Taxing fat people

[lumpy]

It just seems that some people do not understand that it is not the governments responsibility to fix every little problem someone has because they cannot deal with it themselves.

Why is this so hard to understand.

So those people who can't deal with all their "little problems" ... who is going to help them? Are you saying they should fend for themselves and taxpayers shouldn't help them?

I think the way to judge a country is by how well they treat their own disadvantaged.

Being patronizing doesn't help you here, nor is it necessary.

 

[BimmsAndBices]

Man, my dad's muscles are bigger than all yall's!

(anyone?)

 

[Pendejo]

"It just seems that some people do not understand that it is not the governments responsibility to fix every little problem someone has because they cannot deal with it themselves." QUOTE]

EXACTLY, Spartan. That's my point. Why aren't you seeing this? If someone is obese and ends up with diabetes, amputations, heart disease, and all the rest of the typical consequences, society should be set up so that they have to pay for their own treatments, and if they can't that's tough. OR, society should be set up so that medical treatment is available to all, BUT people who put their health at risk in the most obvious ways should have to contribute more in taxes to support that health system. In either case, you have personal responsibility at work. Each time you post you seem to contradict yourself on this issue.

 

[baillirw]

Well if the junk food tax is a bad idea, what do you nay sayers suggest? I guess to find an answer to this issue is to look at other countries and look at what they're doing. Why is America so much fatter then everyone else?
But I do agree, it does come down to personal responsibility. I lost a lot of weight last year because I looked myself in the mirror and said I didn't want to live this lifestyle anymore. But it's been tough. Everyday I'm faced with tough choices be it at school, at the mall, wherever.
The junk food tax is just an idea to make healthy living more affordable. Maybe we need to give tax breaks to stores like Whole Foods or companies that encourage better choices. For the sake of America's health, something has to be done by somebody!

 

[Blademun]

Taxes are in fact the price of consequences shared by society. So, I really don't see your point there.

The rest is just not factual. If you think that supply and demand is an adolecent theory, well you really have some thinking to do.

And you just talked over yourself. If in fact there is this corporatocracy, and the government is the board of directors (thus implying that is not what you want) why would you want to give the board of directors more power by letting them tax people? Your theory needs some major tweaking.

And nobody said anyone hated America. It just seems that some people do not understand that it is not the governments responsibility to fix every little problem someone has because they cannot deal with it themselves. And if you are in the crowd that thinks the government should take money from a company that is doing well because their product is in high demand, well get ready to live in either a communist or socialist America. Take you pick.

The bottom line is that if you don't want a company to make money. Don't buy their product. Simple. If enough people are not buying their product they will have to lower prices to meet demand or go out of business.

Why is this so hard to understand.

I would like to note real quick that the enviormentalists are not anti-capitalistic. They are anti-exploitation, which is what the oil companys are doing to us. You mentioned that the Gas station gets only 1/5 of the profit, and the rest gos to taxes? Well, profits are whats made after the actual cost they pay for the gas. If you were to make a pie chart of what costs are associated with a gallon of gas, the lions share would be the wholesale price of gas itself..tax and gas station profits would be slivers.

Also, there are several real alternatives to fossil fuels we could use for transportation and electric generation. Some of which you've never heard of.

Scalar Electromagnetics: This is a complex aspect of electromagnetics that I do not quite understand, but have seen plenty of proof substantiating its claims. It has the ability to produce electricity in large amounts through a method of induction from...what, I don't understand, aether..void..not sure..There are working tabletop generators working off the theroy.

Pyroelectric Fusion: Tabletop fusion has been confirmed and produced at Rensselaer and UCLA. Heres a Wiki on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyroelectric_fusion

And the more well known methods, Fuel Cells, Hybrids, Hydrogen fueled cars, ect.

'Informed' People will tell you these sources of energy are not easily applicable and thus 'not viable'. Well gee whiz, neither was the gasoline internal combustion engine, it took 40 years to get that right..The reality is we do not want to devote the resources, time or attention to all of these methods, and the Oil companys do everything they can to keep the status quo just like that.

(And now, to get back on topic, the rest of this is in regards to the topic in general.)

As for what this post is about, its about people getting fat because they don't take care of themselfs. Low and behold, 20-40 years later they roll into a emergency room, dying. This is a side effect of the well marketed "American way of Life". You see, the very idea of who and what we should be is largely influenced by advertising. Advertising is specificly made, not to simply tell you about a product, its designed with the intent of social engineering. Now here we are, firmly believing that one of the great rites of passage to adulthood is learning to drive, and that owning a car is more important than having a roof over ones head. We want our food fast, fried and 'tasty', which in itself is a dubious term, since 'tasty' is whatever we were brought up into liking.

The reality is we've woven a system dedicated to enslaving you..When you are a teen, you get your first job simply to pay the cost of having a car, a luxury you don't even need. As a young adult, you are cut off, and suddenly have to pay for your own medical needs, clothing and food. This on top of that car and its many expenses, and of course somewhere in between you are suppose to find time to get a education, otherwise, guess what, you won't ever be able to make enough money to get out of this very well designed financial cage. Oh, and if you were dumb enough to have a kid in your teen's or early 20's? Well fah'gitta'bout it..

Now, back to that "American way of Life"...the picture painted by our economy..leaves little room for anything 'healthy'. The end result is obvious, early medical problems, which, ta-da, there are 'treatments' for, which involve even more money, and so forth.

And now we want another tax..to tax people for buying into the system which we created to enslave them in the first place. Fecking Brilliant....You, my good sir, have great potential as a Politician.

 

[azdroptop]

I'm all for it, as long as some of my tax dollars goes toward having to pay for a share of medical costs caused by obesity. Same for smokers, alcoholics, drug addicts, etc. People should be free to abuse themselves as they see fit, as long as the cost of the consequences doesn't have to be shared with others.

I could not agree more. I see it every day I work a shift-I'm a paramedic for the city. Drive's me nuts. Perfect example-we just transported a guy because he was short of breath and guess what he was holding in his hand on the gurney in the back of the rig? His smokes. Idiot. It's just like taxes. Those of us who actually work for a living pay to support the system abusers.

 

[Madd Dogg]

Perhaps giving the fit a tax break would work better than taxing the obese. Quarterly fitness tests. You score a certain score for that quarter, you reduce your tax liability. The test could be administered by a local gym. You'd have to pay the fee for taking the test out of your own pocket. If you score high enough you take the test for free. Score higher than that and you get a check for big bucks right there on the spot! Cool Baby! The Obese would have an incentive to workout. The fit would be rewarded. The Nation will rise! Xboxes revolt! While I'm on a roll tax breaks for companies that accomodate and encourage bike commuters.

 

[SBSpartan]

You people realize that you are advocating MORE taxes? The government already takes 40% of what you make and you want them to take more for some of the most ignorant reasons I can imagine.

Look, if you think more taxes is a good thing, well great, maybe at the end of the year I can send you my bill and you can take care of it for me? After all this is the same principle that you are advocating for medical care. And I bet there is no way you would do that huh?

If you think socialism is a great idea then you are in the wrong country. Anyway you look at it, that is what you are asking for. I am not saying don't take care of people when they need help. I do that all the time. What I am saying (as I stick to the point) is that a tax is a bad thing.

Pendejo, I hear your point but believe you are only half right and possible stuck in between two points of view. First of all, medical care and insurance is in fact available to all. Some just have to pay more because of their health. If you think that a tax is the right way to handle anything then you really are lost.

 

[Pendejo]

Perhaps giving the fit a tax break would work better than taxing the obese. Quarterly fitness tests. You score a certain score for that quarter, you reduce your tax liability. The test could be administered by a local gym. You'd have to pay the fee for taking the test out of your own pocket. If you score high enough you take the test for free. Score higher than that and you get a check for big bucks right there on the spot! Cool Baby! The Obese would have an incentive to workout. The fit would be rewarded. The Nation will rise! Xboxes revolt! While I'm on a roll tax breaks for companies that accomodate and encourage bike commuters.

I like this idea, Madd Dogg. It would be heck a lot more effective than your typical gym class in school, which in my day was always a big (but welcome) waste of time.

 

[Blademun]

I like this idea, Madd Dogg. It would be heck a lot more effective than your typical gym class in school, which in my day was always a big (but welcome) waste of time.

Yeah, that is a awesome idea Madd Dogg. Much better then more taxes.

 

[baj32161]

I'm all for it, as long as some of my tax dollars goes toward having to pay for a share of medical costs caused by obesity. Same for smokers, alcoholics, drug addicts, etc. People should be free to abuse themselves as they see fit, as long as the cost of the consequences doesn't have to be shared with others.

Well you are certainly living up to your screenname

 

[baj32161]

Perhaps giving the fit a tax break would work better than taxing the obese. Quarterly fitness tests. You score a certain score for that quarter, you reduce your tax liability. The test could be administered by a local gym. You'd have to pay the fee for taking the test out of your own pocket. If you score high enough you take the test for free. Score higher than that and you get a check for big bucks right there on the spot! Cool Baby! The Obese would have an incentive to workout. The fit would be rewarded. The Nation will rise! Xboxes revolt! While I'm on a roll tax breaks for companies that accomodate and encourage bike commuters.

Now this is progressive thinking!!! Bravo!!!!

 

[free_rideman]

I would like to note real quick that the enviormentalists are not anti-capitalistic. They are anti-exploitation, which is what the oil companys are doing to us. You mentioned that the Gas station gets only 1/5 of the profit, and the rest gos to taxes? Well, profits are whats made after the actual cost they pay for the gas. If you were to make a pie chart of what costs are associated with a gallon of gas, the lions share would be the wholesale price of gas itself..tax and gas station profits would be slivers.

Also, there are several real alternatives to fossil fuels we could use for transportation and electric generation. Some of which you've never heard of.

Scalar Electromagnetics: This is a complex aspect of electromagnetics that I do not quite understand, but have seen plenty of proof substantiating its claims. It has the ability to produce electricity in large amounts through a method of induction from...what, I don't understand, aether..void..not sure..There are working tabletop generators working off the theroy.

Pyroelectric Fusion: Tabletop fusion has been confirmed and produced at Rensselaer and UCLA. Heres a Wiki on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyroelectric_fusion

And the more well known methods, Fuel Cells, Hybrids, Hydrogen fueled cars, ect.

'Informed' People will tell you these sources of energy are not easily applicable and thus 'not viable'. Well gee whiz, neither was the gasoline internal combustion engine, it took 40 years to get that right..The reality is we do not want to devote the resources, time or attention to all of these methods, and the Oil companys do everything they can to keep the status quo just like that.

(And now, to get back on topic, the rest of this is in regards to the topic in general.)

As for what this post is about, its about people getting fat because they don't take care of themselfs. Low and behold, 20-40 years later they roll into a emergency room, dying. This is a side effect of the well marketed "American way of Life". You see, the very idea of who and what we should be is largely influenced by advertising. Advertising is specificly made, not to simply tell you about a product, its designed with the intent of social engineering. Now here we are, firmly believing that one of the great rites of passage to adulthood is learning to drive, and that owning a car is more important than having a roof over ones head. We want our food fast, fried and 'tasty', which in itself is a dubious term, since 'tasty' is whatever we were brought up into liking.

The reality is we've woven a system dedicated to enslaving you..When you are a teen, you get your first job simply to pay the cost of having a car, a luxury you don't even need. As a young adult, you are cut off, and suddenly have to pay for your own medical needs, clothing and food. This on top of that car and its many expenses, and of course somewhere in between you are suppose to find time to get a education, otherwise, guess what, you won't ever be able to make enough money to get out of this very well designed financial cage. Oh, and if you were dumb enough to have a kid in your teen's or early 20's? Well fah'gitta'bout it..

Now, back to that "American way of Life"...the picture painted by our economy..leaves little room for anything 'healthy'. The end result is obvious, early medical problems, which, ta-da, there are 'treatments' for, which involve even more money, and so forth.

And now we want another tax..to tax people for buying into the system which we created to enslave them in the first place. Fecking Brilliant....You, my good sir, have great potential as a Politician.

Wow! I don't think any of you got what this user mentioned. Why the hell would you even think about rewarding or punishing someone, when in some cases the problem isn't even him/her. Do all you know how easy, convient, and efficient setting up one social structure in society? America is good for the business man, because how well the marketing "brain washing" works. Other countries don't have such a emphasis on pop culture.
It all started after WW2. People during the war had less stuff, since supplies were limited. Then after the war, "great" scientists come out and make all the wonders and conveniences to help in our daily "busy" lives. So after this generation, people got really lazy. And after that each other generation was taught to the same ****. It went from a business/people's America, to only a business America.
So today people are lazy and don't give a care about too much. They believe what has been told to them.
Imagine this. You are taught something today. Then a year from now you discover it is false. Well, maybe after a couple of days, and some evidence you will part ways with your old belief. But can you imagine, trying to teach America as a whole that there is a alternate way of life? This is something that has been there for their whole life! This is them. And plus changing your way of life is really hard. They can all so easily just quit. Look I am smart in the health aspect of life, but it even was hard for me, and still is.
The thing is, when we weren't as evolved as now society is, everything was hard, and luckly the hard ways of doing things were the right ways. Now we have easy alternate ways, which includes **** food. And not only bad food as in fast food, but also many of our staple foods aren't being made ethically. If only every average person new what was really happening around them then they would freak out. But wait, no that wouldn't happen. Why? Because every person's life, the one now, is so deeply routed, that if the truth was told they wouldn't believe it!
We can even see it on this forum. People arguing for no good reason. Going at it, and not being open minded. About subjects that don't even matter, like falling bullets. So how can we expect people to think about their lives?
If people are dumb enough to spend money on **** that hurts them, then this won't do much more. Plus like one of the great philosophers said, "the masses are a$$es". That said, there would be more protest to this dumb idea than anything.

The only thing we can do now, is ensure that our kids won't be so screwed up. And vote with our money. The goverment should be afraid of the people, and so should the companies.

Todays age that we are coming into, companies have more power than people.

In the end it comes down to choice. And some people don't know of the choice, are afraid of the choice, or oppose this choice. No one ever said life is easy.

 

[rsette]

Maybe we should tax people who take up internet bandwidth by posting arrogant, holier-than-thou (not to mention idiotic and just plain stupid) ideas on cycling forum message boards?

I'm sure if we checked out your life, pendejo, we'd find many vices and foibles for which we could denigrate you (and maybe tax you in the process, too)!

 

[mitosis]

I don't know about taxing them but I have always thought it unfair that I have to pay excess on planes when I take my bike when I know that even with my bike I weigh far less than some of the lard arses who bulge out of their seats into the space of the person beside them.

You should have to pay extra if your total weight exceeds a certain amount - like 110 kg.

 

[SBSpartan]

I don't know about taxing them but I have always thought it unfair that I have to pay excess on planes when I take my bike when I know that even with my bike I weigh far less than some of the lard arses who bulge out of their seats into the space of the person beside them.

You should have to pay extra if your total weight exceeds a certain amount - like 110 kg.

I think that is a space issue. You get nailed either way. Too many bags, too much weight, too big of a bag.

 

[tyler1212]

Lets tax people who call themselves "original pube" in other languages!

 

[cavedog]

Maybe we should tax people who take up internet bandwidth by posting arrogant, holier-than-thou (not to mention idiotic and just plain stupid) ideas on cycling forum message boards?

I'm sure if we checked out your life, pendejo, we'd find many vices and foibles for which we could denigrate you (and maybe tax you in the process, too)!

Rats, you beat me to it. I was thinking this while reading the thread.

Anyway, we don't have to tax them. Dr. Darwin will take good care of them. As for the health care costs, well, we gotta have at least one industry left in the US!

<smirk>

 

[mitosis]

I think that is a space issue. You get nailed either way. Too many bags, too much weight, too big of a bag.

So far I haven't been squeezed in my seat by such a person, my gripe is about the excess baggage I am forced to pay based on weight. Planes need more fuel for extra weight and yet me and my baggage weigh much less than many people.

 

[JohnO]

Ah, now we're getting somewhere. Make people pay for any preventable health problems. Of course, that depends upon how 'preventable' is defined...

Let's say you blow a tire on a ride and take a header. That was preventable - you didn't have to ride the bike. Let's tax cyclists more to cover that.

Shin splints from jogging, now that's certainly preventable. So we'd better tax runners, too.

Done any rock climbing? I've been hammered taking a long 20 foot whipper. That sounds preventable - call the taxman, quick.

Same with white water rafting, hang gliding, jogging, basketball, weight lifting... just about any physical sport causes injury, and could be prevented by refraining from the sport.

In fact, just about any activity at all carries risk with it. Should we have a sliding scale of tax based on the risk? And who determines the risk? How much should be charged? It's a little different when the holier than thou eye gets put on something you like.

So one should be careful with that line of thought, because it can be turned against you. The current system isn't perfect, but at least it is not intruding on our personal lives very much. It easily could.

"It just seems that some people do not understand that it is not the governments responsibility to fix every little problem someone has because they cannot deal with it themselves."

EXACTLY, Spartan. That's my point. Why aren't you seeing this? If someone is obese and ends up with diabetes, amputations, heart disease, and all the rest of the typical consequences, society should be set up so that they have to pay for their own treatments, and if they can't that's tough. OR, society should be set up so that medical treatment is available to all, BUT people who put their health at risk in the most obvious ways should have to contribute more in taxes to support that health system. In either case, you have personal responsibility at work. Each time you post you seem to contradict yourself on this issue.