TDF Q2 - Pyrenees vs Alps

[DaveB]

A few riders have commented on a preference for the Pyrenees over the
Alps. How do the profiles differ and what sort of rider does each favour?

DaveB

 

[SomeGuy]

A few riders have commented on a preference for the Pyrenees over the
Alps. How do the profiles differ and what sort of rider does each favour?

DaveB

From what I can see on cyclingnews the climbs in the Pyrenees are steeper. I think you'll find the genuine climbers (eg Rasmussen) are happier on the steeper climbs.

 

[Zebee Johnstone]

In aus.bicycle on Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:44:45 +1000
SomeGuy <[email protected]> wrote:
> From what I can see on cyclingnews the climbs in the Pyrenees are
> steeper. I think you'll find the genuine climbers (eg Rasmussen) are
> happier on the steeper climbs.

There is something so wrong with the concept "happier on steeper
climbs".

Zebee

 

[Dave]

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 02:02:47 +0000, Zebee Johnstone wrote:

> There is something so wrong with the concept "happier on steeper
> climbs".

Not at all. That way when you fall you don't hit anything until the rope
catches you.

On a bike it's just silly! (Actually, I get the idea that you suffer
harder for less time. Particularly for those with a really good power to
weight ratio it's easier to put the hurt on to their competitors in that
situation).

--
Dave Hughes | [email protected]
The RSPCA at the end of the road where I work also
offers a pet chipping service. Whenever I see the
sign (most days) I think of the film Fargo.

 

[Michael Brown]

Dave wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 02:02:47 +0000, Zebee Johnstone wrote:
>
>> There is something so wrong with the concept "happier on steeper
>> climbs".
>
> Not at all. That way when you fall you don't hit anything until the
> rope catches you.
>
> On a bike it's just silly! (Actually, I get the idea that you suffer
> harder for less time. Particularly for those with a really good power
> to weight ratio it's easier to put the hurt on to their competitors
> in that situation).

For me, Black Mountain is a an easier ride than some of the longer and
shallower hills out of Canberra. Of course, I'm mostly fast-twitch from
downhill skiing so distance is my usual enemy

--
Michael Brown
Add michael@ to emboss.co.nz - My inbox is always open

 

[neon]

A few riders have commented on a preference for the Pyrenees over the
Alps. How do the profiles differ and what sort of rider does each favour?

DaveB

From what I understand the Pyrenees are bit more shelter from wind by vegetation and more twisting nature of the roads.

 

[TimC]

On 2007-07-19, Zebee Johnstone (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> In aus.bicycle on Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:44:45 +1000
> SomeGuy <[email protected]> wrote:
>> From what I can see on cyclingnews the climbs in the Pyrenees are
>> steeper. I think you'll find the genuine climbers (eg Rasmussen) are
>> happier on the steeper climbs.
>
> There is something so wrong with the concept "happier on steeper
> climbs".

Not everyone rides a 'bent, you know ;P

--
TimC
C Code.
C Code Run.
Run, Code, RUN!
PLEASE!!!! --unknown

 

[Zebee Johnstone]

In aus.bicycle on Thu, 19 Jul 2007 23:08:34 +1000
TimC <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2007-07-19, Zebee Johnstone (aka Bruce)
> was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
>> In aus.bicycle on Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:44:45 +1000
>> SomeGuy <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> From what I can see on cyclingnews the climbs in the Pyrenees are
>>> steeper. I think you'll find the genuine climbers (eg Rasmussen) are
>>> happier on the steeper climbs.
>>
>> There is something so wrong with the concept "happier on steeper
>> climbs".
>
> Not everyone rides a 'bent, you know ;P

What, every upright rider just lives for honking up steep hills?

I mean I knew wedgie types were a bit silly, but I didn't realise they
were *that* demented.

Zebee

 

[Halcyon]

DaveB wrote:
> A few riders have commented on a preference for the Pyrenees over the
> Alps. How do the profiles differ and what sort of rider does each favour?
>
> DaveB
Explanation here:
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fullstory&id=5114&status=True

Halcyon

 

[SomeGuy]

Actually, I get the idea that you suffer harder for less time. Particularly for those with a really good power to weight ratio it's easier to put the hurt on to their competitors in that situation

The thing is, the climbs are just as long. Just, you know, steeper. So instead of 18km at 7%, it's 18km at 8%. Ouch.

 

[rooman]

The thing is, the climbs are just as long. Just, you know, steeper. So instead of 18km at 7%, it's 18km at 8%. Ouch.

here are the categorised climbs for the Alps and Pyrenees stages.



Stage 7 Bourg on bresse le gran bornand

Km 35.5: Côte de Corlier: 6.4 km climb @ 5.3 % grade / 3rd Cat.
Km 122.5: Côte de Cruseilles: 7.1 km climb @ 4.4 % grade / 3rd Cat.
Km 134: Côte Peguin: 4.3 km climb @ 4.1 % grade / 4th Cat.
Km 183: Col de la Colombière: 16.0 km climb @ 6.8 % grade / 1st Cat.



Stage 8 le gran borgnan – tignes

Climbs:
Km 15.5: Col du Marais: 3.8 km climb @ 4.1 % grade / 4th Cat.
Km 22: Côte du Bouchet-Mont-Charvin: 2.0 km climb @ 7.1 % grade / 3rd Cat.
Km 46.5: Col de Tamié: 9.5 km climb @ 4 % grade / 2nd Cat.
Km 99.5: Cormet de Roselend 19.9 km climb @ 6 % grade / 1st Cat.
Km 136.5: Montée d'Hauteville: 15.3 km climb @ 4.7 % grade / 1st Cat.
Km 163: Montée de Tignes: 18.0 km climb @ 5.4 % grade / 1st Cat.



Stage 9 Val de isere – briancon

climbs

Km 15: Col de l'Iseran: 15.0 km climb @ 6 % grade / hors catégorie
Km 99: Col du Telegraphe: 12.0 km climb @ 6.7 % grade / 1st Cat.
Km 122: Col du Galibier: 17.5 km climb @ 6.9 % grade / hors catégorie



Stage 14 mazamet - plateau de beille

Climbs:
Km 9: Côte de Saint-Sarraille: 9.0 km climb @ 5.3 % grade / 2nd Cat.
Km 146.5: Port de Pailhères: 16.8 km climb @ 7.2 % / hors catégorie
Km 197: Plateau de Beille: 15.9 km climb @ 7.9 % / hors catégorie



Stage 15 foix – loudenville - le leron

Climbs:
Km 27.5: Col de Port: 11.4 km climb @ 5.3 % grade / 2nd Cat.
Km 98.5: Col de Portet d'Aspet: 5.7 km climb @ 6.9 % grade / 2nd Cat.
Km 114: Col de Menté: 7.0 km climb @ 8.1 % grade / 1st Cat.
Km 159.5: Port de Balès: 19.2 km climb @ 6.2 % grade / hors catégorie
Km 184.5: Col de Peyresourde: 9.7 km climb @ 7.8 % grade / 1st Cat.



Stage 16 Orthez - Gourette - Col d’Aubisque

Climbs:
Km 79: Port de Larrau: 14.7 km climb @ 8.1 % grade / hors catégorie (Spain)
Km 93: Alto Laza - 3.5km climb @ 6.8 % grade / 3rd Cat. (Spain)
Km 131: Col de la Pierre-Saint-Martin: 14.2 km climb @ 5.2 % grade / 1st Cat.
Km 180.5: Col de Marie-Blanque: 9.3 km climb @ 7.4 % grade / 1st Cat.
Km 218.5: Col d'Aubisque: 16.7 km climb @ 7 % grade / hors catégorie

FWIW a summary of cat climbs over gradient is

Stage 7 - 33.8 km @ 5.12%
Stage 8 - 68.5 km @ 5.2%
Stage 9 - 44.5 km @ 6.5%
stage 14 - 31.7 km @ 6.8%
stage 15 - 43 km @ 6.8%
stage 16 - 48.4% @ 6.8%

it's still a lot of hurt no matter where the ground rushes up to the sky.

The Col d'Aubisque at 16.7 @ 7% is going to be the killer to make the last TT a nail biter. it will be the Galibier and Colombiér all over again in a feast-like climbing finale.
I think the sleepers are Leipheimer and Vino, both can climb, both can TT and both are cunning with experience, and my wild card is Klöden. Heart says Cadel, if they don't snap him and he keeps cool and makes one calculated death blow to shake Valverde and Sastre..( not sure where that will be as he has been a bit off the hard punches to go on with it...but he has his experience in the Giro to draw on when wearing the Pink & his body gave up. I think he is a hell of a lot tougher and smarter now...just how tough though we will learn in the next week or so.