven away most of
:: the really highly dedicated riders who care enough about the sport
:: to train seriously and who enjoy riding at a very high level. (You
:: can do that without actually racing.) I stay involved with the
:: club, but I get frustrated. I don't try to tell others how they
:: should ride except when they're being a danger to others or when
:: they're not sharing the road we're supposed to be sharing.
::
:: As for your partial knee replacements and your age, well, I'm 49. I
:: got slammed by a teenage driver talking on a cell phone just 2 1/2
:: years ago. I was told I'd never ride again and that I might not
:: walk again. I've got all kinds of titanium hardware holding my left
:: leg together (it held my left leg on for a while), and I had
:: fractures to my spine and pelvis. I know we all have different
:: constitutions and characters. I wasn't about to be handed crutches
:: and/or a wheelchair for life, but it amazed me to see how readily
:: people with whom I was in rehab accept those kinds of verdicts
:: without challenge. I ride and walk just fine today.

:: Most
:: limitations are in your mind. Not all, but most.

Please tell this to Maggie!!!!
 
>
> I thought that's pretty much what I was crying out for. In my case, I was
> being told yet again that I "didn't ride right" by a "social rider" just
> because I exceeded some mysterious, invisible speed limit that
> disqualified me from the ride he organized. If you don't ride the way I
> do, you don't hear the things I do.


True.

There's quite a crowd of people in my area who feel
> compelled to tell me that I need to slow down and ride their way.
> (Likewise, there are plenty of folks I enjoy riding with who like to ride
> the way I do.) Aside from that garbage, I enjoy being involved in the
> club. I've done the newsletters and designed logos and ride T-shirts. I'm
> volunteering all the time. I also support the club financially, well
> beyond my annual dues. When it's time to ride, I don't care to be told
> how I'm supposed to ride. I ride just fine. I ride on the fog line and
> I'm respectful of the traffic I share the road with. Most of the riders I
> ride with through the week don't bother to be involved with the club 'cuz
> they're sick of the "you ride too fast" garbage. I've always thought it
> quite ironic that our club has driven away most of the really highly
> dedicated riders who care enough about the sport to train seriously and
> who enjoy riding at a very high level. (You can do that without actually
> racing.) I stay involved with the club, but I get frustrated. I don't
> try to tell others how they should ride except when they're being a danger
> to others or when they're not sharing the road we're supposed to be
> sharing.
>
> As for your partial knee replacements and your age, well, I'm 49. I got
> slammed by a teenage driver talking on a cell phone just 2 1/2 years ago.
> I was told I'd never ride again and that I might not walk again. I've got
> all kinds of titanium hardware holding my left leg together (it held my
> left leg on for a while), and I had fractures to my spine and pelvis. I
> know we all have different constitutions and characters. I wasn't about
> to be handed crutches and/or a wheelchair for life, but it amazed me to
> see how readily people with whom I was in rehab accept those kinds of
> verdicts without challenge. I ride and walk just fine today. Most
> limitations are in your mind. Not all, but most.
>
> If you're still in recovery mode, I wish you all the best! Well, I wish
> you all the best, anyway.
>
> --
> Bob C.


Same to you. Yes, it's amazing how each small victory can lead to the next
one. :)

Sarah
 
>
> Anybody claiming cycling is a"sport" without recognising that it's
> much more than mere "sport" for many of us who choose it as their
> lifestyle really makes me want to strangle them.
>
> Cycling is life.
>
> "Sport" serves no useful purpose. It's play. It's a game like tennis
> or golf or ultimate frisbee. Utterly useless for anything other than a
> pastime.
>
> Go golf if you want a "sport" for people with lousy knees or start
> racing if wish to pigeonhole cycling in the very limited realm of
> "sport".


You sound like one of those fundamentalists who insists that their god is
the only one. So no one should cycle unless they do it your way?
 
"Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> Same to you. Yes, it's amazing how each small victory can lead to the next
> one. :)
>
> Sarah


Sarah, since you're coming back from two knee replacements, I'll tell you
that my most emotional moment in all my rehab related to the broken kneecap
injury I had. It was awful. The knee was so incredibly stiff. I had no
flexibility at all. I had to sleep with my leg strapped into this machine
that bent it back and forth all night long to try to reduce scar tissue and
promote flexibility.

Well, in rehab we'd finish each session with me on an exercise bike rocking
my foot back and forth to try to get my knee to bend more each day. It was
so frustrated when, after weeks of work, I was almost able to complete a
full revolution, but not quite. Then, finally, after six weeks of torturing
myself and trying to break that knee loose, I finally went all the way
around on the pedal on that bike. I cried. I couldn't believe it, but I
cried. That one pedal revolution was such a huge victory that I just broke
down. That evening, I rode my bike outside 12 miles. I thought my wife was
gonna kill me. The next evening I joined a 35 mile club ride. Then I
thought my doc was gonna kill me. But it all worked out.
Good luck!

--
Bob C.

"Of course it hurts. The trick is not minding that it hurts."
T. E. Lawrence (of Arabia)
 
psycholist wrote:
> "Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>> Same to you. Yes, it's amazing how each small victory can lead to
>> the next one. :)
>>
>> Sarah

>
> Sarah, since you're coming back from two knee replacements, I'll tell
> you that my most emotional moment in all my rehab related to the
> broken kneecap injury I had. It was awful. The knee was so
> incredibly stiff. I had no flexibility at all. I had to sleep with
> my leg strapped into this machine that bent it back and forth all
> night long to try to reduce scar tissue and promote flexibility.
>
> Well, in rehab we'd finish each session with me on an exercise bike
> rocking my foot back and forth to try to get my knee to bend more
> each day. It was so frustrated when, after weeks of work, I was
> almost able to complete a full revolution, but not quite. Then,
> finally, after six weeks of torturing myself and trying to break that
> knee loose, I finally went all the way around on the pedal on that
> bike. I cried. I couldn't believe it, but I cried. That one pedal
> revolution was such a huge victory that I just broke down. That
> evening, I rode my bike outside 12 miles. I thought my wife was
> gonna kill me. The next evening I joined a 35 mile club ride. Then
> I thought my doc was gonna kill me. But it all worked out.


Yo, Bob: You a member of any 12-step group(s) by any chance?!? You sure
got (some of) the requisite traits!

Meant in a nice way, BS (no, really :) )
 
Tue, 31 May 2005 16:19:23 -0400, <[email protected]>,
"Sarah Banick" <[email protected]> wrote:

>> Go golf if you want a "sport" for people with lousy knees or start
>> racing if wish to pigeonhole cycling in the very limited realm of
>> "sport".

>
>You sound like one of those fundamentalists who insists that their god is
>the only one. So no one should cycle unless they do it your way?


"Sport", in this context, means to me an active diversion requiring
physical exertion and competition. "Sport" is the occupation of
athletes.
It sounded to me like you were on a recreational ride, not a
competition. So tell me, how is your cycling a "sport"?
--
zk
 
"psycholist" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...


> Sarah, since you're coming back from two knee replacements, I'll tell you
> that my most emotional moment in all my rehab related to the broken
> kneecap injury I had. It was awful. The knee was so incredibly stiff. I
> had no flexibility at all. I had to sleep with my leg strapped into this
> machine that bent it back and forth all night long to try to reduce scar
> tissue and promote flexibility.


Oh yeah, I remember that machine well. I went through several rounds with my
knees before we even got to the surgery. Luckily, I work at home. So we set
it up on a chair next to my computer, with me turning sideways, and just
kept working.

>
> Well, in rehab we'd finish each session with me on an exercise bike
> rocking my foot back and forth to try to get my knee to bend more each
> day. It was so frustrated when, after weeks of work, I was almost able to
> complete a full revolution, but not quite. Then, finally, after six weeks
> of torturing myself and trying to break that knee loose, I finally went
> all the way around on the pedal on that bike. I cried. I couldn't
> believe it, but I cried. That one pedal revolution was such a huge
> victory that I just broke down. That evening, I rode my bike outside 12
> miles. I thought my wife was gonna kill me. The next evening I joined a
> 35 mile club ride. Then I thought my doc was gonna kill me. But it all
> worked out.
> Good luck!
>
> --

You must have been in good shape to come back so strong. I was doing 40 mile
rides before my knee problems, but they put off operating for so long
('cause of my young age) that I really got out of shape (I turned bowlegged
and my whole body ached - they thought I had fibromyalgia. I hate doctors).

Now I have 20 pounds to get rid of. But....I started riding again last fall,
and in less than two weeks I'm doing BRAG (Bike Ride Across Georgia). So
I've come back even stronger (assuming I live). Hills are still a *****, but
if I can make it through the first two days.... :)

I love to travel, but I can't walk long distances anymore. So I'll be biking
my way through Europe from now on!

Sarah
 

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