Shimano R540 vs R500

[Guy Steven]

I am looking at buying a road bike. I have narrowed the options to a
choice between 2 bikes. One comes with Shimano R540 wheels, the other
with R500 wheels. Both are new bikes with 105 componentry, although the
bike with the R500 wheels is a 2005 model, the other one is 2004
componentry.
Is there a huge difference between these wheels?

 

[ritcho]

I am looking at buying a road bike. I have narrowed the options to a
choice between 2 bikes. One comes with Shimano R540 wheels, the other
with R500 wheels. Both are new bikes with 105 componentry, although the
bike with the R500 wheels is a 2005 model, the other one is 2004
componentry.
Is there a huge difference between these wheels?

Apart from having more spokes and having them installed alternating instead of being installed in pairs, there is little difference in the specs. Be prepared to spend about $10 per spoke if you break one (and hope you can find one). I have a pair of venerable WH-535s, the precursor to the 540.

My experience with the 535s has been generally good - they're heavy, a little aero and mostly durable. I built my own wheels that are lighter, easier to fix and better spec'd for about the same price. (plus I haven't broken a spoke yet on the homemade wheels after about 5000km, yay!)

Ritch

 

[Roadie_scum]

I am looking at buying a road bike. I have narrowed the options to a
choice between 2 bikes. One comes with Shimano R540 wheels, the other
with R500 wheels. Both are new bikes with 105 componentry, although the
bike with the R500 wheels is a 2005 model, the other one is 2004
componentry.
Is there a huge difference between these wheels?

The R540's are one of the worst things visited upon the cycling community in many years. They are up there with biopace chainrings and those bandaid things on athlete's noses that were meant to expand one's capacity to breathe as innovations that need never have existed.

Talk to a mechanic who has to work on them - they break spokes all the time if you ride much, the hubs fill up with water and they are neither particularly light nor particularly aero. They are also abominable to work on, taking twice as long to replace and retension spokes if you follow the shimano instructions, which means more $$$ if you need to have work done to them in a shop. Plus the spokes are expensive. And shimano don't give a warranty on their wheels (because they know they suck). The newer wheels are better, but if I were you I'd sell the wheels and get some decent handbuilts straight off, whichever bike you get. (Unless you weigh 45kg, ride 80km a week and only in the dry.)

 

[SteveA]

The R540's are one of the worst things visited upon the cycling community in many years. They are up there with biopace chainrings and those bandaid things on athlete's noses that were meant to expand one's capacity to breathe as innovations that need never have existed.

Talk to a mechanic who has to work on them - they break spokes all the time if you ride much, the hubs fill up with water and they are neither particularly light nor particularly aero. They are also abominable to work on, taking twice as long to replace and retension spokes if you follow the shimano instructions, which means more $$$ if you need to have work done to them in a shop. Plus the spokes are expensive. And shimano don't give a warranty on their wheels (because they know they suck). The newer wheels are better, but if I were you I'd sell the wheels and get some decent handbuilts straight off, whichever bike you get. (Unless you weigh 45kg, ride 80km a week and only in the dry.)

Fancy spoked wheels also, depending on design, can be totally unrideable if you lose just one spoke. Don't even go out of the shop with those wheels on the bike. Get the shop to swap them for some decent hand built wheels as part of the deal. It might cost a couple of hundred dollars more but it will be worth it. On my last bike, I swapped the standard wheels for a set of hand built wheels with DT Swiss hubs, DT Swiss spokes and Ritchey OCR Aero rims. The originals on the bike weren't Shimano R500s or R540s. They were nice wheels but they were too light for a big heavy rider like me so I swapped 'em as part of the deal.

SteveA

 

[Roadie_scum]

Fancy spoked wheels also, depending on design, can be totally unrideable if you lose just one spoke. Don't even go out of the shop with those wheels on the bike. Get the shop to swap them for some decent hand built wheels as part of the deal. It might cost a couple of hundred dollars more but it will be worth it. On my last bike, I swapped the standard wheels for a set of hand built wheels with DT Swiss hubs, DT Swiss spokes and Ritchey OCR Aero rims. The originals on the bike weren't Shimano R500s or R540s. They were nice wheels but they were too light for a big heavy rider like me so I swapped 'em as part of the deal.

SteveA

Solid advice. Couldn't agree more. Some prebuilts are ok for their intended purpose (eg good race wheels) but most people are better off on solid handbuilts. Especially commuters and recreational riders who don't want to screw around swapping between race/training wheels and hanging in a bike shop waiting for repairs all day.

 

[SteveA]

Solid advice. Couldn't agree more. Some prebuilts are ok for there intended purpose (eg good race wheels) but most people are better off on solid handbuilts. Especially commuters and recreational riders who don't want to screw around swapping between race/training wheels and hanging in a bike shop waiting for repairs all day.

Unfortunately, these wheels are a reflection of fashion/marketing. People see some of the fancy top end wheels and want wheels like them. Enter the marketing department. Any wheel other than a 3X 28/32/36 spoke conventional model can be marketed. The more radical the better - radial spokes, paired spokes, and the lower the number of spokes the better. And all marketed to the casual Sunday rider.

And most people neglect to consider that the lower the spoke count, the stronger the rim has to be (greater distance between supporting spokes). Who was it in the bike industry said, "light, strong, cheap - pick two"? So if you don't want to pay heaps for those stronger rims, they will be heavy.

Racing developed technology does trickle down but sometimes the marketing department gets premature in the name of winning market share.

Wait til some more of the wheels which have spokes glued into the hub hit Australia. Their spokes can only be replaced by the factory (in the US!!)

SteveA

 

[Roadie_scum]

I am looking at buying a road bike. I have narrowed the options to a
choice between 2 bikes. One comes with Shimano R540 wheels, the other
with R500 wheels. Both are new bikes with 105 componentry, although the
bike with the R500 wheels is a 2005 model, the other one is 2004
componentry.
Is there a huge difference between these wheels?

Just in case you don't want to take the advice of the crusty old advocates for reliable equipment, the R500 2005's are a substantial improvement on the R540's. Still average, but much better. I'd go for handbuilts anyway, but definitely, under no circumstances the R540's. R500's are passable.

 

[byron27]

Just in case you don't want to take the advice of the crusty old advocates for reliable equipment, the R500 2005's are a substantial improvement on the R540's. Still average, but much better. I'd go for handbuilts anyway, but definitely, under no circumstances the R540's. R500's are passable.

agreed.
my experience with 535's and 540's has been trying to say the least. From the 5 rear shimano wheels i have had, 4 of them fell apart (lost 2 spokes at the same time) and the other developed this horrifying noise in the rear hub which ended up being the bearings grinding up as the hub had collapsed.

I have used campag ventos for the last 7 months and they have been put through the wringer and they have been bullet proof. All for around the same price as the 500's.

 

[rickster]

Roadie_scum <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Guy Steven Wrote:
> > I am looking at buying a road bike. I have narrowed the options to a
> > choice between 2 bikes. One comes with Shimano R540 wheels, the other
> > with R500 wheels. Both are new bikes with 105 componentry, although
> > the
> > bike with the R500 wheels is a 2005 model, the other one is 2004
> > componentry.
> > Is there a huge difference between these wheels?
>
> Just in case you don't want to take the advice of the crusty old
> advocates for reliable equipment, the R500 2005's are a substantial
> improvement on the R540's. Still average, but much better. I'd go for
> handbuilts anyway, but definitely, under no circumstances the R540's.
> R500's are passable.

I had a look at some R500s. It seemed to my uneducated eye that the
spokes were standard ? (as in not $ 10/spoke, meaning replacing the
one that will break should be cheaper, not $ 50). Any one confrim
that ?

 

[mfhor]

Roadie_scum <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Guy Steven Wrote:
> > I am looking at buying a road bike. I have narrowed the options to a
> > choice between 2 bikes. One comes with Shimano R540 wheels, the other
> > with R500 wheels. Both are new bikes with 105 componentry, although
> > the
> > bike with the R500 wheels is a 2005 model, the other one is 2004
> > componentry.
> > Is there a huge difference between these wheels?
>
> Just in case you don't want to take the advice of the crusty old
> advocates for reliable equipment, the R500 2005's are a substantial
> improvement on the R540's. Still average, but much better. I'd go for
> handbuilts anyway, but definitely, under no circumstances the R540's.
> R500's are passable.

I had a look at some R500s. It seemed to my uneducated eye that the
spokes were standard ? (as in not $ 10/spoke, meaning replacing the
one that will break should be cheaper, not $ 50). Any one confrim
that ?

They're standard spokes, but there's not many of them. Like the Greek Chorus of retrofarts says (sorry guys ), they're not much good if you're heavy/ride aggressively/ride a lot. One snapped spoke on the R500 can put the rim sideways a whole lot. The Dura-Ace wheels are nice as race wheels, tho. Still got the nipples at the hub (good place for them to be). 32 spoke wheels all the way for training/everyday miles, I say.

M "closet retrofart" H

 

[ritcho]

[snip]
... 32 spoke wheels all the way for training/everyday miles, I say.

M "closet retrofart" H

I'll go one better: I found I went better in road races when I put the Shimano 535s in the outhouse and put the homemade 2-cross 32 spoke wheels on. Of course I could have improved due to more/smarter training... but I could still do an advertising campaign... "I improved from D-grade to B-grade in one season by upgrading to retro-wheels!"

Ritch.

Then I put the lights back on and ride to work...

 

[mfhor]

I'll go one better: I found I went better in road races when I put the Shimano 535s in the outhouse and put the homemade 2-cross 32 spoke wheels on. Of course I could have improved due to more/smarter training... but I could still do an advertising campaign... "I improved from D-grade to B-grade in one season by upgrading to retro-wheels!"

Ritch.

Then I put the lights back on and ride to work...

"Low spoke-count wheels! An Evil Plot to undermine the confidence of the Beginning Performance Cyclist! Look at the expression of sadness on the face of little Jimmy when his shiny new wheels pop a spoke 3 laps into Junior Criterium! Uncanny! Unnerving! Avoid disappointment! Buy Tried and True "Retrofart" Wheels! Endless hours of fun cleaning them! Plenty of Drag to let you know you're trying hard! Put a pair on your main climbing rival, and watch him fade like a flower! They slice (especially with bladed spokes)! They dice! They go round! They keep going round when you dink your overweight cousin to the milk bar! Hurry! Hurry! This offer won't last! (after anyone who can build a decent wheel has given up in disgust). I'm crazy! You're Crazy!

puff . . . pant . . . phew. Spruiking is hard work!

M"Unspecified-broad-psychological-malaise John" H

 

[aeek]

"Low spoke-count wheels! An Evil Plot to undermine the confidence of the Beginning Performance Cyclist! Look at the expression of sadness on the face of little Jimmy when his shiny new wheels pop a spoke 3 laps into Junior Criterium! Uncanny! Unnerving! Avoid disappointment! Buy Tried and True "Retrofart" Wheels! Endless hours of fun cleaning them! Plenty

so far I've gotten 150 reliable km out of my R550s (16/20) and I suspect the extra rear spokes are cancelled by the narrower track.
hmm, 36 spokes, 60kg = 1.666 kg/spoke; does that mean anything? Maybe if I include the weight of the bike?

This thread helped me notice some interesting Shimano wheels at Sunday's crit - attached to the outside of the rims. I keep thinking there's a reason most wheels attach the spokes to the centre of the rim. What would they have been?

Which arrangement would be best for wooden nipples? (to justify linseed oil)

 

[ritcho]

so far I've gotten 150 reliable km out of my R550s (16/20) and I suspect the extra rear spokes are cancelled by the narrower track.
hmm, 36 spokes, 60kg = 1.666 kg/spoke; does that mean anything? Maybe if I include the weight of the bike?

This thread helped me notice some interesting Shimano wheels at Sunday's crit - attached to the outside of the rims. I keep thinking there's a reason most wheels attach the spokes to the centre of the rim. What would they have been?

Which arrangement would be best for wooden nipples? (to justify linseed oil)

IIRC, the blurb that accompanied my 535s said the spokes attached to the opposite side of the rim so the angle to the hub would be increased, increasing lateral strength. I can see how it makes sense for a highly dished rear wheel, but I think it's cosmetic on a front wheel...

Ritch.

BTW, not all rims have spoke holes in the centre - the Ritchey OCR rims are an example...