Sundays Age

Peter Signorini said:

TimC said:

And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).

So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.

No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for any
road, and 2+2 when overtaking.

Cheers
Peter

Not real sure about that. I would think that the lanes are treated
seperately.

ProfTournesol said:

Euan said:

Quoted message said:

>>>>"DaveB" == DaveB <[email hidden]> writes:

DaveB> When we know what we want to achieve then is the time to work
DaveB> out how to do it.

I agree.
--
Cheers | ~~ __@
Euan | ~~ _-\<,
Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)

One problem we have is that we are small(er than a car) and invisible:
most of us ride singly (Beach Road is an exception) and the impact of
the absence of our cars on the road is unnoticed.

How about a mass weekend drive down Beach Road instead of a cycle? If
we picked one weekend, all drove at 40 km/hr with bikes mounted on the
car to identify us as cyclists, we could show that:
we are a large group when acting collectively
we (mostly) all drive and pay registration fees
if we chose to drive rather than cycle we would be adding considerably
to traffic congestion.

imagine if even half of the 6000 cyclists a wekend day did this in an
organised fashion, (but didn't break any road rules), even Channel 7
would struggle to vilify us.

That is a brilliant idea.

cfsmtb said:

ProfTournesol said:

imagine if we reversed BV's strategy and organised a Drive to Work Day
for cyclists, again with bikes on roof racks/bike beak etc.

Pah! Discrimination against those of us (freaks) who don't hold a
license! Bikesoiler & I will carshare though. Others quite welcome, we
could fit another 2-3 on the subary + roof racks. 🙂

Yeah.. I,ll fire up the old rat sprite. Lets try and do it a car an
ocupant just to better make the point. I think this is a brilliant
stroke of genius.

alison_b said:

ProfTournesol said:

imagine if we reversed BV's strategy and organised a Drive to Work Day
for cyclists, again with bikes on roof racks/bike beak etc.

I think this is a great idea. But... any chance of car-pooling? We
don't all have licenses, and some of us don't have cars. 😉

ali

I,m sure one way or another we can find plenty of cars.

ProfTournesol said:

alison_b said:

I really do like the idea... puts the "one less car" idea out there in
a pretty material form.

thanks,
ali

It would only be effective if we did it 'en masse' and broke no road
rules. imagine channel & selectively showing 2 seconds of the only car
traveling through a red light.......

Yeah.. do it by meeting in some big carpark early.. and doing a
briefing. But we could pull it off you know. It would be wonderful.

rooman said:

Peter Signorini said:

TimC said:

And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).

So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.

No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for
any
road, and 2+2 when overtaking.

Cheers
Peter

Pete, read the rule again....it is confusing but I read what you say
and I don't agree..

Rule 151 (1) applies to say "-must not ride on a road that is not a
multilane road etc...."- meaning, single lane roads or single marked
lanes in multi laned roads.... see reference to excluding multilane
roads below , so thus you ride two abreast on a single lane road, or
two abreast in any marked lane, not that you cant ride in the remaining
marked line...there is no reference to excluding riders from the
remaining marked lane(s), therefore theoretically, (and legally) on say
Beach Road at a two lane section, two pace lines each in their lane can
move side by side and each can be overtaken by a single rider ( in each
lane) thus 6 riders can ride abreast providing two ( one in each lane)
are overtaking).....
essentially permitting what channel 7 filmed from the air and screened
recently ..... Rule follows:-

quote:

*-151. Riding a motor bike or bicycle alongside more than 1 other
rider-

*-(1) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride on a
road that is not a multilane road alongside more than 1 other rider,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-bicycle-*-, *motor bike *--and *multi-lane road *--are
defined in the dictionary, and *rider *--is defined in rule 17.-

-(2) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride in a
marked lane alongside more than 1 other rider in the marked lane,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-marked lane -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(3) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle may ride alongside more
than 1 other rider if the-

-rider is—-

-(a) overtaking the other riders; or-

-(b) permitted to do so under regulation 403 of the Road Safety
(Road Rules)-

-Regulations 1999.-

-note -*-overtake -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(4) If the rider of a motor bike or bicycle is riding on a road
that is not a multi-lane road alongside another rider, or in a marked
lane alongside another rider in the marked lane, the rider must ride
not over 1.5 metres from the other rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-(5) In this rule—-

*-road -*-does not include a road related area, but includes a
bicycle path, shared path and-

-any shoulder of the road.-

-note -*-bicycle path -*-is defined in rule 239, *road related
area *--is defined in rule 13, *shared path *--is defined in-

-rule 242, and -*-shoulder -*-is defined in rule 12.-

Yeah thats what I think too 🙂

Zebee Johnstone said:

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 08 Aug 2005 18:40:19 +1000

dave said:

Peter Signorini said:

No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for any
road, and 2+2 when overtaking.

Not real sure about that. I would think that the lanes are treated
seperately.

From the Australian Road Rules:

151 Riding a motor bike or bicycle alongside more than
1 other rider
(1) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride on a road
that
is not a multi-lane road alongside more than 1 other rider,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.
Offence provision.
Note Bicycle, motor bike and multi-lane road are defined in the
dictionary, and rider is defined in rule 17.
(2) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride in a marked
lane alongside more than 1 other rider in the marked lane,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.
Offence provision.
Note Marked lane is defined in the dictionary.
(3) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle may ride alongside more
than 1 other rider if the rider is:
(a) overtaking the other riders; or
(b) permitted to do so under another law of this jurisdiction.
Note Overtake is defined in the

I think (2) is the key here.

I agree 🙂

Quoted message said:

Zebee

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 08 Aug 2005 18:40:19 +1000

dave said:

Peter Signorini said:

No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for any
road, and 2+2 when overtaking.

Not real sure about that. I would think that the lanes are treated
seperately.

From the Australian Road Rules:

151 Riding a motor bike or bicycle alongside more than
1 other rider
(1) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride on a road
that
is not a multi-lane road alongside more than 1 other rider,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.
Offence provision.
Note Bicycle, motor bike and multi-lane road are defined in the
dictionary, and rider is defined in rule 17.
(2) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride in a marked
lane alongside more than 1 other rider in the marked lane,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.
Offence provision.
Note Marked lane is defined in the dictionary.
(3) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle may ride alongside more
than 1 other rider if the rider is:
(a) overtaking the other riders; or
(b) permitted to do so under another law of this jurisdiction.
Note Overtake is defined in the

I think (2) is the key here.

Zebee
--
Zebee Johnstone ([email hidden]), proud holder of
aus.motorcycles Poser Permit #1.
"Motorcycles are like peanuts... who can stop at just one?"

In aus.bicycle on Sun, 7 Aug 2005 19:06:48 +1000

ProfTournesol said:

How about a mass weekend drive down Beach Road instead of a cycle? If
we picked one weekend, all drove at 40 km/hr with bikes mounted on the
car to identify us as cyclists, we could show that:
we are a large group when acting collectively
we (mostly) all drive and pay registration fees
if we chose to drive rather than cycle we would be adding considerably
to traffic congestion.

imagine if even half of the 6000 cyclists a wekend day did this in an
organised fashion, (but didn't break any road rules), even Channel 7
would struggle to vilify us.

One thing I've learned with motorcycle advocacy is that if you are
planning a protest, you need to plan it.

Who are you trying to talk to, and what is the message? What do you
want from it? Think hard about that message. Is this about beach rd?
About commuters? About bicycle safety? get that message nailed down
and focus on communicating it.

How many do you think you can get? People will only do something if it
doesn't inconvenience them. Sad but true... most riders aren't
interested in advocacy and protest, they just want to get on with their
lives. So you have to make it sound fun and that it will actually do
something. No one wants to be associated with failure, so what it's
about has to be clear, and it has to sound like it will work and have
results.

Get your publicity worked out. Who will be your front, who will be
speaking to the reporters? They will grab someone to talk to, make sure
it's the one you want them to grab. Have a contact for them. Have a
press release for them that describes what is going on and why, has a
bunch of useful facts they can use - numbers, money spent, and so on.
The more work you do for them so they don't have to hunt this stuff up
themselves, the more likely they are to use that work and print what you
give them. Think about how to give them good TV, that's what makes or
breaks one of these things. Good pics will give you coverage on all
channels.

have a blurb for your protestors. It should give them the soundbytes
for the ride so if a reporter asks them, the reporter gets the party
line back. The protesters need to know in advance the start point and
how to get there, the route, the end point and what to do at the end -
do they park, do they go back, do they disperse, is there a party
afterwards, do they take the bikes off the car and return on bikes?
(that could help the commuter message, but the parking could be a right
[censored])

What is the message you want people to take away? is it that all these
people would be in cars if they weren't hooning on Beach Rd? is it that
they do pay rego? Is it that cars take up a lot of room? Pick a main
message and push that, have other ones if you want, but don't try and do
too many things at once.

Do you want to link this to commuters, if so how will you do it?

How many people will you get? how many will you need to make good TV?
How many will you need to impress reporters with numbers? What numbers
do you give them?

How will people who aren't part of the protest know what you are on
about? A banner? Printed flyers handed out?

Get together and brainstorm. Start with the message you want to get
across, get a good soundbyte for that, plan the format the protest will
take, think about how you are going to get those cars in and out, and
think of all the things that could go wrong so you can deal with them
before they happen.

Otherwise you get a damp squib of a protest, the way some of the
motorcycle protests have embarassed their organisers.

Zebee

Zebee Johnstone said:

In aus.bicycle on Sun, 7 Aug 2005 19:06:48 +1000

ProfTournesol said:

How about a mass weekend drive down Beach Road instead of a cycle? If
we picked one weekend, all drove at 40 km/hr with bikes mounted on the
car to identify us as cyclists, we could show that:
we are a large group when acting collectively
we (mostly) all drive and pay registration fees
if we chose to drive rather than cycle we would be adding considerably
to traffic congestion.

imagine if even half of the 6000 cyclists a wekend day did this in an
organised fashion, (but didn't break any road rules), even Channel 7
would struggle to vilify us.

One thing I've learned with motorcycle advocacy is that if you are
planning a protest, you need to plan it.

Who are you trying to talk to, and what is the message? What do you
want from it? Think hard about that message. Is this about beach rd?
About commuters? About bicycle safety? get that message nailed down
and focus on communicating it.

How many do you think you can get? People will only do something if it
doesn't inconvenience them. Sad but true... most riders aren't
interested in advocacy and protest, they just want to get on with their
lives. So you have to make it sound fun and that it will actually do
something. No one wants to be associated with failure, so what it's
about has to be clear, and it has to sound like it will work and have
results.

Get your publicity worked out. Who will be your front, who will be
speaking to the reporters? They will grab someone to talk to, make sure
it's the one you want them to grab. Have a contact for them. Have a
press release for them that describes what is going on and why, has a
bunch of useful facts they can use - numbers, money spent, and so on.
The more work you do for them so they don't have to hunt this stuff up
themselves, the more likely they are to use that work and print what you
give them. Think about how to give them good TV, that's what makes or
breaks one of these things. Good pics will give you coverage on all
channels.

have a blurb for your protestors. It should give them the soundbytes
for the ride so if a reporter asks them, the reporter gets the party
line back. The protesters need to know in advance the start point and
how to get there, the route, the end point and what to do at the end -
do they park, do they go back, do they disperse, is there a party
afterwards, do they take the bikes off the car and return on bikes?
(that could help the commuter message, but the parking could be a right
[censored])

What is the message you want people to take away? is it that all these
people would be in cars if they weren't hooning on Beach Rd? is it that
they do pay rego? Is it that cars take up a lot of room? Pick a main
message and push that, have other ones if you want, but don't try and do
too many things at once.

Do you want to link this to commuters, if so how will you do it?

How many people will you get? how many will you need to make good TV?
How many will you need to impress reporters with numbers? What numbers
do you give them?

How will people who aren't part of the protest know what you are on
about? A banner? Printed flyers handed out?

Get together and brainstorm. Start with the message you want to get
across, get a good soundbyte for that, plan the format the protest will
take, think about how you are going to get those cars in and out, and
think of all the things that could go wrong so you can deal with them
before they happen.

Otherwise you get a damp squib of a protest, the way some of the
motorcycle protests have embarassed their organisers.

Zebee

Good points all of them.

The MRA protests that worked were the footpath parking ones. Thats
becouse as I said they had a single message.. that motorcycles on the
footpath are not a nuisence and free up parking spaces.

The ones that didnt work so well were the ones with many people pushing
different barrows.

If we push a message like ¨See we do pay rego and by using the bike
instead we are freeing up more space for YOU ¨ It could work and counter
one of the average schmucks most dearly held (and stupid) beliefs.

Comments anyone?

Zebee Johnstone said:

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 08 Aug 2005 19:51:55 +1000

dave said:

If we push a message like ¨See we do pay rego and by using the bike
instead we are freeing up more space for YOU ¨ It could work and counter
one of the average schmucks most dearly held (and stupid) beliefs.

So.. is beach rd the place?

When should the protest happen, and how will you get people out there?

Do commuters *have* bike racks? Or are the bods who have bike racks the
ones who drive their bikes to the recreational grounds?

Perhaps start by talking to commuters. Everyone make it a point to talk
to commuters you haven't talked to before. WOuld they take part? Can
they - do they have a bike rack? Would they be willing to stuff the
bike in the car with the wheel hanging out? 🙂

My plans to ockystrap it to the boot of the sprite. Or maybe on the
gearsack of the Kat.. Nah needs to be on something with 4 wheels I guess 🙂

Quoted message said:

What will they get? Are you wanting more government funding, if so for
what? Or is this to get to drivers "look, more room for you if we are
on bikes"? If so, how will that message get through,and what's a good
soundbite to put on stickers? "If I was on my bicycle, you'd be home
sooner"? 🙂

I like that.

Quoted message said:

Zebee

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 08 Aug 2005 19:51:55 +1000

dave said:

If we push a message like ¨See we do pay rego and by using the bike
instead we are freeing up more space for YOU ¨ It could work and counter
one of the average schmucks most dearly held (and stupid) beliefs.

So.. is beach rd the place?

When should the protest happen, and how will you get people out there?

Do commuters *have* bike racks? Or are the bods who have bike racks the
ones who drive their bikes to the recreational grounds?

Perhaps start by talking to commuters. Everyone make it a point to talk
to commuters you haven't talked to before. WOuld they take part? Can
they - do they have a bike rack? Would they be willing to stuff the
bike in the car with the wheel hanging out? 🙂

What will they get? Are you wanting more government funding, if so for
what? Or is this to get to drivers "look, more room for you if we are
on bikes"? If so, how will that message get through,and what's a good
soundbite to put on stickers? "If I was on my bicycle, you'd be home
sooner"? 🙂

Zebee

In article <[email hidden]>,

dave said:

rooman said:

Peter Signorini said:

"TimC" wrote:

>And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
>2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).
>
>So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.

No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for
any
road, and 2+2 when overtaking.

Cheers
Peter

Pete, read the rule again....it is confusing but I read what you say
and I don't agree..

Rule 151 (1) applies to say "-must not ride on a road that is not a
multilane road etc...."- meaning, single lane roads or single marked
lanes in multi laned roads.... see reference to excluding multilane
roads below , so thus you ride two abreast on a single lane road, or
two abreast in any marked lane, not that you cant ride in the remaining
marked line...there is no reference to excluding riders from the
remaining marked lane(s), therefore theoretically, (and legally) on say
Beach Road at a two lane section, two pace lines each in their lane can
move side by side and each can be overtaken by a single rider ( in each
lane) thus 6 riders can ride abreast providing two ( one in each lane)
are overtaking).....
essentially permitting what channel 7 filmed from the air and screened
recently ..... Rule follows:-

quote:

*-151. Riding a motor bike or bicycle alongside more than 1 other
rider-

*-(1) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride on a
road that is not a multilane road alongside more than 1 other rider,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-bicycle-*-, *motor bike *--and *multi-lane road *--are
defined in the dictionary, and *rider *--is defined in rule 17.-

-(2) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride in a
marked lane alongside more than 1 other rider in the marked lane,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-marked lane -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(3) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle may ride alongside more
than 1 other rider if the-

-rider is‹-

-(a) overtaking the other riders; or-

-(b) permitted to do so under regulation 403 of the Road Safety
(Road Rules)-

-Regulations 1999.-

-note -*-overtake -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(4) If the rider of a motor bike or bicycle is riding on a road
that is not a multi-lane road alongside another rider, or in a marked
lane alongside another rider in the marked lane, the rider must ride
not over 1.5 metres from the other rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-(5) In this rule‹-

*-road -*-does not include a road related area, but includes a
bicycle path, shared path and-

-any shoulder of the road.-

-note -*-bicycle path -*-is defined in rule 239, *road related
area *--is defined in rule 13, *shared path *--is defined in-

-rule 242, and -*-shoulder -*-is defined in rule 12.-

Yeah thats what I think too 🙂

It's an interesting argument. I wonder how bikes in the right lane,
assuming they are travelling at (roughly) the same speed as those in the
left lane, would fare on a charge of obstructing traffic.

--
Shane Stanley

In article <[email hidden]>,

dave said:

rooman said:

Peter Signorini said:

"TimC" wrote:

>And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
>2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).
>
>So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.

No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for
any
road, and 2+2 when overtaking.

Cheers
Peter

Pete, read the rule again....it is confusing but I read what you say
and I don't agree..

Rule 151 (1) applies to say "-must not ride on a road that is not a
multilane road etc...."- meaning, single lane roads or single marked
lanes in multi laned roads.... see reference to excluding multilane
roads below , so thus you ride two abreast on a single lane road, or
two abreast in any marked lane, not that you cant ride in the remaining
marked line...there is no reference to excluding riders from the
remaining marked lane(s), therefore theoretically, (and legally) on say
Beach Road at a two lane section, two pace lines each in their lane can
move side by side and each can be overtaken by a single rider ( in each
lane) thus 6 riders can ride abreast providing two ( one in each lane)
are overtaking).....
essentially permitting what channel 7 filmed from the air and screened
recently ..... Rule follows:-

quote:

*-151. Riding a motor bike or bicycle alongside more than 1 other
rider-

*-(1) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride on a
road that is not a multilane road alongside more than 1 other rider,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-bicycle-*-, *motor bike *--and *multi-lane road *--are
defined in the dictionary, and *rider *--is defined in rule 17.-

-(2) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride in a
marked lane alongside more than 1 other rider in the marked lane,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-marked lane -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(3) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle may ride alongside more
than 1 other rider if the-

-rider is‹-

-(a) overtaking the other riders; or-

-(b) permitted to do so under regulation 403 of the Road Safety
(Road Rules)-

-Regulations 1999.-

-note -*-overtake -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(4) If the rider of a motor bike or bicycle is riding on a road
that is not a multi-lane road alongside another rider, or in a marked
lane alongside another rider in the marked lane, the rider must ride
not over 1.5 metres from the other rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-(5) In this rule‹-

*-road -*-does not include a road related area, but includes a
bicycle path, shared path and-

-any shoulder of the road.-

-note -*-bicycle path -*-is defined in rule 239, *road related
area *--is defined in rule 13, *shared path *--is defined in-

-rule 242, and -*-shoulder -*-is defined in rule 12.-

Yeah thats what I think too 🙂

It's an interesting argument. I wonder how bikes in the right lane,
assuming they are travelling at (roughly) the same speed as those in the
left lane, would fare on a charge of obstructing traffic.

--
Shane Stanley

Shane Stanley said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

dave said:

rooman said:

Peter Signorini Wrote:

>"TimC" wrote:
>
>
>>And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
>>2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).
>>
>>So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.
>
>No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for
>any
>road, and 2+2 when overtaking.
>
>Cheers
>Peter

Pete, read the rule again....it is confusing but I read what you say
and I don't agree..

Rule 151 (1) applies to say "-must not ride on a road that is not a
multilane road etc...."- meaning, single lane roads or single marked
lanes in multi laned roads.... see reference to excluding multilane
roads below , so thus you ride two abreast on a single lane road, or
two abreast in any marked lane, not that you cant ride in the remaining
marked line...there is no reference to excluding riders from the
remaining marked lane(s), therefore theoretically, (and legally) on say
Beach Road at a two lane section, two pace lines each in their lane can
move side by side and each can be overtaken by a single rider ( in each
lane) thus 6 riders can ride abreast providing two ( one in each lane)
are overtaking).....
essentially permitting what channel 7 filmed from the air and screened
recently ..... Rule follows:-

quote:

*-151. Riding a motor bike or bicycle alongside more than 1 other
rider-

*-(1) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride on a
road that is not a multilane road alongside more than 1 other rider,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-bicycle-*-, *motor bike *--and *multi-lane road *--are
defined in the dictionary, and *rider *--is defined in rule 17.-

-(2) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride in a
marked lane alongside more than 1 other rider in the marked lane,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-marked lane -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(3) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle may ride alongside more
than 1 other rider if the-

-rider is‹-

-(a) overtaking the other riders; or-

-(b) permitted to do so under regulation 403 of the Road Safety
(Road Rules)-

-Regulations 1999.-

-note -*-overtake -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(4) If the rider of a motor bike or bicycle is riding on a road
that is not a multi-lane road alongside another rider, or in a marked
lane alongside another rider in the marked lane, the rider must ride
not over 1.5 metres from the other rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-(5) In this rule‹-

*-road -*-does not include a road related area, but includes a
bicycle path, shared path and-

-any shoulder of the road.-

-note -*-bicycle path -*-is defined in rule 239, *road related
area *--is defined in rule 13, *shared path *--is defined in-

-rule 242, and -*-shoulder -*-is defined in rule 12.-

Yeah thats what I think too 🙂

It's an interesting argument. I wonder how bikes in the right lane,
assuming they are travelling at (roughly) the same speed as those in the
left lane, would fare on a charge of obstructing traffic.

People have beaten obstucting traffic charges before. In one instance
for doing 69 kph in the right hand lane of the freeway if I recollect
corectly.

Pretty sure that anytime I am in the right hand lane I am not doing 40
kph less than the posted limit.

Hard for the magistrate to go past the (I was going as fast as I deemed
safe for the conditions.) safety arguament

Shane Stanley said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

dave said:

rooman said:

Peter Signorini Wrote:

>"TimC" wrote:
>
>
>>And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
>>2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).
>>
>>So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.
>
>No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for
>any
>road, and 2+2 when overtaking.
>
>Cheers
>Peter

Pete, read the rule again....it is confusing but I read what you say
and I don't agree..

Rule 151 (1) applies to say "-must not ride on a road that is not a
multilane road etc...."- meaning, single lane roads or single marked
lanes in multi laned roads.... see reference to excluding multilane
roads below , so thus you ride two abreast on a single lane road, or
two abreast in any marked lane, not that you cant ride in the remaining
marked line...there is no reference to excluding riders from the
remaining marked lane(s), therefore theoretically, (and legally) on say
Beach Road at a two lane section, two pace lines each in their lane can
move side by side and each can be overtaken by a single rider ( in each
lane) thus 6 riders can ride abreast providing two ( one in each lane)
are overtaking).....
essentially permitting what channel 7 filmed from the air and screened
recently ..... Rule follows:-

quote:

*-151. Riding a motor bike or bicycle alongside more than 1 other
rider-

*-(1) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride on a
road that is not a multilane road alongside more than 1 other rider,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-bicycle-*-, *motor bike *--and *multi-lane road *--are
defined in the dictionary, and *rider *--is defined in rule 17.-

-(2) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle must not ride in a
marked lane alongside more than 1 other rider in the marked lane,
unless subrule (3) applies to the rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-note -*-marked lane -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(3) The rider of a motor bike or bicycle may ride alongside more
than 1 other rider if the-

-rider is‹-

-(a) overtaking the other riders; or-

-(b) permitted to do so under regulation 403 of the Road Safety
(Road Rules)-

-Regulations 1999.-

-note -*-overtake -*-is defined in the dictionary.-

-(4) If the rider of a motor bike or bicycle is riding on a road
that is not a multi-lane road alongside another rider, or in a marked
lane alongside another rider in the marked lane, the rider must ride
not over 1.5 metres from the other rider.-

-Penalty: 1 penalty unit.-

-(5) In this rule‹-

*-road -*-does not include a road related area, but includes a
bicycle path, shared path and-

-any shoulder of the road.-

-note -*-bicycle path -*-is defined in rule 239, *road related
area *--is defined in rule 13, *shared path *--is defined in-

-rule 242, and -*-shoulder -*-is defined in rule 12.-

Yeah thats what I think too 🙂

It's an interesting argument. I wonder how bikes in the right lane,
assuming they are travelling at (roughly) the same speed as those in the
left lane, would fare on a charge of obstructing traffic.

People have beaten obstucting traffic charges before. In one instance
for doing 69 kph in the right hand lane of the freeway if I recollect
corectly.

Pretty sure that anytime I am in the right hand lane I am not doing 40
kph less than the posted limit.

Hard for the magistrate to go past the (I was going as fast as I deemed
safe for the conditions.) safety arguament

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 08 Aug 2005 20:39:57 +1000

Shane Stanley said:

It's an interesting argument. I wonder how bikes in the right lane,
assuming they are travelling at (roughly) the same speed as those in the
left lane, would fare on a charge of obstructing traffic.

hmm...

note this:
(1) A driver is the person who is driving a vehicle (except a motor
bike, bicycle, animal or animal-drawn vehicle).

Now see this:

(1) A driver must not unreasonably obstruct the path of another
driver or a pedestrian.
(2) For this rule, a driver does not unreasonably obstruct the path
of another driver or a pedestrian only because:
(a) the driver is stopped in traffic; or
(b) the driver is driving more slowly than other vehicles
(unless the driver is driving abnormally slowly in the
circumstances).
Example of a driver driving abnormally slowly
A driver driving at a speed of 20 kilometres per hour on a length of
road to
which a speed-limit of 80 kilometres per hour applies when there is no
reason for the driver to drive at that speed on the length of road.

130 Keeping to the left on a multi-lane road
(1) This rule applies to a driver driving on a multi-lane road if:
(a) the speed-limit applying to the driver for the length of
road
where the driver is driving is over 80 kilometres per hour;
or
(b) a keep left unless overtaking sign applies to the length of
road where the driver is driving.

SO this looks like you can ride your bikes in two lanes all you like.

I would suggest it's a bad idea unless you can really link it to some
procycle message, in a way that the linkage is obvious.

Remember - you are vulnerable, people in cars hate being in cars.
They want to get where they are going and don't want to spend any more
time then they have to in their little boxes.

So if you hold them up, they will try to get past, and that means
someone might get hurt. I saw some *very* dodgy moves by cars at a recent
motorcycle protest. Only, you will note, when barging alongside scooters,
funny how they didn't try that on the Harley guys a bit further along...

Zebee

--
Zebee Johnstone ([email hidden]), proud holder of
aus.motorcycles Poser Permit #1.
"Motorcycles are like peanuts... who can stop at just one?"

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 08 Aug 2005 20:39:57 +1000

Shane Stanley said:

It's an interesting argument. I wonder how bikes in the right lane,
assuming they are travelling at (roughly) the same speed as those in the
left lane, would fare on a charge of obstructing traffic.

hmm...

note this:
(1) A driver is the person who is driving a vehicle (except a motor
bike, bicycle, animal or animal-drawn vehicle).

Now see this:

(1) A driver must not unreasonably obstruct the path of another
driver or a pedestrian.
(2) For this rule, a driver does not unreasonably obstruct the path
of another driver or a pedestrian only because:
(a) the driver is stopped in traffic; or
(b) the driver is driving more slowly than other vehicles
(unless the driver is driving abnormally slowly in the
circumstances).
Example of a driver driving abnormally slowly
A driver driving at a speed of 20 kilometres per hour on a length of
road to
which a speed-limit of 80 kilometres per hour applies when there is no
reason for the driver to drive at that speed on the length of road.

130 Keeping to the left on a multi-lane road
(1) This rule applies to a driver driving on a multi-lane road if:
(a) the speed-limit applying to the driver for the length of
road
where the driver is driving is over 80 kilometres per hour;
or
(b) a keep left unless overtaking sign applies to the length of
road where the driver is driving.

SO this looks like you can ride your bikes in two lanes all you like.

I would suggest it's a bad idea unless you can really link it to some
procycle message, in a way that the linkage is obvious.

Remember - you are vulnerable, people in cars hate being in cars.
They want to get where they are going and don't want to spend any more
time then they have to in their little boxes.

So if you hold them up, they will try to get past, and that means
someone might get hurt. I saw some *very* dodgy moves by cars at a recent
motorcycle protest. Only, you will note, when barging alongside scooters,
funny how they didn't try that on the Harley guys a bit further along...

Zebee

--
Zebee Johnstone ([email hidden]), proud holder of
aus.motorcycles Poser Permit #1.
"Motorcycles are like peanuts... who can stop at just one?"

dave said:

My plans to ockystrap it to the boot of the sprite. Or maybe on the
gearsack of the Kat.. Nah needs to be on something with 4 wheels I guess 🙂

I've thought about attaching the bike to the back of my FJ when I've
needed to get to triathlons. The weight wouldn't be a problem but I'm a
bit concerned about what would happen if I tried to lane split. 🙁

DaveB

DaveB said:

dave said:

My plans to ockystrap it to the boot of the sprite. Or maybe on the
gearsack of the Kat.. Nah needs to be on something with 4 wheels I
guess 🙂

I've thought about attaching the bike to the back of my FJ when I've
needed to get to triathlons. The weight wouldn't be a problem but I'm a
bit concerned about what would happen if I tried to lane split. 🙁

DaveB

If you figure a solution lemme know.

Mind you If I hang a spare helmet of the helmet lock I have to allow an
extra 6 inches on that side. a pushy on the back would be about the
same width all up as a sidecar 🙂