Schiavo debate: Ploy for evangelical vote in 06'?



limerickman said:
Not a very happy or satisfactory position to have been in, David.

You have done very well to overcome those circumstances which lead to your being homeless.

To expand the discussion, it is unforgivable in a world that has plentiful food, that anyone could be allowed to be hungry or to starve for lack of food.
Schiavo excepted.
Many "homeless" are comprised of vet's such as myself. Ever see the Stallone movie "First Blood"?. He describes the disillusionment of reintegrating into civilian society by stateing: "I used to work w/ million dollar equipment & now I can't even get a job in a carwash !" That's no joke my freind. It is a reality & one reason why a sizeable portion of vet's never fully reintegrate.
 
davidmc said:
From Lokstah: She's possesing of a brain stem only, a primordial knob of neural tissue which governs involuntary responses to stimuli and facilitates basic involuntary body function. With no cerebral cortex, she's currently and will never again be capable of self-awareness, any form of cognition, fear, pleasure, pain or comfort. christians & Muslims (of which I am neither) fast for weeks at a time. Its less barbaric than electrocution of which a certain Gov. of a certain State, sharing a boundary w/ Mexico, had no trouble invoking even on women
I'm sorry I wasn't aware that "Lokstah" was nominated for a Nobel Prize in neurology and brain salad surgery.

I'm curious, if a human being can not exist with FOOD and WATER for more than a few weeks…How do they survive these fasts….Oh, they drink water….. I see…WELL SHE DIDN’T GET ANY. So, I say again, perform my test please and make sure you document it well….
 
zapper said:
I'm curious, if a human being can not exist with FOOD and WATER for more than a few weeks…How do they survive these fasts….Oh, they drink water…..
during Ramadan, most Muslims afford themselves an evening meal. We have many Muslim workers and students from Lybia, Saudi, Bahrain etc. where i work and they do get very weak and light headed during the day. No one can live without food or water for more than a couple of weeks but fasting doesnt always mean total withdrawal of food and water.
 
MountainPro said:
No one can live without food or water for more than a couple of weeks but fasting doesnt always mean total withdrawal of food and water.
This is the point I'm trying to make to my canine friend...
 
zapper said:
This is the point I'm trying to make to my canine friend...
i know...just illustrating the point..

not attacking or defending anyone....i am in a good mood today....made a killing on ebay...(ooops sorry, insensitive use of words)...
 
MountainPro said:
i know...just illustrating the point..

not attacking or defending anyone....i am in a good mood today....made a killing on ebay...(ooops sorry, insensitive use of words)...
OH, You sold a cheese doodle that looked like Jesus?

My wifie used to make out pretty good a few years back but it became very time consuming. Plus, she started buying almost as much as she was making... :mad:
 
zapper said:
OH, You sold a cheese doodle that looked like Jesus?

My wifie used to make out pretty good a few years back but it became very time consuming. Plus, she started buying almost as much as she was making... :mad:
No cheese doodle, bought an item from a factory closure sale for £20 and sold it for £410.

Yes, thats the problem with women...theyre spending it faster than you can make it....my £400 is already earmarked for a new vacuum cleaner and a stair carpet...:(
 
MountainPro said:
i know...just illustrating the point..

not attacking or defending anyone....i am in a good mood today....made a killing on ebay...(ooops sorry, insensitive use of words)...
Yeah amazing...I bought a John Denver autobiography for a dollar at a thrift store and it sold for 89 bucks....Funny what folks will bid on.
 
zapper said:
I'm sorry I wasn't aware that "Lokstah" was nominated for a Nobel Prize in neurology and brain salad surgery.

I'm curious, if a human being can not exist with FOOD and WATER for more than a few weeks…How do they survive these fasts….Oh, they drink water….. I see…WELL SHE DIDN’T GET ANY. So, I say again, perform my test please and make sure you document it well….
I see. My point is deprivation is more humane than electrocution (Texas &, up until recently, Virginia use/d this practice.) for an individual in Terry's condition, Terry would feel no pain due to her pleasure/pain center being non-functional/non-existant. Electrocution, albeit short in duration, would be more traumatic. I bring this up because of Gov. Bush utilized it 131 times in Texas. We either have "a failure to communicate" or we will have to just "agree to disagree". Thread-Master out. ;)
 
davidmc said:
I see. My point is deprivation is more humane than electrocution (Texas &, up until recently, Virginia use/d this practice.) for an individual in Terry's condition, Terry would feel no pain due to her pleasure/pain center being non-functional/non-existant. Electrocution, albeit short in duration, would be more traumatic.
Hey TM...Who did Terry Kill? You must be fasting for your doggy brain cells are starving here... She committed no crime. Your point fails miserably...
 
zapper said:
Hey TM...Who did Terry Kill? You must be fasting for your doggy brain cells are starving here... She committed no crime. Your point fails miserably...
You are equating the removal of the feeding tube to punishment, not me. That is why I use the electrocution scenario. The removal of the tube was an administrative medical matter not a punitive matter. You sir, are the one doing the extrapolating. I await your apology :rolleyes:
 
zapper said:
I'm sorry I wasn't aware that "Lokstah" was nominated for a Nobel Prize in neurology and brain salad surgery.
I'll send you my papers. Are PDFs ok?

With the exception of the Nobel nominee you quoted and one or two others, the medical community has been in total agreement about the state of Schiavo's cognitive abilty and her chance of regrowing a cerebral cortex (magic!). I've simply been paraphrasing what the chorus of neurologists have been saying for 10 years: the lady's higher brain function was gone, gone, gone. She had zero cognitive capability.

All of the sympathies you and the Schindler's supporters offered--what a horrible way to die, she's suffering--were totally vicarious, projected.
 
lokstah said:
I'll send you my papers. Are PDFs ok?

With the exception of the Nobel nominee you quoted and one or two others, the medical community has been in total agreement about the state of Schiavo's cognitive abilty and her chance of regrowing a cerebral cortex (magic!). I've simply been paraphrasing what the chorus of neurologists have been saying for 10 years: the lady's higher brain function was gone, gone, gone. She had zero cognitive capability.

All of the sympathies you and the Schindler's supporters offered--what a horrible way to die, she's suffering--were totally vicarious, projected.
In agreement here lokstah. You are, again it would seem, a scholar & a gentleman.
 
davidmc said:
In agreement here lokstah. You are, again it would seem, a scholar & a gentleman.
I am neither; nothing but an honest man on two well-trued, French-made wheels.

For a dog with a bomb, you are a potent asset to the forces of good. I salute you.
 
davidmc said:
In agreement here lokstah. You are, again it would seem, a scholar & a gentleman.
Why don't you two go get a room or something...I'm getting sick :rolleyes:
 
lokstah said:
For a dog with a bomb, you are a potent asset to the forces of good. I salute you.
Why don't others, such as Zapper, recognize my hyper-intelligence :confused:
 
davidmc said:
Why don't others, such as Zapper, recognize my hyper-intelligence :confused:
Ok, I recognize that for a dog with a bomb you are kind of intelligent in a overly exited or high strung sort of way... ;)
 
. . . Smearing Christian Judges

By Paul Gaston
Saturday, April 23, 2005; Page A19

People calling themselves Christians are gathering once again for a crusade against what they consider to be the secular humanist subversion of Christian values. This time the object of their wrath is the judiciary. In the wake of the fanatical and fruitless assaults against the judicial system for letting Terri Schiavo die, the Family Research Council will convene tomorrow what it calls "Justice Sunday," a live simulcast to pit Christian values against "our out-of-control courts."

The burgeoning assault on the American judicial system by right-wing Christians is an integral part of their attack on "godless" secular humanism. According to them, secular humanists nurture a culture that promotes abortion; encourages gay marriage; prohibits prayer and the Pledge of Allegiance in permissive schools that indoctrinate students with Darwin's "theory" of evolution; preaches moral relativism; and generally threatens to subvert the Christian foundations of the republic.

What these self-avowed Christians do not acknowledge -- and what the American public seems little aware of -- is that the war they are waging is actually against other people calling themselves Christians. To simplify: Right-wing and fundamentalist Christians are really at war with left-wing and mainstream Christians. It is a battle over both the meaning and practice of Christianity as well as over the definition and destiny of the republic. Secular humanism is a bogeyman, a smoke screen obscuring the right-wing Christians' struggle for supremacy.

The assault on the judiciary is especially revealing. The vicious attacks on Judge George Greer, the Florida jurist who presided over the Schiavo case, reveal the bizarre nature of right-wing Christian fantasies. A regular recipient of hate mail and threats against his life that required him to walk to court with an armed marshal, Judge Greer is a lifelong Southern Baptist, a regular in church and a conservative Republican. None of those credentials protected him from the assaults of fellow Christians, including messages saying he would go straight to Hell. What he found "exasperating," he told a journalist, "is that my faith is based on forgiveness because that's what God did. . . . When I see people in my faith being extremely judgmental, it's very disconcerting."

Nearly all of the demonized judges are, in fact, practicing Christians, not secular humanists. Perhaps half of them are Republican appointees, and at least that many regard themselves as conservatives. In addition to Greer, most of the judges of the 11th Circuit who upheld his rulings, as well as most of the Supreme Court justices who declined to intervene, consider themselves Christian. And so it goes around the country, even including many, if not most, of the judges in the California-based 9th Circuit, the regular object of President Bush's ridicule. And, lest we forget, Charles Darwin himself was a serious Christian.

The history of a Christian church divided against itself is a long and bloody one. People calling themselves Christians have stood for war and peace, subjugation and brotherhood, communism and capitalism, privilege and equality, enslavement and liberty, imperialism and isolation.

That is one reason Thomas Jefferson insisted on religious liberty in the new republic. In his Virginia Act for Establishing Religious Freedom, he wrote that "millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch toward uniformity."

The present war within the Christian fold is perhaps more threatening to the republic than any of the previous intramural disputes. Right-wing religious zealots, working in partnership with the secularists who have advised President Bush, are a threat to the most fundamental of American principles. The founders of our nation welcomed and planned for spirited debate over public policies, including the role of the judiciary. But as sons of the Enlightenment, they looked to found a republic in which the outcome of those debates would turn on reason and evidence, not on disputed religious dogma. They planned wisely for principles that are now under wide assault.

All Americans, of whatever religious or non-religious persuasion, need to be on the alert to preserve those principles. The burden falls especially heavily on the mainstream Christians who are slowly awakening to the gravity of the challenge facing them. Too long tolerant of their brethren, too much given to forgiveness rather than to confrontation, they need to mount a spirited, nationwide response to what constitutes a dangerous distortion of Christian truths and a frightening threat to the republic they love.

The writer is professor emeritus of southern and civil rights history at the University of Virginia.
 

Similar threads

M
Replies
0
Views
328
Road Cycling
MagillaGorilla
M
M
Replies
0
Views
1K
Road Cycling
MagillaGorilla
M