Story, bg values, conclusions

Discussion in 'Health and medical' started by Michael WäSch, Feb 14, 2004.

  1. Hello everyone,

    for a better understanding and because I have promised to share some of my own thoughts concerning
    inexplicable (right spelling?) bg levels, I decided to write this text.

    Some ten years ago, I often felt ill at work and had to see doctors. I suffered heavily from nausea
    and none of my doctors could figure out any reason for this. They send me to specialists who made
    all sorts of expensive tests, inclusive kernspin MRT and found nothing. Finally my doc had no other
    choice to make all blood values he knew and two das later he called me and saif that I had to come
    to see him. Then he told me, that he thought it was all his fault and he must have noticed the
    symptoms, but now I would be quite clear, because my blood values had shown that I was suffering
    from diabetes.

    He diagnosed Type-2a-diabetes and described me Metformin which I took two or three times for no
    good. The only thing it does, was causing diarrea. I told my doc and he said that most people he
    treats unfortunately react like that on Metformin. So he described me other oral antidiabetica that
    were supposed to decrease my bg levels throughout the day. That worked fine and after a few weeks of
    intensively measuring I cought the pattern and was doing well. All I had to do, was taking those
    pills and make every 3 months HBA1c value. On average I had 6,5, my doc was happy and I thought that
    it would be ok if I had to take those pills for the rest of my life. I didn't do anything special,
    just forfeitet candy, colas and all this sugar-loaded stuff and felt fine. I thought that would do
    for the rest of my life.

    8 years later I should learn how wrong I was.

    Just after my "Abitur" (highschool exam) which I passed when I was 33 years already, I woke up
    having lots of pain in my stomach, and guess what, my doctors again were clueless. I had to pee very
    often and told my doc that I guessed that diabetes could be the reason for that. He didn't believe
    me and so I finally got into hospital were they wanted to cut out parts of my "darm" (sorry, do not
    know the english word, may be Alan can help me out). I refused to let them do that and went to a
    specialist who attestet that everything was fine. He wrote a letter for my doc and when I was again
    there to see him, he still refused to believe that my diabetes could have interfered in such a way.
    So I had no other chance any mor in order to get proof: I cooked a big meal, got my meter ready and
    ate. 2 hours after eating I got 440 mg/dl. With this value on the display I went to my doc and put
    it right under his nose. Then he agreed that diabetes could have been the reason for my pain and
    guessed that even some sort f ketosis or even acidosis could have happened. He prescribed me lantus
    and I applied it as I was told to. The day after I had bg levels of 360 mg/dl and I told my doc,
    that lantus, as long term insulin would not be able to control bg level rise after meals and again
    held him my meter under his nose. He then described me Insuman rapid and let me alone with it.

    All I know know about factors, insulin resistance and receptor-down regulation is not the result of
    the help of doctors, no, I had to figure it out alone. I startet out with 1 IU for 30 carbs which I
    figured out alone. Hell, the doc just said: "Why bother with factors? Just wait until you have 250
    mg/dl then apply 5 IU and see whats happening.". After 6 months I ended up with 10 IU for 10 carbs.

    First I had an overall factor from 1-1 in the beginning then it was 10-1 at noon and 4-1 in the
    evenings. I then hat to take 14 IU of Lantus and more than 70 IU of insulin all day.

    Then I moved to live with my girlfriend and in the new town I had to search for new doctors. Most of
    them told me that insulin is a bodily hormon which does not any harm. They suggested that I should
    apply more and more insulin and to cite Star Trek with only the sky as a limit.

    To that point I was really tired of it and wanted to get a doc prescribing me lispro or aspart, but
    I dindn't find anyone to do so. They all feared that I would get rapidly into hypoglycaemia and fall
    unconscious. Finally I found one and she told me over and over again how careful I would have to be
    with that. I knew already how fast these insulins are and was careful, very careful, but I really
    wasn't prepared for that what was coming.

    So I sat down to eat my 60 carbs meal. 24 IU Insuman would have been the right amount to handle
    this, but now I had to do with lispro. The doc told me that I sould not apply more than half of my
    Insuman-amounts and since I wanted to be really carefull, I decided to even use less. So finally I
    applied 6 IU lispro and immediately the hell broke loose. I felt my bg level rapidly falling, some
    iron fist came right out of the blue, catched me and wanted to kill me, my eyesight started to
    vanish and I was close to fall unconscious. In a final effort I was able to drink some cola and
    started to eat immediately and in a hurry. After meal my bg levels were almost constantly at 140m
    g/dl not moving a single step, then after 40 minutes lispro was over and my bg levels rose up to
    200. I then let my pancreas regulate it out on her own. The next day I tried it once again, first
    eating, then injecting lispro. This was way better, but the iron grip around me was there too and I
    felt unhappy with that insulin.

    The day after I decided to go back to insuman and ate 55 carbs meal. 40 IU Insuman was the right
    amount for that time of the day, well it had been. Lispro had changed my factors which I did not
    know, so I had an 8 times overdose and rapidly falling bg levels. In panic I drank liters of cola
    and ate sugar and when I finally arrived at hospital, I had 380 mg/dl and the doc was ready to give
    me an additional 6 IU lispro. I refused. 2 hours and 3 bananas later my bg levels werde falling
    again rapidly. Again cola in panic, again in hospital, again they wanted to give me lispro, no
    concerns about my overdose at all. They just don't care. I then stayed over night in order to be on
    the safe side, but refused additional insulin. I woke up the next morning with 120 mg/dl having
    everybody around me congratulating for my good fasting bg values.

    Comments of the docs who believed I would get into keto acidosis: "Erm, ähhh, erm ...".

    Due to my insulin and then sugar-overdose I recalculated my new factors and did fine again. Those
    two injections of lispro decreased my insulin resistance by the factor of 8! No doc ever would
    believe that unless I could proof it with numbers and values. Then they had to accept and were very
    angry with me because I came up with something they could not understand. Only one doctor agreed and
    told me that this was the reason why she would apply insulin directly to the bloodstream of patients
    with high insulin resistance.

    Another 4 months later I visited my mom and had to carry heavy luggage. When I finally arrived, my
    insulin dependency was gone. It was just gone. Of course I was very cautious and just ate 35 carbs
    with no insulin apllied. My meter didn't show any movement of my values. They were frozen. After 2
    hours I ate 35 more carbohydrates with no effect on my bg levels. Then another 20 and another 20.
    Only when I ate fruits my level would rise.

    Back at home I told my doc that I ceased applying insulin. Then, now for him, the hell broke loose.
    His mouth popped open, he literally froze in his movement, got white and finally he said with a
    crumbling voice: "What did you do? Jesus no! You can't do that!".

    I told him that I could and that I had and showed him my newest bg values. He read them carefully,
    his mouth still open, and while he read I could hear "That's not possible!", or "I can't belive
    it!", "hell he ate 70 carbs and it had no effect on him. None!", "oh my god!".

    Finally he agreed that I could go on with no insulin and with excercises.

    Thats my story.

    Statistics show:

    Me and oral antidiabetica: Av A1c = 6,5

    Me and insuline: Av A1c = 8,0

    Me and excercise: Av A1c = 6,4

    Now, as I promised my own conclusions concerning spilling ketones.

    Example 1:

    50 carbs, no ketones. After meal 180 mg/dl no ketones, 4 hrs 130 mg/dl.

    Everything is fine, although after meal value could be better. Here in GER should be below 160 mg/dl

    Example 2:

    20 carbs, no ketones. After meal 200 mg/dl ketones ++, 4,5 hrs 250 mg/dl no ketones. 5
    hrs: 130 mg/dl

    My conclusions:

    In example 2 my pancreas does not do anything after meal. It does not recognize the increas in bg
    levels. Lack of insuline = ketones. After 4,5 hours values too high, pancreas reacts and puts
    insulin into bloodstream, no more lack of insulin = 0 ketones. And after 5 hrs values are
    acceptable again.

    Comments are welcome.

    Michael
     
    Tags:


  2. Michael, I'm sure that I will have some comments. I just will have to reread this post several
    times. There is a lot to absorb. (I have a feeling that my main comment will amount to "Wow.") Steph

    "Michael Wäsch" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hello everyone,
    >
    > for a better understanding and because I have promised to share some of my own thoughts concerning
    > inexplicable (right spelling?) bg levels, I
    decided
    > to write this text.
    >
    > Some ten years ago, I often felt ill at work and had to see doctors. I suffered heavily from
    > nausea and none of my doctors could figure out any reason for this. They send me to specialists
    > who made all sorts of
    expensive
    > tests, inclusive kernspin MRT and found nothing. Finally my doc had no
    other
    > choice to make all blood values he knew and two das later he called me and saif that I had to come
    > to see him. Then he told me, that he thought it
    was
    > all his fault and he must have noticed the symptoms, but now I would be quite clear, because my
    > blood values had shown that I was suffering from diabetes.
    >
    > He diagnosed Type-2a-diabetes and described me Metformin which I took two
    or
    > three times for no good. The only thing it does, was causing diarrea. I
    told
    > my doc and he said that most people he treats unfortunately react like
    that
    > on Metformin. So he described me other oral antidiabetica that were
    supposed
    > to decrease my bg levels throughout the day. That worked fine and after a few weeks of intensively
    > measuring I cought the pattern and was doing
    well.
    > All I had to do, was taking those pills and make every 3 months HBA1c
    value.
    > On average I had 6,5, my doc was happy and I thought that it would be ok
    if
    > I had to take those pills for the rest of my life. I didn't do anything special, just forfeitet
    > candy, colas and all this sugar-loaded stuff and felt fine. I thought that would do for the rest
    > of my life.
    >
    > 8 years later I should learn how wrong I was.
    >
    > Just after my "Abitur" (highschool exam) which I passed when I was 33
    years
    > already, I woke up having lots of pain in my stomach, and guess what, my doctors again were
    > clueless. I had to pee very often and told my doc that
    I
    > guessed that diabetes could be the reason for that. He didn't believe me
    and
    > so I finally got into hospital were they wanted to cut out parts of my "darm" (sorry, do not know
    > the english word, may be Alan can help me out).
    I
    > refused to let them do that and went to a specialist who attestet that everything was fine. He
    > wrote a letter for my doc and when I was again
    there
    > to see him, he still refused to believe that my diabetes could have interfered in such a way. So I
    > had no other chance any mor in order to get proof: I cooked a big meal, got my meter ready and
    > ate. 2 hours after
    eating
    > I got 440 mg/dl. With this value on the display I went to my doc and put
    it
    > right under his nose. Then he agreed that diabetes could have been the reason for my pain and
    > guessed that even some sort f ketosis or even acidosis could have happened. He prescribed me
    > lantus and I applied it as
    I
    > was told to. The day after I had bg levels of 360 mg/dl and I told my doc, that lantus, as long
    > term insulin would not be able to control bg level
    rise
    > after meals and again held him my meter under his nose. He then described
    me
    > Insuman rapid and let me alone with it.
    >
    > All I know know about factors, insulin resistance and receptor-down regulation is not the result
    > of the help of doctors, no, I had to figure
    it
    > out alone. I startet out with 1 IU for 30 carbs which I figured out alone. Hell, the doc just
    > said: "Why bother with factors? Just wait until you
    have
    > 250 mg/dl then apply 5 IU and see whats happening.". After 6 months I
    ended
    > up with 10 IU for 10 carbs.
    >
    > First I had an overall factor from 1-1 in the beginning then it was 10-1
    at
    > noon and 4-1 in the evenings. I then hat to take 14 IU of Lantus and more than 70 IU of insulin
    > all day.
    >
    > Then I moved to live with my girlfriend and in the new town I had to
    search
    > for new doctors. Most of them told me that insulin is a bodily hormon
    which
    > does not any harm. They suggested that I should apply more and more
    insulin
    > and to cite Star Trek with only the sky as a limit.
    >
    > To that point I was really tired of it and wanted to get a doc prescribing me lispro or aspart,
    > but I dindn't find anyone to do so. They all feared that I would get rapidly into hypoglycaemia
    > and fall unconscious. Finally
    I
    > found one and she told me over and over again how careful I would have to
    be
    > with that. I knew already how fast these insulins are and was careful,
    very
    > careful, but I really wasn't prepared for that what was coming.
    >
    > So I sat down to eat my 60 carbs meal. 24 IU Insuman would have been the right amount to handle
    > this, but now I had to do with lispro. The doc told me that I sould not apply more than half of my
    > Insuman-amounts and since I wanted to be really carefull, I decided to even use less. So finally I
    > applied 6 IU lispro and immediately the hell broke loose. I felt my bg
    level
    > rapidly falling, some iron fist came right out of the blue, catched me and wanted to kill me, my
    > eyesight started to vanish and I was close to fall unconscious. In a final effort I was able to
    > drink some cola and started
    to
    > eat immediately and in a hurry. After meal my bg levels were almost constantly at 140m g/dl not
    > moving a single step, then after 40 minutes lispro was over and my bg levels rose up to 200. I
    > then let my pancreas regulate it out on her own. The next day I tried it once again, first eating,
    > then injecting lispro. This was way better, but the iron grip
    around
    > me was there too and I felt unhappy with that insulin.
    >
    > The day after I decided to go back to insuman and ate 55 carbs meal. 40 IU Insuman was the right
    > amount for that time of the day, well it had been. Lispro had changed my factors which I did not
    > know, so I had an 8 times overdose and rapidly falling bg levels. In panic I drank liters of cola
    and
    > ate sugar and when I finally arrived at hospital, I had 380 mg/dl and the doc was ready to give me
    > an additional 6 IU lispro. I refused. 2 hours and
    3
    > bananas later my bg levels werde falling again rapidly. Again cola in
    panic,
    > again in hospital, again they wanted to give me lispro, no concerns about
    my
    > overdose at all. They just don't care. I then stayed over night in order
    to
    > be on the safe side, but refused additional insulin. I woke up the next morning with 120 mg/dl
    > having everybody around me congratulating for my
    good
    > fasting bg values.
    >
    > Comments of the docs who believed I would get into keto acidosis: "Erm, ähhh, erm ...".
    >
    > Due to my insulin and then sugar-overdose I recalculated my new factors
    and
    > did fine again. Those two injections of lispro decreased my insulin resistance by the factor of 8!
    > No doc ever would believe that unless I
    could
    > proof it with numbers and values. Then they had to accept and were very angry with me because I
    > came up with something they could not understand. Only one doctor agreed and told me that this was
    > the reason why she would apply insulin directly to the bloodstream of patients with high insulin
    > resistance.
    >
    > Another 4 months later I visited my mom and had to carry heavy luggage.
    When
    > I finally arrived, my insulin dependency was gone. It was just gone. Of course I was very cautious
    > and just ate 35 carbs with no insulin apllied.
    My
    > meter didn't show any movement of my values. They were frozen. After 2
    hours
    > I ate 35 more carbohydrates with no effect on my bg levels. Then another
    20
    > and another 20. Only when I ate fruits my level would rise.
    >
    > Back at home I told my doc that I ceased applying insulin. Then, now for him, the hell broke
    > loose. His mouth popped open, he literally froze in
    his
    > movement, got white and finally he said with a crumbling voice: "What did you do? Jesus no! You
    > can't do that!".
    >
    > I told him that I could and that I had and showed him my newest bg values. He read them carefully,
    > his mouth still open, and while he read I could
    hear
    > "That's not possible!", or "I can't belive it!", "hell he ate 70 carbs and it had no effect on
    > him. None!", "oh my god!".
    >
    > Finally he agreed that I could go on with no insulin and with excercises.
    >
    > Thats my story.
    >
    > Statistics show:
    >
    > Me and oral antidiabetica: Av A1c = 6,5
    >
    > Me and insuline: Av A1c = 8,0
    >
    > Me and excercise: Av A1c = 6,4
    >
    > Now, as I promised my own conclusions concerning spilling ketones.
    >
    > Example 1:
    >
    > 50 carbs, no ketones. After meal 180 mg/dl no ketones, 4 hrs 130 mg/dl.
    >
    > Everything is fine, although after meal value could be better. Here in GER should be below
    > 160 mg/dl
    >
    > Example 2:
    >
    > 20 carbs, no ketones. After meal 200 mg/dl ketones ++, 4,5 hrs 250 mg/dl
    no
    > ketones. 5 hrs: 130 mg/dl
    >
    > My conclusions:
    >
    > In example 2 my pancreas does not do anything after meal. It does not recognize the increas in bg
    > levels. Lack of insuline = ketones. After 4,5 hours values too high, pancreas reacts and puts
    > insulin into bloodstream,
    no
    > more lack of insulin = 0 ketones. And after 5 hrs values are acceptable again.
    >
    > Comments are welcome.
    >
    > Michael
     
  3. Oldal4865

    Oldal4865 Guest

    Michael Wäsch wrote in message ...
    >Hello everyone,
    >
    >for a better understanding and because I have promised to share some of my own thoughts concerning
    >inexplicable (right spelling?) bg levels, I decided to write this text.
    >
    >Some ten years ago, I often felt ill at work and had to see doctors. I suffered heavily from nausea
    >and none of my doctors could figure out any reason for this. They send me to specialists who made
    >all sorts of
    expensive
    >tests, inclusive kernspin MRT and found nothing. Finally my doc had no
    other
    >choice to make all blood values he knew and two das later he called me and saif that I had to come
    >to see him. Then he told me, that he thought it was all his fault and he must have noticed the
    >symptoms, but now I would be quite clear, because my blood values had shown that I was suffering
    >from diabetes.
    >
    >He diagnosed Type-2a-diabetes and described me Metformin which I took two
    or
    >three times for no good. The only thing it does, was causing diarrea. I
    told
    >my doc and he said that most people he treats unfortunately react like that on Metformin. So he
    >described me other oral antidiabetica that were
    supposed
    >to decrease my bg levels throughout the day. That worked fine and after a few weeks of intensively
    >measuring I cought the pattern and was doing well. All I had to do, was taking those pills and make
    >every 3 months HBA1c
    value.
    >On average I had 6,5, my doc was happy and I thought that it would be ok if I had to take those
    >pills for the rest of my life. I didn't do anything special, just forfeitet candy, colas and all
    >this sugar-loaded stuff and felt fine. I thought that would do for the rest of my life.
    >
    >8 years later I should learn how wrong I was.
    >
    >Just after my "Abitur" (highschool exam) which I passed when I was 33 years already, I woke up
    >having lots of pain in my stomach, and guess what, my doctors again were clueless. I had to pee
    >very often and told my doc that I guessed that diabetes could be the reason for that. He didn't
    >believe me
    and
    >so I finally got into hospital were they wanted to cut out parts of my "darm" (sorry, do not know
    >the english word, may be Alan can help me out).
    I
    >refused to let them do that and went to a specialist who attestet that everything was fine. He
    >wrote a letter for my doc and when I was again
    there
    >to see him, he still refused to believe that my diabetes could have interfered in such a way. So I
    >had no other chance any mor in order to get proof: I cooked a big meal, got my meter ready and ate.
    >2 hours after
    eating
    >I got 440 mg/dl. With this value on the display I went to my doc and put it right under his nose.
    >Then he agreed that diabetes could have been the reason for my pain and guessed that even some sort
    >f ketosis or even acidosis could have happened. He prescribed me lantus and I applied it as I was
    >told to. The day after I had bg levels of 360 mg/dl and I told my doc, that lantus, as long term
    >insulin would not be able to control bg level
    rise
    >after meals and again held him my meter under his nose. He then described
    me
    >Insuman rapid and let me alone with it.
    >
    >All I know know about factors, insulin resistance and receptor-down regulation is not the result of
    >the help of doctors, no, I had to figure it out alone. I startet out with 1 IU for 30 carbs which I
    >figured out alone. Hell, the doc just said: "Why bother with factors? Just wait until you have 250
    >mg/dl then apply 5 IU and see whats happening.". After 6 months I ended up with 10 IU for 10 carbs.
    >
    >First I had an overall factor from 1-1 in the beginning then it was 10-1 at noon and 4-1 in the
    >evenings. I then hat to take 14 IU of Lantus and more than 70 IU of insulin all day.
    >
    >Then I moved to live with my girlfriend and in the new town I had to search for new doctors. Most
    >of them told me that insulin is a bodily hormon which does not any harm. They suggested that I
    >should apply more and more insulin and to cite Star Trek with only the sky as a limit.
    >
    >To that point I was really tired of it and wanted to get a doc prescribing me lispro or aspart,
    >but I dindn't find anyone to do so. They all feared that I would get rapidly into hypoglycaemia
    >and fall unconscious. Finally I found one and she told me over and over again how careful I
    >would have to
    be
    >with that. I knew already how fast these insulins are and was careful, very careful, but I really
    >wasn't prepared for that what was coming.
    >
    >So I sat down to eat my 60 carbs meal. 24 IU Insuman would have been the right amount to handle
    >this, but now I had to do with lispro. The doc told me that I sould not apply more than half of my
    >Insuman-amounts and since I wanted to be really carefull, I decided to even use less. So finally I
    >applied 6 IU lispro and immediately the hell broke loose. I felt my bg
    level
    >rapidly falling, some iron fist came right out of the blue, catched me and wanted to kill me, my
    >eyesight started to vanish and I was close to fall unconscious. In a final effort I was able to
    >drink some cola and started to eat immediately and in a hurry. After meal my bg levels were almost
    >constantly at 140m g/dl not moving a single step, then after 40 minutes lispro was over and my bg
    >levels rose up to 200. I then let my pancreas regulate it out on her own. The next day I tried it
    >once again, first eating, then injecting lispro. This was way better, but the iron grip
    around
    >me was there too and I felt unhappy with that insulin.
    >
    >The day after I decided to go back to insuman and ate 55 carbs meal. 40 IU Insuman was the right
    >amount for that time of the day, well it had been. Lispro had changed my factors which I did not
    >know, so I had an 8 times overdose and rapidly falling bg levels. In panic I drank liters of cola
    >and ate sugar and when I finally arrived at hospital, I had 380 mg/dl and the doc was ready to give
    >me an additional 6 IU lispro. I refused. 2 hours and
    3
    >bananas later my bg levels werde falling again rapidly. Again cola in
    panic,
    >again in hospital, again they wanted to give me lispro, no concerns about
    my
    >overdose at all. They just don't care. I then stayed over night in order to be on the safe side,
    >but refused additional insulin. I woke up the next morning with 120 mg/dl having everybody around
    >me congratulating for my
    good
    >fasting bg values.
    >
    >Comments of the docs who believed I would get into keto acidosis: "Erm, ähhh, erm ...".
    >
    >Due to my insulin and then sugar-overdose I recalculated my new factors and did fine again. Those
    >two injections of lispro decreased my insulin resistance by the factor of 8! No doc ever would
    >believe that unless I
    could
    >proof it with numbers and values. Then they had to accept and were very angry with me because I
    >came up with something they could not understand. Only one doctor agreed and told me that this was
    >the reason why she would apply insulin directly to the bloodstream of patients with high insulin
    >resistance.
    >
    >Another 4 months later I visited my mom and had to carry heavy luggage.
    When
    >I finally arrived, my insulin dependency was gone. It was just gone. Of course I was very cautious
    >and just ate 35 carbs with no insulin apllied.
    My
    >meter didn't show any movement of my values. They were frozen. After 2
    hours
    >I ate 35 more carbohydrates with no effect on my bg levels. Then another 20 and another 20. Only
    >when I ate fruits my level would rise.
    >
    >Back at home I told my doc that I ceased applying insulin. Then, now for him, the hell broke loose.
    >His mouth popped open, he literally froze in his movement, got white and finally he said with a
    >crumbling voice: "What did you do? Jesus no! You can't do that!".
    >
    >I told him that I could and that I had and showed him my newest bg values. He read them carefully,
    >his mouth still open, and while he read I could
    hear
    >"That's not possible!", or "I can't belive it!", "hell he ate 70 carbs and it had no effect on him.
    >None!", "oh my god!".
    >
    >Finally he agreed that I could go on with no insulin and with excercises.
    >
    >Thats my story.
    >
    >Statistics show:
    >
    >Me and oral antidiabetica: Av A1c = 6,5
    >
    >Me and insuline: Av A1c = 8,0
    >
    >Me and excercise: Av A1c = 6,4
    >
    >Now, as I promised my own conclusions concerning spilling ketones.
    >
    >Example 1:
    >
    >50 carbs, no ketones. After meal 180 mg/dl no ketones, 4 hrs 130 mg/dl.
    >
    >Everything is fine, although after meal value could be better. Here in GER should be below
    >160 mg/dl
    >
    >Example 2:
    >
    >20 carbs, no ketones. After meal 200 mg/dl ketones ++, 4,5 hrs 250 mg/dl no ketones. 5 hrs:
    >130 mg/dl
    >
    >My conclusions:
    >
    >In example 2 my pancreas does not do anything after meal. It does not recognize the increas in bg
    >levels. Lack of insuline = ketones. After 4,5 hours values too high, pancreas reacts and puts
    >insulin into bloodstream,
    no
    >more lack of insulin = 0 ketones. And after 5 hrs values are acceptable again.
    >
    >Comments are welcome.
    >
    >Michael
    >
    >

    DKA is known to cause abdominal pain. You were right to object when somebody suggested cutting
    out part of your intestine (darm) without evaluating you as a diabetic.

    However, your description of DKA is a bit different than most report, i.e..

    http://www.embbs.com/cr/dka/diagn.html

    ". . . .History and Physical: Patients with DKA usually present with complaint of fatigue, malaise,
    thirst, and polyuria. Depending on the length of symptoms the patient maybe able to report weight
    loss. As the patient becomes increasingly ill they may begin to vomit and complain of abdominal
    pain. The exact cause of abdominal pain that is associated with DKA is not known. The abdominal pain
    is disturbing since it may be secondary to the DKA, or be from the pathologic process that
    initiatedthe crisis, such as pyelonephritis, pancreatitis, etc. Usually, abdominal pain secondary to
    DKA will begin to resolve with treatment.

    The physical signs of DKA can be variable. Most patients will have some degree of tachycardia, but
    the blood pressure is often normal. Evidence of dehydration, such as loss of skin turgor, and dry
    mucus membranes may be present. The patient may be febrile, and extreme elevations of temperature
    should not be assumed to be the result of dehydration. Hypothermia may also be seen. The . . . ."

    http://www.embbs.com/cr/dka/treat.html

    ". . .History and Physical: NKH is a slowly progressive disease and it is not uncommon to have 3-10
    day history of increasing thirst, polyuria, and malaise. Courses of up to three weeks have been
    described. Symptoms of an underlying infection may be present, but in some cases there is little
    history and the clinician must consider this diagnosis in the elderly obtunded patient.

    Patients usually have evidence of dehydration such as dry mucus membranes, tachycardia, poor skin
    turgor, and sometimes a low grade fever. The blood pressure is usually well preserved unless there
    is severe dehydration or infection. Respiratory symptoms are usually absent unless the patient has
    pneumonia. Central nervous system dysfunction is relatively common in patients with NKH. Lethargy
    and disorientation are common, but frank coma is rare. It is critical to remember that these CNS
    symptoms rarely present unless the effective osmolarity is greater than 340-350 mOsm/L. Patients
    with altered sensorium and osmolarity less than this should have a different etiology searched for.
    Any area within the brain can be affected, and while focal neurologic findings are uncommon in DKA,
    they are fairly common in patients with NKH. Seizures may be present in up to one-fourth of
    patients and can be focal or generalized. Fortunately, cerebral edema is very rare in patients with
    NKH. . . ."

    Since you seem to be quite different than most standard diabetics, I don't think you should stop
    looking for a more intense diagnosis from a doctor until you find a doctor who can explain all of
    your symptoms. I hope some doctor can be found to discuss your pancreas and its health in great
    depth. Some of your symptoms sound a bit like complaints we have seen on the newsgroups by people
    with hyperlipidemia which, I thnk, can damage the pancreas (Use caution when reading my opinions, I
    am an engineer, not a doctor.)

    Regards
    Old Al
     
  4. Hi,

    > However, your description of DKA is a bit different than most report,
    i.e..

    It couldn't be clarified afterwards. The pain used to vanish when NaCl + Ca was given directly to
    the bloodstream.

    Michael
     
  5. Michael, I agree with Old Al. You certainly seem to be an unusual case. I hope that you continue to
    hound your doctors. Hopefully someone will have some answers to your questions.

    Good luck. Steph

    "Michael Wäsch" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi,
    >
    > > However, your description of DKA is a bit different than most report,
    > i.e..
    >
    > It couldn't be clarified afterwards. The pain used to vanish when NaCl +
    Ca
    > was given directly to the bloodstream.
    >
    > Michael
     
Loading...