Strong aerobic; but weak legs

[David_Lawton]

I come from cross country running and I noticed while riding on my bike that I feel great aerobically but my legs seem so far behind. From what I have read, it seems like riding up hills will build strength in them; but what type of muscle does it work (slow twitch/fast twitch), and how does that effect me in my long endurance rides i.e. will strength gained from hill climbing be beneficial for long, low endurance rides?



I’d also like to add that I tend to go 16-17 mph on flat, paved roads with no wind resistance, while usually staying in Z2 (129-139 bpm)—and it can diminishe greatly with wind or slight raises in the gradient.

 

[ric_stern/RST]

I come from cross country running and I noticed while riding on my bike that I feel great aerobically but my legs seem so far behind. From what I have read, it seems like riding up hills will build strength in them; but what type of muscle does it work (slow twitch/fast twitch), and how does that effect me in my long endurance rides i.e. will strength gained from hill climbing be beneficial for long, low endurance rides?



I’d also like to add that I tend to go 16-17 mph on flat, paved roads with no wind resistance, while usually staying in Z2 (129-139 bpm)—and it can diminishe greatly with wind or slight raises in the gradient.

basically, many of the adaptations that occur from training are specific to the joint angle and velocity at which they're trained and each exercise modality will use different muscle groups for that particular exercise. as you've discovered the muscles used in running are different to those used in cycling and thus, there's very little crossover to the other modality. The actual cardiovascular system as you've found will feel fine but your legs obviously don't. Obviously though, you'll be better at cycling than an untrained person, but not as fit as an equally well trained cyclist (compared to you as a runner).

cycling (for endurance events, e.g., RR, TT, crits, track endurance, MTB, etc) are not limited by strength, and riding uphills is unlikely to build strength in most people. the type of muscle (or motor units) that may be targetted would have little to do with the topography and everything to do with the duration and type of the training session (e.g., 10 x 10-secs sprints would target type IIa and IIb fibres, whereas 3 hrs at an easy pace may mainly target type I fibres).

I'm not sure why you want to specifically target long low intensity rides -- presumably you want to get fitter to better ride certain events/durations?

ric

 

[fixed]

Ok, I have exactly the opposite problem as you do. I have very strong legs but lack in the cardiovascular system (at least compared to the elite cyclists it is my goal to ride with). I've been riding for 6 months or so...training hard. I've been training on a fixed gear bike with a 48x16 gear ratio, which while not huge if I was racing on the track is still a beast to push for 40+ miles and is big enough to do sprint workouts on. My legs a very strong but whenever I get on my road bike or any bike where I can spin much faster than I do on the fixed gear at top speed I can definately feel it. So I would suggest riding in bigger gears...preferably getting yourself a cheap single speed setup with a big gear on it. I'm looking to setup a fixed gear with a bit lower gear to work on my spin and cardio...trying to get the heart rate down. I can almost guarantee you will see strength increases if you lock yourself into bigger gears....just make sure the fixed gear, if you go that way, is the same measurements as your road bike. If you are worried about cycling affecting your running I can't be as helpful. Cycling and running work the muscels in opposite fashions (tightening what the other lenghtens and vice-versa). I run too, but sub 10 mile distance for the most part. I can't say how cycling will affect endurance running...maybe someone else can help

 

[ric_stern/RST]

I can almost guarantee you will see strength increases if you lock yourself into bigger gears....just make sure the fixed gear, if you go that way, is the same measurements as your road bike.

Apart from in a few people (e.g., frail old ladies) cycling aerobically does not increase strength. period.

ric

 

[David_Lawton]

I'm not sure why you want to specifically target long low intensity rides -- presumably you want to get fitter to better ride certain events/durations?

Well I read that it's important to do alot of long endurance rides in the beginning to get use to being in the saddle for long durations. Are you recommending doing sprints then to build stronger legs?

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Well I read that it's important to do alot of long endurance rides in the beginning to get use to being in the saddle for long durations. Are you recommending doing sprints then to build stronger legs?

presumably you've already done some endurance work, i.e., you've been riding the bike? While it may be important for some to do longer steadier rides, just doing that doesn't necessarily do much for your fitness. You need to do some training that increases your LT and MAP. My response in this thread provides some similar answers.

as mentioned, strength isn't an important determinant of endurance cycling performance and having stronger legs won't really increase performance.

ric

 

[David_Lawton]

What increases speed then?

 

[ric_stern/RST]

What increases speed then?

riding downhill with a tailwind?

seriously, under given conditions it's an increase in power output that will allow you to travel at a higher velocity under those given environmental and topographical conditions. In general, and it appears certainly with you that you need to increase your MAP and LT. These are issues related to cardiovascular and metabolic issues and have nothing to do with strength. Because you (everyone) can sprint at a higher power than either your MAP or TT power, increasing strength is unlikely to make you go faster unless you're only looking to go faster over durations of up to ~ 60-secs (1-km TT).

thus, your power at the much lower intensities of MAP & LT need to be improved, and these are increase with on the bike specific training.

ric

 

[David_Lawton]

Thank you.