slim fast for recovery drink

[dhk]

Ted, that all makes sense to me. Understand the key is to restore the carbs at the right time, and not to go overboard.

I had been riding after lunch lately, and then eating nothing until supper about 3-4 hours later. Today, went out earlier and had lunch after the ride. Had about 50 g carb from rye bread, a slice of deli ham, a slice of cheese, and an orange. Will see how these little changes work for me.

Have also ordered a couple of the Ed Burke books...Serious Cycling and Long Distance Riding. Now that I'm retired and have the time to train, want to make sure I'm doing it right.

Thanks for the detailed reply.

Dan

 

[dhk]

OK, have read Serious Cycling. Found it to be a quick read with some content I'd seen before, but still a good basic primer.

At any rate, the book's (well-known) nutrition advice appears to be working for me. This week, have specifically consumed more pre-ride, on-bike and recovery carbs, and seem to be recovering much better now. Did a ride today with a tandem and another solo rider, faster than my usual training pace. I took a full-strength Gatorade bottle, instead of my usual water. Sipping it slowly every 10 minutes or so over the 2 hours, no problem at all with the sugar. HR was mostly 80% and up for two hours, and 92-93% on the final climb for about 15 minutes.

One of the riders I was with uses Cytomax. He also mixes his own maltodextrin-based drink at home. Think I'll get a sample of Cytomax, and maybe a bag of malto-dextrin and give it a try next.

Dan

 

[zaskar]

Originally posted by dhk
OK, have read Serious Cycling. Found it to be a quick read with some content I'd seen before, but still a good basic primer.

At any rate, the book's (well-known) nutrition advice appears to be working for me. This week, have specifically consumed more pre-ride, on-bike and recovery carbs, and seem to be recovering much better now. Did a ride today with a tandem and another solo rider, faster than my usual training pace. I took a full-strength Gatorade bottle, instead of my usual water. Sipping it slowly every 10 minutes or so over the 2 hours, no problem at all with the sugar. HR was mostly 80% and up for two hours, and 92-93% on the final climb for about 15 minutes.

One of the riders I was with uses Cytomax. He also mixes his own maltodextrin-based drink at home. Think I'll get a sample of Cytomax, and maybe a bag of malto-dextrin and give it a try next.

Dan

if you can get past the taste of cytomax it's not bad, once
it warms it taste like spoiled milk. gotorade for me works
just as well. i cut my sugar intake a lot the last few months
and i think my riding suffered a little from it. i bought a few
energy gels to try (cliff shots) made of brown rice syrup,
raspberry puree, citric acid, sea salt,potassium citrate,
magnesium oxide. these for me has made a world of
difference when i go hard, i have broke my personal time
tt's with these. also just eating a cookie or 2 makes a
difference, why are you so against sugar?? thats
what potatos turns to once eatin. slim fast for me is
a quick fix in route home from long hard rides, once home
it's whey protien & good high carb foods.

 

[dhk]

Well, cutting sugar and hi-gly carbs from the diet has been the key to major weight loss for me this year. But, now agree sugar or other hi-gly carb do really help on the bike. And the Gatorade mix worked fine for me also yesterday, just a sip every 10-15, a 20 oz H20 bottle over two hours made the difference.

In the past, I've only used Gatorade by drinking a cold 16 oz bottle in 5-10 minutes at mid-ride rest stops. That gave me a mild headache, and left me crashing 30-45 minutes later. Dumb, huh?

Dan

 

[zaskar]

Originally posted by dhk
Well, cutting sugar and hi-gly carbs from the diet has been the key to major weight loss for me this year. But, now agree sugar or other hi-gly carb do really help on the bike. And the Gatorade mix worked fine for me also yesterday, just a sip every 10-15, a 20 oz H20 bottle over two hours made the difference.

In the past, I've only used Gatorade by drinking a cold 16 oz bottle in 5-10 minutes at mid-ride rest stops. That gave me a mild headache, and left me crashing 30-45 minutes later. Dumb, huh?

Dan

hey DAN, you think thats dumb i use to ride with just water
only!! and i wondered why i couldnt ride past 2 hours in
the hot desert when i was mtb. also thats why i cut alot
of sugar for wieght loss, i use to think as long as i ride hard
i can eat anything i want and still lose the weight! i did
lose the wieght but could not get to the desired wieght
target, fats dropping off me so fast right now its kinda scary,
my lowest wieght i was able to get to before changing my diet
was 155lbs im now down to 148lbs, my up hill speeds have
gone up 3-4 miles per hour!!

 

[dhk]

Yep, I dropped 45 lbs this year, down to 168 now. At 6 ft, this is as light as I've been since college in the 60's. It does make a big difference up hill, as well as overall comfort on the bike.

Dan

 

[Ted B]

Atkins Diet = Common sense guidelines for a healthy lifestyle amidst a world of junk food, and *essential* for a sedentary person to avoid becoming overweight.

For those of us who engage in physical activity of this type, the Atkins diet rules do not apply just before, during, and just after long, strenuous aerobic exercise.

The mental consolation here is you need to burn glycogen to burn fat, so keep the pedals turning.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Atkins diet is not common sense guidelines for a healthy lifestyle. period.

ric

 

[Ted B]

Originally posted by ricstern
Atkins diet is not common sense guidelines for a healthy lifestyle. period.

I only know the basics of the Atkins Diet, so allow me to specify:

The minimization of unnecessary high glycemic and refined sugars, and other foods that provide nothing but 'empty calories' from one's diet is a common sense guideline for a healthy lifestyle.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Originally posted by Ted B
I only know the basics of the Atkins Diet, so allow me to specify:

The minimization of unnecessary high glycemic and refined sugars, and other foods that provide nothing but 'empty calories' from one's diet is a common sense guideline for a healthy lifestyle.

whilst avoiding refined sugars (e.g. table sugar) might be a good idea for some people, that isn't the Atkins diet. And, i certainly wouldn't suggest that anyone use Atkins.

Ric

 

[Ted B]

Originally posted by ricstern
whilst avoiding refined sugars (e.g. table sugar) might be a good idea for some people, that isn't the Atkins diet. And, i certainly wouldn't suggest that anyone use Atkins.

Oops, my bad. All this time I am thinking "Sugar Busters Diet", not Atkins!

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Originally posted by Ted B
Oops, my bad. All this time I am thinking "Sugar Busters Diet", not Atkins!

Sorry for the confusion.

As an aside, i see no reason to eliminate any food from the diet (except perhaps lard), unless it's under specific medical intervention, because of religious beliefs, or other beliefs (e.g., being a vegetarian)

ric

 

[Ted B]

Originally posted by ricstern
As an aside, i see no reason to eliminate any food from the diet (except perhaps lard), unless it's under specific medical intervention...

'Minimization' is the key. 'Elimination' would be quite difficult, if not virtually impossible.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Okay, i see no reason to minimise down to zero (as these two diets suggest) or near zero levels. That doesn't however, mean i advocate eating cream cakes or chocolates etc on a regular basis

ric

 

[Ted B]

Originally posted by ricstern
Okay, i see no reason to minimise down to zero (as these two diets suggest) or near zero levels.

The reality of the matter is that here in the U.S., it is virtually impossible to minimize down to zero even if you try. Virtually every food you can buy contains some degree of added sugars. Therefore, if you make a conscious effort to do so, you'll minimize to a degree that you will begin to (slowly) reverse the years of neglect and bad eating habits.

Being a resident of a U.S. urban area, let me assure you that it takes considerable effort to eat properly here. We are a nation with an alarming rate of obesity, and one needs not look further than the fast food we eat and the supermarket shelves to understand why.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

I understand that, we have a problem here too, but are slightly behind the US in this regard. There's many foods that can be purchased in a supermarket that isn't rubbish (at least in the UK).

I am horrified at some of the foods available at the supermarket, and try to avoid processed food. However, in terms of weight management it's an energy balance or negative energy intake that's important. The processed food is also killing people's ability to cook, which i think is a great shame.

being a vegetarian i eat a moderately high carbohydrate, high fibre type diet with lots of pasta, rice, veggies, fruit, some dairy, bread, potatoes, meat alternatives etc.

Ric

 

[Ted B]

Originally posted by ricstern
However, in terms of weight management it's an energy balance or negative energy intake that's important.

Bingo.

And what is challenging here is when you have someone who has regained their health and vigor through rigorous changes in their dietary habits, who subsequently discovers a sport like cycling.

Suddenly, their dietary requirements are different, and they may be reluctant to eat things that are considered as 'bad', because they are afraid that by doing so, they'll turn back the clock and regain the lard.

Balance is the key.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

I'm not entirely sure if i understand what you've written, but endurance exercise, such as cycling is predominantly fuelled by carbohydrates. Hence the reason, my carb intake is ~ 500+g per day.

Ric

 

[Ted B]

Originally posted by ricstern
I'm not entirely sure if i understand what you've written, but endurance exercise, such as cycling is predominantly fuelled by carbohydrates. Hence the reason, my carb intake is ~ 500+g per day.

Yes, but stop the cycling and keep eating those carbs and watch what happens.

My point was there are people who've witnessed the results of minimizing sugars and starch, and they've discovered cycling sometime later. Naturally, cycling will change their dietary requirements, but they may be reluctant to respond, only because they perceive it to be 'breaking one's diet'.

Basically, if you eat just enough carbs such that you can recover and feel good during your rides without running into an energy deficit, you've attained the 'balance' I was talking about.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Originally posted by Ted B
Yes, but stop the cycling and keep eating those carbs and watch what happens.

Yes, but if you ate too much of anything without maintaining energy balance you'd put on weight.

My point was there are people who've witnessed the results of minimizing sugars and starch, and they've discovered cycling sometime later. Naturally, cycling will change their dietary requirements, but they may be reluctant to respond, only because they perceive it to be 'breaking one's diet'.

But carbohydrates (of which sugars are) have the lowest energy per unit mass of any of the macronutrients

Starchy type carbohydrates are indeed good for you, whether you exercise or not.

Basically, if you eat just enough carbs such that you can recover and feel good during your rides without running into an energy deficit, you've attained the 'balance' I was talking about.

That what i said with maintaining an energy balance. if i ate too much carbs (or protein, fat or alcohol) i'd put on weight like anyone else

Ric