Stubborn Bolt



Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>
> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>
> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until
> I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>

Try your equivalent of RP-7, AKA Rat-****, WD-40, or anything else
similar. One rider in days of yore had a seat post that wouldn't budge.
He stuck it in a vice and managed to flatten it, but it stayed stuck. We
referred to it as an aerodynamic seatpost (LOL) It was a KMart bike of
course.
 
Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>
> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>
> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until
> I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>
> --
> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> www.schnauzers.ws


That's ISIS, right? Aren't the cranks self extracting? If that's the
case then you'll need to keep the cover on.

/s
 
Scott Gordo wrote:
> Ride-A-Lot wrote:
>> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>>
>> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>>
>> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until
>> I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>>
>> --
>> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
>> www.schnauzers.ws

>
> That's ISIS, right? Aren't the cranks self extracting? If that's the
> case then you'll need to keep the cover on.
>
> /s
>


Yes, it's ISIS. How will I get them off if the cover is on? These were
on the bike when I bought it. All my others have been x-type and they
are easy.

Looks like I'll have to take the whole thing to the LBS. I was hoping
to save some money by stripping it down myself. I've also got a problem
with the rear disc brake. The hose was thread through the cable holders
and then bled after. So I guess the only way is to cut the brake hose.

Aaaarrrrggggghhhhh!!!!!

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws
 
Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> Scott Gordo wrote:
> > Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> >> What do you use to loosen one of these:
> >>
> >> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
> >>
> >> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until
> >> I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
> >>
> >> --
> >> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> >> www.schnauzers.ws

> >
> > That's ISIS, right? Aren't the cranks self extracting? If that's the
> > case then you'll need to keep the cover on.
> >
> > /s
> >

>
> Yes, it's ISIS. How will I get them off if the cover is on? These were
> on the bike when I bought it. All my others have been x-type and they
> are easy.
>
> Looks like I'll have to take the whole thing to the LBS. I was hoping
> to save some money by stripping it down myself. I've also got a problem
> with the rear disc brake. The hose was thread through the cable holders
> and then bled after. So I guess the only way is to cut the brake hose.
>
> Aaaarrrrggggghhhhh!!!!!
>
> --
> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> www.schnauzers.ws


Scratch the self-extracting bit. I think for ISIS you need to buy a
special bolt setup for that.
Anyway, if you're not getting anywhere with the bolt and you're afraid
of stripping it, i'd drill some little holes in the plastic and try to
snap it out with some needlenose pliers. Not 100% sure that'll get you
better access to the bolt's threads (which could probably use a shot of
WD40/Liquid Wrench/whatever, but at least you'll have tried the option.

Words of warning:
-- Be sure not to ding up any metal bits with the drill.
-- I'm pretty impatient these days as repairs go, and I haven't mucked
around much with my ISIS. There may be better solutions.

/s
 
"Ride-A-Lot" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>
> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>
> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until
> I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>
> --
> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> www.schnauzers.ws


Did the plastic piece from the other side have any threads on it? If they
don't, just unscrew the bolt.

I had some Specialized Strong Arm Cranks that had bolts like that, but the
only thing the plastic piece did was keep dirt out. If you unscrew the bolt
the plastic piece comes right out.

If that doesn't work get a bigger wrench. :)

-Derek
 
These things aren't reverse threaded like pedals or anything, are they ?
 
Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>
> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>
> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off
> until I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.


It's not self extracting. I use a 8mm hex bit in a 3/8" rachet handle.
Apply slow even pressure in a CCW direction until it pops free. I usually
lean over the bike and push down on the rachet handle for leverage. The
plastic cap should come out with the bolt and then you can use a crank
extractor to get it off the BB axle. I think those cranks are square taper.
I'm surprised the carbon fibre stickers have stayed on this long.

Mike
 
ok, you need a 10mm hex wrench, period. DO NOT USE WD-40!!!! that ****
is the absolute worst s*** on the market for bikes. WD-40 is made for
displacing dirt and grease, like the grease in your BB that it will
inevitably soak into when you spray your crankbolt. we use Tri-Flow at
Down Cycles, it's teflon inpregnated and is not designed to displace
grease. If after you soak that bolt in tri-flow, it still doesn't come
out, find something to slide over your wrench to get some more torque.
finally you can always try an impact drill with a 10mm bit. the bolts
you have dont appear to be self-extracting from the look, most
self-extracting cranks have some fanciness on the crank-bolt, yours are
probably just standard ISIS sized crank-bolts. if you still have
trouble getting it out, you can bring it to your LBS, but I can assure
you we're going to do the same thing I just said, there are no special
tools we use to get stubborn bolts out, just fat-power, lube and
patience.

btw....this should be a good lesson to constantly check your crank
bolts to make sure they are not seized and are tightened propery.

stef
 
downcycles_stef wrote:
> ok, you need a 10mm hex wrench, period. DO NOT USE WD-40!!!! that ****
> is the absolute worst s*** on the market for bikes. WD-40 is made for
> displacing dirt and grease, like the grease in your BB that it will
> inevitably soak into when you spray your crankbolt. we use Tri-Flow at
> Down Cycles, it's teflon inpregnated and is not designed to displace
> grease. If after you soak that bolt in tri-flow, it still doesn't come
> out, find something to slide over your wrench to get some more torque.
> finally you can always try an impact drill with a 10mm bit. the bolts
> you have dont appear to be self-extracting from the look, most
> self-extracting cranks have some fanciness on the crank-bolt, yours are
> probably just standard ISIS sized crank-bolts. if you still have
> trouble getting it out, you can bring it to your LBS, but I can assure
> you we're going to do the same thing I just said, there are no special
> tools we use to get stubborn bolts out, just fat-power, lube and
> patience.
>
> btw....this should be a good lesson to constantly check your crank
> bolts to make sure they are not seized and are tightened propery.
>
> stef
>


Thanks. I will try soaking it. I have tri-flow on hand. It's an older
Race-Face Prodigy and I really like them. Just a good solid crankset.

I tried one of the hex wrenches I have and ended up stripping the
wrench. I guess the next step is to hook up the compressor to the air
hammer.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws
 
downcycles_stef wrote:
> ok, you need a 10mm hex wrench, period. DO NOT USE WD-40!!!! that ****
> is the absolute worst s*** on the market for bikes. WD-40 is made for
> displacing dirt and grease, l


You do know that WD-40 was designed to displace water ... right?

<snip>

> we use Tri-Flow at
> Down Cycles, it's teflon inpregnated and is not designed to displace
> grease.


If you are using aerosol Triflow it will dissolve grease just as fast
as WD-40 since it uses a similar volatile solvent as a carrier.

<snip>

R

picking nits ... and fleas ...
 
Michael Dart wrote:
> Ride-A-Lot wrote:
>> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>>
>> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>>
>> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off
>> until I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.

>
> It's not self extracting. I use a 8mm hex bit in a 3/8" rachet handle.
> Apply slow even pressure in a CCW direction until it pops free. I usually
> lean over the bike and push down on the rachet handle for leverage. The
> plastic cap should come out with the bolt and then you can use a crank
> extractor to get it off the BB axle. I think those cranks are square taper.
> I'm surprised the carbon fibre stickers have stayed on this long.
>
> Mike
>
>


Do you think it would be easier upside down and off the stand? How do I
keep the crankarms from turning. while pushing down?

The PDF directions I downloaded didn't look like square taper. The
stickers are still on because this bike gets little use in this area.
The last time I used it was with Sorni and Chip in SD and that was a
while ago.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws
 
John E Williams, Sr wrote:
> "Ride-A-Lot" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>>
>> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>>
>> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until I
>> get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>>
>> --
>> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
>> www.schnauzers.ws

>
> How did you get the crank arm off on the other side? Was it a cap or a hex
> bolt with a collar?
> John
>
>


Hey John! The arm didn't come off, just the bolt. That was another
problem. I need a rubber mallet (I've got tons of tools but not one of
those). The cap is a metal hex bolt with a very important washer
(according to race-face).

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws
 
Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> Michael Dart wrote:
>> Ride-A-Lot wrote:
>>> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>>>
>>> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>>>
>>> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off
>>> until I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.

>>
>> It's not self extracting. I use a 8mm hex bit in a 3/8" rachet
>> handle. Apply slow even pressure in a CCW direction until it pops
>> free. I usually lean over the bike and push down on the rachet
>> handle for leverage. The plastic cap should come out with the bolt
>> and then you can use a crank extractor to get it off the BB axle. I
>> think those cranks are square taper. I'm surprised the carbon fibre
>> stickers have stayed on this long. Mike
>>
>>

>
> Do you think it would be easier upside down and off the stand? How
> do I keep the crankarms from turning. while pushing down?
>
> The PDF directions I downloaded didn't look like square taper. The
> stickers are still on because this bike gets little use in this area.
> The last time I used it was with Sorni and Chip in SD and that was a
> while ago.


CF stickers imply square taper. Current Turbine cranks are ISIS... they
probably don't have the old manuals anymore.
--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
 
Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> Michael Dart wrote:
>> Ride-A-Lot wrote:
>>> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>>>
>>> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>>>
>>> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off
>>> until I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.

>>
>> It's not self extracting. I use a 8mm hex bit in a 3/8" rachet
>> handle. Apply slow even pressure in a CCW direction until it pops
>> free. I usually lean over the bike and push down on the rachet
>> handle for leverage. The plastic cap should come out with the bolt
>> and then you can use a crank extractor to get it off the BB axle. I
>> think those cranks are square taper. I'm surprised the carbon fibre
>> stickers have stayed on this long.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>

>
> Do you think it would be easier upside down and off the stand? How
> do I keep the crankarms from turning. while pushing down?
>


It's generally easier to really torque on stuff off the stand. I've done it
with the frame upside down. I hold the crankarm in one hand and the wrench
in the other. Either opposite each other (3 & 9 o'clock) or nearly together
and pull/push them toward each other. The key for stuck bolts is slow even
pressure until it breaks free. You can slip a pipe over the wrench handle
for leverage but don't jam on it. Slow even pressure!!! Either the bolt
will break free or break off. You can try to get penetrating oil into the
threads. The nylon dust cap will pry off the bolt with a screwdriver
(you'll have to mangle it a bit) to get the penetrant to bolt threads. Also
use an new (sharp) hex bit. An old worn one will round off the inside of
the bolt. You can sharpen an old one with a bench grinder but take care not
to overheat the tool. It will soften the metal. Clean any mud or stuff
from inside the bolt so the tool can bottom out well.

Also it really looks like a square taper crank version in the picture. You
will be able to verify by looking in the hole after the bolt comes out.
You'll need the appropriate crank arm puller to get the crank arm off the BB
axle. A rubber mallet probably won't work.

Mike
 
Michael Dart wrote:
> Ride-A-Lot wrote:
>> Michael Dart wrote:
>>> Ride-A-Lot wrote:
>>>> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>>>>
>>>> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off
>>>> until I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>>>
>>> It's not self extracting. I use a 8mm hex bit in a 3/8" rachet
>>> handle. Apply slow even pressure in a CCW direction until it pops
>>> free. I usually lean over the bike and push down on the rachet
>>> handle for leverage. The plastic cap should come out with the bolt
>>> and then you can use a crank extractor to get it off the BB axle. I
>>> think those cranks are square taper. I'm surprised the carbon fibre
>>> stickers have stayed on this long.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>>

>>
>> Do you think it would be easier upside down and off the stand? How
>> do I keep the crankarms from turning. while pushing down?
>>

>
> It's generally easier to really torque on stuff off the stand. I've
> done it with the frame upside down. I hold the crankarm in one hand
> and the wrench in the other. Either opposite each other (3 & 9
> o'clock) or nearly together and pull/push them toward each other.
> The key for stuck bolts is slow even pressure until it breaks free.
> You can slip a pipe over the wrench handle for leverage but don't jam
> on it. Slow even pressure!!! Either the bolt will break free or
> break off. You can try to get penetrating oil into the threads. The
> nylon dust cap will pry off the bolt with a screwdriver (you'll have
> to mangle it a bit) to get the penetrant to bolt threads. Also use
> an new (sharp) hex bit. An old worn one will round off the inside of
> the bolt. You can sharpen an old one with a bench grinder but take
> care not to overheat the tool. It will soften the metal. Clean any
> mud or stuff from inside the bolt so the tool can bottom out well.
>
> Also it really looks like a square taper crank version in the
> picture. You will be able to verify by looking in the hole after the
> bolt comes out. You'll need the appropriate crank arm puller to get
> the crank arm off the BB axle. A rubber mallet probably won't work.


If it is an ISIS and you try to use a square taper crank puller, it won't
work, and you probably won't damage anything because the piston of the
puller will go clear inside the entire BB spindle. If it's a square taper
and you try to use an ISIS puller, it won't work, and you will likely
destroy the crankset because it will be pushing against the extractor
threads!

--
Phil, Squid-in-Training
 
Ride-A-Lot wrote:
> John E Williams, Sr wrote:
> > "Ride-A-Lot" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >> What do you use to loosen one of these:
> >>
> >> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
> >>
> >> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until I
> >> get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
> >>
> >> --
> >> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> >> www.schnauzers.ws

> >
> > How did you get the crank arm off on the other side? Was it a cap or a hex
> > bolt with a collar?
> > John
> >
> >

>
> Hey John! The arm didn't come off, just the bolt. That was another
> problem. I need a rubber mallet (I've got tons of tools but not one of
> those). The cap is a metal hex bolt with a very important washer
> (according to race-face).
>
> --
> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> www.schnauzers.ws


If a rubber mallet works, you're looking at buying some new cranks as
well.

/s
 
"Ride-A-Lot" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>
> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>
> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off until I
> get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>
> --
> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> www.schnauzers.ws


WOW! After reading all the posts, I understand how bikes can get so messed
up before they are brought to the shop. Ouch. Good Luck.

TJ
 
TJ wrote:
> "Ride-A-Lot" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> What do you use to loosen one of these:
>>
>> http://www.schnauzers.ws/hex.jpg
>>
>> It's not rusty, just dirty. I don't think I can get the crank off
>> until I get the cover off, right? The other side came right off.
>>
>> --
>> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
>> www.schnauzers.ws

>
> WOW! After reading all the posts, I understand how bikes can get so
> messed up before they are brought to the shop. Ouch. Good Luck.
>
> TJ


He said he just wanted to get the bolt out. Not that he wanted to put it
back together! ;^)