Should DSC change tactics for stage 15?

[trg]

"David Ferguson" <[email protected]> a écrit dans le message de
news: [email protected]...
> On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 14:40:48 +0200, "trg"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>"David Ferguson" <[email protected]> a écrit dans le message de
>>news: [email protected]...
>>> On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 12:04:32 GMT, "Steven L. Sheffield"
>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On 07/16/2005 08:55 PM, in article
>>>>[email protected], "David Ferguson"
>>>><[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you think they are going to send Popo and George in an early break
>>>>> so they will be there at the catch and ready to "pace set and clean
>>>>> up" you have never been on a bike for more than 50 miles and have
>>>>> never gone up a hill bigger than one you'd sleigh ride down.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>So why is George in the early break today?
>>>
>>> That's exactly my question. What is that really going to do?
>>>
>>> I guess we'll find out.
>>>
>>> If it's "pace set and clean up" on the last hill, as has been
>>> surmised, I will concede to the all knowing.
>>>
>>> D
>>Stage win, Enter in the top 5. Already, the presence of Pereiro and
>>Hincapie
>>in the break means that it's CSC leading the peloton at 60kph to protect
>>Basso's GC position.
>>
>
>
> 11:55 - Discovery Channel Leads The Peloton
> The peloton is being led by the Discovery Channel team. This squad has
> one representative in the 14-man escape group (Hincapie) which is
> about to contest the first intermediate sprint (at the 37km mark).
>

With Discovery "leading" (ie riding pace), the break got 19 minutes. So CSC
had to come to the front for Basso.

 

[David Ferguson]

>
>That was 2 hours and 50 minutes prior to your post.
>

>
>

Yah, and I made another post 20 minutes before yours(above) saying CSC
was back up after the puncture.

Time flies.

D

 

[Joe Blow]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 13:10:05 +0200, Ewoud Dronkert
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sat, 16 Jul 2005 14:59:51 -0500, Joe Blow wrote:
>> Perhaps putting Popovych and/or Hincapie in an early break?
>
>Well, you nailed it, Hincapie in the break.

Lucky guess from a July RBR homer /eye roll/

Actually I would never have picked Hincapie as a good choice, but he's
climbing so damn well this tour. And like I mentioned, Johan/Postal
did this on a previous years' tour stage, but my shitty memory can't
recall exactly when/where it was.

 

[trg]

"Joe Blow" <[email protected]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email protected]...
> On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 13:10:05 +0200, Ewoud Dronkert
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 16 Jul 2005 14:59:51 -0500, Joe Blow wrote:
>>> Perhaps putting Popovych and/or Hincapie in an early break?
>>
>>Well, you nailed it, Hincapie in the break.
>
> Lucky guess from a July RBR homer /eye roll/
>
> Actually I would never have picked Hincapie as a good choice, but he's
> climbing so damn well this tour. And like I mentioned, Johan/Postal
> did this on a previous years' tour stage, but my shitty memory can't
> recall exactly when/where it was.

TIIRC, they did it twice in 2003 with Beltran and also Rubiera

 

[David Ferguson]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 09:35:02 -0500, Joe Blow <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 13:10:05 +0200, Ewoud Dronkert
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 16 Jul 2005 14:59:51 -0500, Joe Blow wrote:
>>> Perhaps putting Popovych and/or Hincapie in an early break?
>>
>>Well, you nailed it, Hincapie in the break.
>
>Lucky guess from a July RBR homer /eye roll/
>
>Actually I would never have picked Hincapie as a good choice, but he's
>climbing so damn well this tour. And like I mentioned, Johan/Postal
>did this on a previous years' tour stage, but my shitty memory can't
>recall exactly when/where it was.


Either way, it was a damn good call.

I still can't figure out exactly what the advantage really is.

 

[[email protected]]

David Ferguson wrote:
> "Steven L. Sheffield" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > So why is George in the early break today?
>
> That's exactly my question. What is that really going to do?
>
> I guess we'll find out.

Insurance. He might be needed. Or not. It does make more
difference when there's flat before the last climb. I didn't
think DSC would do this, just that they could. The team that's
been hurt are CSC who could have used someone in the break.
I do think it's apparent that DSC have soft-pedaled
(relatively) in the peleton, riding conservatively to
save the team, rather than trying to reduce the gap so that
LANCE can go for the stage win.

At this point, leaders hitting the final climb, it looks
like the break could stay away. LANCE doesn't appear to
have much trouble and there are no danger men ahead (I don't
have OLN so can't see what LANCE looks like). If he is
OK and the break looks like staying away, Disco probably
will not ask George to drop back, but have him go for a
position on the stage.

 

[David Ferguson]

On 17 Jul 2005 07:54:07 -0700, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>
>David Ferguson wrote:
>> "Steven L. Sheffield" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> > So why is George in the early break today?
>>
>> That's exactly my question. What is that really going to do?
>>
>> I guess we'll find out.
>
>Insurance. He might be needed. Or not. It does make more
>difference when there's flat before the last climb. I didn't
>think DSC would do this, just that they could. The team that's
>been hurt are CSC who could have used someone in the break.
>I do think it's apparent that DSC have soft-pedaled
>(relatively) in the peleton, riding conservatively to
>save the team, rather than trying to reduce the gap so that
>LANCE can go for the stage win.
>
>At this point, leaders hitting the final climb, it looks
>like the break could stay away. LANCE doesn't appear to
>have much trouble and there are no danger men ahead (I don't
>have OLN so can't see what LANCE looks like). If he is
>OK and the break looks like staying away, Disco probably
>will not ask George to drop back, but have him go for a
>position on the stage.


I find the whole thing odd.

Lots of energy for Hincapie to spend. I guess they don't believe they
will need him that bad next week. Rest day coming will help. Flats.

 

[trg]

"David Ferguson" <[email protected]> a écrit dans le message de
news: [email protected]...
> On 17 Jul 2005 07:54:07 -0700, "[email protected]"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>David Ferguson wrote:
>>> "Steven L. Sheffield" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> > So why is George in the early break today?
>>>
>>> That's exactly my question. What is that really going to do?
>>>
>>> I guess we'll find out.
>>
>>Insurance. He might be needed. Or not. It does make more
>>difference when there's flat before the last climb. I didn't
>>think DSC would do this, just that they could. The team that's
>>been hurt are CSC who could have used someone in the break.
>>I do think it's apparent that DSC have soft-pedaled
>>(relatively) in the peleton, riding conservatively to
>>save the team, rather than trying to reduce the gap so that
>>LANCE can go for the stage win.
>>
>>At this point, leaders hitting the final climb, it looks
>>like the break could stay away. LANCE doesn't appear to
>>have much trouble and there are no danger men ahead (I don't
>>have OLN so can't see what LANCE looks like). If he is
>>OK and the break looks like staying away, Disco probably
>>will not ask George to drop back, but have him go for a
>>position on the stage.
>
>
> I find the whole thing odd.
>
> Lots of energy for Hincapie to spend. I guess they don't believe they
> will need him that bad next week. Rest day coming will help. Flats.
>


"I actually went in the break so that I could help Lance in the finish"

-George Hincapie

 

[David Ferguson]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 17:31:59 +0200, "trg"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>>
>
>
>"I actually went in the break so that I could help Lance in the finish"
>
>-George Hincapie
>


Um, yeah, you already said that exact same thing in another tread. I
replied there.

D

 

[Ewoud Dronkert]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 10:40:39 -0400, David Ferguson wrote:
> I still can't figure out exactly what the advantage really is.

Look at Sevilla/Ullrich.

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[David Ferguson]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 17:51:21 +0200, Ewoud Dronkert
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 10:40:39 -0400, David Ferguson wrote:
>> I still can't figure out exactly what the advantage really is.
>
>Look at Sevilla/Ullrich.


They finished ST

Hincapie was 5 minutes ahead of Armstrong.

If he'd have been caught and in shape to help I would say there was an
advantage.

D

 

[Ewoud Dronkert]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 12:39:39 -0400, David Ferguson wrote:
>> Look at Sevilla/Ullrich.
>
> They finished ST
>
> Hincapie was 5 minutes ahead of Armstrong.
>
> If he'd have been caught and in shape to help I would say there was an
> advantage.

Sevilla was in the break, got caught on the last climb, waited for Ullrich
and was able to tow him along for 2 kilometres or a little more, which
maybe saved Ullrich another half minute time loss.

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[David Ferguson]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 18:44:03 +0200, Ewoud Dronkert
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 12:39:39 -0400, David Ferguson wrote:
>>> Look at Sevilla/Ullrich.
>>
>> They finished ST
>>
>> Hincapie was 5 minutes ahead of Armstrong.
>>
>> If he'd have been caught and in shape to help I would say there was an
>> advantage.
>
>Sevilla was in the break, got caught on the last climb, waited for Ullrich
>and was able to tow him along for 2 kilometres or a little more, which
>maybe saved Ullrich another half minute time loss.


Right. But is that what Hincapie did?

I grasp the situation. George was in that position, to be able to do
that. I see the advantage there. When it said "I still can't figure
out exactly what the advantage really is." it was before the end of
the race but after we knew he wasn't going to be dropping back or
waiting for Armstrong.

D