Santa Cruz Bullit headtube crack

Discussion in 'Mountain Bikes' started by Oedipus Thorpe, Mar 4, 2003.

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  1. Is it possible for a bike shop to crack a headtube when they are installed a headset? I took my 01
    Bullit frame in to have a Race Face Team SL headset installed. They called me and told me that they
    couldn't do it since my frame was cracked. I show up and there is a huge crack on the headtube. I
    definitely know it wasn't there before I took it in; it's just way too big for me and the couple of
    buddies of mine who saw the frame to miss.

    There is a knick on the headset that ligns up perfectly with the crack. Yet, they claim it was
    already there. Needless to say, I got shafted. The bike shop is Hyland Family Bike Shop in San Jose,
    California, USA.

    Anybody know anything about whether a simple headset install can crack a frame, a Bullit no less.

    Thanks.

    Biking Brazilian San Jose, CA, USA

    --

    "The future is here. It's just not widely distributed yet." -- William Gibson
     
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  2. Slacker

    Slacker Guest

    "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Is it possible for a bike shop to crack a headtube when they are installed a headset? I took my 01
    > Bullit frame in to have a Race Face Team SL headset installed. They called me and told me that
    > they couldn't do it since my frame was cracked. I show up and there is a huge crack on the
    > headtube. I definitely know it wasn't there before I took it in; it's just way too big for me and
    > the couple of buddies of mine who saw the frame to miss.
    >
    > There is a knick on the headset that ligns up perfectly with the crack. Yet, they claim it was
    > already there. Needless to say, I got shafted. The bike shop is Hyland Family Bike Shop in San
    > Jose, California, USA.
    >
    > Anybody know anything about whether a simple headset install can crack a frame, a Bullit no less.
    >
    > Thanks.
    >
    > Biking Brazilian San Jose, CA, USA

    Dang, that really blows! Just about anything is possible with an incompetent shop. What made you
    have to change the headset in the first place and what type of riding do you do?

    Maybe there was a hairline crack and when they were pressing in the new one it opened up?
    --
    Slacker
     
  3. David Bailey

    David Bailey Guest

    If the head tube was cracked the cup would have come out without tools ie by had. Did they use a
    headset illstalation tools or simply a hammer and a block of wood. Cracks behind the headtube is
    quite common usually just behind the weld but good frames have a headtube constructed via a billet
    of alloy and extremely strong. If you had an impact on the bike at some time espicailly with single
    crown forks a crack in the headtube is a common result. Is this not covered under warranty??
     
  4. Bomba

    Bomba Guest

    oedipus thorpe wrote:
    > Is it possible for a bike shop to crack a headtube when they are installed a headset? I took my 01
    > Bullit frame in to have a Race Face Team SL headset installed. They called me and told me that
    > they couldn't do it since my frame was cracked. I show up and there is a huge crack on the
    > headtube. I definitely know it wasn't there before I took it in; it's just way too big for me and
    > the couple of buddies of mine who saw the frame to miss.
    >
    > There is a knick on the headset that ligns up perfectly with the crack. Yet, they claim it was
    > already there. Needless to say, I got shafted. The bike shop is Hyland Family Bike Shop in San
    > Jose, California, USA.
    >
    > Anybody know anything about whether a simple headset install can crack a frame, a Bullit no less.

    I would be very surprised if a shop could put a crack in a frame. Dents I could understand, but
    cracks in alu tend to be caused by repeated stress. Even with a knick, I can't see a way they could
    cause the crack without deliberately levering it open.

    I'd be tempted to go along with Slacker on this one - there was probably already a crack there that
    was opened up when they tried to press the headset.

    Is it covered by warranty?

    --
    a.m-b FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/ambfaq.htm

    b.bmx FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/bmx_faq.htm
     
  5. Mark Webb

    Mark Webb Guest

    A friend of mine cracked his frame in the same position fitting the head fittings it was because
    they were not going in square. He was talking and didn't notice it until he heard the noise
    (CRACK)...It was on a Raceline Roadie and yes he did get a warranty replacement...I don't think he
    told them how it was done..

    Webby "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Is it possible for a bike shop to crack a headtube when they are installed
    a
    > headset? I took my 01 Bullit frame in to have a Race Face Team SL headset installed. They called
    > me and told me that they couldn't do it since my frame was cracked. I show up and there is a huge
    > crack on the headtube. I definitely know it wasn't there before I took it in; it's just way too
    > big for me and the couple of buddies of mine who saw the frame to miss.
    >
    > There is a knick on the headset that ligns up perfectly with the crack.
    Yet,
    > they claim it was already there. Needless to say, I got shafted. The bike shop is Hyland Family
    > Bike Shop in San Jose, California, USA.
    >
    > Anybody know anything about whether a simple headset install can crack a frame, a Bullit no less.
    >
    > Thanks.
    >
    > Biking Brazilian San Jose, CA, USA
    >
    > --
    >
    >
    > "The future is here. It's just not widely distributed yet." -- William Gibson
     
  6. David Bailey coins a new word with:

    >Did they use a headset illstalation tools or simply a hammer and a block of wood.

    I would have thought that a hammer and a block of wood was the perfect set-up for an "illstallation"
    tool. Good one!

    Steve
     
  7. Michael Dart

    Michael Dart Guest

    "bomba" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > oedipus thorpe wrote:

    >
    > Is it covered by warranty?
    >

    If not warranty, go for a crash replacement or repair. And keep us posted on the outcome. I, for
    one, am interested in hearing how Santa Cruz handles this.

    Mike
     
  8. The frame is out of warranty by 4 months. I have begun correspondence with a Danny Ward from Santa
    Cruz Bicycles. I sent him e-mails and pictures on Monday but he hasn't responded yet. I am tempted
    to drive over the hill to their HQ if I don't get a response by the end of the week.

    I will definitely keep you guys posted on the outcome of this claim.

    Alas, after reading all your great posts, the best theory that I can come up with is that there was
    a hairline crack already in the frame and the bike shop "finished the job." If I can figure out how
    to take macro shots with my digital camera, maybe I'll post some photos of the crack and the
    scratches on the headset, which the bike shop initially claimed they never tried to install. After
    bringing in the frame and headset and throwing it on their counter, their story changed as they
    claimed that they had attempted to install the headset when they saw the crack. Completely farcical.
    Wouldn't you, as a professional bike mechanic, visually inspect the headtube area BEFORE you insert
    the headset cups? Wouldn't you SEE the huge, 1" long crack on the top of the headtube, visible from
    both sides? Wouldn't you therefore NOT install the headset? So why is the headset scracthed and
    scuffed? Because you cracked the frame when you tried to install it, that's why.

    The owner simply put his hand out for me to shake and said, "Sorry."

    Do not solicit, if ever in the area: HYLAND FAMILY BICYCLE 1515 Meridian Ave, San Jose, CA 95125
    Phone: (408) 269-2300

    > > Is it covered by warranty?
    > >
    >
    > If not warranty, go for a crash replacement or repair. And keep us posted on the outcome. I, for
    > one, am interested in hearing how Santa Cruz
    handles
    > this.
    >
    > Mike
     
  9. L Hays

    L Hays Guest

    "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:b43le3$gt[email protected]...
    > Is it possible for a bike shop to crack a headtube when they are installed
    a
    > headset? I took my 01 Bullit frame in to have a Race Face Team SL headset installed. They called
    > me and told me that they couldn't do it since my frame was cracked. I show up and there is a huge
    > crack on the headtube. I definitely know it wasn't there before I took it in; it's just way too
    > big for me and the couple of buddies of mine who saw the frame to miss.
    >
    > There is a knick on the headset that ligns up perfectly with the crack.
    Yet,
    > they claim it was already there. Needless to say, I got shafted. The bike shop is Hyland Family
    > Bike Shop in San Jose, California, USA.
    >
    > Anybody know anything about whether a simple headset install can crack a frame, a Bullit no less.
    >
    > Thanks.
    >
    > Biking Brazilian San Jose, CA, USA
    >
    > --
    >
    >
    > "The future is here. It's just not widely distributed yet." -- William Gibson
    >
    >
    Is this the place: http://www.hylandbikes.com/store_info.htm

    Bummer, it looks like a nice place.

    Lance
     
  10. Jd

    Jd Guest

    "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > Is it possible for a bike shop to crack a headtube when they are installed a headset? I took my 01
    > Bullit frame in to have a Race Face Team SL headset installed. They called me and told me that
    > they couldn't do it since my frame was cracked. I show up and there is a huge crack on the
    > headtube. I definitely know it wasn't there before I took it in; it's just way too big for me and
    > the couple of buddies of mine who saw the frame to miss.
    >
    > There is a knick on the headset that ligns up perfectly with the crack. Yet, they claim it was
    > already there. Needless to say, I got shafted. The bike shop is Hyland Family Bike Shop in San
    > Jose, California, USA.
    >
    > Anybody know anything about whether a simple headset install can crack a frame, a Bullit no less.

    Inferior design, irregular tolerances, and cheap frame materials are to blame.

    JD Alcoa can't wait
     
  11. That's the place. It is a nice place. Actually, the guys are pretty cool. But the facts just don't
    jive, and they're not fessing up.

    > Is this the place: http://www.hylandbikes.com/store_info.htm
    >
    > Bummer, it looks like a nice place.
    >
    > Lance
     
  12. MTBScottie

    MTBScottie Guest

    [email protected] (JD) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > Is it possible for a bike shop to crack a headtube when they are installed a headset? I took my
    > > 01 Bullit frame in to have a Race Face Team SL headset installed. They called me and told me
    > > that they couldn't do it since my frame was cracked. I show up and there is a huge crack on the
    > > headtube. I definitely know it wasn't there before I took it in; it's just way too big for me
    > > and the couple of buddies of mine who saw the frame to miss.
    > >
    > > There is a knick on the headset that ligns up perfectly with the crack. Yet, they claim it was
    > > already there. Needless to say, I got shafted. The bike shop is Hyland Family Bike Shop in San
    > > Jose, California, USA.
    > >
    > > Anybody know anything about whether a simple headset install can crack a frame, a Bullit
    > > no less.
    >
    > Inferior design, irregular tolerances, and cheap frame materials are to blame.

    Yep, and Carla's Santa Cruz probably gets ridden harder then anyone elses bike of whatever brand and
    hers is just fine.

    >
    > JD Alcoa can't wait

    Maybe not, but I think the world could wait or do without your baseless oponions........
     
  13. Mark Hickey

    Mark Hickey Guest

    "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Alas, after reading all your great posts, the best theory that I can come up with is that there was
    >a hairline crack already in the frame and the bike shop "finished the job." If I can figure out how
    >to take macro shots with my digital camera, maybe I'll post some photos of the crack and the
    >scratches on the headset, which the bike shop initially claimed they never tried to install. After
    >bringing in the frame and headset and throwing it on their counter, their story changed as they
    >claimed that they had attempted to install the headset when they saw the crack. Completely
    >farcical. Wouldn't you, as a professional bike mechanic, visually inspect the headtube area BEFORE
    >you insert the headset cups? Wouldn't you SEE the huge, 1" long crack on the top of the headtube,
    >visible from both sides? Wouldn't you therefore NOT install the headset? So why is the headset
    >scracthed and scuffed? Because you cracked the frame when you tried to install it, that's why.

    FWIW, remember that the mechanic might not notice the crack from the outside before removing the
    old headset. Chances are, once the cup was removed, the crack would close. The installation of the
    new cup may have drastically increased it though (aluminum is pretty fragile stuff once the crack
    is started).

    Let us all know how it comes out...

    Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame

    >The owner simply put his hand out for me to shake and said, "Sorry."
    >
    >Do not solicit, if ever in the area: HYLAND FAMILY BICYCLE 1515 Meridian Ave, San Jose, CA 95125
    >Phone: (408) 269-2300
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >> > Is it covered by warranty?
    >> >
    >>
    >> If not warranty, go for a crash replacement or repair. And keep us posted on the outcome. I, for
    >> one, am interested in hearing how Santa Cruz
    >handles
    >> this.
    >>
    >> Mike
    >>
    >
     
  14. Attached is a picture of the crack.

    pcl
     
  15. L Hays

    L Hays Guest

    "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Attached is a picture of the crack.
    >
    > pcl
    >
    >
    >

    That chipped paint shows there has been some serious flex in that tube. While the press would be a
    straight up/down force, that looks like a tell-tale example of hard riding!

    My .02 Euro

    Lance
     
  16. Mark Hickey

    Mark Hickey Guest

    "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Attached is a picture of the crack.

    It's hard to tell if the surface of the crack is shiny or dull and weathered. If the LBS did the
    damage, it should be very shiny. If the crack has been there a while, it will be much duller.

    Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame
     
  17. Sorni

    Sorni Guest

    "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...

    > Attached is a picture of the crack.

    "You call that a crack? Naw...THIS is a crack." {Cue Pete F. link -- goatsce or whatever}

    Bill "Crocodile SorKnee" S.
     
  18. Interesting point.

    However, the LBS initially denied that they even attempted to put the headset in. When I got home
    that night, I opened the headset box and was shocked to see that there were scratches on the headset
    indicating that they had attempted to press it in. Orienting the headset on the headtube, you see
    that the scratch marks on the front of the headset--where the crack on the headtube is--lines up
    exactly with the crack, but they are only small nick marks. On the back of the headset the scuff
    marks are a lot longer and run up and down the headset cup from the bottom to right underneath the
    bearing race, a good indication that the headset was pressed in at an angle.

    The paint chip, before attempted headset install, was only about 1/8" to either side of the where
    the crack runs along the top of the headtube. Upon retrieval of my frame, you can see that the chip
    inside the headtube is pretty worn out, as pointed out by Lance in this Reply:To.

    Again, the only acceptable theory to me is that there initially was a crack in the frame that nobody
    could see with the naked eye. The LBS made it visible to the naked eye by putting the headset in
    incorrectly.

    pcl

    > That chipped paint shows there has been some serious flex in that tube. While the press would be a
    > straight up/down force, that looks like a tell-tale example of hard riding!
    >
    > My .02 Euro
    >
    > Lance
     
  19. It's definitely not shiny; pretty "weathered and dull."

    "Mark Hickey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:eek:[email protected]...
    > "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >Attached is a picture of the crack.
    >
    > It's hard to tell if the surface of the crack is shiny or dull and weathered. If the LBS did the
    > damage, it should be very shiny. If the crack has been there a while, it will be much duller.
    >
    > Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame
     
  20. Pete Jones

    Pete Jones Guest

    On Thu, 6 Mar 2003 23:24:56 -0800, "oedipus thorpe" <[email protected]> blathered:

    >Again, the only acceptable theory to me is that there initially was a crack in the frame that
    >nobody could see with the naked eye. The LBS made it visible to the naked eye by putting the
    >headset in incorrectly.

    Then they did you a favour - would you rather it had failed catastrophically while out riding?

    Stop bitching about it. If the frame's covered by warranty, you get a new one; if it isn't, chalk it
    up to experience and buy a decent bike.

    Pete
    ----
    http://www.btinternet.com/~peteajones/
     
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