Re: Was Greg dirty in his day?



T

Tom Kunich

Guest
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> He didn't need to be doped up...at the age of 14 he won the US junior
> qualification road race decisively before he was even eligible to
> compete...he had more natural talent than any other US rider including
> one nut. Drugs were around then, but not like today... he kept getting
> better. He was also the first rider to crack the million dollar
> salary... breaking new ground for all pro riders.
>
> Callistus Valerius wrote:
>> Not being a LeMondologist, I ask the question, was Greg dirty in his
>> day? LeMond was before my time, and my knowledge of him consists of what
>> I've read in rbr. But if someone could fill in the knowledge gap.


Greg LeMond went from being a poor also ran in the Giro to a front runner in
the Tour de France after an "iron" shot. Sure, he had a blood disease and he
rode for a couple of years better than anyone else.
 
Tom Kunich wrote:
> Greg LeMond went from being a poor also ran in the Giro to a front runner in
> the Tour de France after an "iron" shot.


That someone could go from an also-ran to a contender in the space of a
month is not out of the question. Getting iron levels back up to where
they are supposed to be makes a sedentary person go from feeling like
garbage to feeling normal again. Imagine what it does for an athlete
who is being pushed very hard in a three-week stage race.

In addition, form can change quickly. Someone can be under-recovered
and undertaking a huge workload. One week easy and he feels great.

I'm not saying GL didn't dope, but it's very possible that he didn't,
and that the iron shot was really just an iron shot.
 
K

Kurgan Gringioni

Guest
[email protected] wrote:
> Tom Kunich wrote:
> > Greg LeMond went from being a poor also ran in the Giro to a front runner in
> > the Tour de France after an "iron" shot.

>
> That someone could go from an also-ran to a contender in the space of a
> month is not out of the question.





Dumbass -


It was a much shorter time than that. He went from laughing group to
finishing 2nd in the Giro's final day time trial.

That's what you call panache.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.
 
S

steve

Guest
Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > Greg LeMond went from being a poor also ran in the Giro to a front runner in
> > > the Tour de France after an "iron" shot.

> >
> > That someone could go from an also-ran to a contender in the space of a
> > month is not out of the question.

>
>
>
>
> Dumbass -
>
>
> It was a much shorter time than that. He went from laughing group to
> finishing 2nd in the Giro's final day time trial.
>
> That's what you call panache.
>
>
> thanks,
>
> K. Gringioni.


Being the same age I raced against him some. I remember racing against
him in the Wildwood, NJ crit in Oct 1978 and later in the Lowenbrau GP
Central Park RR in May or June 1979. The difference in his physique was
great. He seemed so much more muscular and my first reaction was
ster..ds(?)
 
J

Jack Maars

Guest
"steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>
>
> Being the same age I raced against him some. I remember racing against
> him in the Wildwood, NJ crit in Oct 1978 and later in the Lowenbrau GP
> Central Park RR in May or June 1979. The difference in his physique was
> great. He seemed so much more muscular and my first reaction was
> ster..ds(?)
>


It was the late '70s that Eddy Borysewicz got the USCF to send Greg to
Poland for two months.

Over there Greg was worked on by the same system that brought two
weightlifting gold medals to Waldemar Baszanowski in the light weight
division.
 
J

Jonathan v.d. Sluis

Guest
"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>
> [email protected] wrote:
>> Tom Kunich wrote:
>> > Greg LeMond went from being a poor also ran in the Giro to a front
>> > runner in the Tour de France after an "iron" shot.

>>
>> That someone could go from an also-ran to a contender in the space of
>> a month is not out of the question.

>
>
>
>
> Dumbass -
>
>
> It was a much shorter time than that. He went from laughing group to
> finishing 2nd in the Giro's final day time trial.
>
> That's what you call panache.
>
>
> thanks,
>
> K. Gringioni.
>


So you think that doping use can be derived from results?
 
C

Curtis L. Russell

Guest
On 29 Jun 2006 20:47:43 -0700, [email protected] wrote:

>That someone could go from an also-ran to a contender in the space of a
>month is not out of the question. Getting iron levels back up to where
>they are supposed to be makes a sedentary person go from feeling like
>garbage to feeling normal again.


Hell, there was a female asthmatic racer that would have a bad lap and
recover and ride off the front - Betsy somethingorother. I don't
particularly like Lemond, but my first reaction would be that he was
clean for the most part - other than the famous diarrhea stage.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...
 
M

Mark Fennell

Guest
steve wrote:
> Being the same age I raced against him some. I remember racing against
> him in the Wildwood, NJ crit in Oct 1978 and later in the Lowenbrau GP
> Central Park RR in May or June 1979. The difference in his physique was
> great. He seemed so much more muscular and my first reaction was
> ster..ds(?)


I don't believe that. He didn't change physically any more than you would
expect of a teenager.
 
E

Ernst Blofeld

Guest
Tom Kunich wrote:
> Greg LeMond went from being a poor also ran in the Giro to a front runner in
> the Tour de France after an "iron" shot. Sure, he had a blood disease and he
> rode for a couple of years better than anyone else.


EPO only became available in 1989, so it is highly unlikley that he was
on it in that Giro. I don't think anything else would have dramatic
effects
of that nature; amphetamenes would light up all the **** tests and
roids
wouldn't have that sort of effect on riding.

I suspect he was clean. He was a massive talent, better than
his three tour wins show. There are plenty of stories about unreal
things
he did as a teenage rider. He was riding the Red Zinger as a junior
and finishing in the top ten. (Was he limited to junior gearing in
that race?)
 
K

Kurgan Gringioni

Guest
Jonathan v.d. Sluis wrote:
> >
> > Dumbass -
> >
> >
> > It was a much shorter time than that. He went from laughing group to
> > finishing 2nd in the Giro's final day time trial.
> >
> > That's what you call panache.
> >
> >
> > thanks,
> >
> > K. Gringioni.
> >

>
> So you think that doping use can be derived from results?




Dumbass -


No.

The one who credited the "iron injection" for LemonD's miraculous
recovery was LemonD himself.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.
 
N

need more sun

Guest
I remember that...the story was that he was anaemic, very low iron/red
blood cell concentration. Given his talent and the fact that he was
coming back from such a tough situation, I think that is a plausable
explaination for how iron injections would have improved his level.

In fairness, guys, while I don't know Greg LeMond I do think he would
have to be remarkably stupid to be saying what he has been saying about
Armstrong had he been doping; someone would have come out of the
woodwork by now to say that Greg was also dirty. He's been brave in
speaking up, especially as Trek are involved in distributing his bikes,
so for me I think he was probably clean. He's got conviction and
courage to speak out so I'm on his side on this one. Too many guys keep
quiet, and that is part of the problem.

So bravo Greg, and Andy Hamsten, and anyone else who has voiced their
concerns...


Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
> Jonathan v.d. Sluis wrote:
> > >
> > > Dumbass -
> > >
> > >
> > > It was a much shorter time than that. He went from laughing group to
> > > finishing 2nd in the Giro's final day time trial.
> > >
> > > That's what you call panache.
> > >
> > >
> > > thanks,
> > >
> > > K. Gringioni.
> > >

> >
> > So you think that doping use can be derived from results?

>
>
>
> Dumbass -
>
>
> No.
>
> The one who credited the "iron injection" for LemonD's miraculous
> recovery was LemonD himself.
>
>
> thanks,
>
> K. Gringioni.
 
L

Les Earnest

Guest
Ernst Blofeld wrote:
> I suspect he [Lemond] was clean. He was a massive talent, better than
> his three tour wins show. There are plenty of stories about unreal
> things
> he did as a teenage rider. He was riding the Red Zinger as a junior
> and finishing in the top ten. (Was he limited to junior gearing in
> that race?)


No -- I got that silly rule removed the year before.

At the 1978 Butterfly Criterium in Pacific Grove, California, when the
junior gear rule was still in force and I was chief referee, I noticed
that Lemond's cadence in the senior race was about the same as the other
riders, so I asked for his bike at the end to do a gear check. He
responded "Never mind, it's illegal." I therefore had to disqualify him,
but felt bad about it.

That night I drafted a rule change to end this unfair rule and got the
U.S. Cycling Federation board of directors to approve it two weeks
later. Greg and his dad wrote a supporting letter, which helped.

-Les Earnest
 
M

Mark Fennell

Guest
Les Earnest wrote:
> No -- I got that silly rule removed the year before.
>
> At the 1978 Butterfly Criterium in Pacific Grove, California, when the
> junior gear rule was still in force and I was chief referee, I noticed
> that Lemond's cadence in the senior race was about the same as the other
> riders, so I asked for his bike at the end to do a gear check. He
> responded "Never mind, it's illegal." I therefore had to disqualify him,
> but felt bad about it.


Oh man, memory lane...every time I drive down Lighthouse in PG I remember
those great races. And wasn't it Rory O'Reilly who won because of that DQ?
Plus the day before, GL made an amazing last-lap bridge to another Santa
Barbaran, Larry Shields, to win (?) the senior race at Laguna Seca. I know
he didn't use jr gears (93" back then) that day either since he made the
bridge on the downhill. So, getting back on topic, yes I guess he was dirty
in his day by cheating on the gear restriction.