Steel versus carbon

[Wurm]

South African wine

Yeah...it's like Ripple, Thunderbird, or Mad Dog, but with less aging.

 

[Eldron]

South African wine

Try them - you'll like it. Thousands of your countrymen drink one of our famous beers too - Millers Genuine Draft - so the wine can't be too bad.

Take a quick trip through the International Wine and Spirit Competition website - they agree on the quality of South African wines.

http://www.iwsc.net/index.cfm?Page=homeA

 

[jhuskey]

Try them - you'll like it. Thousands of your countrymen drink one of our famous beers too - Millers Genuine Draft - so the wine can't be too bad.

Take a quick trip through the International Wine and Spirit Competition website - they agree on the quality of South African wines.

http://www.iwsc.net/index.cfm?Page=homeA

Side note: I have a young gentleman here from SA who is helping with our J1 workers this winter and he is a cyclist.
He seems to be a good guy.

Ok back to the debate ,I think Godzilla can beat Mothra..no wait this eternal debate is about frame material,oh well close enough.

 

[Eldron]

Side note: I have a young gentleman here from SA who is helping with our J1 workers this winter and he is a cyclist.
He seems to be a good guy.

Ok back to the debate ,I think Godzilla can beat Mothra..no wait this eternal debate is about frame material,oh well close enough.

I have heard many positive things about young South Africans abroad - unfortunately most of them leave and never come back. The 1994 elections and the "oh my god they've given our country to the blacks" has left many young white south africans feeling a bit disheartened - whatever the reasons they're doing a fine job of marketing SA across the globe. Recently young black south africans have also started exploring the globe. Good for them all I say!

What? You didn't even rise to the Millers Genuine Draft heckle? What's the use of my dad being able to beat up your dad if you aren't even going to get hot under the collar?

Pamela Anderson's **** are bigger than Jordans...

 

[jhuskey]

I have heard many positive things about young South Africans abroad - unfortunately most of them leave and never come back. The 1994 elections and the "oh my god they've given our country to the blacks" has left many young white south africans feeling a bit disheartened - whatever the reasons they're doing a fine job of marketing SA across the globe. Recently young black south africans have also started exploring the globe. Good for them all I say!

What? You didn't even rise to the Millers Genuine Draft heckle? What's the use of my dad being able to beat up your dad if you aren't even going to get hot under the collar?

Pamela Anderson's **** are bigger than Jordans...

Beer and boobs are good!

 

[Bob Ross]

this debate is very similar to the "analog vs. digital" or "tubes vs. transistors" debates in audio-land.

Bingo. Saying that "steel bikes ride better than CF bikes" is as ignorant a generalization as saying "vinyl sounds better than CDs"

(Feel free to swap either pair of descriptors if those generalizations offend you.)

Without a context -- e.g., *THIS PARTICULAR* steel bike rides better than "THAT PARTICULAR* CF bike -- it ignores the simple fact that there are very few absolutes that can be applied over such a vast collection of variables.

Kudos to the poster that mentioned the fallabilities of sighted perception; methinks Expectation Bias has fueled almost as many bike frame materials arguements as it has audiophile arguements.

 

[DM4]

Being a steel addict I automatically imagine you as a 50 something male with a long beard and a cupboard full of wool jerseys (cos lycra just isn't better damnit!!!) but today this puppy dog will concede and agree that more time should be spent on wine, women and song!



Jeez, talk about profiling and stereotyping.

I will admit to late 40's, but I do not have a moustache, let alone a beard. The only wool jerseys I have are mementos. I appreciate new technology. I use clipless pedals and my car has twin turbos, but I do not buy into the "latest and greatest" dogma just because some marketing dude waves shiny things at me. I do not dislike CF frames. I prefer the steel frames I purchased to the CF frames I’ve tried. So, shoot me.

I like analog audio as opposed to digital when fidelity is the primary concern (Norah Jones on Blue Note vinyl will make your hair stand on end). CDs are good when convenience is most important. MP3s should be damned to hell.

I like wines from California above all others. Screw the French (for a multitude of reasons). Stag's Leap, Courtney Benham and Joseph Phelps (Insignia is to die for, but Pastiche is the ultimate wine value) are my favorites.

I could go on, but I feel I may be getting a little preachy…

 

[Eldron]

Jeez, talk about profiling and stereotyping.

I will admit to late 40's, but I do not have a moustache, let alone a beard. The only wool jerseys I have are mementos. I appreciate new technology. I use clipless pedals and my car has twin turbos, but I do not buy into the "latest and greatest" dogma just because some marketing dude waves shiny things at me. I do not dislike CF frames. I prefer the steel frames I purchased to the CF frames I’ve tried. So, shoot me.

I like analog audio as opposed to digital when fidelity is the primary concern (Norah Jones on Blue Note vinyl will make your hair stand on end). CDs are good when convenience is most important. MP3s should be damned to hell.

I like wines from California above all others. Screw the French (for a multitude of reasons). Stag's Leap, Courtney Benham and Joseph Phelps (Insignia is to die for, but Pastiche is the ultimate wine value) are my favorites.

I could go on, but I feel I may be getting a little preachy…

Easy DM4 - my tongue was firmly in my cheek when I wrote that!

Twin turbos huh? Bless you! At one stage there were 7 turbos in our garage - some in cars - some out. Johannesburg is 6000 foot above sea level so the difference between normally aspirated & turbo/super charged is enormous. Ahhhh turbos.

I'm a bit of an AV heathan - hell I thought I'd reinvented the wheel when I connected my sat feed to my new TV through the RGB rather than RCA. Scart is rather scrace here...

As for CF - I'm a big fan. Racing bike is CF - wouldn't ever buy a CF mtb though. Alu is best for that. My track bike is Alu also. Training road bike is alu/CF for cost reasons.

Wine can only be South African. Not debatable!

So what twin turbo sits in your garage? My brother and I have a Toyota Supra, Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4, oldish Volvo S40 T4, an RX7 on order and an old pair of turbos from the Toyota waiting to be installed into something as an insane weekend warrior project.

 

[sideshow_bob]

As for CF - I'm a big fan. Racing bike is CF - wouldn't ever buy a CF mtb though. Alu is best for that. My track bike is Alu also. Training road bike is alu/CF for cost reasons.

my currrent mtb has carbon stays (felt rxc pro) and it's probably the best hartail frame i've ever owned in terms of a cross country race bike.

--brett

 

[DM4]

Easy DM4 - my tongue was firmly in my cheek when I wrote that!

Twin turbos huh? Bless you! At one stage there were 7 turbos in our garage - some in cars - some out. Johannesburg is 6000 foot above sea level so the difference between normally aspirated & turbo/super charged is enormous. Ahhhh turbos.

I'm a bit of an AV heathan - hell I thought I'd reinvented the wheel when I connected my sat feed to my new TV through the RGB rather than RCA. Scart is rather scrace here...

As for CF - I'm a big fan. Racing bike is CF - wouldn't ever buy a CF mtb though. Alu is best for that. My track bike is Alu also. Training road bike is alu/CF for cost reasons.

Wine can only be South African. Not debatable!

So what twin turbo sits in your garage? My brother and I have a Toyota Supra, Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4, oldish Volvo S40 T4, an RX7 on order and an old pair of turbos from the Toyota waiting to be installed into something as an insane weekend warrior project.

I was working under the impression that your last post was tongue in cheek. My response was also intended to be good natured. The problem with forum posts is that it is veeeeeeerrrrrry difficulty to inflect tone and emotion.

The twins are on a Nissan 350 roadster.

 

[Eldron]

I was working under the impression that your last post was tongue in cheek. My response was also intended to be good natured. The problem with forum posts is that it is veeeeeeerrrrrry difficulty to inflect tone and emotion.

The twins are on a Nissan 350 roadster.

Nice! Japanese and turbo charged is a fine combination!


@sideshow bob: In winter I ride in very dry, rocky conditions and the stone impacts have removed most of the paint (down to the metal in some places) in and around the bb/stays/down tube area. Not bad for alu - pretty bad for carbon! I would probably own a full carbon mtb if not for the rather punishing conditions.

 

[Wurm]

I like analog audio as opposed to digital when fidelity is the primary concern (Norah Jones on Blue Note vinyl will make your hair stand on end). CDs are good when convenience is most important. MP3s should be damned to hell.

All of that, and 2-channel only please, thank you very much. Well, maybe 2.1 . (Yes, there are things going on at 20Hz you need to know about. )

 

[DM4]

All of that, and 2-channel only please, thank you very much. Well, maybe 2.1 . (Yes, there are things going on at 20Hz you need to know about. )

2 (2.1) channel is best for audio-only applications.

You will also find things going on above 20K Hz, where CDs fail to go.

 

[Wurm]

You will also find things going on above 20K Hz, where CDs fail to go.

Correct sir! My VdH Frog lets me know every time I spin a waxen!

 

[DM4]

Ok, where do we go now??

We have settled the (pick from the list below) thing.
1) Carbon
2) Audio
3) Wine
4) Tight sweaters
5) Beer
6) Wool
7) Turbos
8) Structural Integrity
9) Digital
10) Tour controversies
11) Other

There have been over 1500 views to this thread and less than 100 replies. There must be more opinions about something...anything...

 

[Wurm]

There have been over 1500 views to this thread and less than 100 replies. There must be more opinions about something...anything...

Well, there is Homeland S'curty, ya know....

 

[jhuskey]

Ok, where do we go now??

We have settled the (pick from the list below) thing.
1) Carbon
2) Audio
3) Wine
4) Tight sweaters
5) Beer
6) Wool
7) Turbos
8) Structural Integrity
9) Digital
10) Tour controversies
11) Other

There have been over 1500 views to this thread and less than 100 replies. There must be more opinions about something...anything...

You forgot boobs.We could discuss the structural intregrity of carbon implants in boobs and how they look in a tight wool sweater. Turbo charged boobs,of course

 

[Bob Ross]

Ok, where do we go now??

We have settled the (pick from the list below) thing.
1) Carbon
2) Audio
3) Wine
4) Tight sweaters
5) Beer
6) Wool
7) Turbos
8) Structural Integrity
9) Digital
10) Tour controversies
11) Other

There have been over 1500 views to this thread and less than 100 replies. There must be more opinions about something...anything...

Well, for the sake of argument -- or rather, in order to spare cycling aficianados a totally off-topic argument -- I haven't really jumped too hard on the audio opinions. Suffice to say there's about as much objective data motivating people's audio choices here as there is Hard Science backing up all the pro CF/anti-CF positions we've seen in this thread.

I.e., precious little.

And when did beer get mentioned? How did I miss that? American micro-brewed IPAs, end of story!

 

[EoinC]

...And when did beer get mentioned? How did I miss that? American micro-brewed IPAs, end of story!

Horseshite! Tell us of your experiences of non-American IPA's. There are plenty of IPA's around the World that can stand on their own head. The US does not have a monopoly on IPA's - They weren't even known there by most punters until relatively recently.

 

[DM4]

I had to take a nap...where were we?

Oh IPAs. My favorite imported IPA is the Westmalle Tripel. I do like to spend money as close to home as possible so I typically get IPAs from Flying Fish Brewery and Philadelphia Brewing Company