Shove off

[Kenneth Clements]

Cycling north up the Epping Rd. this evening I got a whack on my right arm.
I was going at quite a speed so lost control but managed to make my landing
on the soft stuff at the left verge. Thought it was a wing mirror but didn't
see which vehicle it was as I was too busy falling off but it didn't stop. A
lady stopped and asked if I was alright and offered to take me home (my home
;-)) with bike in the boot. After checking myself and my bike I found only I
had an aching side but nothing serious but pretty annoyed . As I was about
to set off again a van stopped opposite and the driver said a passenger had
leaned out and deliberately pushed me off and he had chased the car and got
the number. So witness and I to the cop shop to give details and obtain a
crime number. Common assault was mentioned but I don't expect the sod will
get more than a caution if found. I know I would do the same but I am glad
these two people were around.

Ken.

 

[Richard]

Kenneth Clements wrote:
> After checking myself and my bike I found only I
> had an aching side but nothing serious but pretty annoyed

Do check your frame. I fell off once (entirely my own fault, I was
gazing at the passing scenery when a pedestrian refuge jumped out at me)
and thought the bike was OK, it was one of those pathetically
non-violent crashes. However, it later transpired I'd bent the rear
triangle.

> crime number. Common assault was mentioned but I don't expect the sod will
> get more than a caution if found. I know I would do the same but I am glad
> these two people were around.

Hear hear - well done to them for stopping. When a similar thing
happened to me, I got the number and they investigated it as assault.
However, the driver was stricken with amnesia as who his passengers
were, and as I was witnessless, there was little they could do. But
they did speak to him at home and at work, and according to the officer,
neither his wife nor his boss were at all amused.

R.

 

[[email protected]]

Don't know the exact circumstances here but if your witness says the
car deliberately slowed down and passed close to you to allow the
passernger to assault you would it be possible to charge the driver
with assault on the basis he was acting along with the passenger?
Perhaps a post on UK legal might give an opinion or "Sniper"
might turn up here.

Iain

 

[Andy M]

[email protected] wrote:
> Don't know the exact circumstances here but if your witness says the
> car deliberately slowed down and passed close to you to allow the
> passernger to assault you would it be possible to charge the driver
> with assault on the basis he was acting along with the passenger?
> Perhaps a post on UK legal might give an opinion or "Sniper"
> might turn up here.

I would have thought both the driver and passenger could be charged with
assault, and the driver charged with failing to stop at the scene of an
accident.

Surely if assault was mentioned then it is up to the victim to press
charges, not the police to issue a warning?

I'm no lawyer though, so get proper legal advice, but I'd aim to have
the book thrown at them... including all costs, which includes medical.

--
Andy.

 

[graham]

"Kenneth Clements" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Cycling north up the Epping Rd. this evening I got a whack on my right
> arm. I was going at quite a speed so lost control but managed to make my
> landing on the soft stuff at the left verge. Thought it was a wing mirror
> but didn't see which vehicle it was as I was too busy falling off but it
> didn't stop. A lady stopped and asked if I was alright and offered to take
> me home (my home ;-)) with bike in the boot. After checking myself and my
> bike I found only I had an aching side but nothing serious but pretty
> annoyed . As I was about to set off again a van stopped opposite and the
> driver said a passenger had leaned out and deliberately pushed me off and
> he had chased the car and got the number. So witness and I to the cop shop
> to give details and obtain a crime number. Common assault was mentioned
> but I don't expect the sod will get more than a caution if found. I know I
> would do the same but I am glad these two people were around.
>
> Ken.
Private prosecution? Sue the ******* for trauma/damage etc.?
Graham

 

[Pinky]

"Kenneth Clements" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Cycling north up the Epping Rd. this evening I got a whack on my right
> arm. I was going at quite a speed so lost control but managed to make my
> landing on the soft stuff at the left verge. Thought it was a wing mirror
> but didn't see which vehicle it was as I was too busy falling off but it
> didn't stop. A lady stopped and asked if I was alright and offered to take
> me home (my home ;-)) with bike in the boot. After checking myself and my
> bike I found only I had an aching side but nothing serious but pretty
> annoyed . As I was about to set off again a van stopped opposite and the
> driver said a passenger had leaned out and deliberately pushed me off and
> he had chased the car and got the number. So witness and I to the cop shop
> to give details and obtain a crime number. Common assault was mentioned
> but I don't expect the sod will get more than a caution if found. I know I
> would do the same but I am glad these two people were around.
>
> Ken.
>
If you are a member of CTC then please contact their free legal help line
and I think you will find, since you have witnesses and a police crime
number, that they will support you with free legal assistance in terms of
making a compensation claim at least, or even a private prosecution. ( If
you aren't a member still ask them and if they say they would support you
then JOIN!)
I would expect there to be little further action from the police without
pressure from a solicitor! They manage to give an impression of being too
busy, too overworked, to supportive of criminal rights ( usw) to care. It is
a sad fact in my own long experience that the very real respect for the
police that was instilled into me by my parents and other educators when I
was young has evaporated over the years. Slowly at first but increasingly
rapidly in the last 20 years. They are very unlikely to act in a case like
this.

But, since you have the driver's car number and witnesses, sue the b*stard!

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire,
England, United Kingdom.
www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

 

[John Rowland]

"graham" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:UQb8g.144401$P01.127663@pd7tw3no...
>
> Private prosecution? Sue the ******* for trauma/damage etc.?

Attempted murder, surely?

 

[LSMike]

Pinky wrote:
> --
> Trevor A Panther
> In South Yorkshire,
> England, United Kingdom.
> www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

I'm surprised you didn't plonk him!

 

[spindrift]

All credit to the other van driver.

 

[Kenneth Clements]

"LSMike" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Pinky wrote:
>> --
>> Trevor A Panther
>> In South Yorkshire,
>> England, United Kingdom.
>> www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk
>
> I'm surprised you didn't plonk him!

I didn't even see the car let alone the occupants.
I am a member of the CTC and called the accident helpline. They were not
interested as I wasn't really injured just a bit sore and my belonings don't
appear to be damaged. They referred me back to the CTC and they were not
interested either. I know they don't want to know every time someone falls
off their bike but I would have thought they would have been interested in
criminal assaults on their members while cycling, with witnesses and a crime
number. Apparently not.

Ken.

 

[[email protected]]

Kenneth Clements wrote:
> a passenger had leaned out [of a moving car] and
> deliberately pushed me off [my bike] and he had chased
> the car and got the number.
....
> I don't expect the sod will
> get more than a caution if found

Thing is, you are a second class citizen. Only cage
operators and their associates are First Class Citizens
who can offer the prospect of imminent death on a
daily basis without censure.

As far as I can tell we will have to get used to it since there
are to many of them.

 

[Danny Colyer]

Kenneth Clements wrote:
> I am a member of the CTC and called the accident helpline. They were not
> interested as I wasn't really injured just a bit sore and my belonings don't
> appear to be damaged. They referred me back to the CTC and they were not
> interested either. I know they don't want to know every time someone falls
> off their bike but I would have thought they would have been interested in
> criminal assaults on their members while cycling, with witnesses and a crime
> number. Apparently not.

I suggest a letter to Cycle may be in order, asking why they are not
interested in an assault on a member while cycling. As a member myself,
I'd certainly be interested in the answer.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Subscribe to PlusNet <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/referral/>
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

 

[Pinky]

"Kenneth Clements" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "LSMike" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Pinky wrote:
>>> --
>>> Trevor A Panther
>>> In South Yorkshire,
>>> England, United Kingdom.
>>> www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk
>>
>> I'm surprised you didn't plonk him!
>
> I didn't even see the car let alone the occupants.
> I am a member of the CTC and called the accident helpline. They were not
> interested as I wasn't really injured just a bit sore and my belonings
> don't appear to be damaged. They referred me back to the CTC and they were
> not interested either. I know they don't want to know every time someone
> falls off their bike but I would have thought they would have been
> interested in criminal assaults on their members while cycling, with
> witnesses and a crime number. Apparently not.
>
> Ken.
>
>
ken

Well that is more than sad and you should take it up with CTC headquarters
direct because that sort of incident is where we need support.

I personally feel that far too many motorists are allowed to continue on
their destructive way with no restrictions. When I was knocked off my bike
and given 3 broken ribs -- and the driver admitted liability to the
police -- their action was absolutely nil. They even failed to reply to my
letter asking for an explanation of their decision making process in
deciding to "take no further action in this matter". CTC legal support has
given me a real compensation claim -- but the driver will just lose his no
claims bonus and continue on his destructive way!

My experience is very different but that doesn't mean that I condone such a
lack of response. CTC does need a hefty kick up the **** occasionally and I
disagree with many of its modern policies. However on the positive side, my
experience in an accident and with bike insurance has been excellent.

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire,
England, United Kingdom.
www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

 

[Ian Smith]

On Wed, 10 May 2006, Danny Colyer <[email protected]> wrote:
> Kenneth Clements wrote:
> > I am a member of the CTC and called the accident helpline. They were not
> > interested as I wasn't really injured just a bit sore and my belonings don't
> > appear to be damaged. They referred me back to the CTC and they were not
> > interested either. I know they don't want to know every time someone falls
> > off their bike but I would have thought they would have been interested in
> > criminal assaults on their members while cycling, with witnesses and a crime
> > number. Apparently not.
>
> I suggest a letter to Cycle may be in order, asking why they are not
> interested in an assault on a member while cycling. As a member myself,
> I'd certainly be interested in the answer.

Seconded. In fact, I feel somewhat inclined to write myself ("an
acquaintance reports....")

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

 

[Kenneth Clements]

"Ian Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

snip

>> I suggest a letter to Cycle may be in order, asking why they are not
>> interested in an assault on a member while cycling. As a member myself,
>> I'd certainly be interested in the answer.
>
> Seconded. In fact, I feel somewhat inclined to write myself ("an
> acquaintance reports....")
>
> regards, Ian SMith

I've sent a brief letter,below, to the editor. You can but try!

Ken.

Hi

I was disappointed with the response I had from the CTC today. Yesterday
evening I was deliberately pushed off my bike at speed by a passing car
passenger. At the time I thought I had been hit by a wing mirror but didn't
see the vehicle. A few minutes later a driver stopped and said he had seen
me being pushed off and had chased the car and got the number. So I had a
witness and a crime number from the police.

I called the CTC accident helpline mainly to seek advise on what action to
take, if any. Their response was that as I had no injuries, just sore ribs,
and my property wasn't damaged they had nothing to say. They just take names
and addreses and send out claim packs but referred me back to the CTC for
advise. The person on the enquiries line was sympathetic but said the
accident helpline dealt with this kind of event. It seems the CTC is not
interested in recording criminal assaults on its members while cycling and I
think it should. These yobs will probably go on their way with little or no
concequence. If the CTC does have a policy on these events perhaps you could
enlighten me.

Regards, K Clements
9994437

 

[Pinky]

I have also sent an e-mail to CTC Hq expressing my disquiet with regard to
their lack of support in this matter

Here is the mail that I sent :-

"CTC Directors/Managers/Employees

A topic was raised on the News Group "uk.rec.cycling" by a poster who told a
tale of being assaulted on the road by a passenger in a car striking him on
the arm and "nearly" dismounting him. This was raised under the topic
heading
"Shove off" by a Kenneth Clements. I suggest that you look at this topic to
see the various comments made -- including my own.

In response, I made a strong suggestion that the poster, if he was a member,
should
contact CTC legal services for advice and help -- saying how pleased I was
by their support in a case of my own.

He later reposted, in answer to me, saying, that, as a CTC member, he had
had
no support at all! Also quoting his membership number (xxxxxxxx Deleted).

I actually do believe that legal support for incidents like this is an
absolute essential requirement for an organisation such as CTC. This is
basic support for ordinary members at "grass roots level" and very much the
support that I would expect myself.

All this government lobbying is all very well but it takes years and years
to have any effect. A few appearances in courts (at a high a level as
possible) has a much more immediate effect -- with due publicity,

It is one of the areas that I believe CTC fails to hit the headlines ( they
also fail in many other areas -- perhaps by becoming a charity and
receiving/seeking too much Governmental support).

I do believe, very seriously, that CTC should have an immensely more
positive support to a case like this.

I will provide more information on this if it is required but you only have
to look


....

Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire,
England, United Kingdom.
www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

 

[Paul Boyd]

Kenneth Clements said the following on 10/05/2006 18:16:
> I am a member of the CTC and called the accident helpline. They were not
> interested as I wasn't really injured just a bit sore and my belonings don't
> appear to be damaged. They referred me back to the CTC and they were not
> interested either. I know they don't want to know every time someone falls
> off their bike but I would have thought they would have been interested in
> criminal assaults on their members while cycling, with witnesses and a crime
> number. Apparently not.

That is appalling. As a member of the CTC also, I would have expected
them to take action. I though this was what part of our subs were for.
They are supposed to be campaigning for road safety, and at the same
time apparently ignoring a blatantly dangerous act that should result in
a clear-cut prosecution. As you say, this is not simply a case of
falling off your bike, but a deliberate assault against you by a
motorist. And for the pedants on here, the registered keeper is
ultimately repsonsible if he/she can't/won't say who actually committed
the offence. That fact that you weren't injured beyond a few bruises is
just fortunate - it could easily have been far worse.

On the face of it, it appears that the CTC are only looking to help with
personal injury cases. If that is the case, then they are as bad as
all the other sharks that operate in that area.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

 

[Ambrose Nankivell]

Paul Boyd wrote:
> Kenneth Clements said the following on 10/05/2006 18:16:
>> I am a member of the CTC and called the accident helpline. They were
>> not interested as I wasn't really injured just a bit sore and my
>> belonings don't appear to be damaged. They referred me back to the
>> CTC and they were not interested either. I know they don't want to
>> know every time someone falls off their bike but I would have
>> thought they would have been interested in criminal assaults on
>> their members while cycling, with witnesses and a crime number.
>> Apparently not.
>
> That is appalling. As a member of the CTC also, I would have expected
> them to take action. I though this was what part of our subs were
> for. They are supposed to be campaigning for road safety, and at the
> same time apparently ignoring a blatantly dangerous act that should
> result in a clear-cut prosecution. As you say, this is not simply a
> case of falling off your bike, but a deliberate assault against you
> by a motorist. And for the pedants on here, the registered keeper is
> ultimately repsonsible if he/she can't/won't say who actually
> committed the offence. That fact that you weren't injured beyond a
> few bruises is just fortunate - it could easily have been far worse.
>
> On the face of it, it appears that the CTC are only looking to help
> with personal injury cases. If that is the case, then they are as
> bad as all the other sharks that operate in that area.

Not to jump in at the deep end, I think the personal injury department are,
what with them being lawyers hired for that reason. I imagine also that it's
a pretty busy time of year for them, especially with the sunny dry weather
encouraging people out.

I think it's pretty likely that the people on the end of the line
misunderestimated the magnitiude of the assault.

I look forward to the CTC proving me right on that assumption.
--
Ambrose

 

[Paul Boyd]

Ambrose Nankivell said the following on 11/05/2006 12:57:

> I look forward to the CTC proving me right on that assumption.

I hope so.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/