Stimulants (legal) in lieu of training

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Leftlane, Feb 18, 2004.

  1. Leftlane

    Leftlane Guest

    O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to train
    for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not lookin' for
    any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that will keep me up?
    My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it with these cats; I
    need HELP!

    Thanx for da' 411

    LL
     
    Tags:


  2. On 18 Feb 2004 09:25:29 -0800, LeftLa[email protected] (LeftLane)
    wrote:

    >O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to train
    > for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not lookin'
    > for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that will keep me
    > up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it with these cats;
    > I need HELP!
    >
    >Thanx for da' 411

    You shouldn't be hanging out with a crowd you can't keep up with.

    This is why I ride alone.

    -Luigi
     
  3. Luigi de Guzman <[email protected]> wrote:
    : You shouldn't be hanging out with a crowd you can't keep up with. This is why I ride alone.

    man, luigi. it'll get better.

    i think you're likely to get marked improvement with riders who are faster than yourself. but not so
    much faster that it's crazy frustrating. not frustrating to the point, for instance, that you're
    willing to post on rec.bicycles.misc for information about stimulants. that's probably too fast.

    not that that's relevant. to the OP i would suggest crystal meth. just head to the trailer park.
    don't race with it, tho, it's very easy to test for.
    --
    david reuteler [email protected]
     
  4. Zoot Katz

    Zoot Katz Guest

    18 Feb 2004 09:25:29 -0800,
    <[email protected]>,
    [email protected] (LeftLane) wrote:

    >O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to train
    > for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not lookin'
    > for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that will keep me
    > up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it with these cats;
    > I need HELP!

    I use Siberian Ginseng for combating fatigue, both mental and physical. It's particularly useful in
    extreme temperature conditions.
    --
    zk
     
  5. Rick Onanian

    Rick Onanian Guest

    >On 18 Feb 2004 09:25:29 -0800, [email protected] (LeftLane)
    >>O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to
    >> train for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not
    >> lookin' for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that
    >> will keep me up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it
    >> with these cats; I need HELP!

    There's nothing legal to help if you're too far out of your league.

    If it was close, caffeine pills (I get the most reaction from Pep Back brand; others don't do much)
    could help, especially with an effective sports drink and smart riding. Go to the library and see if
    they have books on long-distance and/or road cycling and/or racing. I've been reading Bicycling
    Magazine's "Complete Book of Road Cycling Skills" and "Complete Book of Long-Distance Cycling" and
    have found a pretty good concentration of techniques that could help. It's almost all stuff I've
    already known or experienced, but put into a concentrated form, which I can further distill into a
    sheet of notes for when the nice weather returns, to make it easier to set some goals and assemble
    the techniques.

    On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:27:30 -0500, Luigi de Guzman <[email protected]> wrote:
    >You shouldn't be hanging out with a crowd you can't keep up with. This is why I ride alone.

    I could say exactly the same thing. Maybe you should ride with me. Luigi, are you in New England, by
    any chance?
    --
    Rick Onanian
     
  6. On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:11:27 -0800, Zoot Katz <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >I use Siberian Ginseng for combating fatigue, both mental and physical. It's particularly useful in
    >extreme temperature conditions.

    There's a great scene in the kung-fu movie "Heroes among Heroes" where the principal hero in
    question, the physician-revolutionary-martial artist Wong Fei-Hong, has an epic duel with the Korean
    Ginseng Master, the only posessor of an immense root of ginseng which Wong Fei-Hong requires for
    some heroic deed or other.

    ZK, Canadian Ginseng Master?

    -Luigi

    www.livejournal.com/users/ouij Photos, Rants, Raves
     
  7. Zoot Katz

    Zoot Katz Guest

    Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:26:19 -0500,
    <[email protected]>, Luigi de Guzman
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >ZK, Canadian Ginseng Master?

    Siberian Ginseng isn't a "true" ginseng. Eleutherococcus instead of Panax

    "In an alarming situation, the adrenal glands release corticosteroids and adrenaline which prepare
    the organism for the fight or flight reaction. When these hormones are depleted, the organism
    reaches an exhaustive phase. Eleutherococcus delays the exhaustive phase and allows a more
    economical and efficient release of these hormones." (Brunner et al. 1990; Fulder, S. 1980)

    The Russians conducted numerous double-blind studies which were so conclusive that their
    professional athletes, cosmonauts and dancers began using Siberian Ginseng as part of their regular
    regimen. It improved their recovery rate so they could continue to train harder.

    What amazed me was that I don't become irritable when I get hungry or dull witted when fatigued.
    There's no hyped-up feeling or let-down.

    Don't take it you've got high blood pressure. It's Qi neutral. American Ginseng is Yin Qi, Chinese
    Ginseng is Yang Qi

    It supposedly combats the effects of radiation, boosts your immune system and finds your keys but
    you've still got to get your own slippers.
    --
    zk
     
  8. On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:22:21 -0800, Zoot Katz <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:26:19 -0500, <[email protected]>, Luigi de Guzman
    ><[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >>ZK, Canadian Ginseng Master?
    >
    >Siberian Ginseng isn't a "true" ginseng. Eleutherococcus instead of Panax
    >
    >"In an alarming situation, the adrenal glands release corticosteroids and adrenaline which prepare
    >the organism for the fight or flight reaction. When these hormones are depleted, the organism
    >reaches an exhaustive phase. Eleutherococcus delays the exhaustive phase and allows a more
    >economical and efficient release of these hormones." (Brunner et al. 1990; Fulder, S. 1980)

    Journals?

    >
    >The Russians conducted numerous double-blind studies which were so conclusive that their
    >professional athletes, cosmonauts and dancers began using Siberian Ginseng as part of their regular
    >regimen. It improved their recovery rate so they could continue to train harder.
    >
    >What amazed me was that I don't become irritable when I get hungry or dull witted when fatigued.
    >There's no hyped-up feeling or let-down.
    >
    >Don't take it you've got high blood pressure. It's Qi neutral. American Ginseng is Yin Qi, Chinese
    >Ginseng is Yang Qi

    Damn Yang Qis!

    >
    >It supposedly combats the effects of radiation, boosts your immune system and finds your keys but
    >you've still got to get your own slippers.

    although, truth be told, I like ginseng tea. Not for anything, and couldn't tell you why, but
    I like it.

    now, buckwheat tea. I need to go down to the Korean supermarket and buy buckwheat tea sometime.

    -Luigi
     
  9. Leftlane

    Leftlane Guest

    Zoot Katz <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:26:19 -0500, <[email protected]>, Luigi de Guzman
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >ZK, Canadian Ginseng Master?
    >
    > Siberian Ginseng isn't a "true" ginseng. Eleutherococcus instead of Panax
    >
    > "In an alarming situation, the adrenal glands release corticosteroids and adrenaline which prepare
    > the organism for the fight or flight reaction. When these hormones are depleted, the organism
    > reaches an exhaustive phase. Eleutherococcus delays the exhaustive phase and allows a more
    > economical and efficient release of these hormones." (Brunner et al. 1990; Fulder, S. 1980)
    >
    > The Russians conducted numerous double-blind studies which were so conclusive that their
    > professional athletes, cosmonauts and dancers began using Siberian Ginseng as part of their
    > regular regimen. It improved their recovery rate so they could continue to train harder.
    >
    > What amazed me was that I don't become irritable when I get hungry or dull witted when fatigued.
    > There's no hyped-up feeling or let-down.
    >
    > Don't take it you've got high blood pressure. It's Qi neutral. American Ginseng is Yin Qi, Chinese
    > Ginseng is Yang Qi
    >
    > It supposedly combats the effects of radiation, boosts your immune system and finds your keys but
    > you've still got to get your own slippers.

    The Ginseng thing sounds pretty good, I assume it comes in capsules? How 'bout a little caffiene and
    ginseng when I start losing it? I'll give it a try on some local training rides.

    Thanks for the help
     
  10. Tom Keats

    Tom Keats Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    [email protected] (LeftLane) writes:
    > O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to
    > train for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not
    > lookin' for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that
    > will keep me up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it
    > with these cats; I need HELP!

    If you're interested: http://faculty.washington.edu/crowther/Misc/RBC/QandA6.shtml

    cheers, Tom

    --
    -- Powered by FreeBSD Above address is just a spam midden. I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn
    [point] bc [point] ca
     
  11. David Kerber

    David Kerber Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to
    > train for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not
    > lookin' for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that
    > will keep me up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it
    > with these cats; I need HELP!
    >
    > Thanx for da' 411

    Even if you could find something to get you through the first day, you probably won't be able even
    to walk on the second day, so it's probably a lost cause.

    --
    Dave Kerber Fight spam: remove the ns_ from the return address before replying!

    REAL programmers write self-modifying code.
     
  12. Badger_south

    Badger_south Guest

    On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 22:47:53 -0800, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

    >In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
    >(LeftLane) writes:
    >> O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to
    >> train for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not
    >> lookin' for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that
    >> will keep me up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it
    >> with these cats; I need HELP!
    >
    >If you're interested: http://faculty.washington.edu/crowther/Misc/RBC/QandA6.shtml
    >
    >
    >cheers, Tom

    I had a discussion on MFW about this and the consensus was that you can't change the pH of the
    blood, which is tightly regulated by the body to a few tenths of a percent. It's interesting to see
    an actual peer reviewed article on it. Actually, there appears to be an effect HCO3- (The sodium
    bicarbonate had the desired effect of increasing blood HCO3- prior to the start of the test).
    Unfortunately, it's difficult to consume the large amt of bicarb. needed to get the effect, as the
    link above discusses.

    Another ergogenic aid, also touted by Runner's World many years ago was the use of dibasic sodium
    phosphate (anhydrous), and monobasic sodium phosphate (monohydrate) to increase 2,3 DPG and ATP, and
    thus energy availability.

    There may be some effect, but you have to consume these in gram quantities a week or so before the
    event to get any benefit, and you have to have pretty good fitness base already. It can probably cut
    a minute or two off your 10K running performence for most middle-of-the-pack runners.

    This is not a recommendation. Read the Runner's World article if you can find it and do some
    additional research. Here's a page that refers to it:

    http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/0156.htm

    -B
     
  13. Frank Knox

    Frank Knox Guest

    "LeftLane" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to
    > train for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not
    > lookin' for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that
    > will keep me up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it
    > with these cats; I need HELP!
    >
    > Thanx for da' 411
    >
    > LL

    Here's a link for you: http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/0054.htm

    You can take 2 Aleve (naproxen sodium) before the ride and another during the ride. You must take
    it *before* serious pain begins because it is difficult to get pain back under control once it
    starts. This, along with a Vivarin might get you through it. However, just because you can doesn't
    mean you should.

    Last year I attended a ride with a group that rides much faster than I do. We rode 77 miles into a
    20mph headwind with much higher gusts. Because of the gusts, drafting didn't work well, so I simply
    suffered through it so as not to hold up the group. 3 hours after the ride my pulse was still well
    above 100. The lesson I learned is to know my limitations and don't do rides that I am not in
    condition for. This pace and distance may be too much for you.
     
  14. Rick Onanian

    Rick Onanian Guest

    On Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:25:23 GMT, "Frank Knox"
    <[email protected]> wrote:
    >Here's a link for you: http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/0054.htm

    Note to anybody who reads it: Read the _whole_ thing before you go out and try anything you
    learn from it.

    >You can take 2 Aleve (naproxen sodium) before the ride and another during the ride. You must
    >take it *before* serious pain begins because it is difficult to get pain back under control once
    >it starts.

    Naproxen sodium is a muscle relaxer. It will help with the pain, and maybe help you relax and
    avoid being overtense (white-knucle grip, etc). However, I'd be concerned that it will slow you
    down too much.

    >This, along with a Vivarin might get you through it.

    Interesting idea; maybe the caffeine will counteract the depressant effect but leave the pain-releif
    and muscle relaxation. Maybe.

    I've found Vivarin and No-Doz to be ineffective, sometimes they even make me drowsy. Ultra Pep Back
    works, somehow with the same dose (must be extracted differently / from a different source). It
    makes me hyper and raises my resting heart rate; and, if I haven't been taking it regularly (I try
    not to), it makes me jittery too.

    Okay, looking at a Pep Back box, it's got 200mg of "Caffeine Anhydrous", not just plain caffeine. I
    wonder what that means.

    Results of some googling: Apparently, it just means the powdered form of extracted caffeine. In that
    case, it's silly for Pep Back to have a trade name for it (they call it "Eleveine").

    >However, just because you can doesn't mean you should.

    You can say that again! The OP sounds like a suicide mission.
    --
    Rick Onanian
     
  15. On 2004-02-21, Rick Onanian <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Naproxen sodium is a muscle relaxer.

    No. It's a non-steroidal anti-inflamatory: http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/n1/naprox.asp

    > It will help with the pain, and maybe help you relax and avoid being overtense (white-knucle grip,
    > etc). However, I'd be concerned that it will slow you down too much.

    NSAIDS like naproxen don't have any sedating or muscle relaxing effects.

    > Okay, looking at a Pep Back box, it's got 200mg of "Caffeine Anhydrous", not just plain caffeine.
    > I wonder what that means.

    Anhydrous = "without water." Dry caffeine, IOW.

    --

    -John ([email protected])
     
  16. Hunrobe

    Hunrobe Guest

    >[email protected]

    wrote:

    >O.k, so I'm headin' off with a group of hardcores on a 100+mi/day tour. I haven't had time to train
    > for this thing! Sooooo, what can I take to crank me up and get through this thing? Not lookin'
    > for any lectures here, just tell me what can I buy from a vitamin store/phamacy that will keep me
    > up? My current fit level is maybe slightly above average, but that won't cut it with these cats;
    > I need HELP!
    >
    >Thanx for da' 411
    >
    >LL

    If the other riders are in much better condition than you, they will drop you. There are no magic
    pills that will change that fact but since you want to buy your success on the tour I'll offer three
    options: 1- Buy a prepaid cell phone to secretly call for a taxi. 2- Find out what the other riders'
    favorite alcoholic beverage is and send each one a case of that favorite. Hangovers make riding
    difficult. 3- Buy a day planner and use it to keep track of your training for the *next* such tour.

    Regards, Bob Hunt
     
  17. Hunrobe <[email protected]> wrote:
    : 2- Find out what the other riders' favorite alcoholic beverage is and send each one a case of that
    : favorite. Hangovers make riding difficult.

    practice, practice, practice. hangovers present no appreciable hurdle to me, i'm sad to say. but
    they do make it difficult to start early.

    so above and make sure the ride starts at 5am. you may end up riding alone, tho.
    --
    david reuteler [email protected]
     
  18. On 24 Feb 2004 15:38:11 GMT, David Reuteler <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Hunrobe <[email protected]> wrote:
    >: 2- Find out what the other riders' favorite alcoholic beverage is and send each one a case of
    >: that favorite. Hangovers make riding difficult.
    >
    >practice, practice, practice. hangovers present no appreciable hurdle to me, i'm sad to say. but
    >they do make it difficult to start early.
    >

    Never done serious cycling on a hangover. But baseball, yes. A bit of vigorous baserunning usually
    cleared me up.

    >so above and make sure the ride starts at 5am. you may end up riding alone, tho.
     
  19. Kevan Smith

    Kevan Smith Guest

    On 24 Feb 2004 15:04:45 GMT, [email protected] (Hunrobe) from AOL
    http://www.aol.com wrote:

    >If the other riders are in much better condition than you, they will drop you. There are no magic
    >pills that will change that fact ....

    Amphetamines. He has to be pretty close ot the shape of the other riders, though. Then he'll need
    some narcotics to go to sleep at night. And some vitamin injections. Where's that Festina Doctor
    when you need him?

    --
    [email protected]
    Not building a wall but making a brick.
    54
     
  20. On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:37:47 -0600, Kevan Smith
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >On 24 Feb 2004 15:04:45 GMT, [email protected] (Hunrobe) from AOL http://www.aol.com wrote:
    >
    >>If the other riders are in much better condition than you, they will drop you. There are no magic
    >>pills that will change that fact ....
    >
    >Amphetamines. He has to be pretty close ot the shape of the other riders, though. Then he'll need
    >some narcotics to go to sleep at night. And some vitamin injections. Where's that Festina Doctor
    >when you need him?

    I always thought it funny that the biggest doping scandal in cycling ever happened on a team whose
    name is the Latin imperative:

    "HURRY!"

    Kinda like the same way I'm always amused that there are millions of Italians driving around with
    "let it be done" on their bumpers (FIAT). Fatalism in traffic, what a culture.

    -Luigi

    "Me vexat, Quinte. Magnopere vexatus sum!"

    - Commodus imperator,
    apud cinematographiam "Gladiatorem"
     
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