Shimano automatic transmission, experiences?

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Jouko L., Feb 16, 2003.

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  1. Jouko L.

    Jouko L. Guest

    I'm interested in any experiences you may have with the Shimano Nexus 3-speed automatic
    transmission. Especially I'm interested in battery consumption, and more specifically, battery
    consumption in cold climate (down to -20 C = -2 F).

    - Jouko L.
     
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  2. Russell

    Russell Guest

    "Jouko L." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > I'm interested in any experiences you may have with the Shimano Nexus 3-speed automatic
    > transmission. Especially I'm interested in battery consumption, and more specifically, battery
    > consumption in cold climate (down to -20 C = -2 F).
    >
    > - Jouko L.

    Are you talking about the Auto-D system. AFAIK, it has never been available for sale here
    in the U.S.
     
  3. A Muzi

    A Muzi Guest

    > > I'm interested in any experiences you may have with the Shimano Nexus 3-speed automatic
    > > transmission. Especially I'm interested in battery consumption, and more specifically, battery
    > > consumption in cold climate (down to -20 C = -2 F).

    > "Jouko L." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > Are you talking about the Auto-D system. AFAIK, it has never been available for sale here in
    > the U.S.

    The Auto-Fours were, though. I've sold them.

    --
    Andrew Muzi http://www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April 1971
     
  4. Jouko L.

    Jouko L. Guest

    Russell wrote:

    > Are you talking about the Auto-D system. AFAIK, it has never been available for sale here in
    > the U.S.

    Yeah, that's the system I'm talking about. Actually, my inquiry concerns the 4-speed transmission as
    well, 'cause (AFAIK) it's very similar with the 3-speed transmission.

    - Jouko L. (from Finland, where may have down to -40 C = -38 F in winter, but we can't ride bicycle
    below -30 C = -20 F because the grease in hubs gets so stiff...)
     
  5. Hatch-It

    Hatch-It Guest

    stiff grease? use synthetic lubricants. many of those are rated down to -60C and are available for
    automotive and cold-room applications are well as countries with frigid climates. go to a bearing
    supplier and ask them what they have.

    h

    Jouko L. wrote:
    > Russell wrote:
    >
    >> Are you talking about the Auto-D system. AFAIK, it has never been available for sale here in
    >> the U.S.
    >
    >
    > Yeah, that's the system I'm talking about. Actually, my inquiry concerns the 4-speed transmission
    > as well, 'cause (AFAIK) it's very similar with the 3-speed transmission.
    >
    > - Jouko L. (from Finland, where may have down to -40 C = -38 F in winter, but we can't ride
    > bicycle below -30 C = -20 F because the grease in hubs gets so stiff...)
     
  6. Must not say derogatory things about man who can't handle manually.... shifting... 3.......
    gears........

    *head explodes*
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  7. Jouko L.

    Jouko L. Guest

    Chris Phillipo wrote:
    > Must not say derogatory things about man who can't handle manually.... shifting... 3.......
    > gears........

    Who's the man who can't handle 3 gears manually? Can you? Can't the Americans shift gears of their
    cars manually, or don't they just want to do so?

    > *head explodes*

    Maybe 'cause your brains were in the wrong gear or out of gear?

    J.L.
     
  8. J. L.

    J. L. Guest

    hatch-it wrote:
    > stiff grease? use synthetic lubricants. many of those are rated down to -60C and are available for
    > automotive and cold-room applications are well as countries with frigid climates. go to a bearing
    > supplier and ask them what they have.

    Okay, okay, I wasn't that serious. Actually, there are many other things (than just the stiff
    grease) that make riding under -30 C = -20 F unpleasant. When talking about ordinary, everyday usage
    of bicycle (riding to the school, to a shop, to your friend's home etc.), there are rare people who
    would ride no matter how low the temperature goes. Here I exclude the extreme people.

    - Jouko L.
     
  9. In article <[email protected]>,
    [email protected] says...
    > Chris Phillipo wrote:
    > > Must not say derogatory things about man who can't handle manually.... shifting... 3.......
    > > gears........
    >
    > Who's the man who can't handle 3 gears manually? Can you? Can't the Americans shift gears of their
    > cars manually, or don't they just want to do so?
    >
    >

    Remind me again who's looking for an automatic transmission for a 3 speed bike?

    Yes I am out of gear but I'm trying to buy more.
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  10. <<>>

    <<>> Guest

    In news:[email protected], Chris Phillipo typed:

    > Remind me again who's looking for an automatic transmission for a 3 speed bike?

    I think the Auto Milano is a 7-speed. I looked at one tonight and I wasn't terribly impressed by the
    auto shifting. The mechanism is the same as the manual bike it just has a speed-sensor and a
    do-wacky that shifts for you depending on the speed. Not very wiz-bang if you ask me and certainly
    not worth the ~$100 price increase. I was under the impression that it was some sort of Continuously
    Variable (CV) transmission, which would have been much cooler. I'm looking for a bike to cruise
    around the City and the regular Milano is high on my list.

    Chris

    --
    #include <disclaimer.h> [email protected]
     
  11. A Muzi

    A Muzi Guest

    > Chris Phillipo typed:
    > > Remind me again who's looking for an automatic transmission for a 3 speed bike?

    "<<>>" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > In news:[email protected], I think the Auto Milano is a 7-speed. I
    > looked at one tonight and I wasn't terribly impressed by the auto shifting. The mechanism is the
    > same as the manual bike it just has a speed-sensor and a do-wacky that shifts for you depending on
    > the speed. Not very wiz-bang if you ask me and certainly not worth the ~$100 price increase. I was
    > under the impression that it was some sort of Continuously Variable (CV) transmission, which would
    > have been much cooler. I'm looking for a bike to cruise around the City and the regular Milano is
    > high on my list.

    Bianchi offers the bike with Shimano's Seven Nexus and also with their Auto Four. These are two
    different bikes.

    Although I haven't sold a Bianchi Auto Four we do sell Milano Sevens. More pointedly, I made a
    commitment to Raleigh's Auto Four and their Nexus Seven bikes when they were in style a few years
    ago. The Nexus outsold the Auto Four in spite of similar bike specs and a higher price tag. (Both
    together sell less well than a premium quality fully-equipped Kettler with SRAM seven at double
    the price.)

    The Auto Four offers an automatic shift acomplished by a servo behind the BB with a small camera
    battery and a wheel speed sensor. The control includes regular auto, an agressive "early shifting"
    auto mode and a manual override with pushbutton shifting ( Not as slick as my '58 Rambler's
    pushbutton automatic but cool nonetheless).

    Customers for the Auto Four were almost exclusively non-cyclists. A common comment on these and the
    SRAM sevens is that the customer really liked the fully covered chain. (Exposed chain is, by the
    way, still a _major_ purchase objection for beginning cyclists.) None of our Auto Four customers
    were concerned with rear wheel removal as they would have us change flats always. These bikes,
    while not high-mileage, are giving good service and battery replacement is about the only shifting
    service we do.

    So in my limited experience the Auto Four does just what it is intended to do - get a non cyclist on
    two wheels onto a fun and innovative vehicle at a very low price. My shop does not see great numbers
    of that kind of customer but overall I was satisfied with the product.

    Raleigh has discontinued that model and the Bianchi, while a _much_ nicer bike, is $250 more (or 50%
    more expensive) and so I haven't comitted to it. Milano Sevens sell dependably year in and year out.

    I can't imagine a CVT at $400 and in fact CVT designs I have seen are not all that suitable to
    a bicycle.
    --
    Andrew Muzi http://www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April 1971
     
  12. Jouko L.

    Jouko L. Guest

    Chris Phillipo wrote:

    > Remind me again who's looking for an automatic transmission for a 3 speed bike?

    - Why don't you remind me, who wrote that he's about to buy a 3-speed automatic bike for himself?
    I did not.

    - Why don't you remind me, who wrote that he's about to buy a 3-speed automatic bike due to
    incapability to change gears manually? I did not.

    - Why did you ignore half of my questions? Where they too tough for you?

    Here's the toughest question:
    - If a certain (brand new) bike with 3-speed manual transmission costs USD 350 and the same bike
    with 3-speed automatic transmission costs USD 160 (big sale), would you find it make any sense to
    buy the bike with the automatic transmission?

    > Yes I am out of gear but I'm trying to buy more.

    Oh...you're so funny guy! :) (made me smile)

    - J.L.
     
  13. <<>>

    <<>> Guest

    In news:[email protected], A Muzi typed:

    > Bianchi offers the bike with Shimano's Seven Nexus and also with their Auto Four. These are two
    > different bikes.

    The salesman failed to mention this. He told me that the both bikes had the exact same 7-speed hub
    but that the Auto had an electronic shifting mechanism.

    > Customers for the Auto Four were almost exclusively non-cyclists.

    Though I don't consider my self a cyclist I have been riding since I was a kid.

    > A common comment on these and the SRAM sevens is that the customer really liked the fully covered
    > chain. (Exposed chain is, by the way, still a _major_ purchase objection for beginning cyclists.)

    I like the way the chain covers look, reminds me of my old bike.

    > our Auto Four customers were concerned with rear wheel removal as they would have us change flats
    > always. These bikes, while not high-mileage, are giving good service and battery replacement is
    > about the only shifting service we do.

    I would probably do most of the service on my bike.

    > So in my limited experience the Auto Four does just what it is intended to do - get a non cyclist
    > on two wheels onto a fun and innovative vehicle at a very low price. My shop does not see great
    > numbers of that kind of customer but overall I was satisfied with the product.

    My goal is to find a fun, stylish, and comfortable bike to get around the city, ride through the
    parks, and get some exercise.

    > Raleigh has discontinued that model and the Bianchi, while a _much_ nicer bike, is $250 more (or
    > 50% more expensive) and so I haven't comitted to it. Milano Sevens sell dependably year in and
    > year out.

    I was quoted $569 for a Milano Seven, which is a bit more than I wanted to spend. But I really love
    the curved top tube, the fenders, the red-wall tires, and the Bianchi 'celeste' color. Plus it seems
    to have good components and is well made, and I am partial to all things Italian. I'm still looking
    at cheaper Schwinn and Raleigh bikes, as well as a black Trek Clyde.

    > I can't imagine a CVT at $400 and in fact CVT designs I have seen are not all that suitable to a
    > bicycle.

    I must read too many issues of Popular Mechanics ;)

    Chris

    --
    #include <disclaimer.h> [email protected]
     
  14. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > In news:[email protected], Chris Phillipo typed:
    >
    > > Remind me again who's looking for an automatic transmission for a 3 speed bike?
    >
    > I think the Auto Milano is a 7-speed. I looked at one tonight and I wasn't terribly impressed by
    > the auto shifting. The mechanism is the same as the manual bike it just has a speed-sensor and a
    > do-wacky that shifts for you depending on the speed. Not very wiz-bang if you ask me and certainly
    > not worth the ~$100 price increase. I was under the impression that it was some sort of
    > Continuously Variable (CV) transmission, which would have been much cooler. I'm looking for a bike
    > to cruise around the City and the regular Milano is high on my list.
    >
    > Chris
    >
    > --
    > #include <disclaimer.h> [email protected]
    >
    >
    >

    I would imagine that a CV transmission bike would be just like a single speed that always seems to
    have the right gear ratio no matter how fast you go. There is a problem with these things of course,
    people are not engines. Every car with a given set of gears in it's transmission and differentials
    gets the same engine. The bikes would have to be manufactured the same way, except the engine
    (people) would be a variable instead of a constant. Although a CV or centrifugal clutch transmission
    bike that has some sort of adjustment to customize the ratio for the rider would be really cool and
    useful, to my knowledge it hasn't been done, and if it was possible it probably would already be on
    the market displacing the likes of 9 speed manual transmissions.
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  15. Jouko L.

    Jouko L. Guest

    Chris Phillipo wrote:
    > Must not say derogatory things about man who can't handle manually.... shifting... 3.......
    > gears........
    >
    > *head explodes*

    Dear Chris,

    Why did you post that kind of impertinent follow up to a pertinent and relevant message?

    - Jouko L.
     
  16. In article <[email protected]>,
    [email protected] says...
    > Chris Phillipo wrote:
    > > Must not say derogatory things about man who can't handle manually.... shifting... 3.......
    > > gears........
    > >
    > > *head explodes*
    >
    >
    > Dear Chris,
    >
    > Why did you post that kind of impertinent follow up to a pertinent and relevant message?
    >
    > - Jouko L.
    >
    >

    Why did you?
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  17. Jouko L.

    Jouko L. Guest

    Chris Phillipo wrote:

    >>Dear Chris,
    >>
    >>Why did you post that kind of impertinent follow up to a pertinent and relevant message?
    >>
    >>- Jouko L.
    >>
    >>
    >
    >
    > Why did you?

    Because you started. Until you posted an impertinent follow up, I had posted only one article which
    was pertinent (the opening article of this thread). Then you replied with your impertinent article
    (your first follow up) and I decided to continue the discussion in the (lower) level that was chosen
    by you, not by me. For some reason the pertinent way was something you didn't want, so I thought
    that maybe we can do this by your way - the impertinent way.

    Now I can do nothing but repeat my inquiry: Why did you post that kind of impertinent follow up to a
    pertinent and relevant message?

    - Jouko L.
     
  18. In article <[email protected]>,
    [email protected] says...
    > Chris Phillipo wrote:
    >
    > >>Dear Chris,
    > >>
    > >>Why did you post that kind of impertinent follow up to a pertinent and relevant message?
    > >>
    > >>- Jouko L.
    > >>
    > >>
    > >
    > >
    > > Why did you?
    >
    >
    > Because you started. Until you posted an impertinent follow up, I had posted only one article
    > which was pertinent (the opening article of this thread). Then you replied with your impertinent
    > article (your first follow up) and I decided to continue the discussion in the (lower) level that
    > was chosen by you, not by me. For some reason the pertinent way was something you didn't want, so
    > I thought that maybe we can do this by your way - the impertinent way.
    >
    > Now I can do nothing but repeat my inquiry: Why did you post that kind of impertinent follow up to
    > a pertinent and relevant message?
    >
    > - Jouko L.
    >
    >
    >

    Could you say "pertinent" for me a few more times please? It really makes you sound cool and by
    extension I want to be associated with you.
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  19. Jouko L.

    Jouko L. Guest

    Chris Phillipo wrote:

    > Could you say "pertinent" for me a few more times please? It really makes you sound cool and by
    > extension I want to be associated with you.

    What a jerk!

    I guess you noticed that you did wrong, and you just can't admit it and you try to avoid to face
    that truth by ignoring my relevant questions. You behave like a child...

    I hope you behave better towards your bike stuff shop customers. Or do you laugh at loud if some of
    them pronounces a word badly or asks "something stupid"? That wouldn't be surprise...

    I regret that I replied your fist message at all. After all this debate it's still unclear, why you
    wrote it. I don't expect you to explain it, as you haven't done it by now, even if I've asked it.

    - Jouko L.

    Ps. I don't read your messages any more, so save trouble and don't reply this message.
     
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