Stem adjustment & trekking handlebars...

[Alan Braggins]

Steven M. Scharf wrote:
>Alan Braggins wrote:
>
>> (The latter page descibes how to use a threadless stem in an adjustable
>> way, but it assumes your steerer hasn't already been cut down short.
>
>Unfortunately, this is a very big assumption.

Fortunately, the other half of the possible solution works around it.

 

[Mike Latondresse]

Peter Cole <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Alan Braggins wrote:
>> Steven M. Scharf wrote:
>>
>>>It's a threadless headset and non-adjustable.
>>>
>>>You can see various methods for solving this issue at
>>>"http://bicycleshortlist.com", then click on "Why Threaded
>>>Headsets, with Quill Stems, are preferable to Threadless
>>>Headsets" in the table of contents.
>>>
>>>Basically your choices are buying a stem with more or less rise
>>>(depending on which way you want to go), buying a threadless stem
>>>riser, or buying a SpeedLifter
>>>("http://www.speedlifter.com/de/sehen/index.html").
>>
>>
>> Or, crossing http://www.sheldonbrown.org/thorn/ with
>> http://www.sheldonbrown.com/handsup.html#threadless, put a collar
>> round the steerer to replace the stem and put a quill stem inside
>> the steerer.
>>
>> (The latter page descibes how to use a threadless stem in an
>> adjustable way, but it assumes your steerer hasn't already been
>> cut down short. The Thorn page uses both a threadless stem and a
>> quill stem, with two handlebars.)
>
> I did the same thing (sort of). I put on a threadless stem, pushed
> the star nut down, and put a quill stem in the steer tube. Since
> both stems have removable faceplates, I can switch my bars from
> high position to low in a couple of minutes. I can still set the
> preload conventionally, just with a long bolt on the cap (which I
> then remove). Alternatively, you can use the low bar position to
> mount a shortened handlebar to mount lights, bag or other
> accessories.
>
Interesting...got any pictures?

 

[Clive George]

Steve -

Are you also going to fix the tandems section of your site? Your main
problem is going to be finding a decent budget steel tandem! (thorn). Also
you recommend 700c wheels - don't forget that the mixed UK end to end record
is held on an aluminium tandem with 26" wheels, which sort of implies
they're just as good for long road rides.

clive

 

[[email protected]]

In message <[email protected]>, Ken
<[email protected]> writes
>Do you have and pictures of these bars installed on a bike?
There's an illustration of them in situ at:

http://www.gearshift.co.uk/acatalog/bars.html

Click on 'More' for the bigger picture

--
Chris

 

[Rich]

Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> Jon Senior wrote:
>
> Don't get so attached to your posessions that you have to constantly
> defend your decisions.

This is most interesting, as your web pages pretty much do just this.
And then you tell others that they can't do the same.

Rich

 

[Jon Senior]

Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> Jon Senior wrote:
>
>> Steven is surely the world's leading authority on why his bike is
>> better than yours.
>
> Gimme a break. I own both aluminum framed bicycles, and ones with
> threadless headsets. This does not mean that I cannot state what the
> advantages and disadvantages are.

^ ^
0 0
|
\___/

It was a sarcastic (humorous) reference to the final line on a number of
your web pages.

> Don't get so attached to your posessions that you have to constantly
> defend your decisions.

I too own both Steel and Aluminium framed bikes and both threaded and
threadless headsets. By leaving a few extra cm on the steerer and using
spacers (Normal practice by the look of the bikes in the LBS) a fair
degree of adjustment can be made without recourse to buying new parts.

As mentioned, I can tweak the headset with a 5mm allen key. In fact
everything on my race bike can be adjusted or removed with one of three
allen keys. Carrying a headset spanner is a little more awkward!

I also find that holding two things straight and where you want them,
while tightening a third without introducing error is significantly
harder than turning an allen key.

In summation... either step down from your high horse with regard to
your extravagent claims of personal brilliance... or learn to take a
joke! ;-)

Jon

 

[killermike]

On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:57:30 -0400, Peter Cole wrote:

>>
>> Newbie question from someone who has just returned to cycling this year:
>> Does the fact that the break levers are not immediately to hand ever cause
>> difficulties with handle bars of this type?
>>
>
> Good question, and one that applies to not only these bars but a variety
> of others. I frequently ride using aerobars or no-hands, so I have given
> this question a lot of thought.
>

Thanks for the reply. I may add them to list of things I want for the
mountain bike that I am gradually adapting for touring. Sensible tires next
though.

--
***My real address is m/ike at u/nmusic d/ot co dot u/k (removing /s)
np:
http://www.unmusic.co.uk
http://www.unmusic.co.uk/amh-s-faq.html - alt.music.home-studio FAQ
http://www.unmusic.co.uk/wrap.php?file=vhs.html - vhs purchase log.

 

[killermike]

On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 10:57:07 +0100, Richard wrote:

>
> I don't have those particular bars, but I use bar ends for alternate
> hand positions where the brake levers aren't immediately to hand.
> Never had a problem; if I'm cycling anywhere where I might need to
> brake, I'll ride with my hands covering the brakes (no different to
> covering the brake pedal in a car, really). If I know I won't have to
> be braking sharply I can use the full range of grips.

Thanks for the reply.

--
***My real address is m/ike at u/nmusic d/ot co dot u/k (removing /s)
np:
http://www.unmusic.co.uk
http://www.unmusic.co.uk/amh-s-faq.html - alt.music.home-studio FAQ
http://www.unmusic.co.uk/wrap.php?file=vhs.html - vhs purchase log.

 

[Clive George]

"Steven M. Scharf" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> >There's a limit to how high up a quill stem will go, too.
>
> Yes, the adjustability range is limited, but at least they had enough
> range so that they could be adjusted to be level with the seat.

Not IME - hardly any range at all on my last quill-stemmed bikes. But then
I'm comfortable with the bars a bit below the seat, and bought my bikes
appropriately.

cheers,
clive

 

[Steven M. Scharf]

Clive George wrote:

> You also omitted 'easier to set up'. Well, it appears both Jon and I find
> that - possibly a suitable form of words would be 'some people also find
> them easier to set up'.

Well maybe "some people" do.

Yesterday I had visitors and was trying to get enough bikes set up for
all of them. I took out a Montague Urban, which I hadn't used in a
while, which has a threadless headset, and no room for spacers. No
problem, so I thought, since I had purchased a Delta stem extender a
while back. Set-up was a royal pain in the ass. No matter how much
weight I placed on the stem extender to set the pre-load, when I
tightened the bolts, the headset was loose. I finally got a Quick-Grip
bar clamp from the garage
(amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00004SBCL) and used it to set the
pre-load, and this worked fine. But I can't imagine packing a bicycle
with a threadless headset for a tour, and having to set the pre-load up
without one of those "Problem Solvers MicroAdjust Headset Spacers." With
the Delta adapter installed, at least the handlebars can be removed
without having to set the pre-load again.

Of course the other bicycles I took out to use were no problem to fit,
since it took only an Allen wrench to change the stem height and angle.

On a tour, I will take along the headset wrenches for the CoolTool, just
in case. Very small, and just fine to use in the unlikely event that the
headset nuts get loose.

 

[[email protected]]

Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> Clive George wrote:
>
> > You also omitted 'easier to set up'. Well, it appears both Jon and I find
> > that - possibly a suitable form of words would be 'some people also find
> > them easier to set up'.
>
> Well maybe "some people" do.
>
<snip>

Well, to follow up on my own post, I do now see how they can be easier
to set up. The bicycle I was setting up had no "star fangled nut" or
adjusting bolt, only a plastic cap on the handlebars. The Delta adapter
does has a place for an adjusting bolt, but I'll have to get one of
those star fangled nuts for inside the steer tube.

 

[Peter Cole]

[email protected] wrote:
> Steven M. Scharf wrote:
>
>>Clive George wrote:
>>
>>
>>>You also omitted 'easier to set up'. Well, it appears both Jon and I find
>>>that - possibly a suitable form of words would be 'some people also find
>>>them easier to set up'.
>>
>>Well maybe "some people" do.
>>
>
> <snip>
>
> Well, to follow up on my own post, I do now see how they can be easier
> to set up. The bicycle I was setting up had no "star fangled nut" or
> adjusting bolt, only a plastic cap on the handlebars. The Delta adapter
> does has a place for an adjusting bolt, but I'll have to get one of
> those star fangled nuts for inside the steer tube.
>

The star-fangled nut usually comes with the headset. On one of my bikes,
I have driven the nut a few inches down the tube and use a threadless
stem with a conventional quill stem in the steerer. Both stems have
removable faceplates, it's quick to pull the quill stem & move the
handlebars to the lower stem, preload isn't affected. Preload is set the
same way, but with a longer bolt (removed).

Sheldon has done a similar thing, using a collar to hold the preload.
The second stem doesn't weigh very much, and it's kind of handy to
locate a sawed-off bar to mount accessories below the main bar. Best of
both worlds (or worst, depending on POV). Bottom line, you can still use
a quill stem in a threadless fork if you want.

 

[Steven M. Scharf]

Peter Cole wrote:

> The star-fangled nut usually comes with the headset. On one of my bikes,
> I have driven the nut a few inches down the tube and use a threadless
> stem with a conventional quill stem in the steerer. Both stems have
> removable faceplates, it's quick to pull the quill stem & move the
> handlebars to the lower stem, preload isn't affected. Preload is set the
> same way, but with a longer bolt (removed).
>
> Sheldon has done a similar thing, using a collar to hold the preload.
> The second stem doesn't weigh very much, and it's kind of handy to
> locate a sawed-off bar to mount accessories below the main bar. Best of
> both worlds (or worst, depending on POV). Bottom line, you can still use
> a quill stem in a threadless fork if you want.

Yes, I saw those. Very clever. I added links to the picture of your
set-up, and of Sheldon's set-up, to http://bicycleshortlist.com.

The bike I had problems with had a very early threadless headset,
apparently before they came up with adjusting bolt and star-fangled nut
system. With Sheldon's set-up, he has the same issue of setting the
pre-load without an adjuster bolt. At least you only have to do it once.
But Sheldon's set-up will almost certainly require a new fork with a
longer steering tube, at least your idea will work with short steer tubes.

 

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

At Wed, 15 Jun 2005 12:51:24 +0100, message
<[email protected]> was posted by
"Clive George" <[email protected]>, including some, all or none
of the following:

>> Gimme a break. I own both aluminum framed bicycles, and ones with
>> threadless headsets. This does not mean that I cannot state what the
>> advantages and disadvantages are.

>So why do you fail to do so?

LOL! Not come across Scharf before, then? Since he is one of Earth's
leading experts on *everything*, his opinion is all you need to know.
Even when he obviously disagrees with it himself, as in this case

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

85% of helmet statistics are made up, 69% of them at CHS, Puget Sound