Station St bike lane Bonbeach: cars parked in bike lane

Discussion in 'Australia and New Zealand' started by AndrewJ, Mar 29, 2006.

  1. AndrewJ

    AndrewJ Guest

    Nepean Highway, south of Melbourne near Bonbeach station.

    I have complained to the Kingston council about cars parked in the bike
    lane on the west side of Station St. The cars are always parked near
    the station in the bike lane.

    Their response is that this parking is legal, and they do not propose
    to do anything about it.

    If you use these bike lanes going northward, then I suggest the only
    safe way to proceed is to "seize the lane", and to ride in the middle
    of the car lane. Of course riding no more than two abreast, as the law
    requires. No need to hurry, since obviously there is no car traffic to
    speak of, and they won't be delayed significantly.

    Meanwhile I am going to contact the Victorian Government and see if
    Kingston Council received money for this bike lane. If they did then I
    will encourage them to seek a refund of the funding for this portion of
    the bike lane. Since it is obviously not a bike lane, and the money
    would be better spent on councils that actually make bike lanes.

    Please forward this message to any cycling outlets that may be
    appropriate.

    Thanks.
     
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  2. flyingdutch

    flyingdutch New Member

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    Sadly, it IS legal to park in bike lanes (unless a clearway or signage says otherwise).

    The council would have recieved funding from Vicroads to put the paint down and signs up at start/finish.

    Please DONT write that letter to the govt. it's hard enough getting funding.
    or if you do suggest it should have been a wider parking AND bike lane (ie either parknig indicated plus separate EBL or one big wide zone as done recently elsewhere...
     
  3. TimC

    TimC Guest

    On 2006-03-30, flyingdutch (aka Bruce)
    was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
    > Please DONT write that letter to the govt. it's hard enough getting
    > funding.
    > or if you do suggest it should have been a wider parking AND bike lane
    > (ie either parknig indicated plus separate EBL or one big wide zone as
    > done recently elsewhere...


    To put a cyclist straight into the door zone?

    --
    TimC
    Experiments must be reproducible; they should all fail in the same way.
     
  4. AndrewJ

    AndrewJ Guest

    Hm. I haven't written the letter yet.

    But surely a bike lane with cars parked in it is of no use to anybody?

    There is no room on this road for a park + lane option. It is this way
    on the other side of the road.

    In the surrounding streets there is plenty of parking available - all
    the coffin drivers have to do is park and walk 100m or so.
     
  5. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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  6. "cfsmtb" wrote
    >
    > I *strongly* recommend, if people are interested in bicycle facilities,
    > to have a perusal of VicRoads Cycle Notes:
    >
    > http://tinyurl.com/c4m4o


    The link for the May 1999 pdf on Bike Lanes is faulty - just brings up an
    error message. However while perusing other Cycle Notes I found these new
    designs for "bicycle friendly" roundabouts:
    http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/vrpdf/trum/TR2005253v2.pdf

    This is full of lots of warm words about how intimidating and dangerous
    roundabouts are and providing safe roundabouts for cyclists and pedestrians.
    However have a close look at the designs proposed for 2-lane, and especially
    3-lane, roundabouts. Bear in mind that the provision of a bike lane compels
    cyclists legally (at least in the eyes of motorists and police) to use the
    bike lane and not the road.

    These designs force cyclists to ride in a situation where they must give way
    _multiple times_ while on the roundabout, to exiting traffic, even if the
    cyclist is confident of negotiating the roundabout on the road. The 3-lane
    design is a total joke - cyclists making a right turn are forced to travel 3
    sides of a square, using 2 ped crossings. For _all_ cyclists, including
    traffic-experienced riders, the right lane turn is not an option. Luckily
    where I mostly ride there are not many of the larger roundabouts, but there
    are more of these going in all the time, and in particular many outer
    suburban and fringe rural routes use them a lot.

    I know how I'll be riding roundabouts, but it may be harder to take control
    of the road space with these god-awful bike lane designs. :angry:
     
  7. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    But that's what cyclists in Victoria have too contend with Peter. That and Part 14 of AusRoads. If you don't know what VicRoads are doing, then how can cyclists interact and advocate for change? Otherwise we have yet another meaningless piss and moan session that in my estimation, has gone on far too long in Victoria.

    Either learn to participate in the current process or contribute with numerous community advocates/bicycle user groups who are in there trying to negoitate with local councils, state gov and DOI/VicRoads. There's been a lot of excellent work done by cyclists & community groups in the past, but there's unfortunately another group, whether they're quite aware of it or not, who have left a dysfunctional mess for current advocates to attempt to patch up.
     
  8. "cfsmtb" wrote:
    > If you don't know what VicRoads are doing,
    > then how can cyclists interact and advocate for change?


    Certainly these Cycle Notes are valuable in telling cyclits what VicRoads
    are up to and whether their designs are appropriate. Thanks for pointing
    them out to us.

    <snip>

    > Either learn to participate in the current process


    What process? Because I tend to see and hear very little about any real
    process that involves consultation and listening to what cyclists need.

    > or contribute with
    > numerous community advocates/bicycle user groups who are in there
    > trying to negoitate with local councils, state gov and DOI/VicRoads.


    I have tried lobbying and letter-writing on a number of issues, myself and
    through BV, on several issues over the years. Personally I feel the chances
    of success in many cases are a real hit and miss affair, subject to the
    whims of politics at the time. The general response on cycling issues tends
    to be "Oh we can't make those sort of changes just for a few cyclists" or
    "That would be unsafe/enviromentally damaging" (in the views of non-cycling
    transport, council or Parks Vic bureaucrats). Some of BVs public campaigns
    have born fruit - the Gardiners Ck-Yarra Trail link was one where we got
    Kennet to move. Others have flopped and will lay floundering for decades -
    the Warburton Trail bridge at Lilydale springs to mind.

    Ten years ago I contacted Parks Victoria about some restrictive gates on the
    Dandenong Ck Trail at Shepherds Bush that were very difficult to pass
    through on a single bike and impossible with a tandem or child trailer (we
    were using both at the time). Response? "Oh, no. If we widen the gates
    motorbike riders will get in and place people in danger. If one person was
    injured by a motorbike we'd be liable. We can't allow that risk" Letters,
    phone calls, a visit to meet with the Parks staff, but no change. I gave up
    on bad show.

    Now 10 years later all of a sudden those gates have been chopped out! Its an
    open ride through to Jells Park and beyond. But what about the trail bike
    danger now? I wonder what the spur was for this change - maybe I can claim
    credit for my lobbying in 1995?

    > There's been a lot of excellent work done by cyclists & community
    > groups in the past, but there's unfortunately another group, whether
    > they're quite aware of it or not, who have left a dysfunctional mess
    > for current advocates to attempt to patch up.


    Yep, well aware of all the good work being done on many local problems by
    the BUGs and other community groups. All credit to them. I've just got a bit
    past that now, just want to ride my bike on the public roads, use the trains
    for extensions to my travels, and do some bush track riding. Locally I'm not
    aware of any real BUG activity, Whitehorse BUG became a psuedo-touring club
    for a generation older than I, and I'm very happy with MBTC in that regard.

    Who's the dysfunctional group? Wouldn't be that group headed by 'Barry
    Harber'?

    --
    Cheers
    Peter

    ~~~ ~ [email protected]
    ~~ ~ _- \,
    ~~ (*)/ (*)
     
  9. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    Wasn't pointing the finger exclusively at BV. Have a think about it Peter, there's some folks out there who haven't exactly covered themselves in glory either.
     
  10. "cfsmtb" wrote:

    > Wasn't pointing the finger exclusively at BV. Have a think about it
    > Peter, there's some folks out there who haven't exactly covered
    > themselves in glory either.


    Aww! C'mon, hint, hint?

    Is this a formal group, or are you referring to bike path riders and the
    general push towards this?

    Cycle Vic and the roadie mobs on Beach Rd?

    Or is it the RACV and VicRoads who've spent so much time trying to get bikes
    off the roads?

    I don't know, I give up. Do tell.

    --
    Cheers
    Peter

    ~~~ ~ [email protected]
    ~~ ~ _- \,
    ~~ (*)/ (*)
     
  11. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    Simple really, grumpy gits waaaayy past their expiry date who whinge, bear old grudges and don't do anything to assist the current crop of cyclist/transport advocates. Names? Why bother? They probably still lurk out there on the newsgroup. As with the h*lm*t non-debate, it's time to move on and get on with it.
     
  12. AndrewJ

    AndrewJ Guest

    Here it is. Lots of grovelling, but I don't figure whinging will help.

    To: [email protected]
    <[email protected]>
    Subject: car parking in bicycle lanes

    Firstly let me thank you for your excellent efforts in creating many
    new and well constructed bicycle lanes. They really make Melbourne a
    much more liveable city.

    However I have one issue.

    In the City of Kingston, I have complained to the Council about car
    parking in the bicycle lanes at Bonbeach Station. The precise location
    is the west side of Station St near the station.

    Here there is an excellent bicycle lane, which is every day occupied by
    cars parking in the bicycle lane.

    I would really like you to legislate to make it illegal to park in a
    bicycle lane. We can't create bicycle lanes and then fill them with
    cars. It defeats the point.

    Failing that, please take issue with those councils that allow parking
    in bicycle lanes.

    Thanks again for the great work on encouraging cycling.
     
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