Ride an SUB not an SUV



Curtis L. Russell wrote:
> On 13 Apr 2007 11:27:43 -0700, "donquijote1954"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> As a matter of fact, windmills are a good solution --in some cases.
>
> Windmills are a good supplement. In the U.S. with tax breaks and
> setasides, even the oil companies are buying lots, but its a huge
> investment and it doesn't add up to much as a percentage of the power
> needed and in the windiest areas they aren't reliable enough to
> support even a small grid on their own. Windmills are not a solution.
>
> Curtis L. Russell
> Odenton, MD (USA)
> Just someone on two wheels...

Has anybody looked at the current generation of high-tech (sic) windmills?
They are a joke, and bird killers to boot.
The best windmill designs were those that were in use in the 1930's when
the TVA project demanded that a farmer take down or disable his windmill
to get power to the farm. Obviously that would take enough electricity
to pay for running out the electricity so the farmer could have electric
lights. The new, 3 skinny blade windmills are a joke since 90% of the
air pass right through the gaps.
The intake vanes of a modern jet engine show how a windmill should be
designed, along with a feathering mechanism for windy days.
Too much thinking for the current crop of over-educated dimwits.
Bill Baka
 
On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 00:31:11 -0700, Bill <[email protected]> wrote:

>Curtis L. Russell wrote:
>> On 13 Apr 2007 11:27:43 -0700, "donquijote1954"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> As a matter of fact, windmills are a good solution --in some cases.
>>
>> Windmills are a good supplement. In the U.S. with tax breaks and
>> setasides, even the oil companies are buying lots, but its a huge
>> investment and it doesn't add up to much as a percentage of the power
>> needed and in the windiest areas they aren't reliable enough to
>> support even a small grid on their own. Windmills are not a solution.
>>
>> Curtis L. Russell
>> Odenton, MD (USA)
>> Just someone on two wheels...
>
>Has anybody looked at the current generation of high-tech (sic) windmills?
>They are a joke, and bird killers to boot.

Oh, F the damn birds. Sit under the damn thing with a net, pluck 'em, fry at
350 degrees.

>The best windmill designs were those that were in use in the 1930's when
>the TVA project demanded that a farmer take down or disable his windmill
>to get power to the farm. Obviously that would take enough electricity
>to pay for running out the electricity so the farmer could have electric
>lights. The new, 3 skinny blade windmills are a joke since 90% of the
>air pass right through the gaps.

Will still produce 10 Kw from a 27 foot fan in a 12 mph wind, so they can't be
all that bad.

>The intake vanes of a modern jet engine show how a windmill should be
>designed, along with a feathering mechanism for windy days.
>Too much thinking for the current crop of over-educated dimwits.
>Bill Baka
 
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"Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >>
> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> news:[email protected]...
> >> > -
> >> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in
message
> >> > news:[email protected]...
> >> >>
> >> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> >> news:[email protected]...
> >> >> >
> >> >> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in
> > message
> >> >> > news:[email protected]...
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> >> >> news:[email protected]...
> >> >> >> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in
> >> > message
> >> >> >> > news:[email protected]...
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> >> >> >> news:[email protected]...
> >> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> > Do stay on track - the issue is whether we spend hundreds of
> >> >> >> >> > billions
> >> >> >> >> > of
> >> >> >> >> > dollars on Iraqi's or whether we spend a tenth of that on
our
> > own
> >> >> >> > people.
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > (and yes, there are reports that elections are not
> >> >> >> >> > particularly
> >> > fair
> >> >> > in
> >> >> >> >> > LA.)
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Then why did you bring up your feeling that the people of
> > Louisiana
> >> >> >> >> are
> >> >> >> >> somehow downtrodden in a way that Mississippians aren't?
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > Your question is nonsensical.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Obviously you don't have an answer then.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> > No, your question is nonsensical in this context. Your question
> > might
> >> > be
> >> >> > more appropriate in context with the US Attorneys firings that are
> >> >> > in
> >> > the
> >> >> > news.
> >> >>
> >> >> I see you've learned one of George Conklin's less admirable
> >> > techniques...If
> >> >> someone disagrees with you or questions you further, declare the
> >> >> comment/question irrelevant, drivel, or nonsensical. Nice :)
> >> >>
> >> > Then suppose you detail that relevance for us?
> >>
> >> That's what I was asking you to do.
> >>
> > Let's see - you want *me* to explain the relelavance of *your*
response?!
> > That's the sort of thing Conklin does.
>
> No, I want you to explain why you think your feeling that the people of
New
> Orleans are somehow uniquely downtrodden has anything to do with the topic
> of this threat or even this forum as a whole. And as an aside, do you
have
> any direct experience of the area that was hit by Katrina to base your
> reaction on?
>
"Feeling that the people of New Orleans are somehow uniquely downtrodden"
are YOUR words - YOU explain them.
 
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"Curtis L. Russell" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 13 Apr 2007 11:27:43 -0700, "donquijote1954"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >As a matter of fact, windmills are a good solution --in some cases.
>
> Windmills are a good supplement. In the U.S. with tax breaks and
> setasides, even the oil companies are buying lots, but its a huge
> investment and it doesn't add up to much as a percentage of the power
> needed and in the windiest areas they aren't reliable enough to
> support even a small grid on their own. Windmills are not a solution.
>
I guess you've never been to the Oregon Coast.
 
"nash" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:ZDwTh.64893$6m4.36854@pd7urf1no...
> "So defined, I repeat, freedom means concretely freedoms of various
> kinds, which may be at least roughly specified. Among the most
> fundamental is political freedom, involving some means of control of
> rulers by the ruled, some protection of the individual against
> government by legal rights or civil liberties."
>
> <<<<<,
>
> and we all know how well that worked out. Sorry could not resist
>

Y'all need to read Hofstadter's book on the paranoid in American politics.
You are good examples.
 
"Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> -
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> > news:[email protected]...
>> >>
>> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> >> news:[email protected]...
>> >> > -
>> >> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in
> message
>> >> > news:[email protected]...
>> >> >>
>> >> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> >> >> news:[email protected]...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in
>> > message
>> >> >> > news:[email protected]...
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> >> >> >> news:[email protected]...
>> >> >> >> > "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in
>> >> > message
>> >> >> >> > news:[email protected]...
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> >> >> >> >> news:[email protected]...
>> >> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >> > Do stay on track - the issue is whether we spend hundreds
>> >> >> >> >> > of
>> >> >> >> >> > billions
>> >> >> >> >> > of
>> >> >> >> >> > dollars on Iraqi's or whether we spend a tenth of that on
> our
>> > own
>> >> >> >> > people.
>> >> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >> > (and yes, there are reports that elections are not
>> >> >> >> >> > particularly
>> >> > fair
>> >> >> > in
>> >> >> >> >> > LA.)
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >> Then why did you bring up your feeling that the people of
>> > Louisiana
>> >> >> >> >> are
>> >> >> >> >> somehow downtrodden in a way that Mississippians aren't?
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > Your question is nonsensical.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Obviously you don't have an answer then.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> > No, your question is nonsensical in this context. Your question
>> > might
>> >> > be
>> >> >> > more appropriate in context with the US Attorneys firings that
>> >> >> > are
>> >> >> > in
>> >> > the
>> >> >> > news.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I see you've learned one of George Conklin's less admirable
>> >> > techniques...If
>> >> >> someone disagrees with you or questions you further, declare the
>> >> >> comment/question irrelevant, drivel, or nonsensical. Nice :)
>> >> >>
>> >> > Then suppose you detail that relevance for us?
>> >>
>> >> That's what I was asking you to do.
>> >>
>> > Let's see - you want *me* to explain the relelavance of *your*
> response?!
>> > That's the sort of thing Conklin does.
>>
>> No, I want you to explain why you think your feeling that the people of
> New
>> Orleans are somehow uniquely downtrodden has anything to do with the
>> topic
>> of this threat or even this forum as a whole. And as an aside, do you
> have
>> any direct experience of the area that was hit by Katrina to base your
>> reaction on?
>>
> "Feeling that the people of New Orleans are somehow uniquely downtrodden"
> are YOUR words - YOU explain them.

Well, you seem to think that there is something in national policy that is
holding back the New Orleans area, yet the Mississippi Gulf Coast is _not_
being held back. So, if that is not a function of _local_ leadership, the
logical conclusion is that you believe that there is a national policy that
somehow applies to New Orleans but not in Mississippi.

"Most of the people there CANNOT help themselves - the System has made sure
of that -- and Continues to make sure of that." as you said.

What is it about "the System" that is making sure the people of New Orleans
"CANNOT" help themselves, yet is not even remotely preventing the people of
Mississippi from helping themselves?

And, you never answered my question...have you ever actually *been* to the
storm-affected area, either before or after Katrina? If not, don't you
think the eye-witness account of an actual resident might have some sort of
weight?
 
"george conklin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "nash" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:ZDwTh.64893$6m4.36854@pd7urf1no...
>> "So defined, I repeat, freedom means concretely freedoms of various
>> kinds, which may be at least roughly specified. Among the most
>> fundamental is political freedom, involving some means of control of
>> rulers by the ruled, some protection of the individual against
>> government by legal rights or civil liberties."
>>
>> <<<<<,
>>
>> and we all know how well that worked out. Sorry could not resist
>>
>
> Y'all need to read Hofstadter's book on the paranoid in American politics.
> You are good examples.

Just because people are paranoid does not mean the government is not out to
get them!
 
On Apr 13, 5:20 pm, "di" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "donquijote1954" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > "The terrorists who attacked America weren't being funded primarily by
> > drug money. They were being funded primarily by oil money. In other
> > words, it isn't the drug addicts who should feel guilty. It's the
> > gasoline addicts."
>
> So where did this "oil money" come from? Before you answer, be careful,
> you about to justify the Iraq War.

My understanding is that it went through Saudi hands, just as the
terrorists were Saudis. And WHO feeds the Saudis? That's right, our
administration and our SUV drivers.
 
""We don't want to pollute - but it's OK if China does - - - ""

> Welcome to the Global Economy

> It's not politics - - It's business

> Remember supply and demand. How about we demand, and they supply. It's a new version of > the NIMBY syndrome. We want (just for you) new bicycles, but don't be polluting our air to
> make it for me.

You may as well may have given it the title "Welcome to the Jungle"...
which proves my point that we reject civilization in order to eat each
other --or may I say in order to compete unequally, where the unions --
American unions-- are crushed before the never tiring, never
complaining Chinese workers...

"What is the market? It is the law of the jungle, the law of nature.
And what is civilization? It is the struggle against nature."

http://www.federalreserve.gov/boarddocs/speeches/2003/20031211/default.htm

WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE
http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote
 
On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 09:34:08 -0700, "Baxter"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I guess you've never been to the Oregon Coast.

What power grid is supported solely by windmills? According to WSJ
sources, none in the U.S. - and in the windiest part of the U.S. on a
consistent basis - in the Southwest, not Oregon - even if the windmill
system is fully developed with state of the art technology, they can't
support a power grid on their own. That means that they may be a
useful or even a major adjunct, but they aren't a solution.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...
 
-
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Free software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------


"Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
> > "Feeling that the people of New Orleans are somehow uniquely
downtrodden"
> > are YOUR words - YOU explain them.
>
> Well, you seem to think that there is something in national policy that is
> holding back the New Orleans area, yet the Mississippi Gulf Coast is _not_
> being held back.

Your facts are wrong. Mississipi Coast is also in dire need of funds. They
are as bad off as New Orleans.

>
> And, you never answered my question...have you ever actually *been* to the
> storm-affected area, either before or after Katrina? If not, don't you
> think the eye-witness account of an actual resident might have some sort
of
> weight?
>
There's a lot of stories coming out of the area. What makes yours better
than the rest?
 
On Apr 14, 12:31 am, Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
> Curtis L. Russell wrote:
> > On 13 Apr 2007 11:27:43 -0700, "donquijote1954"
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> As a matter of fact, windmills are a good solution --in some cases.
>
> > Windmills are a good supplement. In the U.S. with tax breaks and
> > setasides, even the oil companies are buying lots, but its a huge
> > investment and it doesn't add up to much as a percentage of the power
> > needed and in the windiest areas they aren't reliable enough to
> > support even a small grid on their own. Windmills are not a solution.
>
> > Curtis L. Russell
> > Odenton, MD (USA)
> > Just someone on two wheels...
>
> Has anybody looked at the current generation of high-tech (sic) windmills?
> They are a joke, and bird killers to boot.
> The best windmill designs were those that were in use in the 1930's when
> the TVA project demanded that a farmer take down or disable his windmill
> to get power to the farm. Obviously that would take enough electricity
> to pay for running out the electricity so the farmer could have electric
> lights. The new, 3 skinny blade windmills are a joke since 90% of the
> air pass right through the gaps.
> The intake vanes of a modern jet engine show how a windmill should be
> designed, along with a feathering mechanism for windy days.
> Too much thinking for the current crop of over-educated dimwits.
> Bill Baka

The best hi tech windmills are from germany - they have
variable vane/airfoils that can adjust to the windspeed.
They are very tall structures and generate quite a bit of
power. Some environmentalist are worried that these
structures represent a danger to birds - I haven't come
across any scientific studies verifying this risk though.

The reason the blades/vanes are very thin is that this
design can structurally handle higher wind forces
and thus is more resistance to damage from high
winds. Lighter thinner blades require less wind
force to reach the minumum speed needed for
electric generation faster than if the windmill blades
were heavier and larger.

The intake vanes of a turbojet are designed to
runs at a different speed and different magnitude
of force than a windmill. There are similarities
in a turbojet's intake vanes and that of a
hydro electric generator's turbine. Nuclear
power plants that use hi pressure steam also
have electric generator turbines that look
similar to a turbojet's vanes.
 
"Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> -
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> "Amy Blankenship" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Baxter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>>
>> > "Feeling that the people of New Orleans are somehow uniquely
> downtrodden"
>> > are YOUR words - YOU explain them.
>>
>> Well, you seem to think that there is something in national policy that
>> is
>> holding back the New Orleans area, yet the Mississippi Gulf Coast is
>> _not_
>> being held back.
>
> Your facts are wrong. Mississipi Coast is also in dire need of funds.
> They
> are as bad off as New Orleans.
>
>>
>> And, you never answered my question...have you ever actually *been* to
>> the
>> storm-affected area, either before or after Katrina? If not, don't you
>> think the eye-witness account of an actual resident might have some sort
> of
>> weight?
>>
> There's a lot of stories coming out of the area. What makes yours better
> than the rest?

Because I have direct experience of the area, and I'm in a position to
judge. Obviously you haven't actually experienced either area, either
before or after the storm. You shouldn't just swallow whatever the news
services choose to focus on, but should find out for yourself.

Besides, it's not just a "story." If the system really were keeping people
down and not _local_ leadership, how do you account for the variation in how
different localities have recovered?
 
On Apr 14, 7:33 pm, "johnny@." <johnny@.> wrote:
> donquijote1954 wrote:
> > ""We don't want to pollute - but it's OK if China does - - - ""
>
> >> Welcome to the Global Economy
>
> >> It's not politics - - It's business
>
> >> Remember supply and demand. How about we demand, and they supply. It's a new version of > the NIMBY syndrome. We want (just for you) new bicycles, but don't be polluting our air to
> >> make it for me.
>
> > You may as well may have given it the title "Welcome to the Jungle"...
> > which proves my point that we reject civilization in order to eat each
> > other --or may I say in order to compete unequally, where the unions --
> > American unions-- are crushed before the never tiring, never
> > complaining Chinese workers...
>
> Oh, they complain, but when they do, they get crushed. By tanks!

Here the picture is different: You can complain, but they don't
listen. ;)

"Freedom is when the people can speak, democracy is when the
government listens" -Alastair Farrugia
 
This may sound Quixotic, but the future is up in the air, not in the
sense the Republicans make it likely, but in the sense of windmills.
Regrettably, not enough money is going into it, since --as you may
very well know, unless you are blind-- our resources are going into
war and other stupid ways to secure a long life for the dinosaurs, ie
the SUVs...

Wind Power Set to Become World's Leading Energy Source

Lester R. Brown

In 1991, a national wind resource inventory taken by the U.S.
Department of Energy startled the world when it reported that the
three most wind-rich states-North Dakota, Kansas, and Texas-had enough
harnessable wind energy to satisfy national electricity needs. Now a
new study by a team of engineers at Stanford reports that the wind
energy potential is actually substantially greater than that estimated
in 1991.

Advances in wind turbine design since 1991 allow turbines to operate
at lower wind speeds, to harness more of the wind's energy, and to
harvest it at greater heights-dramatically expanding the harnessable
wind resource. Add to this the recent bullish assessments of offshore
wind potential, and the enormity of the wind resource becomes
apparent. Wind power can meet not only all U.S. electricity needs, but
all U.S. energy needs.

....

Denmark leads the world in the share of its electricity from wind-20
percent. In terms of sheer generating capacity, Germany leads with
12,000 megawatts. By the end of 2003, it will have already surpassed
its 2010 goal of 12,500 megawatts of generating capacity. For Germany,
this rapid growth in wind power is central to reaching its goal of
reducing carbon emissions 40 percent by 2020.

....

The energy future belongs to wind. The world energy economy became
progressively more global during the twentieth century as the world
turned to oil. It promises to reverse direction and become more local
during the twenty-first century as the world turns to wind, wind-
generated hydrogen, and solar cells. Wind and wind-generated hydrogen
will shape not only the energy sector of the global economy but the
global economy itself.

http://www.earth-policy.org/Updates/Update24.htm
 
drydem wrote:
> On Apr 14, 12:31 am, Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Curtis L. Russell wrote:
>>> On 13 Apr 2007 11:27:43 -0700, "donquijote1954"
>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> As a matter of fact, windmills are a good solution --in some cases.
>>> Windmills are a good supplement. In the U.S. with tax breaks and
>>> setasides, even the oil companies are buying lots, but its a huge
>>> investment and it doesn't add up to much as a percentage of the power
>>> needed and in the windiest areas they aren't reliable enough to
>>> support even a small grid on their own. Windmills are not a solution.
>>> Curtis L. Russell
>>> Odenton, MD (USA)
>>> Just someone on two wheels...
>> Has anybody looked at the current generation of high-tech (sic) windmills?
>> They are a joke, and bird killers to boot.
>> The best windmill designs were those that were in use in the 1930's when
>> the TVA project demanded that a farmer take down or disable his windmill
>> to get power to the farm. Obviously that would take enough electricity
>> to pay for running out the electricity so the farmer could have electric
>> lights. The new, 3 skinny blade windmills are a joke since 90% of the
>> air pass right through the gaps.
>> The intake vanes of a modern jet engine show how a windmill should be
>> designed, along with a feathering mechanism for windy days.
>> Too much thinking for the current crop of over-educated dimwits.
>> Bill Baka
>
> The best hi tech windmills are from germany - they have
> variable vane/airfoils that can adjust to the windspeed.
> They are very tall structures and generate quite a bit of
> power. Some environmentalist are worried that these
> structures represent a danger to birds - I haven't come
> across any scientific studies verifying this risk though.
>
> The reason the blades/vanes are very thin is that this
> design can structurally handle higher wind forces
> and thus is more resistance to damage from high
> winds. Lighter thinner blades require less wind
> force to reach the minumum speed needed for
> electric generation faster than if the windmill blades
> were heavier and larger.

The reason the blades are thin is they LOOK hi-tech.
When I see a big wind generator all I see is inefficiency.
Most of the wind goes through the HUGE gap between the blades.
When birds try to do that most get through but some get nailed by the
next blade. I won't try to debate with you since if you don't understand
now I doubt that you ever will.
Bill Baka
>
> The intake vanes of a turbojet are designed to
> runs at a different speed and different magnitude
> of force than a windmill. There are similarities
> in a turbojet's intake vanes and that of a
> hydro electric generator's turbine. Nuclear
> power plants that use hi pressure steam also
> have electric generator turbines that look
> similar to a turbojet's vanes.
>
>
 
"di" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

>
> "donquijote1954" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>> "The terrorists who attacked America weren't being funded primarily
>> by drug money. They were being funded primarily by oil money. In
>> other words, it isn't the drug addicts who should feel guilty. It's
>> the gasoline addicts."
>>
>
> So where did this "oil money" come from? Before you answer, be
> careful, you about to justify the Iraq War.
>
>
>

The people who who attacked America on 9/11 were funded by the taxes the
Americam people pay every year on April 15. They are :
Elliott Abrams
Gary Bauer
William J. Bennett
Jeb Bush
**** Cheney
Eliot A. Cohen
Midge Decter
Paula Dobriansky
Steve Forbes
Aaron Friedberg
Francis Fukuyama
Frank Gaffney
Fred C. Ikle
Donald Kagan
Zalmay Khalilzad
I. Lewis Libby
Norman Podhoretz
Dan Quayle
Peter W. Rodman
Stephen P. Rosen
Henry S. Rowen
Donald Rumsfeld
Vin Weber
George Weigel
Paul Wolfowitz


Please see : http://www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
 
> So, don quixote, What would it take to get you to sell
> us all down the river?

Well, besides T-shirts (I don't think the store is even working), I'm
selling the idea of THE REVOLUTION. Hey, don't you think of Chavez
taking over here --or even Obama (much less Osama)--, but rather to
get America going in the path toward change and civilization, say the
Canadian DEMOCRATIC way. Yes, they have signed the Kyoto Protocol,
provide Healthcare for all and stayed away from this predatory war...

So if you want to buy the idea let me know. Absolutely free. ;)

THE REVOLUTION
http://webspawner.com/users/bananarevolution
 
On Apr 14, 3:18 pm, "george conklin" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "nash" <[email protected]> wrote in message

>
> Y'all need to read Hofstadter's book on the paranoid in American politics.
> You are good examples.

George, Big Oil and Big Tobacco are very similar. Even when Big
Tobacco knew of the risks of smoking, they dismissed it by hiring a
good PR firm to throw confusion about the issue. Maybe you should try
to work for one, if you are not already doing so...

The big difference is that smokers mostly pollute their own lungs.
SUVs, though, are dangerous to all who inhabit this planet. A label
may just say, "This Supersized Unnecessary Vehicle is dangerous to
your health, and to those around you."
 
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