Riders that Never were?

[Mapei81]

To say that "much more" was expected of Rominger is ridiculous. The guy won three Vueltas, a Giro,
the hour record, second place in the Tour, the climber's jersey, several classics and a slew of
lesser races like the Med Tour and Paris-Nice. Yeah, he was second best to Indurain in the Tour, but
no one other than Big Mig won "much" more in his era. No one who really knew racing expected him to
beat Indurain head-to-head, and he won everything that he *was* expected to.

Dumbass.

 

[Kurgan Gringion]

"h squared" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
> >
>
> > There's an advantage to being an underdog: you've got something to prove
and
> > there's nothing to lose.
> >
> > Being the opposite (overdog?) has a lot to lose and little to gain:
perform
> > well and you're even, perform poorly and you've let down everyone who
had
> > expectations.
>
> a friend once sent me a comment about an inline skater who has over 40 world championship medals.
> he told me- "One reason he doesn't like skating now is that if he wins by too little a margin
> people say he's doing poorly."
>
> i could never stand up against those kind of expectations.

I can tell, by your response to being annointed the Supreme Ruler of this newsgroup.

>this is one reason why i find LANCE interesting to watch, because these kinds of things don't seem
>to get to him at all.

Sure they do.

Do a google on his wife's article right after Luz Ardiden. There were a few interesting tidbits
about the pressure of having so many people's livelihood depending upon his performance as well as
the hopes of all those cancer victims.

 

[Amit]

[email protected] (Davide Tosi) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> [email protected] (Crank Yanker) wrote:
>
> >In the spirit of the "greatest crashers in cycling" thread, who were the "greatest" riders that
> >never fulfilled the promise they showed early in their career?
> >
> >In recent years, Kloden and Vainstains come to mind.
>
> In the last 30 years or so, the ones in which I had been following cycling, most of those guys
> were Belgians. As soon as some of those guys started to win something, they were soon entitled to
> a future of greatness by flemish newspapers.

That's because the Belgians have big shoes to fill. Bruyneel was another who was supposed to be the
next big Tour contender.

The same thing is happening in Spain now for a few years, they are looking for the next Indurain.
Two big washouts have been Santiago Blanco and Juan Carlos Dominguez, both decent riders, but
neither able to live up to their billing.

 

[Davide Tosi]

"Nick Burns" <[email protected]> wrote:

>Here are more:
>
>Giorgio Furlan

No. Giorgio Furlan falls in the opposite category: the overachiever. Until the very day he started
winning important races, everybody in the Italian cycling environment considered him just a good
coequipier. He had never been the hope of becoming the next whoever. When he won T-A, M-SR and FW
he was already bordering his 30s and about everyone (press, other cyclists, team ds) were
convinced that each of his important achievement was going to be the last one. In fact most
insiders knew that he was just someone who managed to discover some "right stuff" before most of
the rest of the peloton.

OTOH the mid '90s Italian rider that was assumed to be the next Argentin but did fail to fulfil
those high expectations is Gabriele Colombo, the winner of '96 M-SR.

 

[Royg]

Pantani

"Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In the spirit of the "greatest crashers in cycling" thread, who were the "greatest" riders that
> never fulfilled the promise they showed early in their career?
>
> In recent years, Kloden and Vainstains come to mind.

 

[Omc]

[email protected] (Joshua Zlotlow) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> >Subject: Re: Riders that Never were? From: [email protected] (chris) Date: 8/24/03 3:32 PM
> >Pacific Daylight Time Message-id: <[email protected]>
>
> >
> >Jeff Evanshine.
>
> I wouldn't count winning a junior world championship and not having a stellar career as worthy of
> mention. I don't think a junior world championship really counts for much. Josh Zlotlow
> [email protected] Sacramento, California Sacramento Golden Wheelmen www.sacgw.com

Don't forget Matt Kelly...........His "coach" was quoted that he was the next Lance. One year later,
he is missing from the OTC, returned home to Minnesota totally burned out never to be heard from
again. What kind of coach would destroy such a talent in less than a year ?

OMC

 

[Bob Schwartz]

Nick Burns <[email protected]> wrote:

> "Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> In the spirit of the "greatest crashers in cycling" thread, who were the "greatest" riders that
>> never fulfilled the promise they showed early in their career?
>>
>> In recent years, Kloden and Vainstains come to mind.

> Here are more:

> Joel Pelier Luc Roosen Fabio Baldato Eugeni Berzin Abraham Olano Giorgio Furlan Pavel Tonkov Raul
> Alcala Jose Maria Jimenez Andy Hampsten Roy Knickman

> (OK, there are too many more but I am getting bored...the point is that most pros fail to meet the
> lofty expectations of their fans)

With respect to the grand tour riders in that list, neither Hampsten or Jimenez ever established
themselves as the complete riders that you need to be in order to be a force over three weeks. So I
think a Giro, several single week tours, and several great mountain stages are about what anyone
could have expected from Hampsten. Jimenez never came close to accomplishing that much. His career
is awash in lost opportunity.

A guy like Olano, OTOH, comes much closer to the grand tour ideal. A great career, sure. But you
would have to think that if he had had Indurain's exceptional drive there would have been more than
a single Vuelta accomplished through the overwhelming superiority of his team.

Maybe it's time to stop screwing around and list everyone that has ever ridden for ONCE, the kings
of Spanish one week stage races that no one outside of Spain pays attention to. Steve Perryman, are
you out there?

Bob Schwartz [email protected]

 

[Clovis Lark]

Bob Schwartz <[email protected]> wrote:
> Nick Burns <[email protected]> wrote:

>> "Crank Yanker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> In the spirit of the "greatest crashers in cycling" thread, who were the "greatest" riders that
>>> never fulfilled the promise they showed early in their career?
>>>
>>> In recent years, Kloden and Vainstains come to mind.

>> Here are more:

>> Joel Pelier Luc Roosen Fabio Baldato Eugeni Berzin Abraham Olano Giorgio Furlan Pavel Tonkov Raul
>> Alcala Jose Maria Jimenez Andy Hampsten Roy Knickman

>> (OK, there are too many more but I am getting bored...the point is that most pros fail to meet
>> the lofty expectations of their fans)

"They said I was supposed to be the next Willie Mays. When they told me that, it was an honor.
You're talking about a guy who I considered the greatest player to ever wear shoes. I probably had
more success than anyone they ever put that label on. You show me another guy who's going to do
30-30 five times. But all the writers kept talking about was potential. You haven't reached your
potential yet, they say. Well, unless you win a Pulitzer Prize, you're not living up to your
potential either, are you?"

(Bobby Bonds riposte to journalists)

> With respect to the grand tour riders in that list, neither Hampsten or Jimenez ever established
> themselves as the complete riders that you need to be in order to be a force over three weeks. So
> I think a Giro, several single week tours, and several great mountain stages are about what anyone
> could have expected from Hampsten. Jimenez never came close to accomplishing that much. His career
> is awash in lost opportunity.

> A guy like Olano, OTOH, comes much closer to the grand tour ideal. A great career, sure. But you
> would have to think that if he had had Indurain's exceptional drive there would have been more
> than a single Vuelta accomplished through the overwhelming superiority of his team.

> Maybe it's time to stop screwing around and list everyone that has ever ridden for ONCE, the kings
> of Spanish one week stage races that no one outside of Spain pays attention to. Steve Perryman,
> are you out there?

> Bob Schwartz [email protected]

 

[K. J. Papai]

"Nick Burns" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> "Ken Papai" <ken@as usual.
>
> I did not expect *you* to get it.

Oh you're just trolling on Rominger and Jaja... OK. Chris/Nick.

Really funny.

 

[Crank Yanker]

> Don't forget Matt Kelly...........His "coach" was quoted that he was the next Lance. One year
> later, he is missing from the OTC, returned home to Minnesota totally burned out never to be heard
> from again. What kind of coach would destroy such a talent in less than a year ?
>
> OMC

A guy I know knew Kelly on the national junior mountain bike scene and said he was a very strange
guy. FWIW, he believed Kelly became anorexic and that's what led to his leaving cycling.

 

[Carl Sundquist]

"OMC" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> Don't forget Matt Kelly...........His "coach" was quoted that he was the next Lance. One year
> later, he is missing from the OTC, returned home to Minnesota totally burned out never to be heard
> from again. What kind of coach would destroy such a talent in less than a year ?
>

Charlie Walsh?

 

[Chris]

???I never said anything like that.

[email protected] (Mapei81) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> To say that "much more" was expected of Rominger is ridiculous. The guy won three Vueltas, a Giro,
> the hour record, second place in the Tour, the climber's jersey, several classics and a slew of
> lesser races like the Med Tour and Paris-Nice. Yeah, he was second best to Indurain in the Tour,
> but no one other than Big Mig won "much" more in his era. No one who really knew racing expected
> him to beat Indurain head-to-head, and he won everything that he *was* expected to.
>
> Dumbass.

 

[Chris]

Josh, I think the post was Riders that never were...Jeff had as much talent, if not more, than Fast
Freddy and he quit before he reached 24 or 25. Tough to say he had a less than stellar career.
Besides, Mike Neel referred to him as the most talented rider he had worked with.

CH

[email protected] (Joshua Zlotlow) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> >Subject: Re: Riders that Never were? From: [email protected] (chris) Date: 8/24/03 3:32 PM
> >Pacific Daylight Time Message-id: <[email protected]>
>
> >
> >Jeff Evanshine.
>
> I wouldn't count winning a junior world championship and not having a stellar career as worthy of
> mention. I don't think a junior world championship really counts for much. Josh Zlotlow
> [email protected] Sacramento, California Sacramento Golden Wheelmen www.sacgw.com

 

[Chris]

More like Chris Carmichael. You know, Carmichael "killed" a lot of riders, as he himself has
admitted. It was common in the 90's for the National team to end a lot of careers.

"Carl Sundquist" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> "OMC" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >
> > Don't forget Matt Kelly...........His "coach" was quoted that he was the next Lance. One year
> > later, he is missing from the OTC, returned home to Minnesota totally burned out never to be
> > heard from again. What kind of coach would destroy such a talent in less than a year ?
> >
>
> Charlie Walsh?

 

[Chris]

This strikes a cord. I knew a kid by the name of Justin Bartlett who was quite a talent but was so
screwed up in the head...well you had to really know him. Ultimately he was a real shithead, but
also a pathalogical liar involved in insurance fraud, a drug dealer from time to time and bulemic.
He went from the pro track to nothing in about a year.

[email protected] (Crank Yanker) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > Don't forget Matt Kelly...........His "coach" was quoted that he was the next Lance. One year
> > later, he is missing from the OTC, returned home to Minnesota totally burned out never to be
> > heard from again. What kind of coach would destroy such a talent in less than a year ?
> >
> > OMC
>
> A guy I know knew Kelly on the national junior mountain bike scene and said he was a very strange
> guy. FWIW, he believed Kelly became anorexic and that's what led to his leaving cycling.

 

[Kurgan Gringion]

"h squared" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> k.a. wrote- "But when you are going for five wins in a row? No, you are not the underdog. Instead
> you get to attach a trailer to your bike, filled with the world's expectations, hopes of
> cancer patients everywhere, all the folks who now make a living from your pedaling, and
> pressure from all
sides."
>
> but see, that's kind of my question, how does he keep from crumbling like a little ***** and
> giving up or setting himself up to fail when under that kind of heavy ****?

Because he's not you.

His detached attitude may serve him very well.

 

[H Squared]

Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
>
> Because he's not you.

i knew bringing up personal experience would be a mistake, but i thought it would help to get my
point about lance across if i compared him to someone who is as much a loser as he is a winner.
looking at the direct opposite can be helpful when trying to understand something. at least now do
you see what i meant by lance isn't bothered by other's expectations?

anyway, i've explained it more than it's interest factor rates, so i'll be quiet now, h

 

[Kurgan Gringion]

"h squared" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
> >
> > Because he's not you.
>
> i knew bringing up personal experience would be a mistake, but i thought it would help to get my
> point about lance across if i compared him to someone who is as much a loser as he is a winner.
> looking at the direct opposite can be helpful when trying to understand something. at least now do
> you see what i meant by lance isn't bothered by other's expectations?

It may not show up in his performance, but very few human beings have the ability to
compartmentalize to the extent that it wouldn't affect them at all.

At least none that I know. I assume some must exist.

 

[H Squared]

Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
>
>
> It may not show up in his performance, but very few human beings have the ability to
> compartmentalize to the extent that it wouldn't affect them at all.

ok, my initial statement was a little extreme, sorry. what you wrote is better/more accurate.

xheather

 

[Carl Sundquist]

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> It may not show up in his performance, but very few human beings have the ability to
> compartmentalize to the extent that it wouldn't affect them at all.
>
> At least none that I know. I assume some must exist.
>

You could probably find a fair number of them in maximum security prisons.