Salzberg

portia said:

okay, the US is a Killer Nation and you choose to... the US caused every problem around the globe themselves, IGNORAMOSES, I don´t feel any pity because of Sept 9/11 , serves you right, ...

Wow. Nice reasoning there. Kill the killers.

portia said:

okay, the US is a Killer Nation and you choose to... the US caused every problem around the globe themselves, IGNORAMOSES, I don´t feel any pity because of Sept 9/11 , serves you right, ...

Actually...it's spelt "Ignoramuses".
Bad spelling will cause the end of civilisation.

cyclingheroes said:

Shall i only say hello or shall i give him a good bottle of wine?😄

T. Dekker is out, so Boogerd will be second or third...😉

My favourite.... Alexander Vinokourov

Dark horse: Philippe Gilbert

I have to with Vino as my favorite, with Bettini and Valverde being the next 2.

Call me crazy, but my dark horses has to be Zabel and Kasechakin (Sp?). Zabel, even at his older age, is the one sprinter to show he can get over climbs, so I think if he can stay in the lead pack, he will be able to win out of a small group sprint. The Kazakh, Andrey, I think can get away because too many people will be placing focus on Vino, and they may be hesitant to chase Andrey, since they know they would just be towing Vino, for what would be an eventual attack.

Has to be Bettini, it is just about the last important one day race he has not won. He is in excellent shape coming out of the Vuelta also... And he needs it as a morale booster before winning the Lombardia again this year... 😉

Powerful Pete said:

Has to be Bettini, it is just about the last important one day race he has not won. He is in excellent shape coming out of the Vuelta also... And he needs it as a morale booster before winning the Lombardia again this year... 😉

Can I change my vote? I want Bettini now with McQ still in the mix along with all the other I mentioned including Roole.

helmutRoole2 said:

Can I change my vote? I want Bettini now with McQ still in the mix along with all the other I mentioned including Roole.

Sorry Helmut. We don't allow American "IGNORAMOSES" to change their vote on this forum. You're stuck with Robbie McEwen.

We do however tolerate stereotyping of Americans. Oh yes! Feel free to say whatever you will about Americans. But go after anyone else and you'll definitely be attacked (which is what we Americans are supposed to be good at 😕 ) and perhaps even moderated.

meehs said:

Sorry Helmut. We don't allow American "IGNORAMOSES" to change their vote on this forum. You're stuck with Robbie McEwen.

We do however tolerate stereotyping of Americans. Oh yes! Feel free to say whatever you will about Americans. But go after anyone else and you'll definitely be attacked (which is what we Americans are supposed to be good at 😕 ) and perhaps even moderated.

Well, our government -- and when I say "our" I mean "our" despite the fact that I didn't vote for the current administration but with the understanding that it represents me as an American and thus I'm obliged to recognize its promises -- is dicking things up globally... and locally.

It's unfortunate that some might believe that all Americans are GWB, but the fact is, like him or not, he is our representative and you can't blame reasonable people in the rest of the world for being upset with the government we elected.

And, one must acknowledge that some American cyclists and American cycling organizations, though not starting the doping wars waging within the sport of cycling, played a significant role in taking it to the next level, which is where currently resides.

I think some Euros resent the American presence in the pro peloton for this reason and I have some sympathy for that. I also have some sympathy for those who are displaced or dead because our government "thought" there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq without even a "my bad" to anyone. And this coming from an American --- me -- who served on the ground as a solider in the midEast.

Mees? What up? So serious lately. Like I said, I would have given you a hit off my Old English 800 if I had seen you in the crowd. I can't be held responsible for that. You know how frenzied those GT crowds get.

I didn't see you. Get over it.

helmutRoole2 said:

Well, our government -- and when I say "our" I mean "our" despite the fact that I didn't vote for the current administration but with the understanding that it represents me as an American and thus I'm obliged to recognize its promises -- is dicking things up globally... and locally.

It's unfortunate that some might believe that all Americans are GWB, but the fact is, like him or not, he is our representative and you can't blame reasonable people in the rest of the world for being upset with the government we elected.

And, one must acknowledge that some American cyclists and American cycling organizations, though not starting the doping wars waging within the sport of cycling, played a significant role in taking it to the next level, which is where currently resides.

I think some Euros resent the American presence in the pro peloton for this reason and I have some sympathy for that. I also have some sympathy for those who are displaced or dead because our government "thought" there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq without even a "my bad" to anyone. And this coming from an American --- me -- who served on the ground as a solider in the midEast.

Actually, I agree with all of what you said above. I guess I just find it extremely irritating when narrow-minded nit-wits lump us all into one group. It's no better than Americans who lump all Muslims into one group. And I can't even begin to explain exactly how moronic a stament like "you had it coming" with regard to 9/11 is! I won't get into it further but gimme a break!

helmutRoole2 said:

Mees? What up? So serious lately. Like I said, I would have given you a hit off my Old English 800 if I had seen you in the crowd. I can't be held responsible for that. You know how frenzied those GT crowds get.

I didn't see you. Get over it.

You're right! I do need to lighten-up a little. A belt or two off of that 40 of Old English is probably exactly what I need. I'm trying to get over being shunned but I'm still stinging. It was very traumatic!

meehs said:

Actually, I actually agree with all of what you said above. I guess I just find it extremely irritating when narrow-minded nit-wits lump us all into one group. It's no better than Americans who lump all Muslims into one group. And I can't even begin to explain exactly how moronic a stament like "you had it coming" with regard to 9/11 is! I won't get into it further but gimme a break!

Yeah. I saw that. Well, ignoramuses will be ignoramuses. Where do you start with a guy like that?

helmutRoole2 said:

And, one must acknowledge that some American cyclists and American cycling organizations, though not starting the doping wars waging within the sport of cycling, played a significant role in taking it to the next level, which is where currently resides.

I think some Euros resent the American presence in the pro peloton for this reason and I have some sympathy for that.

This is the first I have ever read of an argument like this. Do others agree or disagree?

JRMDC said:

This is the first I have ever read of an argument like this. Do others agree or disagree?

Hamilton was busted and denied it. Landis just won the TdF and was busted (I guess unofficially at this point). And the biggie is that while Armstrong has never "officially" been nailed, there is plenty of evidence to suggested that he doped and there are lot of people ferverently believe that he doped. More importantly, LA has been very vocal and brash about denying PED use, which drives some people nuts!

I guess I'm not sure if I agree that Americans brought doping to the next level. But they certainly have made it more visible. Overall I would tend to agree with what Helmut is saying.

Spain's National Team:

Alejandro Valverde and Joaquín Rodríguez (Caisse d'Epargne-Illes Balears), Juan Antonio Flecha (Rabobank), Xavier Florencio (Bouygues Telecom), Samuel Sánchez (Euskaltel), Íñigo Cuesta (CSC), Fran Ventoso (Saunier Duval) and Luis Pérez (Cofidis). The ninth place will be for Carlos Sastre (CSC), although it isn't confirmed by now..

Substitutes:
Manuel Beltrán and Egoi Martínez (Discovery Channel).

For Time Trial only one cyclist: José Iván Gutiérrez.

I think is a nice time. It is clearly focused in Valverde but, if he fails, the team has another possibilities as Sánchez or Flecha, even Ventoso in an hypothetic sprint.

meehs said:

Hamilton was busted and denied it. Landis just won the TdF and was busted (I guess unofficially at this point). And the biggie is that while Armstrong has never "officially" been nailed, there is plenty of evidence to suggested that he doped and there are lot of people ferverently believe that he doped. More importantly, LA has been very vocal and brash about denying PED use, which drives some people nuts!

I guess I'm not sure if I agree that Americans brought doping to the next level. But they certainly have made it more visible. Overall I would tend to agree with what Helmut is saying.

I think it has less-to-nothing to do with the fact that they're Americans and most-if-not-everything to do with the fact that they came in contact with USA Cycling and US Pro. That crew -- and it hasn't changed much over the years -- has been doping American cyclists since before 1984.

I think Kashechkin may be the man. He has raging form and Vino will attempt to pay him back for the Vuelta.

El Chava said:

Spain's National Team:

I think is a nice time. It is clearly focused in Valverde but, if he fails, the team has another possibilities as Sánchez or Flecha, even Ventoso in an hypothetic sprint.

Flecha or Sanchez could definitely take this and won't be marked as closely as some others.

Bro Deal said:

I think Kashechkin may be the man. He has raging form and Vino will attempt to pay him back for the Vuelta.

They guys vying for top placing at the Vuelta probably won't impact the worlds. However, seems I remember a certain somebody finishing fourth one year and then going on to finish fourth at the worlds. What the hell was his name?

helmutRoole2 said:

Yeah. I saw that. Well, ignoramuses will be ignoramuses. Where do you start with a guy like that?

Portia? Either a girl or a guy with a girl's name. Either way...it explains everything.

helmutRoole2 said:

Hincappie isn't doing it. I was surprised. He won the US nats pretty easy. Keep an eye on Farrar. I raced with him in the US Northwest. He drilled me in a sprint from a six-man break. Of course, I was 39 back then. But, well, he was 16. Also, watch for Danny Pate to do something early. He was the world u23 TT champ back in, I believe 2001 or 2. A reputed clean rider btw.

Danny Pate - I'm familiar with.
I wasn't aware of Farrar - but thanks for the heads up.

It's time to put the head on the block HR.

The Limerickman Kiss O' Death goes to : Matthias Kessler.
This man has been going well all season - if he rides the worlds, I think he'll be in the shakeup.

And I've another tip : Nicole Cooke for the womens title (are we allowed to discuss womens cycling??????).

Of course if Tommy Boonen does the business - it will be one hell of an achievement.

PP's tip for Bettini is also tempting.

Wonder what Martin Jackson thinks - about the world title race that is!

unfortunally Kessler won't start, he said his form isn't good and he is too tired.

Farrar: good tip from Helmut.

limerickman said:

Danny Pate - I'm familiar with.
I wasn't aware of Farrar - but thanks for the heads up.

It's time to put the head on the block HR.

The Limerickman Kiss O' Death goes to : Matthias Kessler.
This man has been going well all season - if he rides the worlds, I think he'll be in the shakeup.

And I've another tip : Nicole Cooke for the womens title (are we allowed to discuss womens cycling??????).

Of course if Tommy Boonen does the business - it will be one hell of an achievement.

PP's tip for Bettini is also tempting.

Wonder what Martin Jackson thinks - about the world title race that is!

cyclingheroes said:

unfortunally Kessler won't start, he said his form isn't good and he is too tired.

And he heard Lim picked him so - why bother?