Shortening Your Recovery Period?



The trouble is, that sort of pace can be directly uncomfortable if you're
used to much faster running. Even I find it awkward.
J
"Phil M." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Phil M." <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:
>
> > You said you ran a 19:36 5k last fall. Based on that, you should be doing your easy days at an
> > 8:00 min/mi pace.
>
> Actually, this should be even slower. Pfitzinger recommends 2 minutes per mile slower than your 10
> mile to 1/2 marathon race pace. A 19:36 5K extrapolates to a 6:49 min/mile pace for a 10 mile
> race. Therefore, 8:49 min/mi for recovery runs would be appropriate.
>
> -Phil
 
TopCounsel <[email protected]> writes:
: At 44, I am already finding that I often need a day of rest after I do an interval workout on
: the track, as well as a day of rest after my long runs. This is mostly due to
: stiffness/soreness that prevent me from having a good next workout if I don't take the day
: off. Would prefer only one day of rest per week, and no need to have any "junk miles"
: workouts.

At 57, I ran my long run for the week yesterday. 16 1/2 miles. I ran in the late morning. By the
middle of the afternoon I was pretty tired and stiff, so I did the only thing I could think of to
hasten recovery. I gathered up the children and went for a 3 mile walk. I have tried this several
times after a hard workout, and I find that it works wonders.

To hasten recovery go for a long easy walk a couple hours after the workout.

Larry
 
"TopCounsel" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> At 44, I am already finding that I often need a day of rest after I
do an
> interval workout on the track, as well as a day of rest after my long
runs.
> This is mostly due to stiffness/soreness that prevent me from having a
good
> next workout if I don't take the day off.

Probably not adding anything that hasn't been said before but don't you think you might be running
your long runs too hard if they're leaving you with stiffness/soreness?

Whilst I might feel a little tired after my 18-20 milers, they never leave me stiff or sore (or
perhaps I should say, I always run them at a pace that I know won't leave me stiff or sore). I
usually feel like I could repeat them the following day.

Tim
 
Donovan Rebbechi <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

> I think it's probably a combination of (a) a lack of sleep (b) a fairly demanding training
> schedule, and (c) age in approximately that order.

I´d suggest insufficient "muscle maintenance" as a factor which should be at the top of the list: a
younger man can often get away with poor warmup & cooldown and stretching habits, but at some point
beyond forty he will reap what he has sown - or so I´ve been told.

Tense muscles get sore, recover slowly; daily stretching and, if possible, a weekly aquajogging
session would be recommended.

Further, it might be prudent to add a few strength sessions, either at home (with or without
weights) or at a gym.

Anders
 
Steroid drugs are supposed to be very helpful this regard, though I never tried it. Many potentially
bad side-effects, especially as males get older.
 
[email protected] (TopCounsel) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> >You are clearly not up to SPEED on the proven positive aspects of coffee
> (caffeine).
>
> Well... enlighten us, then. I know caffeine can help you run faster in the short run -- it does
> that for me, too. But what is the research which shows that caffeine (or is it specifically
> coffee?) has the "surprising power to heal" which the March Runner's World crows about? And, if
> one is already drinking lots of caffeinated beverages, isn't the issue a red herring? Or, are
> there other safe ways to selectively speed up your metabolism to improve healing rates (e.g.,
> thyroid supplements?). Believe me, I'm all ears.

All ears? That's the problem. Need something in between.
 
Larry McMahan <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> TopCounsel <[email protected]> writes:
> : At 44, I am already finding that I often need a day of rest after I do an interval workout
> : on the track, as well as a day of rest after my long runs. This is mostly due to
> : stiffness/soreness that prevent me from having a good next workout if I don't take the day
> : off. Would prefer only one day of rest per week, and no need to have any "junk miles"
> : workouts.
>
> At 57, I ran my long run for the week yesterday. 16 1/2 miles. I ran in the late morning. By the
> middle of the afternoon I was pretty tired and stiff, so I did the only thing I could think of to
> hasten recovery. I gathered up the children and went for a 3 mile walk. I have tried this several
> times after a hard workout, and I find that it works wonders.

Back in my marathon days (mid 90's) I would do a long run Sunday morning then in the afternoon go
out for an hour easy bike ride.

Now that I'm not doing marathons after a long run (13-15 miles) I'll drink some sort of protien rich
recovery drink and keep moving around. I've been informed that stretching right after a long run
will delay recovery. So I'll stretch after moving around in the afternoon.

I believe active recoveries are working well for me.

Andy
 
TopCounsel wrote:

>>Back down before you break. Your body is giving you hints and I don't think
>
> your listening.
>
> What do you think of shedding a quick 10 lbs. or so to lighten the work load (after all, f = ma,
> and p = mv, and all that, right?). Do you think this could compensate for the aging and bring my
> recovery periods down to where they once were?

I hope your kidding. You need to learn to run smarter not necessarily faster especially each day.
Sorry legal man but the clock is ticking and your living in the past.

Do you feel like your giving up life just because you can't add quality each day?

--
Doug Freese "Caveat Lector" [email protected]
 
In article <[email protected]>, TopCounsel wrote:

> I'm just wanting to do what I always have done, without the need for sitting out any extra days.
> I'm not trying to set speed records. I hear very often in this NG how much easier it is for obese
> people to run once they lose weight, etc. What works on a macro scale should have some benefit on
> a micro scale. I would be just fine 10 lbs. lighter, so, if it eases the load and prevents the
> need for extra rest, why not? Do you see any downside?

If your content to stay at the same *absolute* (not relative) pace, then anything that makes you
faster will make that easier. The problem is that you probably need to get a lot faster before
you'll be comfortable at that pace on that milage.

I think the point that you're missing is that there's nothing wrong with your recovery capacity at
all. In fact I think you're doing remarkably well to train at that pace for that milage.

You're simply pushing quite hard on your day to day runs, which places larger demands on your
recovery. I think it also results in less intense interval sessions. For example, your training runs
are about 15-30 seconds faster than mine yet your 400m repeats are about the same speed as my tempo
runs or 1 mile tempo repeats. The problem, IMO, with trying to train "hard" all the time is that the
end result is that you actually end up training "medium-rare" all the time, much harder than the
easy training pace, but nowhere near real speedwork pace.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/
 
Donovan Rebbechi <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

> In article <[email protected]>, TopCounsel wrote:
> > I'm just wanting to do what I always have done, without the need for sitting out any extra
> > days. (...)

1. You can´t always get what you want - even if you used to keep getting it until now.

2. I don´t think you want to do what you always have done just because it is what you always have
done; maybe you can ask yourself what it is that you´ve got out of doing what you always have
done - and whether you could still get it by doing something slightly different (i.e. by training
"smarter" along the ways suggested here)?

3. Calling "easy", "recovery" or "preparatory" training "sitting out" smacks of stupid macho
********. If Rob de Castella could limit himself to two "intense" days per week, maybe you
should, too.

> (...) I think the point that you're missing is that there's nothing wrong with your
> recovery capacity at all. In fact I think you're doing remarkably well to train at that
> pace for that milage.

I´ll let myself be blunt and put it this way: "TopCounsel, it could be you´re not old, but stupid
and stubborn!":)

Anders
 
white birch tree bark.if interest in willie. do some reserch on birch beer. now is the season to
gather. take a sharp knife with you and a carry bag. for me I have to go soon to pick.( ! Now") by
time this on I be home and out again for more shaghorn sumacc. and good load of barks twigs both
inner and outer. rain and snow melt well make gather a probe. so got to get while I can stand on
snow and ice. more like above and below my knee. at least not mud and swamp. all birch are not in
the swamp now. maybe hard like a walk on a . thin ice. hee hee ha ah ha ha. key stone cops trick
right. maybe. by takeing wet side of tree bark and place on legs. old ***** indiantrick. latter
Lowtuc got to run be stelth, be ninja and above all be safe. shag horn lick the fingers is sweet and
a blast. jaw still like a biggey tingggggg 5 makes a cup. de pends how much of the fruit you want to
feel the tips of fingers to remove from stems.
 
TopCounsel wrote:

> I'm just wanting to do what I always have done, without the need for sitting out any extra days.

You have a few choices;
1. continue with constant quality until your body/age take you behind the barn.
2. Continue your constant push to every run until you have to take a day off from over training.
3. Every third run do an easy short recovery run. That means slow, flat not even one little pick
up the pace!

I think Lyndon very succinctly provided the answer - you get stronger during REST days. You're great
at tearing down your muscles but not good at allowing them to rebuild. Note Noakes' 5th law of
training, "alternate hard easy training days." He further goes on to qualify, only train hard twice
a week. I'm sure there some room for variation but the theme is consistent.

Also note Donovan's "medium rare" perspective.

I'm not trying to set speed records. I hear very often in
> this NG how much easier it is for obese people to run once they lose weight, etc. What works on a
> macro scale should have some benefit on a micro scale. I would be just fine 10 lbs. lighter, so,
> if it eases the load and prevents the need for extra rest, why not? Do you see any downside?

So you're doing all this hard work and you still have 10 pounds of fat to shed? Are you on a
20 Milky Way a day diet? Somehow I suspect poor eating, or excess Calories is not you. To get
off another 10 pounds it would likely come from water, muscle and maybe some fat and likely in
that order.

Like most of us that have been running for years our weight settles into a small range depending on
our training. Sure we could concentrate on every morsel we eat and possibly eliminate some junk
calories and maybe get lighter. Will that make you run faster, maybe. Quite honestly what will make
you run faster regardless of weight will be better recovery which means REST days. Add some
carefully placed easy days, you will feel better, recover faster, and likely race faster.

--
Doug Freese "Caveat Lector" [email protected]
 
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