Sachs Ergo Levers- How to tell what rear der they are compatible with?

[RobertPerkins]

I have two sets of Sachs Ergo (made by Campy) 8-speed brake/shift
levers. Both are from around 1993.

I am currently using one set of Ergo with a Deore rear der on 7s
Shimano hyperglide. It seems to work okay, especially after I aligned
my derailleur hanger. I had heard that they shifted 3.1mm per click,
like the shimano 7s shifters, though it has never been clear to me if I
should ideally be using a new success derailleur. Or, perhaps, the
new success derailleur is compatible with shimano derailleurs. Who
knows?

Is there a way to check out the shift disks?

I heard that Sachs later sold Ergo levers that were intended to work
with Shimano 8s using Shimano derailleurs. If this is true, how do I
tell if I have one of them?

So, for these particular Sachs Ergo levers, is there any way to
determine what combinations of Sachs, Shimano, or Campy rear
derailleurs will work with Shimano 7s or Shimano 8s?

Right now, it is
Sachs Ergo 8s, Shimano Deore 7s long cage rear der, Shimano hyperglide
7s cogs.

Thanks, Rob

 

[Dave Mayer]

"RobertPerkins" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>I have two sets of Sachs Ergo (made by Campy) 8-speed brake/shift
> levers. Both are from around 1993.

I have a pair of these.

>
> I am currently using one set of Ergo with a Deore rear der on 7s
> Shimano hyperglide. It seems to work okay, especially after I aligned
> my derailleur hanger. I had heard that they shifted 3.1mm per click,
> like the shimano 7s shifters, though it has never been clear to me if I
> should ideally be using a new success derailleur. Or, perhaps, the
> new success derailleur is compatible with shimano derailleurs. Who
> knows?
>
These shifters were designed for use with Sachs New Success Rear
derailleurs. They work poorly with Shimano derailleurs. They work even
worse with Campy derailleurs. Some folks have stated that they 'work' with
Shimano, but these folks may have never experienced a fully dialed-in
drivetrain before. With a Shimano derailleur, you'll get clattering, missed
gears and the chain jumping around the cogset. With a New Success RD, they
will work 100% right away without any fooling around. The mechanical
advantage of the Shimano derailleurs and the Sachs derailleur was just plain
different during the early 90's.

BTW: these were designed for a cog spacing of 5.0mm cog center to center.
It will likely work with Shimano 8-speed spacing of 4.8mm, but it will be
more finicky.

> Is there a way to check out the shift disks?
>
> I heard that Sachs later sold Ergo levers that were intended to work
> with Shimano 8s using Shimano derailleurs. If this is true, how do I
> tell if I have one of them?

There is a long standing difference of opinion on this subject within this
group. Some say that the shifters are compatible with Shimano; my
experience is definitely not. My theory is that Sachs introduced a version
of the Ergopower shift disk in the late 90's that was compatible with
Shimano derailleurs. They also likely modified their derailleurs as well
for compatibility. If your shifters are from 1993 (only one year after the
mass introduction of Ergo by Campy), then you would certainly have the
non-compatible version.
>
> So, for these particular Sachs Ergo levers, is there any way to
> determine what combinations of Sachs, Shimano, or Campy rear
> derailleurs will work with Shimano 7s or Shimano 8s?

First test is to try out a Shimano rear derailleur and a 7-speed freewheel
or cassette. If it bangs off every shift perfectly right out of the box,
then you've got lucky. Otherwise, hunt down a Sachs New Success derailleur.
Ebay.
>
> Right now, it is
> Sachs Ergo 8s, Shimano Deore 7s long cage rear der, Shimano hyperglide
> 7s cogs.
>
> Thanks, Rob
>

 

[M-gineering]

Dave Mayer wrote:
> "RobertPerkins" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> I have two sets of Sachs Ergo (made by Campy) 8-speed brake/shift
>> levers. Both are from around 1993.
>
> I have a pair of these.
>
>> I am currently using one set of Ergo with a Deore rear der on 7s
>> Shimano hyperglide. It seems to work okay, especially after I aligned
>> my derailleur hanger. I had heard that they shifted 3.1mm per click,
>> like the shimano 7s shifters, though it has never been clear to me if I
>> should ideally be using a new success derailleur. Or, perhaps, the
>> new success derailleur is compatible with shimano derailleurs. Who
>> knows?
>>
> These shifters were designed for use with Sachs New Success Rear
> derailleurs. They work poorly with Shimano derailleurs. They work even
> worse with Campy derailleurs. Some folks have stated that they 'work' with
> Shimano, but these folks may have never experienced a fully dialed-in
> drivetrain before. With a Shimano derailleur, you'll get clattering, missed
> gears and the chain jumping around the cogset. With a New Success RD, they
> will work 100% right away without any fooling around. The mechanical
> advantage of the Shimano derailleurs and the Sachs derailleur was just plain
> different during the early 90's.
>
> BTW: these were designed for a cog spacing of 5.0mm cog center to center.
> It will likely work with Shimano 8-speed spacing of 4.8mm, but it will be
> more finicky.
>
>> Is there a way to check out the shift disks?
>>
>> I heard that Sachs later sold Ergo levers that were intended to work
>> with Shimano 8s using Shimano derailleurs. If this is true, how do I
>> tell if I have one of them?
>
> There is a long standing difference of opinion on this subject within this
> group. Some say that the shifters are compatible with Shimano; my
> experience is definitely not. My theory is that Sachs introduced a version
> of the Ergopower shift disk in the late 90's that was compatible with
> Shimano derailleurs. They also likely modified their derailleurs as well
> for compatibility. If your shifters are from 1993 (only one year after the
> mass introduction of Ergo by Campy), then you would certainly have the
> non-compatible version.
>> So, for these particular Sachs Ergo levers, is there any way to
>> determine what combinations of Sachs, Shimano, or Campy rear
>> derailleurs will work with Shimano 7s or Shimano 8s?
>
> First test is to try out a Shimano rear derailleur and a 7-speed freewheel
> or cassette. If it bangs off every shift perfectly right out of the box,
> then you've got lucky. Otherwise, hunt down a Sachs New Success derailleur.
> Ebay.
>> Right now, it is
>> Sachs Ergo 8s, Shimano Deore 7s long cage rear der, Shimano hyperglide
>> 7s cogs.
>>
>> Thanks, Rob
>>
>
>

The Sachs shifter I've measured pulls the same as a Campy 8 speed

--
---
Marten Gerritsen

INFOapestaartjeM-GINEERINGpuntNL
www.m-gineering.nl

 

[Qui si parla Campagnolo]

RobertPerkins wrote:
> I have two sets of Sachs Ergo (made by Campy) 8-speed brake/shift
> levers. Both are from around 1993.
>
> I am currently using one set of Ergo with a Deore rear der on 7s
> Shimano hyperglide. It seems to work okay, especially after I aligned
> my derailleur hanger. I had heard that they shifted 3.1mm per click,
> like the shimano 7s shifters, though it has never been clear to me if I
> should ideally be using a new success derailleur. Or, perhaps, the
> new success derailleur is compatible with shimano derailleurs. Who
> knows?
>
> Is there a way to check out the shift disks?
>
> I heard that Sachs later sold Ergo levers that were intended to work
> with Shimano 8s using Shimano derailleurs. If this is true, how do I
> tell if I have one of them?
>
> So, for these particular Sachs Ergo levers, is there any way to
> determine what combinations of Sachs, Shimano, or Campy rear
> derailleurs will work with Shimano 7s or Shimano 8s?
>
> Right now, it is
> Sachs Ergo 8s, Shimano Deore 7s long cage rear der, Shimano hyperglide
> 7s cogs.
>
> Thanks, Rob

Unless the shift disc was changed, they always were 8s and shifted
shimano 8s spacing when using a Sachs, shimano or mavic RD...never
anything using a Campag RD. 8s shimano was close enough to 7s shimano
that I'm not surprised they work with that cogset.

 

[Qui si parla Campagnolo]

Dave Mayer wrote:
> "RobertPerkins" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >I have two sets of Sachs Ergo (made by Campy) 8-speed brake/shift
> > levers. Both are from around 1993.
>
> I have a pair of these.
>
> >
> > I am currently using one set of Ergo with a Deore rear der on 7s
> > Shimano hyperglide. It seems to work okay, especially after I aligned
> > my derailleur hanger. I had heard that they shifted 3.1mm per click,
> > like the shimano 7s shifters, though it has never been clear to me if I
> > should ideally be using a new success derailleur. Or, perhaps, the
> > new success derailleur is compatible with shimano derailleurs. Who
> > knows?
> >
> These shifters were designed for use with Sachs New Success Rear
> derailleurs. They work poorly with Shimano derailleurs. They work even
> worse with Campy derailleurs. Some folks have stated that they 'work' with
> Shimano, but these folks may have never experienced a fully dialed-in
> drivetrain before. With a Shimano derailleur, you'll get clattering, missed
> gears and the chain jumping around the cogset. With a New Success RD, they
> will work 100% right away without any fooling around. The mechanical
> advantage of the Shimano derailleurs and the Sachs derailleur was just plain
> different during the early 90's.

Not in my experience. I have used shimano Ultegra RDs with Sachs Ergo
with great success, since a Sachs RD was so hard to find.

>
> BTW: these were designed for a cog spacing of 5.0mm cog center to center.
> It will likely work with Shimano 8-speed spacing of 4.8mm, but it will be
> more finicky.

shimano 8s was not 5mm c-c...Campag was, but Sachs was designed to be
used with shimano 8s cogsets.
>
> > Is there a way to check out the shift disks?
> >
> > I heard that Sachs later sold Ergo levers that were intended to work
> > with Shimano 8s using Shimano derailleurs. If this is true, how do I
> > tell if I have one of them?
>
> There is a long standing difference of opinion on this subject within this
> group. Some say that the shifters are compatible with Shimano; my
> experience is definitely not. My theory is that Sachs introduced a version
> of the Ergopower shift disk in the late 90's that was compatible with
> Shimano derailleurs. They also likely modified their derailleurs as well
> for compatibility. If your shifters are from 1993 (only one year after the
> mass introduction of Ergo by Campy), then you would certainly have the
> non-compatible version.
> >
> > So, for these particular Sachs Ergo levers, is there any way to
> > determine what combinations of Sachs, Shimano, or Campy rear
> > derailleurs will work with Shimano 7s or Shimano 8s?
>
> First test is to try out a Shimano rear derailleur and a 7-speed freewheel
> or cassette. If it bangs off every shift perfectly right out of the box,
> then you've got lucky. Otherwise, hunt down a Sachs New Success derailleur.
> Ebay.
> >
> > Right now, it is
> > Sachs Ergo 8s, Shimano Deore 7s long cage rear der, Shimano hyperglide
> > 7s cogs.
> >
> > Thanks, Rob
> >

 

[Andrew F Martin]

Yeah - they were 7/8sp shifters. I ran 7 and now 8sp Shimano Cassette
with a Sachs Rear Derr on there. The stuff is bombproof - great for a
rain bike here in Seattle. I've replaced the pulleys a couple times,
but otherwise no issues.

 

[gary jacobson]

"Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> RobertPerkins wrote:>
> Unless the shift disc was changed, they always were 8s and shifted
> shimano 8s spacing when using a Sachs, shimano or mavic RD...never
> anything using a Campag RD. 8s shimano was close enough to 7s shimano
> that I'm not surprised they work with that cogset.

I could never get the Sachs Ergo Shifters to shift my Mavic Rear der. over 8
cogs with Shimano spacing, nor could my LBS.
Never tried it with Sachs News Success nor Shimano, nor Campy rear ders.
though. Would have been good to try.

My wife's lesser quality Sachs Ergo shifters did great with Sachs New
Success rear der.

I suspect that there where variations of Sachs Ergo shifters.

Gary Jacobson
Rosendale, NY